Leaderboard

Hello everyone, I was lucky to take part in a two days digital cinema workshop presented by Marquise technologies and Free Studio in Geneva. I will not try to relay all the information we received in this thread as I am not qualified and it would be a daunting task, but I will rather give you my thoughts on the workshop and give you a little wrap up of the event. [img]http://www.freeimagehosting.net/newuploads/9u9u9.jpg[/img] The workshop covered dailies management and data handling, debayering, the ACES color space, post-production, and DCP. Special guests were Jean-Piere Beauviala founder of Aaton and DP Caroline Champetier (holy motors). It also included a shootout between the following cameras that we compared on the second day from the dcp files in a movie theater: Red epic, Arri Alexa, Sony F65 and Aaton Delta [img]http://www.freeimagehosting.net/newuploads/alh7g.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.freeimagehosting.net/newuploads/u9qde.jpg[/img] The first thing that surprised me was how big the F65 was. I did not tape measure them but I felt size wise from smallest to biggest was like this: red epic, arri alexa, AAton Delta, Sony F65 Here another view of the fully equiped Sony beast: [img]http://www.freeimagehosting.net/newuploads/a3qc9.jpg[/img] Each camera was presented to us and when discussing their features the most intriguing one was the Delta. A couple things separate it from the others: - An optical viewfinder, - a very big ventilator to reduce sound emission - integrated ssd recorder (4 of them stacked up in raid 0) non proprietary you can use the brand of your choice - a little screen on the other side of the camera with the basic info so you can check them on both sides - mechanical rotating mirror shutter - the sensor that physically moves from half a pixel during recording more info here: [url="http://nofilmschool.com/2012/10/aatons-penelope-delta-camera/"]http://nofilmschool....e-delta-camera/[/url] The last feature was the most interesting one but we could sadly not see it in action as the prototype camera did not feature it yet. According to the founder of Aaton, the variation in the image this shift produces forces our brain to stay more focused on the images. You can see the big ventilator and small side screen here: [img]http://www.freeimagehosting.net/newuploads/5wb3y.jpg[/img] Another interesting feature was on the Sony F65, which has a special pixel array arranged in bee hive structure. Which adds up to an odd ratio of 8192 by 2160 pixels even though the final aspect ratio is 17:9 close to 2:1. [img]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-xb0_SirmzNI/TaLAb4d68EI/AAAAAAAAAy0/HJfBv7uuAbU/s1600/Sony+F65+CFA.JPG[/img] explained in detail here: [url="http://camerarentalz.com/sony-f65-6k-sensor/"]http://camerarentalz...-f65-6k-sensor/[/url] An interesting anecdotal info comes from DP Caroline Champetier who had a very harsh view on the Arri Alexa. [img]http://www.freeimagehosting.net/newuploads/z4ysu.jpg[/img] She tested the camera among others before shooting one of her films and really dislikes it. The skin tones and color rendition are terrible in her opinion. She says that that camera is a very good television camera but definitively not a cinema camera. I was quite surprised at how categorical she was on the Alexa because of how good Skyfall looked to me. So I was looking forward to seeing that "television" camera compared in the theater on the next day. But it was no fair fight. They received a faulty Gemini so they had to record prores instead of raw on the Alexa. And it showed. In theater camera comparison: [img]http://www.freeimagehosting.net/newuploads/7qnai.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.freeimagehosting.net/newuploads/45taz.jpg[/img] The subject is very subjective of course but there are a couple things that showed clearly and are not subjective: - On one of the shots with half of a wooden box in the shade, the Alexa and Epic showed no information what so ever, pure black. On the Delta and F65 the wood texture and details were clearly visible, a big difference in visible dynamic range there. Now of course on the epic you would be able to pull some info from the blacks. But straight out of the cam was pure black. - ProRes is not good enough for cinema. It looked very bad. The colors on the girl skin tones and hair were very weak and the clouds looked really muddy. You could really tell the difference. Wish they had shot with ArriRaw so that it would have been more fair. - The Aaton displayed a very smooth gradation between shades of grey. Not a huge difference with the f65, but it was very smooth. Now the rest is subjective: In my opinion there was two groups, the bottom group with the alexa (sadly ProRes) and the Epic. And the top group with the Delta and F65. The F65 red haired woman shot was simply superb! The skintones and hair color and detail rendition were amazing. The Delta delivered a more contrasted image which I liked less. Interestingly the colorist that was presenting the shots said he would rather grade a more contrasted shot like the Delta instead of having to add contrast and the guess work that comes with it like on the f65. [img]http://www.freeimagehosting.net/newuploads/wwgbh.jpg[/img] Both theses cameras displayed a superior dynamic range and most importantly superior colors imo. (The sony was shifting towards yellow in the highlights a bit) The camera that delivered the most complete and appealing image to me was the F65. But when discussing this with the other attendees as you would expect everybody had a different favorite. All in all it was a very fascinating workshop. Big thank you to Marquise Technologies and Free Studios for this.

[quote name='Axel' timestamp='1352453189' post='21378'] Reminds me of the true story of a 500 year old wine bottle (with a history appropriate for a TV series) that was auctioned for $200.000. The world's most expert wine lovers were invited. After the bottle was uncorked, the wine reacted with the oxygen in the air and turned into vinegar immediately. The testers said the first breath they took over the open bottle was of a very good bouquet. [/quote] Oh my god what an awesome story! I love it. I can imagine a story following that of one of the guests going to search the world for that illusive bouquet that he'll never have the chance to taste and how everything else is shit. Like the guy who searched for the mermaid after he saw her. He was convinced no woman could ever satisfy him from then on.

Can confirm that the picture profiles have been drastically changed since Photokina. No High Key, Retro, or anything remotely interesting like that. They have gone all 'Canon' in the picture profile department.

Hi Phil, thank you for uploading this. I think it looks great, it reminded me of Sony EX-footage, with the zooms and the good (auto?)-focus. This might finally be the right cam for me, despite all negative reputation it gathered so far.

[quote name='markm' timestamp='1352446297' post='21370']It annoys me the way some people look for posters weaknesses to win an argument. IE Because I mention I have knowledge of working with film Its easy to diss me off with being out of touch and out of date. That is an awful way to win an argument.[/quote] You get into an argument (I prefer 'discussion') not only if you want to destroy your opponent, but also because you feel involved, because you care. andy lee and I have already said that we have both analog backgrounds (I used to work in the darkroom back then, making special enlargements - [i]and manipulating the, er, data from the negatives[/i] - , then I was analog projectionist, now digital), so please don't imply we just want to win an argument. [quote name='markm' timestamp='1352446297' post='21370'](Please dont start on about grading)[/quote] Difficult, because it was done before. It was complicated and not very precise, and if a print came out as expected, that was the exception from the rule. And [i]because[/i] photochemical timing was so time-consuming and frustrating, it was done with special care. These two words represent a value, for sure. We all should care for what is core (and stop to care about unimportant things), and we all should make every minute of our life special. And as esoteric as this sounds, the analog process is for modern cinema. > the distribution is digital > therefore the laboratories shut down > the film stock production goes down > prices rise > the characteristics of analog film get ironed out in the process of digital transfer, digital post and distribution So very few people with a lot of cash behind them will occasionally try to reanimate analog film. Reminds me of the true story of a 500 year old wine bottle (with a history appropriate for a TV series) that was auctioned for $200.000. The world's most expert wine lovers were invited. After the bottle was uncorked, the wine reacted with the oxygen in the air and turned into vinegar immediately. The testers said the first breath they took over the open bottle was of a very good bouquet.