Leaderboard

I wear glasses - if I want things smoothed out, I just take them off. On a serious note, until TV is properly 1080p, I'm just going to stick with a HD TV - 720p upscaled to 1080p looks fine & Blu-Ray is about as sharp as I can handle. Also, 4K TVs are waaaaaay more expensive than HD TVs. As far as filming things goes, BM Pocket produces one of the best images that I've seen/used for quite a long while (10yrs or so) - it's not about sharpness, never has been, never will be. Look at what most DPs say - they're trying to soften the image & that's for cinema, which you would've thought needed a bigger/better resolution for the bigger screen. So you can take your sharpness and....... If you buy a 4K camera to re-frame & then downscale to 1080p - what a complete & utter waste of time. Learn to frame/film properly & appreciate the beauty of a great camera. I'd prefer to rent a proper 4K camera with a decent codec, instead of using something with a crippling 8-bit mess.

Good finds today. A 100% mint 15mm f4.5 that covers most full frames. Viewfinder and awesome rearcap included. Total cost $250. Sample using T-Max 100. Also a Fujinon 12.5mm f1.4. Very solid and good price. No sample so far, will use it on the Bolex. The M6 will also use the 15mm.

c100.. great low light, rock solid - mark 2 has the incredible dual pixel autofocus.. better video than 5d's, so can be very filmic.. great detail and colour.. low rolling shutter - better all around camera.. that said I would love an a7s to film at night with!

Discussions like this really frustrate me because they're academic and digress into specs and possibilities. Every time there's a tech advance, the first reaction of many is to say they aren't impressed, as if that puts them on a higher pedestal than the mortals who are easily pleased. 4K? It's really about DR. High DR? It's about color. Great color? For pros, it's ergonomics. Everything? Camera doesn't matter. Full equipment? It's not about gear. Etc. Heck, I've seen people ridiculing the excitement over the first Internet browser Netscape (remember that?). Going back to the OP, if you read my first response, I mentioned Cronenweth on the video talking about the advantages of 4K that I mentioned. I didn't make that up: it's from the same video. It may not fit the narrative on this forum, but it was actually said. 4K is NOT about higher res folks, even when you deliver in HD. It's about giving you choices in post WRT stabilization, framing, camera moves, etc. I just put a video on another thread that has video from NX500 (a very low end 4K camera) cropped to be HD. NO extra res there, just HD, but you see a tight crop and framing that would have been impossible using a HD camera without additional lenses. And I was specifically comparing it (and NX1) with an actual HD camera BMMCC, not engaging in an academic discussion. My point is that today you can buy a 4K at comparable prices and get the advantages I mentioned, which directly addresses the OP. May be BMMCC's claimed 13 stops DR and RAW do shine, but I don't see evidence of that (not that it doesn't exist). Specs matter squat if the result is garbage.

I bought an old Panasonic SDX900, it's the dvx100's big brother. I thought maybe SD had something interesting about it - lacking resolution and dynamic range. I tested it quickly against my Sony F65 going to 8mm or 16mm, and it seems to have its own weird unique feel that's kind of interesting. Anyway let me know what you think - post workflow I can post as well how I kind of "destroyed" the image too.

I found something about the GX8 out by accident today which blew my mind. I was setting up manual focus and double clicked the MF Assist which was set to full screen. I was recording via the Ninja Star at the same time, but when I checked the file after the shoot I had recorded the magnified MF assist screen, which created an amazing close up of the subject. It means that you can double tap the screen to punch in and out of zoom via the MF assist screen. The quality didn't seem to suffer either. The client was delighted that I had got such an amazing close up of his woodworking skills! It would be interesting to know if this happens with the other Panny cams when using an external recorder. Yes, it sounds like the GX80 would offer the better value and it is great to record both internally and externally at the same time for redundancy.

Fujinon 25mm... Lens porn?

I'm in the color and dynamic range camp myself, but will say that when it comes to televisions sets, 1080p on my 4K set looks a little better than it did on my 1080p set. it tends to smooth out jagged diagonal lines. http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/by-resolution/4k-ultra-hd-uhd-vs-1080p-full-hd-tvs-and-upscaling-compared

That says more about the average reader than the camera/s.

I'd like to congratulate Zach on for once not writing an unnecessarily long and baffling post Zooming in post feels different to using a dolly and feels different to zooming with a lens. Sometimes you see all three techniques used in a single film or TV episode. Each one has a different emotional effect and one can't be used to replace another.

Colour rendition and broad dynamic range trumps higher resolution needs every time....especially if the goal is to achieve 'filmic' results.

I traded in my GH4+Odyssey combo for a Blackmagic Micro and couldn't be happier. My days of wrestling with a camera to do what I want are behind me.

For me resolution is nowhere near the top of the list of what makes a good image. When I compared the 4K NX1 and RX100iv to the 5Ds HD Raw, the Canon won. The BMPCC or Bolex runs circles around GH4s and Sonys, imo. Same thing happens with still cameras. Plus I don't know how many times I've done blind tests and not even the biggest 4K evangelists of this and other forums can tell the difference. Now, if we have HD vs 4K and all else is equal, both shooting Raw, wide DR, nice color science, etc.. Then 4K might come in handy. But its not needed for any of the work I do personally. Not until its a standard, and thats years from now. So with that said, I still buy HD cameras and have gone back and forth from 4K many times.

The Panasonic team in Osaka have been very good to us over the last few years. Now the GH5 is imminent, EOSHD takes a look at what makes the series so great and what to expect for the new model. Read the full blog post

Hi So I borrowed a 100mm macro lens from a friend and experimented with acrylic colors, milk, water, oil and soap.. Shot it with my GH4, held by my precious gorilla pod and lots of duct tape! I have now entered my video into a contest. If you like it, I would be really really happy, if you'd give it a vote and maybe even share https://apps.facebook.com/dvxvideocontest/?video=16 Thanks!

I've been anxiously waiting for the new Improved Lumetri Color (Secondary HSL) I've always liked Colorista, but I always thought the only reason I still use it is because there is no localized HSL correction for a particular color range. Now, it has it. Crossing my fingers to see if it works well with skin as Adobe at NAB precariously stayed away from demonstrating it on skin. Edit: Works on skin OK. I had "Add color" after I "Set color" to cover the entire spectrum though then blur the mask. Then "Remove color" to remove some nearby similar colors. I would say Colorista is better at skin isolation but this will probably do.

BTW, from shooting Leicas the last months I can say I really dig the Voigtlander M lenses. My favorite by far due the to the quality/€ is the 28mm f2.0 Ultron. Gets you really broad and nice zones for zone focus with a pretty wide aperture and the focus is buttery smooth. Not like the 15mm where everything from 0.7m to infinity is in focus at f4.5, but still. Here is a sample, again using T-Max100. Hanging Around Down Town by Mattias Burling, on Flickr

I totally agree with this!!!

C mounts won't focus to infinity on the nx500... I know... I tried. They are cool macro lenses on it though. I don't think there's a list on here for micro 4/3... Other than the c mount list for the BMPCC. Might be a good place to start. Or try Flickr.

GX80 manual says the same... I don't know why Panasonic is doing that to us- then they don't tell us if it's 8-bit 4:2:2 or 4:2:0. I believe the GX80 one-ups the GX8 on that point because it will record internally at the same time. I would say both cameras are very capable. However, I believe this person is after value based on what he said... I'm going to say the GX80 beats the GX8 because it's less expensive. If he wants weather-sealing though, the GX80 is NOT the way to go- choose GX8 of GH4. I just pixel-peeped it and still couldn't tell a difference. Staying with the original file.

The poor old GX8 keeps being overlooked, yet it is the best of the Panny bunch for photography and superb for video too. I did a shoot today with the GX8/Nikon 28-70/Metabones/Atomos Ninja Star and the quality was really amazing at 1080. I love using the GX8 with the Ninja Star as it is so easy to get very high quality footage with long battery life in both the cam and external recorder and for some reason you still get live view when streaming via HDMI even though the manual says that you can't

I got 2 GX85's for a specific project, so I can attest to the brand loyalty thing. I've used Panasonic cameras for a long time and brand comfort makes the choice to buy-in to a new camera for this gig a bit easier. Plus, the dang things are ridiculously cheap. That said, I still think the 5-axis in the Oly EM5II is just a touch better than what Panasonic is offering; industry leading. However, there's a caveat: that's only when using non-OIS lenses. If you have a Pany OIS lens paired with the Panasonic sensor stabilizer, it's really good. I'm also really loathe to turn away from the ergos of my EM5II. I'm surprised that I connected so much to the EM5II, to be honest, but I do love how it just works. If only Oly had better motion picture IQ...

You have to pixel peep, but, yeah, it's a bit better at smoothing out edges. I wouldn't bother using it for 4K footage that's delivered 1080.

Don't disagree, but I'll add that re-scaling is certainly useful when shooting a documentary. Run'nGun shooting is all about circumstances and compromise. I can be happy with 95% of my shots, but if I can make a shot better with a bit of judicious cropping I'll do it. I ain't proud. Give me a technique I can exploit, I'll exploit it. I'm not shooting with a 4K camera because I want to re-frame all my documentary shots, I'm shooting 4K because it offers options if need be. --And then there's this whole thing, as if this thread needs to go more sideways: http://www.eoshd.com/2014/02/discovery-4k-8bit-420-panasonic-gh4-converts-1080p-10bit-444/

GH Wish List 1. Better autofocus - for smooth touch screen focus pull. Along the lines of Canon's DPAF. 2. Full HD at 120fps or higher. 240fps would be sweet. 3. IBIS

Have been the GH system owner since GH2, had GH3 and Using GH4 with BMPCC speedbooster , Nikon prime AIS lenses plus some Leica lumix lenses and now eargarly waiting for the GH5. Bought an A7sII out of hype and sold it after 3 months since it did not do anything better for my shooting needs.

The idea that 4K "can" be great dependent upon how the rest of image quality performs (i.e. DR, highlight roll-off, colors etc.) is an important one. I probably won't have a 4K TV for years, nor will the people that are my audience (my students). However 4K with great colors and DR down-res to 1080P would be more desirable to 1080P with similar qualities and characteristics. I strongly disagree that 4K is always better than 1080, again I'd prefer to see/use a c100 than a gh4/nx1/a7s. But when you ask about an fs7, 1dx II vs. a c100/c300 then you may have a more appropriate discussion about 4K vs. 1080. Context is key. When the latter discussion is had, I'm particular to canon colors over sony and within canon's lineup it's a toss up between 1080 and 4K. I guess this discussion has demonstrated to me that 4K isn't necessary but is desirable with the right context (DR, etc.) and that investing in quality 1080 isn't a bad move if you're not being mandated by work to have a 4K workflow. Thanks!

I agree that 4K is far less important for a great image than some other features mentioned above, but there are also two kinds of 4K. There is 1Dc or most cinema cameras type of 4K that has the detail but not in camera sharpening, so it can still look very pleasing even in closeups, and there is 4K that is oversharpened on top of big resolution and that tends to look not so good. I believe you once already wrote about this Ebrahim. What I am trying to say is that for me 4K is a great feature if it is the right kind of 4K.

Imo it was about the DR before 4K. And before HD. And before SD. And before Beta Max. And before colored film. Its always been the biggest focus on DR, still is and still will be tomorrow. DR has been the buzz word for as long as I can remember. 4K resolution is just like a slider, a flash, an EVF, 120fps, its just another feature. Until it becomes a standard. 720p took 10 years to become a standard, not in the world, but in a big enough part of the world. Now we are waiting on 1080p HD to become the next thing. After that maybe 4K will catch on so much that its a "need" instead of a "nice". But if it doesn't have the DR its not gonna stick. 50% of the Oscar nominees are still shot on film. And it isn't because of resolution.

That's "pan-and-scan" not a dolly move. No parallax effect=no dolly shot.

I would like to flip the earlier question and ask for an example from the NX1/NX500 that looks better. I've had both those cameras and imo they can't touch a bmcc/bmpcc/5d. Also "camera moves" in post does not look good. I get it if you are shooting an interview alone and didn't have time for B-roll. But you could do that within HD if you really needed to. It should be an emergency tool, not sop.

I'd go even further and say we have evidence it is NOT the same sensor!

Remember that it is an APS-C lens, so if you want 4K you should rent the A7r mk2 instead. I've been impressed with AF from my A5100, so I expect the A7r mk2 will be even better. It won't be perfect, but is likely very "good enough" for your DIY styled project. Another to consider is the Samsung NX1 which is meant to have godly AF, and had a firmware update which gave it in camera stabilization. You could pair it with the Samsung 30mm f2 pancake lens.

I work at a school and all the kids edit on Macbook Airs. This proxy workflow is going to be great as well as the new hardware decode support, those laptops cant deal with 50mbps XAVC-s let alone 100mbps gh4 stuff. Now I just have to set the project up once and it will give them an optimised experience when I give them a copy to work on

if you are going to get a Speedbooster get a Metabones they are the best construction wise and optically plus no lens shift on any on mine and Im using 8 X Metabones XLs to shoot a feature film right now ( 4 in Nikon Mount and 4 in Canon EF mount )- they are outstanding and I love them , I wouldnt shoot without them , they are essential on micro 4/3 cameras plus follow focus works really well as there is no play in the lens mount plus I cable tie all my lenses on rigs to the lens support so there is no movement at all of the follow focus - Im using Gini Rigs follow focus as its very big and smooth Im 38 days into a 45 day shoot and they are all performing superb NO issues at all 5 Metabones XLs on my rigs (Gini Rigs) with Nikon Bourne Lenses for the feature film Pandora I'm DP on .

FILM CITY Matte box works well with my Nikon Bourne lenses on a Gini Rigs rig I made up from their parts

Never trusted the A7 series autofocus enough to shoot video with it. Always used manual lenses and I was using the A7Rii which is supposed to have better AF than the A7Sii. If you really want to shoot Sony you'll need to stop down. The added dof will only lead to many out of focus shots otherwise. Good luck.

Exactly, we are comparing the best 1080p to the best 4K within a budget. So a real life scenario, would for example be comparing a BMMCC image to a GH4 or NX1 in 4K. These images are far from being equal, thus "with everything else equal" (as you put it) isn't really a valid situation for many here. (As nothing is equal in the same price range in regards to 1080p vs 4k. You don't get something for nothing). p.s. Not trying to have a go at you, just trying to point out that your logic (whilst true) isn't realistic for most people here weighing up 4K vs 1080p with the current tech.

I guess it depends on the price range you had in mind, but the reason we're even discussing 4K vs HD is precisely because we get such high quality 4K for so little these days. I shoot regularly with NX1 and NX500; both produce fantastic 4K and neither cost me a pretty penny. I actually bought the NX500 for some $350 for crying out loud.

Thanks so much! I actually considered to use text to make it a fake credit sequence :D Maybe I'll be able to use it for some future scifi movie

The rear bayonet mount is the depth of several filter rings...you have to build up the rings and glue them together so they become a solid mount, so that the front element of your 20mm fd will clear the rear element of the .7 adapter...as front elements on wider lenses bulge outwards, only you can make the call for how high you have to go, relative to the lenses you would use this adapter with (buy enough filter rings to accomplish this)...you also need a rail system to take a lens support, as the adapter weighs at least a lb. if I remember correctly...you can check the specs with the seller...or if you don't like rails, you can use this from Amazon....http://www.amazon.com/Manfrotto-293-Telephoto-Lens-Support/dp/B001BX3ZXE?tag=battleforthew-20....either way the strain on your camera mount is too great, but if like me you are addicted to buying lenses, this is a great solution...and lastly...the fd 17mm is @ f4 and almost twice the price and I think maybe fisheye??...and the adapter gets your 20 to 14...on an fd speedbooster you're nice and wide now...and that's just one lens!

Hey Jason, I think 4K is good for some of us who need a nice HD image with consumer equipment. For Pros great Arri 2K, for indies Digi Bolex 2K is nicer than 4K from Panny and Sony consumer cams. But that Panny and Sony and Samsung 4K ist just so nice for us to shoot it with that affordable tech. Though the Big Screen shows every single digital flaw to the image, but digital projection on 20 feet wide screens looks nice with consumer 4k downscaled HD.

Cartel Land is CRAZY. Not only great looking footage but intense and nerve wrecking.

RAW being the only alternative? Yes, I think we need ProRes. Plus, still optimizing hardware board for production? I'd rather they finish that before they start handing out cameras.

Umm yes.

Hey Lenny! Output would be 8bit. The 4K and 1080 24p codec is on the G7 is very good. One main advantage with external recording to an Atomos would be Prores- a codec which is easier on your editing system. Other than that you got a very, very nice camera in your hands. Speedbooster is giving lenses about the same field of view of Super 35mm, the main film standard, so of cameras as FS7, C100/300/500, etc. They make the field of view of a lens a little bit wider on your Panny G7 or any other M43 camera, such as GH4, GH3, GF1, E-PL1..:) These Speedboosters exist for different lens mounts, so you can adapt lenses with Pentax K-mount, M42, Nikon F-mount, Canon EF mount, etc. You can adapt these lenses with ordinary adapters as well. Speedboosters, additionally, just give you a slight boost in field of view and about 1 Fstop of light gathering/ effecitively sensitivity. Your kit lens is sharp, but colors are rather on the video side, more broadcast look than Hollywood:), hard to fix in post but possible. Manual focus is not so nice, because it´s not mechanical. So my suggestion would be: get an ordinary adapter for Canon FD on m43 mount for about 15USD/EU, plus an 28mm F2.8 in Canon FD mount from Canon (about 20 to 40 USD), Sigma or Tokina or Vivitar or Kiron (cheaper alternatives). Nice filmic combo to produce fantastic results! Plus Canon FD 50mm 1.8 for 15 to 30 USD. There are so many lens tips on this forum from Andy Lee and other guys. But for a start my suggestions would be fine. Avoid the GAS, Gear acquistion syndrome and keep it simple for the beginning.:) 24mm option would be about 40 to 100 EUR: http://www.ebay.com/itm/SIGMA-SUPER-WIDE-II-24mm-f-2-8-CANON-FD-MOUNT-LENS-W-HOOD-/322114601538?hash=item4aff86c242:g:-80AAOSwOVpXWDpq cheers

IMO, B&H has non advantage over Elmo II. So I sold it first.

Are you joking? Multiplying the aperture by the crop factor is mathematically required if one wishes to shoot with equivalence between two camera systems (for example, shooting a GH4 and 5D3 and desiring to get the same basic FOV and DOF for both cameras). Did you try the DOF/POV simulator? http://dofsimulator.net/en/ . Of course you can also try setting up two different sensor size camera systems and try to match FOV and DOF. If you do, you'll find that you need to multiply the aperture by the crop factor (and the ISO by the square of the crop factor if desiring to also match exposure). Perhaps you could post an example with your cameras where you match DOF and FOV along with focal length, aperture, and ISO for both cameras? (you can skip the math and do it by eye, the results may surprise you)