Leaderboard

Forgive me for interrupting but I have used both cameras: The a7riii has less rolling shutter, better motion cadence (imho), a better noise reduction algorithm which reduces ghosting outside of the log-gammas and it's easier to pull manual focus due to the better EVF and screen. If you like sharpness in full frame, then the a7iii is better of course, but sharpness is, as we know, a bourgeois concept.

https://indiefilmhustle.com/color-science-let-pixar-teach/ http://www.dvinfo.net/article/optical-science/a-short-history-of-camera-color.html Smarter, more experienced people in this industry seem to disagree with your dismissal of color science as a concept. Perhaps, as a beginner, you should spend more time listening and learning, rather than espousing ideas you don't understand? All photosites only capture luminance data. That data is assigned an R, G, or B value, depending on the filter that covers it. Those filters have to be carefully designed to let in their color and a bit of the others: if made too pure, the sensor will not be able to accurately reproduce secondary colors, like yellow and cyan; not pure enough, and colors blend together into mud from lack of separation. These color values must be interpolated from nearby photosites, as each one only capture data for R, G, or B. How that data is cobbled together has a profound result on the resulting detail and color. Then this information feeds into a camera's color matrix, which carefully subtracts channels from each other to create clear and distinct colors. All of which are made to hit specific mathematical targets within the manufacturer's carefully designed color space. These are tuned partially for accuracy, but also to create certain effects on the viewer based on the psychological effect of various colors. So sure, subjectivity plays a part. That's why every manufacturer does their color slightly differently, and has their own "look." But to purport that no math or science goes into the process is misinformed and asinine.

Big camera on sticks, small camera on sticks. Doesn't make much difference in my experience. Same thing on a dolly. Handheld, sure, although I'll take a good FS7 shoulder setup to holding a properly rigged camera out in front of me all day. Gimbal...sure, a small camera is the ideal tool there. But gimbal shots are massively overused these days, and don't necessarily guarantee more interesting shots. In fact, I find many people I work with use camera movement much more effectively when stepping up to a larger camera, because it forces them to think harder about how and why they're moving the camera. And also because shoulder/handheld stuff has a nicer look due to the added inertia--a more professional handheld aesthetic, if you will. Also, big cameras just have more going for them. Comprehensive I/O, better image quality, more features, higher frame rates, beefier codecs, etc. More space means better cooling, more ports, bigger processors, etc. I'm not saying a big camera is always the ideal tool, but the vast majority of the time it's not what's holding you back.

Yes, and with A7rIII you would have a vastly better rolling shutter performance compared to the A6500.

Dynamic range should be about the same. The S35 mode in A7rIII offers better resolution (less aliasing/moire) & ~25% faster rolling shutter.

If you need high res then def go for a7riii. The a7riii IS a better camera than the a7iii for video in almost every way (a7iii has sharper full frame 4k). But is it worth the price?....if you only shoot video...absolutely not. If you need high resolution stills....there is nothing on the market that comes close. SO if you were buying an a7riii for ONLY video...I would say NO...go for the a7iii. But for both. totally go for it

Robert, a few years ago, I felt similarly. Over the last year though, I've really come to appreciate color science, specifically what is beyond the scope of the usual color grading tools.

But then everyone around just settles it by shouting 'Shame! Shame! Shame!'.

I don't have time to go back and like all those posts, but just to let you know - I like all those posts!!!

Hi @Robert Collins - thanks for input! Yes, I am addicted to high res. I often shoot multi-row panos with my Nikon D800e/D810 and prior to that with my Canon. I often (depending on the subject and how fast the light is changing) shoot between 100 megapixels to close to 1 gigapixels. So, I'm leaning towards the A7Riii. On fred miranda, I learned about Greentoe and some people told me they got their A7Riii for about $3-400 below MSRP. That makes the price differential not that bad, and I know I'll miss the 30-40 megapixels image size. I'm just waiting for a solid in depth side-by-side video autofocus comparison. The alternative is to buy both the A7riii and A7iii and shoot two camera at once for a short movie I am planning to shoot. This way I have a backup and get both to shoot the dialogues for both sides, etc. Only reason I do not want to do that, is I love the color from my Nikon and I'm just hoping the D850 sensor will end up in a mirrorless in a few months or even canon might do something out of character and release a really competitive 4k camera. I have a few of my panos here but I have a ton that I need to gradually upload, https://www.eyeem.com/u/photojournalist Thanks, again!!!

I don't know, these aren't my questions, I'm just keeping track of them.

"The canon has more of a green tint on the skin which I like more" from the video... yeah no thanks. These guys love wacky green skin tones... Praising Canon for green tint, even though they literally say the Sony camera captured the scene more truthfully. IMO the Sony won hands down, not saying much since their comparison shots said nothing about the color or white balance settings. Just look at the YT comments, everyone is calling them out for their ridiculousness.

Why stop at the gh series? Just use a phone.

A rant. I mostly shoot on DSLRs for my work. Got a big yesterday with a Sony FS7, big ass tripod, monitor, the works. Ohhhh fancy stuff by my standards! But here's the thing. It drove me nuts. Moving, positioning, getting shots was so damned cumbersome. Shot some Broll of a guy on a sailboat. I garauntee I could've gotten way more and frankly, way better and more interesting content with my trusty GH4 and gimbal. Blah blah specs, I don't care. Footage would've been nicer and more interesting to 100% of audiences. I know there'll be some "back in my day, cameras weighed 1000lbs" folks who will scoff, but you know what? Fuck large camera systems. Fuck them.

In other words, not that great in bright conditions.

@Gregormannschaft There are 3 ways of getting this: 1. With a lens that has an internal or external servo. A couple of examples are the Sonys FE PZ 28-135 or the Sony E PZ 18-105. They are usually parfocal, but a very good AF should work as well. The external servo lenses are expensive! 2. Manual zooming potentially with a follow-focus mechanism attached to the zoom ring. It is not very easy to get the same smoothness as with the servo. 3. Digital zoom. Sony has even a Clear image zoom function that you can get smoothly get with a cheap remote. With A7rII I could get a 2X magnification and you can do even more in post if you start from a 4K footage. Of course this will give you the worse IQ and the zoom range is limited, but it is the cheapest way to get smoothness.

Little lensologist advice needed. I've seen a few videos recently (and yet struggle to find those videos again) which feature some lovely smooth zoom ins to people's faces. I love this style and would love to try and replicate it. Any idea what I'd be looking at buying? Would it only be possible with a par-focal cine lens? Let me know if my description is a little too vague. Basically, think wide shot, that quickly zooms into someones face, smoothly and in focus. Re: everything above. @jonpais For what it's worth, you may have to accept the occasional remark on the internet about a grey haired white man living in an Asian country posting videos of teen girls posing for the camera. The situation is so culturally and historically loaded, however unfair or inaccurate that may be for your individual situation. @markr041 You're being immature. There's no need to label Jon 'sick', and I have no clue how anyone would be shocked (SHOCKED) at Jon's video. You're picking a fight and what you have said and directly insinuated is incredibly insulting towards Jon.

@salim I thought Greentoe was some seller on fredmiranda but I just found this post about the marketplace. I bought directly from a seller at fredmiranda and did not use Greentow sorry for the confusion.

Yep thats how I got an "open box" one for $2750 that had 3 shutter actuations. Like in your excellent examples the extra resolution is very useful for landscapes or even cropping and to me worth the extra money compared to the deals you can get right now on the A7rIII. But it is also true that 24MP should be plenty enough for most and the extra resolution can bog down the computer. I wish Sony would implement some version of downsampled RAWs.

@Gregormannschaft - Thanks! Funny you say that, I've sold more iPhone photos than I think SLR photos. But SLR photos were sold for higher prices. I basically started using them last year or so, and after I sold a few more images, I thought why not. However, their commission pricing (especially with their premium market that works with Getty's) is not that great. My best licensing has come from the olden days, when I used, PhotographersDirect (which closes pretty much).So for that reason, I've started posting to Alamy as well. But I've just started (initially you have to go through this QC process so it's slow to upload and sell) and have no volume in there. Once I'm able to upload 500-600 or more...I probably can see if it's useful or not. If you have a big social media following it's much better to use that to license your photos, from what I've been told.

Yeah, at least I don't have to waste any time on Roland it would seem ! Most of the Tascam ones can be controlled by the RC10 remote so thats all covered now, the SoundDevices stuff is too and the Zoom just seems to be done through voltage change so that won't be too much of a hardship. On the camera side its going to be LANC for Sony, Canon C series and BM, wifi for Panasonic, Bluetooth for new BM and probably some sort of simplistic shutter release type for Fuji, Nikon and Canon DSLRS. I just need to make it a bit smaller than the current prototype that you see me working on here.

@docmoore Thanks, he is alright, very simple and all, but just not very particular in his judgement, and he is doing a little bit of everything, so not highly specialized in sound. He used to have the AT, now he uses a 8050 Sennheiser. Real world (and work) circumstances a little bit different than those studio tests. This series is interesting, Manchester! @BTM_Pix You have 9-10 specific recorders there, and OTHERS take the 44% of the poll! It seems that a lot of people are using Tascam's!

Not exactly what you are asking for, but a similar visual:

I'll look into it.. The number one priority is 10 bit cameras; but if things align, possibly

You took the wrong camera for the job. Lesson learned, presumably.

I've been using FS700 / F55 / FS7 / FS5 + Atomos for years, but I started to feel your pain too, and I've only shot on mirrorless cameras since. I have no plans to buy a larger camera in future.

Here's another one I missed...

I would argue that that type of shooting is more videography, as you're not really making a film there in the traditional sense. But sure, for no-budget travel or recording family memories, it's nice to have a smaller camera.

Hi Salim, I am in a vaguely similar position in that I am debating whether to buy a second A7r3 or an A7iii as back up for my existing a7R3, (Actually I would like an A9 with picture profiles but that doesnt sound very likely.) If you happen to be addicted to high resolution sensors (like me) I wouldnt hesitate a minute in buying the A7r3. The video autofocus is really good. I dont know if the A7iii is better (because I havent tried it) but it doesnt seem noticeably better. Obviously the biggest loss by buying an A7riii over an A7iii is the money

I agree with KnightsFan, I’d go with a 50mm, either a 1.8 or a 1.4 and decide from there if you prefer a wider or longer lens. When I used to shoot on crop sensor cameras, I liked to be between 35 and 50mm after the crop, so I never owned too many 50mm lenses. Now that I have a FF camera, I am discovering and testing a bunch of lenses, I never would have bought before. And it’s great because 50mm lenses are cheap. The EF Mount is so adaptable that there are a bunch of vintage lenses that could work. Nikkors are great because they are known for their cinematic look at a good price point. But if you are only looking for a few manual primes, there are also Contax Zeiss or Olympus OM or Yashica ML or Pentax that also have some great choices. And since the advent of the cropped sensor, there are so many cheap 50mm lenses on the used market to experiment with. Now I have purchased 99% of my lenses from eBay. As long as you buy from a seller with a good feedback rating and a detailed post, you should be fine 90% of the time. Just don’t do what I did when I started and buy based on price, you’ll end up with a lot of junk that is hard to resell and collects dust. So know what you’re looking for in focal length and lens speed... I shoot run and gun, horror and thriller short films. So I need fast lenses for lowlight. I try not to get any prime lens slower than an f/2. But I also rarely change lenses, so a fast 50mm lens (which are common) is often all I’ll use on a day’s shoot. Your mileage may vary.

Your lens choices seem reasonable to me. You could grab a 50 to start with, and see whether you find yourself wishing for a longer or shorter lens. I personally would go for manual focus primes. I wouldn't say that it matters all that much in terms of how easy it is to start with. I still don't have an ND filter. It's only crucial if your camera has a high base ISO, like 800 or 1600 on some Sony cameras. You should get a polar filter though, which can more or less be used as an ND filter as well. I have a Nikon->Canon adapter for each lens. They're cheap, and a pain to get on and off. Yeah, a new speed booster costs almost as much as a used 5d2, and there's no mirrorless APS-C cameras that shoot raw. So it doesn't seem like it's a good fit for you. You'll be able to get a repeatable process with raw, though that sort of defeats the purpose of having all that flexibility. But like you say, it's always nice to have if you need it for a specific project.

Look at what you said in your last sentence. That is the science of color. That is what I am talking about. The interplay of colors and their relation to each other. Effective use of this science yields results that have the effects that I mentioned previously: 1) subject isolation 2) dimensionality. Like I said canon also renders all hues similar to skin tones in a similar fashion (e.g a persons eye bags are not so pronounced on a canon because the tones are recognized in camera and brought to uniformity with the rest of the skin) so that skin appears smooth and uniform (not blotchy and patchy like sony) which further reinforces point 1 and 2 above. This last point is the one that most people don't seem to understand. You can see the blue eye bags with the sony image but that is corrected in the canon. It is a darker, more bluish skintone that is identified and corrected in the canon.

Honestly, I am not trolling but I just disagree the 'results speak for themselves'. Lets take a very specific example where the commentators are 'drooling' over the Canon cameras. So look I understand that people see better Canon color here but I dont. I actually dont like either very much but the Canon is definitely too green for me. But more obviously, the Canon is less sharp/softer which makes it look more 'cinematic'. Softness tends to be a 'character' of 5D mkiv images in general but I dont see it as much of an advantage because you can always make images less detailed but you cant add detail. And along the same lines people tend to like Canon video because they 'crush the blacks' and again I dont see that as an advantage on the basis that I can crush the blacks in post but it is more problematic to uncrush them. So, as I see it, there is much more 'subjectivity' in this whole subject than people imagine. I am sure that people who shoot Canon love the colors (most probably because they are used to them) and I would guess that they see any other camera that shoots different colors as 'not so good' because they judge colors against a Canon color standard. And as the majority of pros probably shoot Canon they are all in a cosy information bubble.

@tihon84 V1, especially Daylight, is not bad. V1 Day with VLog in Resolve is quite good. Notably, the Emotive Color component is quite different in exposure handling (which is apart from LogC accuracy). Emotion II is especially egregious, because it features pre-release GHa (pre-Blue and other updates), and the original 8bit PRE, with a hasty midnight grade. I knew (and noted then) that it was a poor technical showcase, but something that I wanted to make for some time That being said, V1 did have an important flaw (apart from the limitations of that process). That flaw was related to the fact that I did not own the Alexa, and had a single window to get the measurements right. I opted to use different lenses, which I thought would be sufficiently neutral. I didn't get a PL adapter for the GH5, and only realized that this would be a problem upon reviewing the results of the shoot. It turned out that Zeiss CP.2s are quite poor in color rendition, but my Sigma 18-35 was excellent. So, I neutralized the grayscale white balance... a kind of continuous white balance shift throughout the grayscale, to accommodate the difference Subsequently, I bought an Alexa (really), to make it perfect. This has proved vital, because I have redone the measurements countless times now, tweaking and tweaking again (same lenses all the way). V2 is approaching the theoretical 'perfect conversion' because of this, and because of the new process, which features 25 times the number of samples, and the code I wrote to handle that unwieldy sample count to a new standard of accuracy and smoothness (previously out of reach with the given degree of intricate transform)

hi. V1 vas close to alexa in case of colors and provided references. As i can see now there are some color differens between new and old luts. So... do you try to create more correct alexa colors or what?) for me the main idea is to create the transformation lut for gh5 vlog to achieve alexa c-log colors and dr as close as possible. Following instructions to shoot with the same wb and exposure

I don't think a big camera is a problem if you have a big crew. With a second AC to carry everything and swap batteries, set up monitor, etc. and a first to pull focus and hit record and set up camera settings, and a DIT to handle cards, all you have to do is operate, or not even that if you have an operator, especially for steadicam shots, jib shots, etc. where you'd traditionally have even more crew and definitely get a better result than from the gimbal you're using yourself (no offense). Under those circumstances, why not go for the FS7 or something? The image quality will be better. I suppose you need to plan a bit more to manage crew efficiently, but that's in the job description: "director" of photography. With a crew that size, you can manage a bigger camera better than as a lone gun with a dSLR, at least if you're a good DP, and get the benefits of a better image, too. But without the crew, I'd take whatever the cheapest option was that delivers adequate image quality, probably a dSLR or mirrorless camera, maybe even using autofocus or image stabilization at times. But that's because I'm not a real DP. A bad carpenter blames his tools. I wouldn't blame the camera for being big, it just needs more people to operate it. But in this case a good carpenter might be five people each getting paid $500-$1000/day. So I hear your point, but it all depends what you're working on and what the budget is. Fwiw, I shoot with a medium/small mirrorless camera and get better results with it than when I operated or DPed on shoots with an Alexa. But I didn't do a great job on those shoots (nor have the resources I needed) and I'd just like to hope that with experience and access to a full crew that would change. But it probably won't for me since I'm a hobbyist. This doesn't reflect poorly on you or on me, I don't think, at least not necessarily. (It reflects poorly on me that I can't operate an Alexa well, but I never said you couldn't.) I've seen some extremely high end content (award winning major national campaigns) shot by lone wolf directors and DPs on 5Ds. And that stuff is breathtaking. They were working under circumstances where they didn't have access to a full crew, but rather wanted more time to wait on the right light etc. or in remote locations, and they made the right compromise.

I think Simon is right actually. If money is no object, I would go a7Riii over a7iii. I found the rolling shutter performance especially in the S35 mode to be truly remarkable. The best of any mirrorless Ive ever seen!

Spread the love, not the hate! Take the victories as they come knowing you can't win all the fights (and some aren't worth stepping in the ring for). The world is too big to make everyone happy, so whatever you do, do it for yourself and don't be bothered too much with what others think. Seen you and Albert Fast do great things with the new Olympus Pro f/1.2 optics and I appreciate the willingness to share your findings with us!

Just buy a 1DC and call it a day. Use the leftover money to buy some margaritas and lounge back in a chair as you convert MJPG to ProRes all day.

CCD sensors definitely got that "classic digital" mojo and better yet are mostly global shutter. it's kind of a shame no one recently aside from digital bolex has done either still/video cams using a CCD in favor of CMOS due to the race in DR & high ISO performance. I'd love to pick up an old CCD cam just for fun but problem is theyr'e usually SD resolution & using obsolete formats like DV/Firewire etc.. I did find the Panasonic AG-HMC150 which is actually built around the aforementioned cult DVX100 but shoots in 1080p (upscaled) and records to SD: IQ looks amazing imo & nails that vibe, but sadly camera seems real hard to find if not impossible here in europe

One way is to use these free tools. At the bottom of the 3dlc page, are +/- exposure and +/- wb generated for specific gammas/gamuts. This can be done with lutcalc as well, but these are already made. Place these look up tables proceeding any other lut/transform, so the following recieves the values it's designed for. Read up thoroughly on luts/transforms etc...if you have not. Use camera man Ben's lut calc to transform from one gamut and/or gamma to another. Xdcamuser is also a great place to learn about your sony cameras from someone who is an actual expert. Most of the talk here is quite simply the blind leading the blind. https://cameramanben.github.io/LUTCalc/LUTCalc/index.html @Gregormannschaft https://3dlutcreator.com/3d-lut-creator---materials-and-luts.html?pro=vvk&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_content=NEW-TEST&utm_campaign=PS&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIluzG-bnV2gIVW7bACh1M_g7UEAAYASADEgKD6_D_BwE

I believe it's user error, and a common one unfortunately, even among people who actually teach log grading. He shot many clips in S-Log2/S-Gamut, and forgot to convert color space during color correction. This a screenshot from his video: Here it is corrected with the color space transform plugin in Resolve, I only added a bit of contrast: Now if I skip color space transformation and only apply contrast and saturation, see what happens: And finally this is the uploaders grade: So it's pretty clear what's happening here, it's not the camera's fault.

I've always loved the DVX100. It was the BMCC of it's day. I shot many things on it for about 5 years, including my first feature: Before the DVX, my first "big boy" camera was the Canon GL2. Here's a short I shot with that camera: These cameras are definitely "retro" now, which is weird to think of.

I honestly think there's more to it than that, any camera can look bad. Check YT, you can find pretty crap 1DX MK II clips, especially if you watch in HD. "More" 1DX II clips might look better because if you drop $6K on a camera you probably know what you're doing, aside from the occasional user with extra cash. But with the cheaper Sony cam's, the barrier to entry is so low there are so many crap clips out there because you get lots of people that don't bother tweaking settings, they just shoot, and then pretend color grade (not that I'm the best), which YT then chews up and spits out, especially if you are not a big YT star / advertiser. I've seen some really good 1DX MK II clips and I won't knock what it can do, but for 1/3 the price the Sony can deliver some decent results as well.

I don't think so. In addition, it is often helpful for crew to be connected to the world outside the set, as, for instance, they might be expecting delivery of gear/expendables or waiting on the arrival of other crew, or if they are consulting a technical expert on a new piece of gear outside the set, etc. Are you certain that they have not consolidated gear nor prepped for the next shot? With pro crews, a lot of that work is built-in to the process and is muscle memory. Would you rather have pros who do their job without thinking and who, consequently, have free time to deal with any unexpected eventualities, or would you rather have inexperienced crew who must constantly focus on every detail and might miss something important or strike out when thrown a curve? If you are genuinely concerned about whether or not they are prepped for the next shot, you can merely have your AD remind the department heads what's coming next. If you do so, you will probably find out that the crew is several steps ahead of you. By the way, consolidation of gear is usually automatic and built-in, because it it makes the work much easier for the crew and makes it easy to deal with unexpected problems, and, most importantly, wrap goes much faster! If you see a pro crew sitting around on their phones or twiddling their thumbs, it's probably because everything is done, dressed, staged and prepped, and they are waiting for the department head to give them their next order -- it's usually a good sign. Also, if there are any sudden, unexpected changes, there is a free pro crew on hand to roll with the punches.

So he's used it for a couple of hours max, recording in a low stress nature setting with perfect natural light. He proceeds to make a review admittedly littered with exaggeration. Definitely fits in at Eoshd.

There is plenty of hobbyist drop big $$ on hasselblad & leica stuff, they cost way more than ursa mini pro (especially with Chinese tourist i see, they even buy kid's leica camera to use lol) It is still cheap compare to some other hobbyist like cars/boat/gliders/airplane, we have one person in our work fly a glider every other weekend, another one fly and own a soviet yak-52 as hobby, he said it cost few hundred dollars to fly his yak-52 each time For me gh5s is good investment, did 20k job with it so already got money back and just come back from a nice trip in japan (it sucks to go on holiday without spending some on nice food and nice hotel lol) Though i use different camera when on holiday or other stuff but i m not alone in that one, i also found out some photog use different camera when they are on holiday (i know two use canon professionally but use fuji for other stuff), that way i have a different "mood" so i am actually on leisure and not remind me of myself working.

I dont mean investment in $ profit. I mean investment in my skillset. I learn something with every camera I buy. I am more about investing in knowledge. I could do wedding, event, corporate video's but then I would loose my passion so fast. I am not in this for the money as most of you are, as I already have a job. Its a hobby where I choose to spend my time and money on. I rather develop my skill up to a certain level, so I could do certain projects where I could work creative but still deliver high quality.

E M1 II 4K video shot in French Alps: