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I don't see any apologies. I just see people that accept reality for what it is and how they will deal with it. I still don't understand why this is happening. Why is this entire forum up in flames over a bunch of newly announced, awesome, in their own ways, cameras? Why do we as a group choose to use the occasion for constant wining, competing, measure penises, attack and ridicule those who dont think exactly like us? Why aren't we discussing what these new things will add to this community? Why does everyone go to bash in the thread of their least favorite instead of having a pleasant conversation in the thread about the one that is their favorite? Positive posts seems to always end up in a thread about other stuff, just as flame instead of where it belongs. 3 new major announcements within a week or so + more to come = The most negative atmosphere ever on a camera forum = Psychotic I remember when NAB, Photokina, etc made forums a fun place.

Look! Magic Lantern want an EOS R. And I know just the guy to give them one... As you can see, Magic Lantern tweeted @ Canon Rumors that they would very much like an EOS R body. Well together my friends, we can make this happen! Be ready tomorrow morning Eastern time. This is when Canon Rumors are starting the competition. All you need to do is enter it. Do whatever's required, even if it involves stupid hashtags like #BeTheRevolution If you're chosen simply reply that you wish for Magic Lantern to have the camera. In return, I'll mention your heroic act on the blog. And if Canon Rumors doesn't end up putting that EOS R body in Magic Lantern's direction, I'll simply point out the truth, that the site Canon once threatened to close down has finally SOLD OUT to the PR machine in a fit of hashtags and Canon giveaways. Yes, the site that leaks and plunders the camera industry for whatever they can find, has finally been tamed! But Canon Rumors have this chance to redeem themselves. Give the camera to Magic Lantern. Contact Canon Rumors here and urge them to support Magic Lantern with the unit

When I die, I want Canon to lower my casket at my funeral so they can let me down one last time.

This is a really good idea. The forum software doesn't have a Ghost feature but it should have it. I had to ban him in the end. Too much BLAH BLAH.

On the subject of adapters, the PL adapter is out already before the camera has shipped. I expect an EF adapter to follow just as quickly from China https://www.newsshooter.com/2018/09/06/mtf-services-nikon-z-mount-adapters/ No. I ban people when they are a pain in the fucking arse.

So taking in all the info and videos... It seems like a better sensor, processor, much improved still AF, some strong still features (30fps for 66 frames raw!)... Great video AF, zebras, 10bit 4K/60p (4:2:0), colour looks beautiful, as expected... 120p is now as strong as the other 1080p framerates. 12 stops on Eterna, more in f-log, H265 codec option, much reduced rolling shutter, 17ms in 4K. 4K 30fps now records for 30 minutes, 60p for 20 minutes. 4K crop similar to XT2. Very impressed, and would bet my house on a 4:2:2 upgrade in the future (Hybrid Log Gamma upgrade already confirmed). The only thing holding me back is the idea that the XH2 will probably have all of the above plus 10bit 4:2:2 and IBIS, making for a more or less perfect hybrid. They know how to keep you hooked!

A few test stills showing some daylight and mixed lighting - I also posted a couple different exposure of shot to show clipped highlights. I have finally developed my node structure in resolve to a powergrade with the olpf, the hue passthrough and my extra contrast added after GHa in LAB colorspace. Seeing as I how I haven't convinced work to invest in Pansonic(they use sonys sadly) I will hopefully have my first personal shoot coming up to really put GHa through its paces. Loving this conversion!

Do you want to be banned? Heading the right way. You're an irritant. What does 10bit HDMI have anything to do with anything? I am talking about the superb internal Nikon colour and codec. I couldn't give a crap about hooking up an HDMI recorder just for 10bit, you can barely tell the difference in quality anyway. I have a lot of interesting lenses to use on it. Nikon F mount ones. Sigma ones. PL. There will be adapters to all sorts. You are a jealous Canon fanboy and an idiot of the first order. Let's vote on it. Should MdB get the boot? He's obviously trolling now. Every day. I am sick of reading this shit and it cluttering up every thread!

Of all the new stuff, the Z7 is the one I am leaning towards buying. The full frame 4K looks like D850++ And that already looked like a 1D C. VERY cinematic. It has superb colour. Nikon's colour science is just as good as Canon's, maybe even a bit better. Great dynamic range. Flat profile and now they have LOG as well. You only have to see some of the early sample videos to see how nice the skin tones are. I don't see any softness, moire, aliasing or rolling shutter issues in the sample videos. I am sure Z6 is fine as well but maybe 1080/120p is better on the Z7. Nikon's codec implementation is superb. Has been since the D750. Now it is high-bitrate 4K. A total winner. I like the look of the ergonomics (and colour science) more than my Sony bodies. I expect MdB will reply next saying why you should buy a shitty EOS R instead, haha. I only have one concern and that is the AF via Nikon F adapter. The native lenses are a bit boring for the price. It clearly has great video AF with those Z lenses but if it has great video AF with Nikon F lenses as well, I am sold, because I already have a bunch of those including Sigma ART.

Jordan already tested it Still no 8K 16 bit raw recording at 240fps with sub 500 Eur price tag. Shame. I think i'll wait for X-T6 or GH9.

With a little lot of temporal noise reduction, I'm getting some pretty impressive results out of this sensor. Granted, there are some artifacts from the heavy NR, but it still looks quite usable to me. Shot 30 minutes after sunset. For an idea of how little light there was, look at the headlights on the hill in the background at the start of the clip, the various phone screens you can see throughout, and the city lights in the background towards the end. I haven't owned any of DJI's previous drones but I have a hard time believing any of the 1/2.3" sensors would have been able to get anything remotely looking like this.

Not this again ?

Publish and be damned? In the run up to IBC, I was put on mailing lists by PR agencies against my will, working for various camera-related brands. I received invite after invite to meet, to talk, to build bridges and make friends. Meanwhile DJI was spamming my forum via a fake user, advertising the Mavic 2. Read the full article

Nikon Z looks the best out of the new offerings to me. I think the lenses are perfect too. The faster primes will be 2000$ or more I bet. How is it good to launch with lenses costing more than two grand? F1.8 is fast enough. More importantly it keeps the lens somewhat small. As usual it seems many lust for bragging rights rather than practicality.

I've made you a handy cut out and keep guide of the lenses you'll need for the equivalent of, for example, a Zeiss Compact Prime set **. If you are looking for a 15.55555555561mm prime then I can definitely recommend Tamron's new 15.5555555556mm f2.8. It has far more mojo than Sigma's 15.55555555561mm f1.8 in my opinion. ** Yes, yes, I know the CP.2s would be used on Super35 so there is an additional multiplier to be factored in but it was only a joke anyway.

Wish more cameras would offer 2K as an option We need more than just the boring old UHD / 1080 / 720 resolutions in the usual 16:9! Give us ALL THE OPTIONS in aspect ratios and frame rates

I am pretty sure I already banned the guy behind the name and he just keeps coming back, like a weed.

What year is it, 2009? Shooting 1080p as a "work-around"? We have plenty of choice for full frame 4K. A7S II, A7R II, A7 III, A7R III, Z6, Z7, D850 and soon A7S III / Panasonic full frame. You buy a full frame camera to shoot full frame stills and full frame video that looks the same as the stills. It's HYBRID camera. If you want to shoot 1.8x crop, get a GH5S or a GH5. You'll have money left over for the EF Speed Booster. I really don't understand why people are making apologies for such a shit spec.

H.265 is chosen because the ARM processors have 10bit HEVC hardware-accelerated encoding. At high bitrate, encoding efficiency/quality between H.264 and H.265 is identical.

Drone cameras are a category unto their own, because they have the best possible heat dissipation (which will never be replicated in a handheld camera). However, I would not be surprised if DJI surprised us with a serious mirrorless entry in the future.

It’s a law of nature of marketing a new product: the less quality you are offering the more noise you have to make. It’s as simple as this. The Pharmaceutical Industrie is the best proof for this law. New drugs, being as ineffective as the previous generation, have to pushed hard, e.g. on one week events for the so called oppinion leaders in the Carribean, Hawaii and locations like this, of course with spouses. An invitation to Hawaii for the so called "camera journalists" (unfortunately only 2 days, no spouses) tells me that the new product is not worth considering at all. Industrial Products Sales Manager, Germany

I don't think people hate it. It's just not terribly exciting on paper. Its too early to really judge yet though. I'd say the reaction to the Nikon is lukewarm. The Canon on the other hand... now there might be some hate there. I'd recommend waiting to see what the Panasonic announcement brings. Its the last big imminent announcement I think, and it could very well steal the show.

It's a Tax write off. 2 cameras will cover it. When you are Incorporated you can take a 3 year Rapid Deprecation and write the whole thing off. I have had two businesses Incorporated. Easy Peezy. Same with the Rental properity's I owned. You can write them off quick. Countries give Company's, Corporations every chance there is to succeed. It is what drives the economy and creates jobs.

What I got in this thread is that most of the EOSHD user with a degree in journalism are working in marketing - which show the decline of journalism around the world... (I'm not a journalist, but most of my friends are, and I'm married to one that - you guessed it - is transitioning to marketing )

As opposed to a $500 35mm, a $1100 24-105, a $2300 50 and a $3000 zoom? You're seriously bashing Nikon's initial rollout compared to Canon's? How many are going to buy a $3000 zoom or a $2300 prime over adapting EF lenses? The whole R line is based around Canon shooters adapting their lenses, hence the THREE adapters. Right now they're both counting on existing DSLR users adapting lenses until they round things out. But what's worse is the fact that they've shown zero sensor advancement in the two years since the 5d4 was released. We already know Nikon has 2.8 zooms and a number of primes coming in the next year. All of your Zed bashing are issues Canon has as well, combined with no IBIS and a crappier sensor that's a couple generations behind current Sony offerings. Are you a paid Canon troll? SMH.

I believe no crop unless you are in 4k 60p in which case it is a slight crop. It is a tough one because I think this is the camera everyone wanted the xh1 to be. Sales of that camera should plummet. I think fuji will be forced into bring out an xh2 fairly quickly to the detriment of those who have already invested. It was always a head scratcher when the xh1 came out knowing the xt3 was in the pipeline. I think people should take a wait and see approach with this one as you will probably get 4:2:2 in the xh1 with the ibis. The problem with the fuji system is that there isn't any great stabilised lenses to assist with shakiness. Looking at the cinema 5d footage I can see the wobble.

@seanzzxx great explanation - that makes sense. Thanks!

Canon.

Depends on the channel. For me affiliate links is hardly worth the time copy pasting them into the description. Depends on the county.

Yeah it is only in 4K. I don't think there is a crop in 1080p is there? But you are paying the big money for 4K. And FF to boot. You might as well just stick with a Canon 80D and be done. And at least Nikon has a Known upgrade path out right now with the Z7. It might be 2 years, or never with the Canon. Hell they don't even have a lens map yet long term years out. That sounds kind of scary to me. Probably are some MF aftermarket Cine Lenses out that could do 15mm with the crop? Damn if it even had a 1.3 crop like the 1DX, 1DC it would be bearable. And no IBIS. Those 2 things and it would be pretty damn good. But Nooo, we can't do that. Nikon seems to be able to on the Z6, and even cheaper. But what the hell we are Canon, The Market Leader. ?

YouTube earnings have turned into a pittance. Affiliates and their own products/merch would be their main ways. "No Such Thing as a Free Lunch" It is a common theme that as the supply of jobs for journalists tries up, they've shifted to marketing instead. If the threshold to inviting people was "would they sell two cameras?" then even nobodies like me would get an invite! But of course that would never happen. Canon's threshold of how much influence a person has over sales is much higher than that.

The X-T3 is about to drop and looks amazing. 4K 60p 10bit internal Super 35mm. That is a first and I am amazed the company that showed ZERO interest in video until only about 2 years ago has been the one to do it. The 28-70 F2 in Caleb's picture above, is a valid size comparison to me. He knows he's not comparing like for like, it' just what he had on him and it's a good size comparison because we're familiar with the size of the GH5. The 28-70 is absolutely enormous and mega heavy. Nearly 2kg like the old BMCC. Canon can fool their customers but they can't fool physics

Only workaround is simply to shoot 1080p. FF stills & video. Obviously not the camera for FF 4K. That boat sailed (or should i say sunk) about 20 hours ago!

I can't speak to other critics. I was optimistic earlier in this thread, before the specs came out, since I've liked every canon I've shot with. the 4K crop is a deal breaker. The only reason I'd upgrade from my apsc is to get full frame. I shoot photos an video, sometimes in quick succession. I can't have my current lens behave differently depending on the mode I'm in. I'd rather just stick with apsc. If I didn't shoot any video then it wouldn't matter to me, of course, but most members on eoshd care about video. 120 fps being in 720 is also a downgrade for me, and that's a feature I've used on almost every project in the past year an a half. so on the other hand I see the Nikon z6, which has much more of what I need, for less money. I'm not mad at canon or anythin stupid like that, but for me it is very clear that the eos r is not worth the money. yeah, unfortunately they don't. If I see a Sony or Panasonic (or canon) that looks like a worthwhile upgrade, I will! I'm pretty happy with what I've got at the moment, I just like keeping up with the news.

I knew all hell was gonna break lose today and everybody is entitled their opinions but calling people morons for being interested in purchasing this camera, or calling it a rip-off is just wrong & uncalled for. People have the right to be interested in this camera and nobody is forcing them to buy it. We all have different needs & backgrounds. So let's just all settlle down shall we? Canon hinted at 2 other bodies coming. My guess is they're IBIS & next-gen sensor tech is still in R&D but they wanted to respond quickly to Nikon and this is what came out of it. This is their first effort, not the end all be all. I was expecting far worst actually, and at a higher price. Not trying to make excuses either, the severe 4k crop blows as is the HFR & lack of IBIS. They did make up for it in other parts (Eye AF, DPAF + Focus guide MF, 10-bit out, Control ring, VariND adapter etc) and the lens line-up is pretty impressive. Nikon have I feel a much better rounded product with no major flaws, but it kinda lacks in flavor / fun-factor, especially the lenses. Feels like a more rugged industrial Sony clone. Can't say i find myself terribly excited about it even though i know it's the superior tool. As always I'll reserve final judgement until I try these out in person but the jury is still out as far as i'm concerned, the lens system being the real tipping point for me.

The problem is that the biggest critics were never going to buy one anyway. And if you look at the video specs, other than the 4K crop and no IBIS, the camera is pretty damn good and beats a lot of other camera’s offerings.

Good lord... when did I say people shouldn’t debate or discuss cameras? Obviously, I have a shit ton of posts and that’s why I’m here. But I don’t waste my precious time, going into camera threads that I have no intention of ever buying just to bash it. These are the people I’m talking about. I also am not going to cry over a camera not having features I want/need like a little baby. It’s an effin camera. I’ve seen your work, you are a talented guy. I’m sure you could go out with a t2i or an a6000 and make great videos, so I wasn’t even talking about you. Methinks you doth a dork. “Let down...” it’s a goddamned camera for Christ’s sake. I was let down as soon as they introduced a new mount... I think it was a moronic move on Canon’s part. But as I just wrote to Wolf whatever... I wasn’t talking about you anyway. I’m not talking about disappointed people, I’m referring to the trolls that only appear during Canon releases, or the fanboys that have nothing better to do than poke around here. I know you’ve shot with a bunch of cameras and are brand agnostic, and I believe that this doesn’t suit your needs. It doesn’t suit mine 100% either but it doesn’t mean it is entire crap and that the camera doesn’t have a bunch of interesting features.

Are yall really this naive? This has been going on for decades, if not centuries. I worked at a tech press agency in the early 00's and we got invited all over europe for product releases.. Sony, Nokia, Apple.. Open bars, buffets, gift bags...etc.. The first iPod, we all got to take one home.. I get this may shock people, and I can't say i condone such practices but like it or not it's pretty standard within the industry. I also don't get why Canon is being singled-out here. Nikon flew the same guys out to NYC 2 weeks ago, gave them helicopter tours. Sony flew them to Las Vegas for A73 launch, had them on dune buggies etc.. i didn't hear any outrage over that and the outcoming reviews. Finally i didn't find DPreview or Jared Polins after-launch videos to be in any way apologetic towards the product? If anything they all seemed very jet-lagged & tired out, so maybe Hawai wasn't even that brilliant of an idea. Just my $0.2

It's time we also held the so-called reviewers responsible for driving the hype-train for handicapped technology for the sake of their pennies in affiliate links. Calling these things "reviews" is fake news. When you're flown out and dined in Hawaii it's not a review, it's a rim job.

Well put, Andrew. Thank you. As one person put it, it is us, the consumers, that end up footing the bill for these events and the nauseating, sugar-coated reviews we get from it later. The extra $300 on the EOS-R body covers the cost of this dishonest extravaganza. Need to put pressure on the "journalists" and unsubscribe from their channels...

Dear Andrew, first time I actually comment on your forum. I really wanted to mention that I appreciate you being truthful to yourself and outspoken. As mostly a consumer of news/hobby videographer I am only interested in a critical view at new developments (both positive and negative). Ultimately, what works for one person with any given camera does not necessarily work for another and vice versa. So please do not change that approach and keep on with your journalistic approach. Being myself a Head of Marketing in the B2B world (instead of B2C) I can only underline your statement, Andrew, that nobody can really stay 100% objective after having been nicely treated at a wonderfully orchestrated event. If that were so, why would marketers literally pour tremendous amounts of money into such events if „theoretically“ good marketing claims could speak for themselves? Such events serve but one goal: Paint the newly launched product in the best possible light and create a fan basis for it subliminally. Who better to try to influence than multipliers? In many corporations codes of conduct (especially in purchasing departments) were developed over the past thirty years to try to reduce this kind of influencing from suppliers by not accepting any gift whatsoever from them. Being on the marketing side I also ethically feel much better creating marketing stories/events for newly launched products where I know that there is fundamentally good evidence that this product will excel in at least one or better even in many categories/features vs competitor products. But when faced with a bad product to be newly launched it can be a tough job for any marketer. All the more reason to focus on the soft factors in marketing via nice events. Last but not least: What is objectivity, anyway? How do you measure that? An honest opinion (negatives and positives) will always be biased but at least honest and not pretending to be non-biased.

The name is still valid EOS camera is still mainly a HD camera with 4k as afterthought, otherwise Andrew have to change eos4k or something ?

I'll start believing these are impartial events when they start holding them in Hull instead of Hawaii.

I make a good living and was ready to hand B&H my CC# for one + the 35 1.8 and the 28-70 F/2. I told myself I would not if the crop was worse that 1.4-1.5 in UHD. Canon shot themselves in the foot again. Canon is like the EX you broke up with a couple years ago - she comes back around every so often - you have a good one night fling and romanticize about the past. Go out to dinner, talk about the 5d3 raw back in 2013, hop into bed. Then the next day you hear she's still doing drugs - hasn't changed at all. There's a reason you two broke up. I wanted to be wrong here - haven't been excited about a camera for a while - I hate the Sony colors and overheating, hate Panasonic's shitty AF, etc. Yes, but are you 100% sure it's UHD out and not just 1080p out? I don't recall any Canon bodies doing UHD HDMI out.

Been lurking in this thread since the announcement. Thought I'd throw my hat in the ring and put some color on the footage. I wanted to color it with the least amount of lift to get it looking good, so I chose colored it within Premiere only using the available Lumetri Color panel. No sharpening or grain correction (adding or removing), no HSL Secondary, just color. My rationale for this being that I think the BPCC4k would fair rather well on shoots for a media company who's main delivery is YT/FB/.Com etc. This is the world I currently work in professionally, and the skill level of a video team in that world can vary greatly. I think it fairs pretty well without going with an extreme pro level of correction, with fairly minimal time spent. Which is exciting when I'm thinking about projects where the deadline is tight.

Offer him $5, that is what it is worth.

its funny how panasonic is the more video orientated camera but olympus lenses are better for video with the manual clutch and look better too

Here are my tests from the past day with 1736x1120 resolution. https://vimeo.com/286711725 https://vimeo.com/286711914 Using a $30 toy c-mount lens (can't figure out how to embed...)

Flags can be very handy in a studio setup - often much quicker to adjust or attach a flag then get a flag on a stand and position it. If I'm shooting in a setup where there are lots of light sources potentially visible, I stick all the flags on. And keep in mind, just because light isn't hitting the sensor, it can still be hitting the lens (esp, say, a full-frame lens on a small sensor camera). Sometimes you don't even know you're getting some flare until you see the same shot flagged. A variable ND isn't an ND at all - it's two polarizers. So yes, it can jack up a shot pretty badly, particularly skies or expanses of solid color, or long camera moves. And for close ups with skin, it can really deaden the skin. And they can be hard to match from shot to shot. A matte box with a rotating stage is really handy for ND grads and polarizers. You'll stop thinking of a grad as "just for the sky" and use them to, say, knock down a bright sidewalk or wall. And with pola's, it makes it easy to kill (or enhance) reflections. A pola in a rotating stage eats a lot less light than a circular pola, which is 2 stacked polarizers. If you're 100% "run and gun", a matte box could be a hassle (but then, you should be shooting with a camera made for run & gun, with switchable ND and a good EVF and so on). (I see a lot of newbies say their "style" is "run n' gun", when in reality run & gun is a situation). I don't find 4x4's slow me down significantly. If I were shooting an event, I'd use my big "video" camera. Most other situations, you have a few minutes to frame a shot and work out the DOF and exposure you want. I'd say the minimum to look for is 2 stages, at least one rotates - adjustable height; flags that attach securely and can be removed and adjusted without tools; and flags with no open slots at the mount, as you'll get reflections of your FF gears in your footage!