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is 8k SHARP enough?

The Atomos guy states the Nikon Z6/7 internal raw is absolutely possible. He even makes it sound like something that they might well plan to implement at some point, The Atomos guy said they recorded in linear gamma.

8K - the only way to get a true 4K image!

I dont understand these comments about the X-T3 feeling like it could fall apart. Ive owned tons of Fuji’s as well as Panasonics, Sonys and Nikons, ove never felt the Fuji were somehow cheaply made. I think this is just becoming troll central.

I don’t think it’s about releasing an “unfinished” product. It’s because our minds are stuck in pre-computerised concepts. Nobody would accuse Apple or Microsoft of unreleasing unfinished products just because they update the OS now and then. And it’s not only about fixing bugs. If you have a software system which you can improve, why wouldn’t you? I’d go so far to say there should be some regulation so that any product can be pushed as far as possible in firmware before releasing subsequent products. It’s horribly wasteful to do otherwise. Its only quite recently that the nature of software is starting to make an imprint in a wider sense. We are hardware minded in general. I know, for example, more recently in airplane software there are structures making sure flight critical software is completely separated from other software. This way systems can be upgraded continuously without the entire system needing to be re-tested and certified. So the concept of upgrade is built in to the core architecture from the start. We’re still quite a few years away before the nature of software is fully absorbed. To treat software based technology, like digital cameras, as if they’re fixed hardware objects from days old will look equally ridiculous as early cars that looked like horse carriages look to us now. In a sense the current transition is even weirder. I would say all cameras should be continuously updated. The camera makers may charge for that. I would not expect it to be free of charge. The failure to properly valorise software is of course another remnant of old thinking. People don’t want to pay for these things which is, of course, totally absurd.

What CMS are you using? I've dabbled a little in what was the big three of the time (mostly WordPress, a little Drupal, and a teeny bit Joomla. And probably a little else here and there I'm forgetting). Not so for me. I'm living the dream! Doing filmmaking, and on any time off I have then I'm getting paid to cycle! Double win-win for me.

Looks like Atomos is saying the Nikon can output higher resolution than 4K. Their video at CES was shot in 4K or more and at 12 bit.

That a giant slap on Panasonic's face, JVC and Sharp can show what M43 can really capable off.. So much for M43 is dead according to that Tony guy

HLG doesn't require the payed update. If you are shooting in 10bit you'll have HLG as an option.

I wouldn't call 1.18 a large crop.

The stills side also need to be taken in account for hybrid shooters. Already got a z6 and wanted to later add a Bmpcc4k, I'm gonna wait to see what is coming from Nikon as firmware additions !

I've shot continuous 1080 ML raw on a 5D with a 256GB Lexar card on occasion with no issues whatsoever. This was simultaneously on a 5D Mark II and III.

Yeah the 5D3 and ML Raw shoots continuous 1080p 14bit Raw. Since I shoot narratives, I’ve never recorded super long takes but I have shot upwards of 5 minutes without any hiccups.

Well maybe they just really can't produce a good enough Sensor or Processor to get the job done? Or a combination of both? They may just be that far behind, say Sony. And I can see Canon's point about not having Raw or 4K back then. It would Have to be reliable and not overheat, and it would have to last a LOT longer in duration than what ML can do recording wise. Nobody would buy a camera that can only work for a limited time, and just be totally unreliable when you need it. Now maybe they could have done 2K. I don't know. 2K is a pretty big jump up from 1080p.

I think I've worked out how we stay relatively sane and civil on these forums when talking about cameras.... We let it all out in threads like this! I mean, seriously, read this thread from the beginning in one go! ???

Yes, that's exactly what I thought when I wrote "I'm not saying it is deliberate, but more a kind of opportunity to make the camera live a long and evolving life !". My rather limited English bridle my capacity to express what I think ? I too need to update my software !!

The release notes : Added 1080p 25/50fps and 4K 25/50fps resolution to basic settings. Added support to shoot 3x3 panorama photos when the tilt axis is between -20° and 80°. Optimized FaceTrack in DJI Mimo. Increased the time that the gimbal is in position to fit into the cover from five to eight seconds. Optimized the focus in ActiveTrack and when detecting faces. Optimized ActiveTrack when the gimbal is in Portrait and Flashlight mode. Fixed the issue where a red tint appeared when using Auto White Balance (AWB) in scenes that were predominantly green. Fixed the issue affecting some devices where the charging time was slow.

Was just a joke, Snowbro. Never thought that you would that seriously.

I use polar pro - well built,good quality, fit well and go on and off easily. Can’t say whether they are worth the premium price over pgytech. For the Mavic pro 2 - with its variable aperture - you really only need an nd8 equivalent to control your shutter speed and you can buy single nds at Polarpro.

After a topic is established as the primary topic for a product, it would make sense to just change the topic title to the said product name.

New Firmware update (01.07) Finally added 25/50p for us PAL users, also FOV seems a bit wider too? Still waiting for Cinelike D though.

Did they cover fully-normalised databases yet? If someone says they've studied database design (in a programming context) and they don't know when a fully-normalised database is better than a semi-normalised database, then I just assume they're lying and/or don't know anything I think it's down to the clothing. @Kisaha also said "which for my country equals to Polar temperatures" which is true for me as well because we don't have clothing that is suitable for that kind of thing because it basically never happens! The wife and I are contemplating visiting Antarctica at some point, and apart from renting some really nice lenses I think I'd also rent some suitable clothing too

In a battle between the people with 100 million guns and the government, my money is on the side with the predator drones, not with the side who can't even talk about photography equipment online without getting into an argument.

Based on the Z Cam E2 already having done it, I'm also pretty certain it can be done.. ? That's not the limit in terms of what is state of the art either... both the RED MONSTRO 8K VV and the RED HELIUM 8K S35 do 8K60, and in theory they should be able to pump enough pixels for 4K240, so either they didn't think anyone wanted it, or there's some other limitation.

we need tha guns for tha tyrannical government tho if shit ever hits the fan with the US gov and yall find out whos really in control of things, youre going to be thanking god almighty that theres an army of 100 million gun owners in america

For me, it definitely does. When I'm doing run-and-gun work, while shooting shallow with cinema or manual focus lenses, I am rarely confident that my focus will be tack sharp. The resolution is significantly lower to the point in which everything seems to blend together. The funny thing is I have the same issue even when I am using my Ninja V. When the framing is normal, the image looks gorgeous, but once I punch-in, I get that same low-res look. I had any easier time focusing using the Focus Assist or Focus Sharpness(whatever its called) feature on the SmallHD Focus.

No worries mate... -3 would make me pretty grumpy too! All professions, huh? ALL professions? Really? Lawyers? Lobbyists? Hitmen? ..................Politicians? ???

Yeah that comment about waiting for A6000 users to reply sums things up perfectly!

Yeah but doesn't the Z Cam E2 do like 4K 120p? So it seems like maybe it can be done?

Let alone the dropped frames... LOL

Britain will be just fine come March! Exactly. Let's not forget how good we've got it now! :-) Which is why it is really sad any time top notch pros like John Brawley leaves ? :-/

This fact illustrates how EOSHD is better than DPReview ? This is one of the things I love about forums, experiencing all the wide ranging diversity of opinions and perspectives. (even if that means you have to take a dose of the crazy in as well along the way....) Would there be overall an increase in crime?? It isn't that clear cut. For one I fully expect the high number of knife attacks would decrease..... Exactly!

Because camera buying is a religion and people gain a god like level of clarity as to which brand to worship. That is a really sad story ? ? And sadly it is far from unique either.

I never said uncompressed, but Raw should be mathematically lossless to be a legitimate Raw format. It should also have a linear gamma, little to no digital processing, and no debayering if originating from a bayer sensor. Any video format can be treated as a "digital negative" and store information that can be recovered later. Most log curves are designed to do just that. If I make a video format that simply takes the bayer data from a sensor, pretend that every group of 3 pixels is a single RGB pixel, then apply ordinary ProRes compression to the entire thing, that's certainly not RAW at all. I suspect that is very nearly what ProRes RAW does. You can essentially change the white balance on any video if you transform it into linear gamma before doing so. The only hindrance is that most cameras don't store the original white balance metadata in non-raw formats. As long as ProRes RAW retains all the information from pixels sufficiently, it should be just as flexible as any of the other Raw-lite formats for white balance adjustments. It does seem silly that it is not builtin, though.

Hard to control movements precisely with a gimbal. A little movement translates to a big movement on a long lens.

@Geoff_L I had the view assist on when I made that video. Maybe the issue goes away in ProRes Raw... that would be nice.

-5 everything except hue and contrast at 0. For the best straight out of camera look I'd recommend Natural. It has the nicest roll off and colors are pretty accurate. HLG is the best if you are going to edit heavy in post or want the most dynamic range. Cine-D for when you can't use HLG(8 bit recording).

Looks like DPR forum now!!! ?

No insult intended! Sorry if that's what it sounded like. I sympathise for the struggles that the pros are experiencing with the changes in the industry, and in a sense I just have my struggles in a different industry. I've had my fair share of stress from work (or the lack of it) during my career and there is just as much criticism and commentary of my industry from those outside it as there is in photography I think. We all live somewhere and holiday somewhere else, and we all work in one industry and have hobbies in other industries.

I agree with @GiM_6x. We should put some effort into using words correctly. Its the reason netflix wont allow upscaled alexa footage to be considered 4k. Prores raw, redcode raw, bmraw, are all fine formats. I dont have an issue with them as formats, but it is marketing bs to call them "RAW." Its not a matter of whats "needed" for a given production, its quite simply a matter of using correct terminology. Its like putting an 8 bit stream into a 10 bit container and calling it 10 bit.

There's no crop with just sensor stabilization, even in 4K.

Call them again and say that you are a very active member of the HK forum. Probably your package will be delivered very fast after it.

Canon will respond to this with their new Canon MJPEG RAW!

Seems more info will be arriving along this NAB... from our @DaveAltizer :

first i wasnt going to post this, bc this thread started really smart, but its falling fast. @Snowbro turns out there are some good canadians

I think two of the biggest challenges that we face in photography, and which starts fights, are: People make different kinds of films. I just started another thread with a great BTS from an adventure film-maker who shoots everything 60p so he has flexibility in post with which things he can use for slow-motion. This makes sense for adventure film-making, but would be stupid in narrative work where slow-motion plays very little part. If I had a zillion dollars then the best camera for narrative work might be an Alexa, but if I'm going to jump out of a plane it sure wouldn't be (extreme example) but also if you're running a studio for a game-show then the Alexa is probably also not the best choice. People see differently and have different tastes. Lots of the talk about colour science is about taste, but some people can't see colour that well and don't care. Some people are much more sensitive to motion and care about the 180 degree shutter, whereas others are sticklers for blowing highlights and chase high DR cameras with low noise and >8-bit outputs to ensure that the foreground looks good and the highlights aren't clipped. Most of the "this camera/lens/mic/preamp/tripod/etc is better" arguments are really people judging equipment according to their individual sensory perceptions, their workflow priorities, and their shooting situations and then thinking other people are stupid because other people have different perceptions / workflows / and shooting situations and evaluate differently. I think the solution is for people to be more curious. If someone says something you disagree with, instead of disagreeing with them, try asking them why they disagree, or how they came to that conclusion. This is how to cool a situation and learn something as well.

The older I get the more I realise that people are mostly fuelled by their irrational insecurities and emotional baggage. I've also realised that people make most of the decisions in their lives (especially major ones) with almost no knowledge whatsoever. Think about buying a house for example - it's the largest investment that most people will ever make, but look at how many people got it so wrong in the US. Same goes with investing in the stock market - I'm not aware of even one economist that predicted the GFC correctly and that's what they do for a living. People are completely rubbish at picking a life partner, look at divorce rates, and those are the ones that aren't still stuck in awful situations by religion, cultural pressures, or economic factors. The general populace are so miserable overall with their life choices that a huge percentage are on some kind of anti-depressant medication. I could go on.... So, if people live their lives with judgement so impaired that they get major investment decisions wrong, choose the wrong partners, can't create happiness in their lives, and then don't even decide to get therapy but opt for medication instead, why would you expect that they will be able to somehow transcend all that and become informed, rational, and articulate people when it comes to cameras? The other factor in this whole thing is that the photography industry is undergoing massive change. Most people don't adapt well to change, and those that are resisting are competing with everyone else for the traditional type of work that they're used to doing which there is less and less of. I think this is the main reason that many photographers are bitter and angry all the time. If you hang out in communities related to industries that are expanding, or where the typical person is new to the field and not clinging to the past then the overall attitude of people is likely to be very different.

Pretty damn interesting comparison with the Osmo Pocket. I must admit the Osmo is a winner in my mind for stabilization. Hmm.

Well then