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And this is one of those three. I have quite a few cameras with MFT mount but I've never really bought anything from the mid let alone high end range of native lenses. Partly because I have lenses that I'd sooner use through adapters but also because I just baulk at the price of them really. As a consequence my collection mainly consists of cheap secondhand editions of the lower end stuff but while I was away I spotted a cheap used edition of a mid end one, the Panasonic Leica DG Vario-Elmarit 12-60mm f/2.8-4, and bought it as I was looking for a fastish (by MFT standards) standard zoom with stabilisation. As this one has a bit of extra reach on the long end, albeit at the loss of some speed, I thought it made even more sense and I have to say its not bad at all, although it probably distorts more than I would like at the wide end. For use as an all round travel zoom, particularly with a non stabilised camera like the OG Pocket Cinema Camera that I was using it with here, I think its a keeper.

Based on just what we know, if Sony released this exact same camera but as the A7sIII, people would be heaping praise on them. - first mirrorless to offer full frame 60p in 4k - 10 bit for 24-60p in 4K (first ever) - very very usable IBIS (unlike Sony’s) - Anamorphic shooting - and oh, btw, the first camera to shoot full frame 6k under $30k... - 14 stops dynamic range with Panasonic’s color science (which is way nicer than Sony). Still hoping for internal NDs, but we’ll see what else they put in here. This thing is PACKED full of features.

Interesting post on RedUser today: http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?176501-New-article-The-Cameras-Behind-Netflix-Best-Series-Spoiler-RED-Dominates&p=1856294&viewfull=1#post1856294 This seems like a more sensical and honest marketing tactic than Red had for the Red One. The David Finchers of the world are exactly who want to use this camera system, and its ergonomics and ecosystem demand the same resources (if not more) than you'd want for an Amira shoot, so it's hardly entry-level. (The David Finchers of the world are sort of the opposite of the Werner Herzogs.... this metaphor makes sense to me but probably not to anyone else.) This is a major departure from Red's original (questionable) pitch for an "affordable" cinema camera for everyone. Red's new high end systems are about as expensive as Arri's. The Raven, meanwhile, seems to have disappeared and the 3k for $3k camera never materialized, and probably never should have. What was the market for that? I'm curious to see if the Foxconn thing ever materializes and in what form. It seems the high end is where the money is still. Despite everything. Also, Red is privately owned by a billionaire so it could still be unprofitable for all we know. Another issue with the sub-$10k camera market is that you have a lower level of production that's using it, and so footage shot with those cameras doesn't look as good as it could for that reason (the original Red suffered from this, too). And how big is this market in the first place and how high are the margins? I'm curious how profitable Canon's, Sony's, and Panasonic's cinema divisions are. Ditto Black Magic. They've cornered a market segment between dSLRs and Alexas that Red seems to be in a rush to abdicate, and there is likely a reason for that. (Selfishly, I hope these cameras stay around because I like them.) Someone posted a teaser months back showing an EVA1-style body that was hinted at during NAB, so this probably has that form factor... more or less... I love the EVA1 and Varicam's color and noise texture–my second favorite image to the Alexa, bar none. Curious if this is positioned above the EVA1 (which is already processing 6k fwiw) or below it and if it maintains that "look" I like, sort of a C300 Mk 1 look with really rich colors. Edit: bar film, I guess.

At least here in Switzerland, the price is part of the problem. The A7 III is on sale for 1849 CHF while the S1 is 2999. That’s not a good basis in combination with the fact that the Sony eco system is a lot better developed.

Agree, that's what I think also - disaster, chasing just for more money now, losing clear distinctive spirit... even as a cleverer business strategy.

Depends on when it's released. Z Cam has FF 6k60 with a planned October release. But I agree with everything you say. It shouldn't be taken lightly that this thing has specs well beyond any of the competition, as was the S1 for that matter. And there are a lot of specs/features that we haven't heard anything about. Rolling shutter? Even if it gets down to ~10ms that would be huge over other FF cameras. How about timecode? Or something as simple as two 1/4-20 holes on the bottom? Nikon is the closest so far, with a 1/4-20 and a locator pin. What if they add a mini XLR like the P4k? A DC power input would streamline a rig. I know most of those probably won't be present, but it's worth waiting to see before dissing it. 6k might be a headline feature, but I'm more interested in the multitude of little things that would make my life easier.

Well I think one of the main reasons Panasonic gets their competitive edge is they were smart. lucky to have had the GH style camera body to start with, and now the S1 body, both being as some people complain, being too big, large, heavy. Well it is proving to be a god send for Panny as everyone, like it or not, is going to have to come up with a larger body to deal with the excess heat. Panasonic is on a roll, but I still worry their luck is running out. This whole FF field is just Way to crowded to have any of them make a decent amount of money doing it.

R = resolution, S = speed (?), and the H = heat ?

ebay but a long time ago but I'll check the transaction list to see if I can find it. https://www.ebay.co.uk/c/1091701075

After going out and climbing the tree in question, I can confirm that it is just less than stellar rendering/focusing the red 'teeth' of the plants against the blue sky. When I say "climbing the tree in question" I mean taking a shot of it with a real lens

Yes but Arri is also renting equipement itself to large productions, They are able to offer complete seamless solutions. Red is selling luxury marketing, including David Fincher who they sponsor . Nothing wrong with that, it s a business after all, but I feel red is in a awkward position now, I think that netflix trend with red is going to fade now that Arri have the LF and the LF mini, those camera are still very recent and that article don t reflect that. Canon and sony have a more define cine/broadcast department that I believe is profitable overall ( I see FS7 and C300 everywhere) Panasonic is more blurry with that I find. Blackmagic are outputting cinema gear at consumer price and also sell a full post production system to go with it, I think their approach is different , people buy because it s cheap and they are willing to try the product, so whether the client is satisfied or not they still make sales.

It reminds me of The Borgias (Showtime TV series, 2011-13, with Jeremy Irons), which was good for the first 2 seasons, but in the 3rd went down into BS, and was cancelled abruptly. ?

I just dropped the saturation and I was on that beach with Chief Brody I'm trying to keep mine down below 3 figures ! I behaved myself in Japan and only bought 3 so thats a start.

I don’t mind. Please do. I’m practically flying blind with this damn MacBook Air screen, so I imagine half of my images look jacked. But since I posted those frames, I looked at a bunch of other ones and I came to a conclusion. I need to just keep this stuff simple. I am not that talented at it and I need to get back to the writing portion rather than laboring over lenses. So, I think I am going to roll with my first, gut purchases... my Canon and Nikon lenses and the Samyang. This will keep my collection way below 10 and I’ll use the proceeds to invest in a better monitor.

I agree. There are a lot of new mounts and high end options out there, but the market overall seems to be shrinking quickly. I'm sure these companies have done their research and are moving upmarket for that specific reason, but I wonder for how long that's sustainable, and if there's already too much competition in a small market. Personally (despite owning lots of adapted Nikon manual focus lenses for EF-mount cameras) I buy into a system for the lenses, because then their cost is amortized over a longer period and I'm not constantly buying and reselling. It's hard for me to imagine what the L mount system or RF mount system looks like five years from now, though, which makes the steep entry price even more of a concern for me. On the other hand, I would probably upgrade my Digital Rebel XT if Canon met Fujifilm's specs. Well said. I bought Oakleys back in school and ended up looking like a dork. I think Bay and Fincher are great directors, but I look better in Ray Bans or Persol. (Same parent company in this case, I know.) I guess I will never be a cool kid. I couldn't afford a Red anyway.

Yeah but you can't sell GH5s for more money than a FF camera is as of now. Even used the GH5s is more than a new FF camera. Panasonic is headed for a disaster doing that stuff. It is only a Very few people that are going to pay that much money. The Fuji XT-3, and now the Canon RS is WAY cheaper, are they better, I don't know, but they are nearly half the price. That is crazy when you look at it as a average consumer.

Probably I'm too idealist, but I firmly think that keeping and going on with once upon a time true and enough enthusiastic spirit is the most important. Isn't is so that this very forum started along with art-for-all liberation impulse given with ML Canon 5D II and, even more, with GH2? Comparatively, all movie makers world has been shaken than with quality of these cameras that stay within reach even to students and other talented dreamers... Tones of serious movies were shot with Canon as B, many as A camera (and most directors has to admit that public wouldn't notice if all works had been done with Canon), Upstream Color was done with GH2 - because these camera indeed were comparatively so capable... And now, it seems to me that all of us are little bit forgeting our dreamer's past - of course, now we can provide more money, now we can pay more, most of us listening GAS thirst and escaping from bore living - but comparatively equally capable successors of 5D and GH2 today don't live at home of Panasonic and Canon, simply because they don't care for that great past spirit which made them so beloved and popular. Of course S1H or A7SIII or GH6 are/will be beast - but not anymore for new generation of young dreamers. And me idealist feel it as a curse. Sorry to ask/remind obvious - what about Pocket 4K?

There will be no cheap "consumer" cameras in five years. It will either be "wannabe professional", or professional cameras. I know that's harsh, but with smartphones taking over photos and video, limited markets mean higher per unit costs for cameras.

Throw on a Ninja V and you got a good setup. I am currently holding off on buying a cinema camera as the prices just keep dropping on everything.

I am suddenly left wondering about a few things: 1. Is it the Same sensor as the S1 (with a Larger body and a better processor) or do they really have a new sensor? 2. If this Already Has VLog with 14 stops of dynamic range, why is the VLog on the S1 coming in July??? Plus will that VLog (on the S1) also have 14 Stops of Dynamic Range? 3. The S1H seems more geared for Full Frame Anamorphic(?) and 6k video. So, are there enough improvements on the S1H to actually have a completely new camera for it, and could some of this not have been possible on the S1? Plus while rumprs claim that the larger body will help with better dissipation, I remember reading, somewhere, that overheating may shut down the camera temporarily(?) I am guessing, the larger size may have more spaces for more ports and better storage among other things. Panasonic manages space rather well on its cameras, and they aren't larger without genuine purpose.

You've been very negative about it from the start, I feel. Just let them announce it and then react. Oh, and be realistic with your expectations. Panasonic, for better or worse, isn't going to be ditching CDAF anytime soon, and if they did I don't think they'd do it for just one camera in an entire lineup. And given the S1 and the S1R don't have flip out screens, it's unlikely that the S1H will. Is that a bummer? Yeah, but it's just the way things are.

For me its to the point where cameras are so good and affordable its simply tough to make something that's attractive anymore. You can get a S35 camera that shoots 4k 10 bit up to 60p with good auto focus for 1k. This new Panasonic camera is very significant though. Full frame 10 bit 422(assuming) 4k 60p is huge. 6k recording full frame is also huge, I think people will love that. The question is of course will Sony put out something that beats it and with their own affordable lens line up and amazing auto focus. The next fuji camera could be even more killer as well. The lens issue is the real killer for those who don't have 8k to spend on new gear. Though for those adapting glass that will be a non issue.

In defence of the L mount*, the two most often used mounts for cinema cameras are PL and EF. There is an adapter for the former and a smart adapter for the latter so the risk such as it is resides in the body. In this respect it is no different to what people have been doing for years with an FS-5 or an FS-7 etc where you would be putting an adapter on it anyway. If people don't want to use an adapter then Sigma's L mount lenses will be here before this camera so the situation in terms of fast native lenses at reasonable prices will be completely different then. I think that considering the track record of the three current members of the L Alliance then the L mount will be around for a good while yet. Its easy to forget that it has already been around for five years as it is. * I'll exclude Leica in that defence for being absolute grade A arseholes for not making their cameras compatible with the Sigma MC-21

I tested both, raw is Far better if your doing color correction. Prores okay for basic correction, make sure you nail the white balance in camera. Really wish the pocket received the prores 4:4:4 codec from the Ursa mini. Love that codec.

Which is ALWAYS welcome in my book!

For a bit of context on that Angenieux and GX80 combo, I've just put it back on and shot a quick test of it at different stages of its range.

The Samsung EVO 860 works but the 850 doesn't. Don't know the models of the enclosures as they are cheap no-brand ebay purchases.

https://www.l-rumors.com/l5-first-leaked-images-of-the-new-panasonic-s1h/

As far as I see as lately coming and open-minded independent outsider (luckily tolerated because of little bit of respect to another field achievement :), whole film industry relays on hierarchy of mutual "sponsored" circles... What's interesting to me about BM is magnificently well and thoroughly thought-out, clever penetrating bravura. Armed with industry-adds and software that so fast became leader in business, step by step winning over, say, even Pablo (DaVince before BM was just one between equally used grading solution), relatively small BM team evolves strategy that relay not "from-above", but "from-the-ground" base of talented and enthusiastic people. Resolve already, from software side, totally destroyed any notion of annoying film-industry snobbery. I expect that BM soon makes even more serious threat and impact to top-budgeted part of industry - funding cameras with better reliability and, even more important, when younger generation of film-makers arrive to high positions, dearly remembering their indie-roots with BM and exchanging contacts. Process of establishing BM's important role is, I think, as democratic and human as it could be in modern circumstances.

I've got a 1tb mSATA drive in a USB 3.1 enclosure that works with BRAW at the highest data rates. You have to be careful though as I've got a very slightly different enclosure and mSATA that the camera doesn't recognise.

With NX1 last summer in Austria;

One more from our holiday in Austria last summer.

Did anybody try and use any new and small USB-C flash drive as solution? Some of them reach even 150mb/s writing speed, so in theory could safely been used for 5:1 and Q5 codecs, or even better for some simpler scenery.

I think the glass element is really a corrective piece for chromatic aberration. As the B4 lenses were never really intended for use a single cmos sensor but a 3 chip ccd array.

Thats possibly the funniest thing i've ever watched

How we feel about Canon sometimes:

Whoa Whoa Whoa, Let's not do anything crazy like count the number of lenses we own. No one wants to go through that ?? Everybody Be cool.

And the people left out would still moan anyway! RED has no PDAF or flippy-tilty screen, are they out of touch with cinema market? Arri?

If everyone got their wishes fulfilled with this camera, it would cost $15,000 USD!

I couldn’t agree more.

That seems like quite a bit for a mirrorless camera. If they can get internal NDs in there, have great pre-amps to eliminate any low level hiss from the XLR adapter (that the GH5 did have a bit of), and broadcast approved 10-12 bit codecs for $4k-$5k (or so), I do think that is game-changing. Nobody has anything even close to that in this size, form factor, or price. Yes, I hope there is some really game-changing extra surprises (like global shutter or 4k 120fps or internal compressed raw), but the above is still leaps and bounds ahead of everything else. There isn't even a manufacturer that offers anything better than 8-bit 420 in UHD. It's a bummer that people are dismissing the S1 when it is such a more capable camera than an EOS R or any Sony I've used (and way nicer image quality) - just because the AF can't perfectly track people sprinting at them, a situation I have never needed to film in my 7+ years making videos and films...

It doesnt make any sense for Pany to go APC-S L-Mount when they already have FF and M43 and zero APC-S lenses. It makes sense to make a S35 sensor with a M43 mount though.

Well, I don't normally do this but I'll be first to preorder because I have a feeling this lens will be on backorder for awhile.

Yeah I don't care how talented you think you are, that was a total......you know what. Stupid is stupid no matter how smart you think you are. Off with their heads. Elitist crap. Perfectly good show that went down in flames. What a way to end. All the lead up for years to end in a Cluster F.

Yeah, the 300-800mm is not the sort of lens that I would have fancied smuggling in if I didn't have the accreditation. Even with accreditation, it still raised a few eyebrows at the security check at the press entrance !

We won’t go against anyone if one follows the rule and respect to others effort. However, a lot of China based companies are notorious for their habit of IP theft around the world. It is not sole case of Huawei being part of it but no doubt she did quite a lot. Huawei's Espionage Plans Confirmed by Ridiculously Incriminating Emails (Stole IP from T-mobile) https://www.androidheadlines.com/2019/01/huawei-t-mobile-ridiculous-corporate-espionage-emails.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2019/02/28/huawei-pleads-not-guilty-accusations-it-stole-t-mobiles-trade-secrets Huawei suspected to have stolen Akhan’s Diamond glass technology, targeted by FBI at CES 2019 https://www.gizmochina.com/2019/02/05/huawei-suspected-to-have-stolen-akhans-diamond-glass-technology-targeted-by-fbi-at-ces-2019/ https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2019-02-04/huawei-sting-offers-rare-glimpse-of-u-s-targeting-chinese-giant https://finance.yahoo.com/news/huawei-akhan-semiconductor-202413843.html Huawei P30 Pro alleged to be querying China servers behind the scenes https://en.ocworkbench.com/huawei-p30-pro-alleged-to-be-querying-china-servers-behind-the-scenes/ https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3685669 By the way, how many innovators in kickstarters mourned for their loss when doing business with the Chinese manufacturers? Who does have empathy for them? IP Theft: Crowdfunding sites are being harvested by Chinese counterfeiters https://www.chinalawblog.com/2019/02/kickstarter-and-china-manufacturing-youve-got-it-all-wrong.html Kickstarter and China Manufacturing: You’ve Got it All Wrong https://www.huffpost.com/entry/ip-theft-crowdfunding-sites-are-being-harvested-by_b_580bbee3e4b099c43431971b She is not alone. Other than IP theft, ZTE just helped China government doing business with Iran remotely that ignored the sanctions. This is epic fail case to China because ZTE is too stupid to ask a Jewish lawyer to handle the documents. US slaps China’s ZTE with 7-year components ban for breaching terms of sanctions settlement https://www.scmp.com/business/companies/article/2142002/us-slaps-zte-seven-year-components-ban-breaching-terms-sanctions And the most horrible thing is China see morality is nothing on the critical bio-tech. China baby gene editing claim 'dubious'. https://www.bbc.com/news/health-46342195 No doubt, the technology innovation is strong in China in certain area. But it is meaningless if morality is eliminated. It is so tired to explain why Huawei and other Chinese companies do not deserve your sympathy. Mourning for a loss of optical zoom smartphone just proves how short-sight of oneself.

If they had turned the lights on someone might have noticed the starbucks cup

I have an idea. If you can get a sample unit to me then we can work together to work out how to connect it to a live stream of stock market prices....

Good summary. I'm a bit skeptical about the usefulness of it. Not to say that it won't be more useful than a normal device, but my question is how much more useful. I think that noise may play a big part in limiting how much extra dynamic range there is. The idea is that in traditional system you want to keep the levels in the sweet spot where they are below the clipping point, but above the point where the noise starts to become audible. An audio engineer will adjust their equipment so that the signal is in that sweet spot through every piece of equipment in the signal path. The problem comes if we don't adjust the levels when we go from one situation to another. Here is how different situations can be from one-another: So, if you set the gain for a noisy street scene where the levels were in the 80-90dB range and then didn't adjust it when you shot the two people talking quietly in bed scene, the bedroom scene would be 60db quieter than what an engineer would set it to. We set the street scene so that the peaks are at -20dB, and we're good to record 70dB of dynamic range because the normal system is fine to about -90dB. We probably don't need the full 70dB, so there's some wiggle room in there. But now were in the bedroom scene and the peaks are at -80dB (because 60dB quieter than our -20dB peaks is -80dB) and with a normal system this means we have less than 20dB of dynamic range there, assuming that at -100dB is where the noise floor is. A normal 16-bit system would be awful quality here, but let's put that aside, because we're now talking about the F6. The Zoom F6 may very well be able to go down to (let's say) -200dB. This is my estimate, but if 16 bits can do -96, 24 bits can do -144, 32 bits should be around -200dB. The problem we're going to have is noise. I'm not sure that the F6 will have input circuitry that has a noise floor of -200dB (that is very very very low noise levels), but let's assume that it does. The problem is that your microphone probably doesn't. Anything that needs phantom power requires it precisely to run its own internal amplifier circuitry, and every microphone on the planet is built for the -96dB levels of 16-bit. For example the Sennheiser 416 has a signal-to-noise ratio of 81dB. If you used this mic then your lovely F6 would be making a very high quality recording of your actors mixed with a very high recording of the microphone noise, and both your actors and the microphone noise would be at the same volume level! Win!! I don't know if the 416 is that good a microphone, but even if we had a mic with SNR of 100, or 120dB, that's still only putting your noise floor of the bedroom scene 20dB or 40dB lower than your actors, and that's not a great end result. If I've done some maths wrong in here please sing out, but I believe the logic stands. And if anyone thinks that my example is extreme, just imagine a shot of two people walking in the doors of their NY apartment, up the stairs, into their apartment, getting undressed and then into bed. Not only might you have level problems in one scene, you might have it IN ONE SHOT!

I agree most including me do not care about 6K. 4K is good enough today. I agree the AF is awful on the S1 as it is on the GH and I have said that for years now: we need good video AF on hybrids. Way more important for me than a flip screen: a good 4K60P 10 bits in FF. No FF hybrid does that as of today. Not even 4K60 FF 8 bits. I am hopeful the A7SIII will bring the above PLUS an insanely good AF (when seeing performance from A6400 consumer camera). Way more excited for that than the L mount system that has no lens, is way overpriced (based on S1 price and the rumored S1H price) and their shitty prehistoric ridiculous AF. Thing is, what is Sony waiting???