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Hey @Andrew Reid I'm not sure you and I can still be friends if you are going round the internet bullying *checks notes* a camera company owned by a billionaire who took legal action to shut you up that they knew you couldn't possibly afford to have defended. Clearly, as Peter says, the internet bullying must be stopped. Peter's solution to your spiteful bullying is to *checks notes* go on the internet and demand a camera company owned by a billionaire shuts you down by taking legal action they know you couldn't possibly afford to defend. Anyway, I'm off to 3D print a new irony meter as my current one has just exploded.

I think that the price of RED's components is not at all the issue. The issues, as far as I can tell, are: - RED has a patent on compressed raw recording, which many people believe is too broad, and is either an invalid patent, or an example of the failure of the patent system. RED's patent is so broad that other camera companies cannot even develop their own compressed raw formats--hence Blackmagic's Braw is "partially debayered." It's not just filmmakers, apparently Apple is currently challenging the patent's legitimacy. - In the past, RED has threatened individuals such as Andrew with lawsuits to get them to be quiet. As written in the blog post, a private individual would be financially unable to counter the lawsuit, whether it's valid or not. Many consider this to be bullying. - In regards to the Jinni Tech controversy, Mr. Royce has provided evidence that RED's claims of custom firmware and "made in the USA" statements are false. If Royce is right, then RED has broken the law and lied to its customers. Additionally, RED claimed that Jinni Tech stole intellectual property, which Royce has also disputed. Again, if Royce is right, then that is libel. - The issue of overpriced components is really incidental to the whole story, despite being an exciting headline. The only issue with the pricing is that there may be false advertising--RED can charge whatever price they want, but only if they are honest about what they are selling. That's my summary of events thus far, hopefully fairly accurately (feel free to set me straight).

Just read the thread, what a rollercoaster one. Just waiting for the revelation that the real patent holder for internal RAW is Ebrahim Saadawi.

No, you're not. This thread reminded that I needed to retweet a message from a guy who has been locked up in an Australian government concentration camp for the past 6 years due to the color of his skin. If toxic masculinity in the nuclear age doesn't finish us off fast, climate change will do us slowly (not that slowly). The sociopathy of greedy rich men and their worshipers is one hell of a doomsday device. RED and its fanboys are the least of our problems, but it's all relative.

I read the same comment last night and it is both sad and scary that someone would reply like this in the wake of the 21st century on a western state. All these are completely out of my league but what do I get is that the world suddenly have become too violent, and our "enemies" have to be eliminated or shutting up forever..this brings a certain middle-Aged smell in the atmosphere, of burned human flesh! Of course I am exaggerating, or maybe not? I mean, it is a simple matter of finding the truth about some codec and the other part is willing to annihilate ethically and/or professionaly one person, what's next? Far far west solutions? Alas, this is happening, people are taking the "law" into their hands and became judge/jury and punisher, this is a reality of our time, if we do not carefully protect our freedoms and laws after thousands of years of human struggle then a dog eat dog/big fish eats small/the law of the jungle will be tommorows law. The war for the human rights is an eternal struggle, if socities relax for a couple of years, boom! Suddenly we are a couple of decades back! It wasn't long ago that women and minorities didn't have a saying on most countries of this world, and surprisingly they still don't on a big part of this planet. I just hope Red is better than this, and they should be careful with the posts in their friendly forums. It is one thing to disagree with someone and have a civilized response and another thing to silence them with show of force or scare tactics. Same here, we shouldn't hope for the demise of anyone and anything, the camera market is enough for everyone of us, and I hoped a much more civilized and above average industry.

Don’t confuse my lack of caring as “riding the fence.” I come to this site to learn and to discuss filmmaking and filmmaking gear, not to argue with people that are incapable of admitting when they’re wrong. 24fps has a stutter/judder, end of discussion. It is a fact! In all honesty, the word FLICKER, is probably a better choice, but with semantics aside, 24fps is anything but smooth. https://www.filmindependent.org/blog/hacking-film-24-frames-per-second/

So much for me trying to hide. Looks like they have found me out... At the time, I don't think appreciated my Redpress / Wordpress joke either. I thought it was quite a funny satire but I was wrong. It was in fact "EXHIBIT A" in a trial. JIM JAMMARD was very upset being bullied this way by the mighty Andrew Reid. It caused him enormous emotional distress. Redpress literally caused the billionaire in Orange Country MENTAL ANGUISH. Now, where did I put that spare $75,000? Opinions in the land of the free!

P6k is twice the price of p4k. It's not an update but different product. It's like saying that Sony A7III is just an update to A6500 (same price difference). Not mentioning media price (p4k 60p works with cheap Samsung T5 ssd, p6k may need something much pricier). For me p6k is not an option. My whole setup with p4k is something around p6k price. And the spec is not much different in my case: don't need 6k (even 4k is little too much for me); need slowmotion a lot, so full sensor 50p In p6k is a downgrade to me; sensor size is the only difference i like, but definitely not worth the price difference. I dont need this camera, but i'm very happy to see it. It has the same software, which means that we will see more fixes, upgrades and more stable product.

@Andrew Reid - I think you were accidentally sent somebody else's lawsuit.

Someone lend me an Alexa and I bet I could prove that point..

As far as I'm aware, Arri doesn't have a culture of toxic masculinity.

I am with Ed here, Phil, let's simmer down. Sorry for some of the things I've said. I think we can do better and have a better discussion about all this far away from the limelight and the heat of the moment. Feel free to stick around and to tell your side of the story though. I don't have an anti-RED agenda. Am I pissed off? Yes. I am pissed off at what happened in 2010. It shouldn't have happened. In fact, I have a deep respect for what Graeme Nattress and the crew have achieved with these cameras. It's a shame to sully their effort by intimidating bloggers and users. Remember what happened with Philip Bloom's camera and the arguement with Jim? Again totally unnecessary behaviour. Many people would kill to lead a company as successful as RED. He needs to CHILL OUT. If I have an "agenda" it is a full-on truth agenda. I am deeply concerned by the claims made by Jinni Tech. The claims of propriety SSD components, etc. "Made in USA". Misleading the FTC and US Patents Office. These things matter to customers. As a blogger it's my job to inform them. I want to know the truth. Jim Jannard's past behaviour doesn't sit well with me, and not just his behaviour towards me. It isn't all about me. It's about Michael Bravin. About Sony. Blackmagic. Band Pro. I want to find out the truth. That's all. People deserve to know. And If they try to shut me down I will go out fighting big style. Thank you.

Soon I'll put the link to the vote on the front page of the blog to drum up some more people to take part and vote. Then let's close the poll around Saturday-ish and do the big reveal of gear. Get some photos of the gear and post it. I'll do the same and reveal what I shot. I made two videos with two different cameras. Then the winner of the public vote gets the last place person's camera If he wants to give it him. We're not going to force it out of his hands This is supposed to be a bit of fun really. Then I'll choose a winner of the judge's prize, who will get one of my cameras.

Blackmagic Micro Cinema Camera Super Guide and Why it Still Matters Today The Blackmagic Micro Cinema Camera was released in 2012. At the rate that cameras are being announced these days, that’s a century ago in the consumer/prosumer world. The camera was released with very little fanfare as it didn’t have a monitor and was marketed as a great companion to drones, head cams, dash cams, sport cams, etc. Some people rigged it up, but for the most part it wasn’t exactly the most popular camera at the time. Though I keep speaking in past tense, this camera is still available to buy today - though with the Pocket 4k and 6k on the market - it’s very unlikely anybody is buying them. As we enter the most competitive market ever for the low/mid tier videographer and filmmaker, I am here to tell why this small unassuming - and rather ancient by todays standards - camera is special and why it could fit well with some of you. This guide is meant to be a fun way to explore a hidden gem, not to cause a spec war, fanboy war, or any kind of mean spirited debate. It is just an opinion of one person, but something that I have been thinking about doing for awhile. Lets get into. Brief History The Blackmagic Micro Cinema Camera shares the same sensor as it’s older cousin, the Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera. A camera that truly revolutionized the filmmaking world, by giving filmmakers that didn’t have the cash to buy expensive cinema gear a camera that had an amazing cinematic and filmic quality to it. Something that wasn’t found in DSLRs at the time with not only the film look, but also specs. The camera could record internal RAW at a price point that was and still is unheard of. But the camera suffered from many issues. The screen was garbage, there was a lot FPN issues, and most notably the battery life was straight up horrible. Batteries would last around 20 minutes and often times much less. The Blackmagic Micro Cinema Camera shares the same sensor as the original pocket. Its’ a sensor created by Fairchild Imaging, with a sensor called the CIS1910F. Fairchild are a company based out of San Jose, CA. They have created several sensors for Blackmagic, but I believe the new sensors of the Pocket 4k/6k are now Sony sensors. The sensor is important in this guide, because thats where the special sauce lies. Blackmagic Micro Differences to Pocket The Blackmagic at first glance seems like a stripped down original Blackmagic pocket. The thing is, it actually cleaned up quite a bit inside the hood. The micro received a new more modern processor, allowing it to clean up some FPN issues and improved rolling shutter. Though not a low light beast, it handles things generally better all the way around compared to the Pocket. When using a monitor, accessing the menus though tedious with its button placement, is much more responsive - where the pocket was a lag fest. Here is where we get to the good stuff. The micro cinema camera on paper and at first glance seems like a bit of a letdown. No monitor? No cold shoe? No handle? Canon Batteries? But, thats because of how Blackmagic marketed it. They didn’t market it like how Red or Zcam do it, which is a modular camera with a build your own adventure way to build it. They didn't even really offer accessories for it. But that is how it needs to be looked at. You get a brain and you need to add accessories, there is no way around it. But building around it is not as daunting as most people make it seem and once you take the step, you really unlock something special. Whats the Point of This and What Makes this Camera Special? I am going to use some overused/misused terminology here to explain how the footage looks and what makes it special. In a current era where modern sensors show every single pore and are mostly made by Sony (with insane modern feats) - there is an organic look about the early Blackmagic cameras (BMMCC, BMPCC, BMCC) that is special and has a very film like look to it, which is what Blackmagic set out to achieve and emulate. This is going back to Fairchild and what they were able to achieve. The look that is ever so popular with almost every young filmmaker and over used on almost every filmmakers youtube titles - which is a ”cinematic or film look”. Yeah, I know, you want to argue its lighting and lenses and actual cinematography skills that achieves that. You are right. But there are still more tangible attributes besides that which can affect the way a video looks. Color science, DR, a soft look, and motion cadence are 4 keys to getting that look. If you can nail all of those, you get a rather easy filmic/cinematic look out the box. And the Blackmagic micro has all of those and is really the last Blackmagic camera to ever use one of those organic sensors that Fairchild brewed up. It’s also the last and only Blackmagic camera that you are able to buy today that has one of those most special sensors every created for its cheap price and accessibility. . It is a hidden gem and footage from the camera are often confused for cameras way out of its league. It’s a look that modern mirrorless cameras don’t often have, at least not without heavy film grain, pro mist filters, vintage glass, added motion blur, etc. What makes this camera special is not on the spec sheet, because 1080p isn’t going to making you excited. It’s not on the paper that will make you go “wow”. It’s simply with the footage. You can throw all the specs you want. The footage of this camera and the fact that it’s still available today new and very cheap used, is the reason for this entire guide. Keys To Rigging You need a cage and an external monitor. There is no way around this. If you don’t purchase or have those, there is no point exploring further. Remember, like I briefly mentioned above - don’t think drone cam or sports cam - think modular RAW capable cinema cam. Smallrig and 8sinn both make cages for it, I have the smallrig and don’t see why you would need anything else. Take your pick with monitor, that is a personal choice, but I prefer something with Sony style NPF batteries. If you only shoot RAW with this camera (which is what I do) - then you can basically set your settings and forget them. I would leave your ISO at 800 and manage your light with your lens aperture and variable ND Filter. There is no need to go into any menus, other than to possibly reformat your memory card. If you do that, you avoid the headache which is the awkward placement on the menu buttons. If you shoot pro-res and you want to constantly change settings (ISO, WB, etc) then you will need to either get used to the buttons or buy a second hand “One Little Remote”. Which is a little add on module that can help you change your cameras settings without menu diving. For battery, you can use canon batteries for about an hour/hour half before it dies. Or choose the best option, which is to buy the NPF bridge (https://www.starvingartist101.com) which allows you to simply attach NPF style batteries to the camera. With this option you can get around 4 hours of battery life on 1 charge or even longer if you opt for the larger style NPF batteries. A monitor most people already have. And if you shoot RAW, which is kind of what makes this camera special and what I recommend using, then you don’t need to menu dive or you can simply use the one little remote. And if you use NPF batteries you now have a cinema camera that doesn’t require v-mount batteries and can shoot RAW video for about 4 hours. All in an insanely small package with amazing footage. I think thats what gets lost with this camera is that people complain about having to rig it up - but a lot of the add ons are either pretty cheap or you already have. The NPF bridge is around 30 bucks. Cage from smallrig is around $80. The monitor you prob already have. You really don’t need the one little remote if you shoot RAW or get used to the menus. Memory Cards If there is one legit complaint, its that newer sandisks memory cards do not work with this camera. Here is the scoop: “Please note that we have discovered an issue with the newer revision of the Sandisk Extreme Pro UHS-I SDXC 95 MB/s cards that begin with the product prefix SDSDXXG. These cards do not work with the following products: 1. Pocket Cinema Camera 2. Micro Cinema Camera 3. Video Assist 4. Video Assist 4K We believe that these new cards have the V30 rating on them. Currently, only Sandisk Extreme Pro UHS-I SDXC 95 MB/s cards that begin with the product prefix SDSDXP are compatible.” Though that sucks, good news is that if you have a sandisk pre 2018, it should work. Also there are non sandisk cards that do work. I have tested this one for example: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00X1406EC/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and it works fine and with RAW. It is still something that you should be aware of. I got lucky and all my sandisks work. Speedbooster There is a dedicated speedbooster for this camera in Nikon or Canon variant. Its called Nikon G to BMPCC or Canon EF to BMPCC. There is a “T” version that has minor improvements, especially to the felt material inside. There are other speedboosters for micro four thirds that will work as well. Viltrox speedboosters also work. The difference is that the specific BMPCC version gives you a 0.58x vs x0.71 or higher crop factor. Resolution Let us now address the elephant in the room. This camera does not shoot 4k. If you want a camera that shoots 4k, this is not it, simple as that. But, if you are a person that cares more about the image quality than the resolution, you won’t be disappointed. But lets say you really do want 4k, well, there is another hidden gem that takes this camera one step further. Inside Davinci Resolve is a feature called “superscale” which upscales footage beautifully. And scaled micro cinema footage to UHD/4K looks fantastic. See Rob Ellis' beautiful video on this: Also even if you need 4k for certain projects, this camera should still be in your arsenal. It’s cheap enough where you can have it along side something like a pocket 4k/6k. Again, the footage speaks for itself. IR Cut and Moire I highly recommend using an IR Cut filter with this camera as there is some IR pollution that can affect your image if you dont use one. You can find some for as cheap as 20-30 bucks. There are also some moire filters, like the RAWLITE OLPF, that does IR CUT and reduces moire at the same time. You install this over the sensor and you dont have to worry about using filters, but it's costly. I don’t have too much of an issue with moire - so for most a simple IR Cut filter could be enough. Where to Buy You can still buy these new today. But you can score amazing kits on ebay, craigslist, etc. You can often find one with a one little remote, cage, and even memory cards for under $700. Some will even include a monitor. You can legit get a full kit for $1,000 - including every thing you need to shoot and rig it up. Conclusion (TL;DR) I made this post because I am a junky of sorts. I buy all the new cameras, fall into the hype traps, and have severe GAS. Every camera I have used lately has left me with a “meh” feeling. Except the micro. Specs can be great, some have amazing autofucus or great color. Some have shit color and shit bitrates. Some are great but the lens system and adapting to it are a pain. And some are plain beautiful but are really expensive. The micro has a rare balance of amazing filmic quality, a lens mount that most of us on here are well aware of at this point, fantastic battery life of around 4 hours with NPF batteries, compact size, legit RAW (not BRAW) to internal SD cards instead of expensive cfast or having an SSD hanging from your camera and its cheap. Ridiculously cheap if you buy used. It also has that old blackmagic special look so many of us fell in love with back in the day and in my opinion is lacking today. It is a hidden treasure in the filmmaking world that is still available new at many retailers. I created this to share and possibly open eyes to what is an amazing camera this is and probably the last of its breed. As we enter the resolution wars with sharper, high res videos, we will slowly be leaving behind that soft organic look. If you like shooting older cameras with vintage glass to get that "look" then you can think of this camera the same way. You do it for the look, not for the specs. Bonus: Footage!!! Here is some great content that I believe shows off this camera and what is capable of doing (All the footage from his reel at the start of this video are from the micro)

I think its being misinterpreted by a lot of people that the Pocket 6K is the Pocket 4K Mark II and it just isn't. The resolution is one thing but the mount dictates that it a different camera. There is no lens you can put on the Pocket 6K that you can't put on the Pocket 4K but there are plenty the other way round. If I look at 3 example lenses of a similar focal length that I own and use on the Pocket 4K but will not fit on the Pocket 6K: Panasonic 25mm f1.7 MFT mount 7Artisans 28mm f1.4 M mount REDPro Prime 25mm t1.8 PL mount So would I prefer the bump in resolution or to be able to use those lenses? I'd like both but I'll take the lenses thanks. That doesn't mean its right for everyone, of course, but for me as a Pocket 4K owner its my preference. What seems to be forgotten in all this is that when the BMCC was launched with the EF mount, people were absolutely thrilled right up until the point that BM produced the MFT mount version shortly after which devalued the EF version immediately as everyone wanted the more versatile mount. So I find it curious that the EF was the "wrong" mount and the MFT was the right mount then and yet now it seems to be the other way round when even leaving aside the additional adaption capabilities there are also far better MFT mount lenses available now than there was then too. Who knows whether history will repeat itself again here and the Pocket 6K will be released with an MFT mount?

Stutter and judder. Canon and Sony raw works natively in FCPX. The RED plugin doesn't exist. The P6K can only shoot videoish. The P6K can not shoot videoish. He has said so much weird stuff it's impossible to keep track. Plus he always puts naive flame baits and personal attacks in the posts to try and derail them and shift focus when he knows he is wrong. Classic troll behavior or that of a juvenile.

People who says 24fps has no stutter should be condemned to a life of playing first person shooters at 24 fps.

Regarding whether Jannard knew about Armstrong’s doping (and sponsored him anyway) the question was asked on Reduser as it pertained to the integrity of the Red founder. The thread was deleted very quickly.

Very much appreciated sir. I will get back to you OliKMIA. I have to pick my battles very carefully and make sure that revealing hidden truths does not make me a martyr. I have a nice blog to look after, some nice cameras, a girlfriend in Berlin to look out for and the last thing I want is more intimidation tactics from Jim Jannard. Reassuring to know I can rely on the support of likeminded people in the industry though, if serious trouble does come knocking. In the latest news... RED have responded to the Apple petition. The date of the provisional response was 15th August, which was yesterday! Just pressed DOWNLOAD ALL. https://portal.unifiedpatents.com/ptab/case/IPR2019-01064

Thanks, I guess I better get that plugin before Red forbids FCPX users to access it. Dont worry, I already went a round with that guy and I really don’t have the time, or inclination, to debate basic camera operations and the history of 24p in cinema with someone who will cherry pick one word in a sentence to try and prove his argument. Thanks, but don’t go too crazy, I base a lot of my opinions on mojo. Btw, I recently used the Samyang 50mm 1.4 on a shoot and I think I may have a hard time parting with that lens. Lol.

Looks like it'll cost a few squid.

I'll sort it out over the weekend once I've calibrated my unicorn to vibe ratio measurement kit.

let's stick to facts, not going after this random dude, whoever he is. Also weird about "All or Nothing" doc that Jim Jannard allegedly knew about Lance Armstrong's doping. Haven't watched it all, but man, someone needs to do a film on Jim Jannard. Wow. After hearing about Jeffrey Epstein's billionare friends as well, I just have to wonder: are a lot of billionares like this? From the doc: from person giving testimony on a phone call: "I told Jim that I can't lie. And he said, well there's ways around it."

WOW. Love this analysis.

Well Waynes that's a good question. When a billionaire and a corporation file a lawsuit with a Los Angeles court against you on the sofa, you have 3 options. Fight, flight or roll over like a little puppy and do what they tell you to do. You can settle out of court, which can be at zero cost. You can challenge the lawsuit, let it go before a judge, but you need to spend thousands of dollars on lawyers and it takes over your life. And if you do nothing you get a default judgement if it goes before a judge and they decide you have a case to answer. I thought about allowing that to happen, because I didn't think the lawsuit had any grounds whatsoever - and that the judge would throw it out - but it would have been a blind risk. I had no expert advice to inform that decision. This was at a time in the very earliest days of EOSHD and just before I was about to move to Berlin and I wanted to focus on the cameras and filmmaking, not fighting a billionaire sunglasses salesman. Obviously the least risky option is to simply sign whatever it is they want you to sign and shut up. So that's what I had to do, and I had to do it without any legal advice whatsoever. When I asked their lawyer what the deadline was, they said "48 hours", otherwise they'd move the court filing before a judge and get on with suing me. That's a threat, that's intimidation, and an abuse of the legal system. My hunch at the time was this: The lawsuit request was initiated by DVXUser's forum mods (yes it is as absurd as it sounds), who were friends with their founder Jarrad Land. I don't know this for sure it's just a hunch, but if true, the lawsuit is partly a result of a trivial DVXUser web argument in the GH1 days where some moderators wanted to settle a score and knew people in high-enough places to do so. I ask myself where does the legal bluff stop and criminal behaviour begin? Can you get a patent lawyer to threaten somebody with a bogus lawsuit, and force them to sign a non-disparagement agreement because they don't have legal representation? If I abused the legal system to shut down competitors or censor critics, I'd probably go to jail. I don't see why it should be one rule for us and another for a Hollywood corporation. In the words of Jinni Tech. "More to come"

Ive had both and compared them side by side. The Viltrox is sharper on all apertures accept for wide open, has an adjustable back focus (no tools required) and its like a third of the price. The only Metabones I would ever buy is the dedicated BMPCC version (which I currently own), used. Otherwise I would go Viltrox (I sold my Metabones XL).

Hey, I can do you an A/B with an EPIC and a Pocket4K if you like and we can have a massive row about silkyshuddercodeshuttermojo ?

Because RED also tried suing Apple/AtomOS for what they are doing! Supposedly they made "a deal", but that deal would appear to have been "Better STFU RED, if you want any chance of being treated nicely once we drag you to court and rip that bullshit patent out of your hands!". It's also the exact reason why no one has implemented IN CAMERA recording of ProRes RAW, which is far superior to any and everything that anyone else is doing with raw btw (or what they like to call raw and isn't… here's looking at you BRAW), let alone what RED has, since everyone is scared to get sued by these douches and rather leave it up to Apple to fix it. Good thing, too! So this is for the free and FAIR proliferation of (ProRes) raw for any and everyone that wants it, which is the entire point behind even making PRraw in the first place!! Extremely high-performance, high-quality, low-data rate raw for everyone! To assume it's for Apple's bottomline is utter bullshit, since what they would stand to make from additional licensing (that's assuming PRraw won't in fact just simply be included in existing ProRes licenses!) is the equivalent to about 2 seconds worth of regular income! If this turns out the way Apple wants, and I sure as **** hope it does, then you can look forward to PRraw on an Arri and many many more, WITHOUT the need for an AtomOS recorder. Unless of course Apple strikes a deal of sorts to protect their partnership with AtomOS… which would REALLY suck! We'll see.

Coming from you, I can only agree... if you say it so! LOL ; -)

Come on. enough. Taking delight in personal squabbles isn't going to do this thread any favours. Let's contribute on the facts and focus on the topic.

Is that you Kaylee?

Animosity towards RED management and the RED community is nothing new, it's been going on since Moses was a boy. A lot of it stems from the actions of said people. Filmmakers have a right to be upset about a patent that may or may not be valid, and is certainly something that many in the film community don't believe should exist. it may be legal to deny the struggling indie filmmaker access to internal raw recording, but it certainly isn't cool. It pays to remember we live and work in a community where one day you can be sleeping in your car, and the next you're making Hollywood features (James Cameron). If that turns out to be me, I know what cameras I won't be shooting with.

You are trying to harass me. Let's be honest. I've seen the Red User agitation and it perfectly fits with the broader pattern of bullying RED-related behaviour. I have evidence of it all over the place from past 8 years I have been in the camera industry. I'd encourage you not to join in yourself. Nobody intends to disinform the public here. We are are trying to do quite the opposite, to get the facts out. Are we perfect? No. Is it a fast moving situation, understanding wise? Yes. Are we legal experts? No. The situation is dynamic, our understanding is often not perfect, we're filmmakers, not highly specialised patent lawyers or legal people. As a filmmaker, I don't have the 110% legal expertise to write the perfectly worded fucking headline on my personal blog first time, every time. And you shouldn't be hanging me for it. Especially not in the hornets nest of Red User where Jarrad can see it. I'd welcome Jarrad on this forum, as you are also welcome, to put his side of the story in detail. To talk about facts. There is a lot to address and not just the Apple situation. I would like to address the harassment directed at me in 2010 for instance. And to explain the claims made by Bruce Royce (Jinni Tech). I am all ears for a good explanation, and I mean that.

Man this P6K footage is so bad and vidoish. Wow the P4K looks like a baby camera next to the P6K footage.

--- Heads-up to some users. I am going to clean this thread. Nothing personal, but I would like it to flow and to be readable by an important third party tomorrow.

Please forgive me as this is my first post. I have been reading eoshd for a while now and have replied to eoshd several times on twitter so it's about time I made an account. ? Something to keep an eye on. Apple has a history of driving companies out of business that they want to consume, so apple pays less for them. They did it with dialog semiconductor. They did it with the qualcomm / intel lawsuit (gobbled up intel's mobile modems division at a steep discount). They did it with P.A. Semiconductor. It's debatable that they were going to do it to GT Advanced Technologies. It is a stretch, but is apple interested in making cinema cameras? Do they want to rekindle the cinematographer relationship they undermined with the fcpx release / taking forever to update the mac pro? Do they want to push the new mac pro sales by getting into video again? Maybe apple wants the new mac pro desktops to accelerate all raw camera footage, and RedRaw was somehow getting in the way. There just so happens to be that apple-specific integrated FPGA accelerator option on the new mac pro that apple has so conveniently released zero information on. Apple likes the look and feel of big brands. They randomly purchased beats for reasons unknown to many. Is RED their next acquisition? Would RED look good on Apple? Granted, this is pure speculation, but I do wonder if Apple has any interest in stepping up and catering more toward the top tier cinematographer. Maybe a RED acquisition is that step.

And the rest! Armstrong was ultimately brought down by financial and government interest cases in his own country though to be fair. SCA sports promotions not wanting to pay him huge bonuses for winning the TdF and the Justice Department for defrauding the federal government because of the USPS sponsorship of the team while he was cheating. Absolutely no doubt he wasn't alone in cheating either before, during and after his career (particularly in terms of some suspcious results gained by a certain team in the past 7 years) but the difference with Armstrong is the lengths he went to in order to contain it. It was shitbaggery on an industrial mechanised scale

When the RED EPIC was released and being touted as a combined cinema and stills camera, I took it to shoot alongside my regular stills gear to shoot the Tour De France to see if it was viable for stills extraction for live editorial use. On BMCUser, someone else was also planning to shoot the Tour de France that year but ourtesy of two EPICs apparently loaned via RED through the well known Minnesota based pro cyclist who was going to expose the evidence of doping by Armstrong and who's friend was the CEO.... According to this post, it fell through in unusual and quite disturbing circumstances. If you watched the clip of Stephanie Mcilvain in that video, the person who did the recording of the phone call with her was three times (legitimate) Tour de France winner Greg LeMond who lost his business and endured 12 years of hell after questioning Armstrong's legitimacy. Imagine being a friend of Greg LeMond,who was losing everything he had legitimately won purely because he was exposing the cheating of another man that you yourself knew was cheating and just letting that happen? With a friend like that, Greg LeMond of Minnesota wouldn't need enemies.

Red do have multiple patents assigned. Some include claims that are worded very broadly, and some do include quite a lot of specifics. Compare the claims in these two (they use the typical obfuscated language and structure that make patents look impenetrable): https://patents.google.com/patent/US9596385B2/ https://patents.google.com/patent/US8872933B2/ Note, for example, how claim 1 in the "electronic apparatus" patent lists the very specific way a blue or red channel is predicted from nearby green values. Contrast this with the wording in the "video camera" patent's Claim 1, which pretty much covers any raw camera with a resolution of 4K or more (compressed or not). Red do have patents on codec specifics, but most of Red's camera/apparatus/device patents mentioning compression explicitly list a bunch of compression approaches as possible means to achieve said compression. They are, informally speaking, patenting the idea of implementing the (compressed) RAW recording camera, rather than any specific compression technique. It is hardly a coincidence that Blackmagic's own "raw" codec, a response to Red's patent violation claims, appears to be designed so that it isn't actually raw. Now, compression itself is an extensively studied field. It is, very, VERY hard to come with significant innovations in this field. A "raw" codec will use any of a few well known image compression techniques and adapt it for Bayer data. That is all there is to raw compression. Raw codecs are universally rehashing old ideas, and (slightly, if at all) differing in the details of data formatting and layout, which has little to do with actual compression technique. Yes, you can pre-process raw data in a bunch of ways, and these are usually (and I use this as an euphemism for "always") trivial for anyone "skilled in the art" (with being "non-trivial" assumed as a prerequisite for patentability). For the curious, probably the biggest advancement in compression in the last two decades is ANS which, incidentally, was explicitly released into the public domain by its creator, Jarek Duda, with the intention to prevent any patents around it.

Trying, just need contacts not their REPORT A TIP thingy from personal view post that my anonymous source alerted me to APPLE VS RED : http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/22255/red-surpassed-beats-by-dr-dre-margins-record-selling-you-just-consumer-ssd-/p2 "One of RED ex workers with lot of contacts inside sent me small note. It is panic inside RED now. They are extremely afraid considering any REDCODE detailed explanation and camera hardware analysis now. As RED camera detailed dissection by pro engineers can unveil similar margins. Firm is in very unstable state, as any weakness will be used by lot of companies to fight back in the raw video patents fight. And this can kill RED. As company won't be able to make enough new gear without this patents." ALSO CAN SOMEONE research all lawsuits against red or red against others? WHAT THE HECK IS GOING ON? THIS IS BONKERS. Are we witnessing the collaspe of a billionare's company due to a person in the UK who makes youtube videos with silly mario bros coin sounds? . TRUTH IS STRANGER THAN FICTION

I do not want to participate but a specific someone is playing us like a fiddle for 15 pages now. Drags people into the nonsense abyss and single handedly destroyed the P6K thread for everyone that is trying to learn anything at all about this camera. Also, is the individual attacking most people on the smaller amount of time I have ever seen here. Stop feeding him and please try to not completely loose control of the thread, any thread.

Apple can smell blood in the the water. A win for Apple allows Nikon, Sony, Panasonic and the rest to license ProRes raw for internal recording. That's a lot of licensing revenue and a lot of FCPX sales. And a lot of happy filmmakers. ?

Or maybe they realize RED users will pay $1500 for $40 of overseas parts and want in on the action that is the insanity of the cinematography market. I think they just want to push ProRes RAW as the default in the industry so they can sell $50,000 Mac Pros to studios and ProRes RAW in their phones.

Welcome to the forum. Likewise I've been reading your posts on twitter for quite a while. Great stuff. My opinion is that ProRes RAW is at the centre of things for now. I suspect RED would have forced Apple into challenging their patent, after telling Apple they were violating it. I'd like to learn more about it, including what the consequences are for RED is their key patent if it is successfully challenged and annulled. Your theory about Apple wanting to buy RED would make sense but they would need to do their due diligence on the company. And perhaps read this thread.

Newshooter just published it https://www.newsshooter.com/2019/08/16/apple-challenges-red-over-raw-patent-legitimacy/ Edit: argh beat by the guy above me

Quite spooky how apt the title of the next video in my YouTube window was when that finished!

lol

BREAKING: Apple has sued Red over their patents on red code and their 4k raw camera Here's info I have learned so far via anonymous source via personal view: http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/22255/red-surpassed-beats-by-dr-dre-margins-record-selling-you-just-consumer-ssd-/p2?post#Form_Body From apple vs red lawsuit https://www.docketalarm.com/cases/PTAB/IPR2019-01065/Inter_Partes_Review_of_U.S._Pat._9245314/docs/05-06-2019-Petitioner/Exhibit-1003-3-Ex1003___Expert_Declaration_Redcom_314.pdf https://www.docketalarm.com/cases/PTAB/IPR2019-01065/Inter_Partes_Review_of_U.S._Pat._9245314/05-06-2019-Petitioner/Petition-2-Petition_for_IPR_of_US_Patent_No_9245314/ https://www.dropbox.com/sh/52mk7rbgykdyk8v/AAB096zoYR9MoGSxVnUT4HgDa?dl=0 LEGAL DISCLAIMER: THIS IS JUST MY OPINION FROM WHAT MY RESEARCH IS - THESE are just my opinions and my research into the legal documents I have read above. Apple’s claim: Patents invalid because tech came from Mølgaard and Presler- video image processing can be applied to Presler’s video camera Presler from Silicon Imaging cmos camera and redcode seems to possibly be modified from some existing tech already by Molgaard Key figures in Apple vs Red lawsuit: Ari Presler - Chief Tech Officer at Silicon Imaging Claus Mølgaard, Vice President of Research and Development - Phase One now at Apple https://www.linkedin.com/in/ari-presler-a250ba4/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/molgaardclaus/ Seems red buys tech, patents as their own, then sues people for using it.

Quite proud of mine ! I OK I am cheating, but I use it as my alarm clock ?

Just ordered the Peak Design Capture as recommended by @pryde so we'll see how that goes. Likely put it on the front strap of my day-pack and have the Sony X3000 action camera mounted on it. During travel legs I'll have quick access to the X3000 and when I'm at location I can easily swap between X3000 and GH5 as required. My trip is approaching, so starting to get excited ???