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this is the elephant in the room. wheres my 5d3 raw color? "clay" is right, skintones seem flat with no depth or translucency

Continuous 4k120 with Audio is a game changer for us. The R5 shoots gorgeous footage with a few well known issues. But even with the limitations, we still prefer them over all our other cameras in the office (much love for our BMPCC6kPro and Ursa G2, but they too have their fair share of issues). Jumped to pre-order an R5C today. Here's a sample of how we use the footage in the first few seconds of one of my recent videos. No need for IBIS, the EVF is critical (and why we didn't buy a C70 before this) and this one pretty much hit all my wishes outside of built-in NDs.

I'll call your having to use a RAW convertor bereft of distortion correction and raise you just putting it on an LS300. You'll then have 10.56mm of wide angle goodness. Obviously you lose the whole compact thing but I've never knowingly let practicalities be the enemy of pedantry 😉

Well, it's not my challenge, so I'm not the official adjudicator, but pretty sure that fame and glory is the reward...

We use the r6 and r5 as b cams for video at work. If you’d shot with them for any amount of time you know the ibis is not up to the task for professional work. The amount of times we got back to see weird warps on our footage is simply too high to trust it.

Yes but some M43 lenses are actually wider than marked and it is AFTER the distortion correction is applied that they become that focal length. I do not know if the 12 f2 is one of those (maybe not since it is a bit older). There is a chance it MIGHT be something like 11mm or 11.5 (You can not out pedant a pedant!).

The lack of 8K 240fps RAW makes it a no go for me. I need to future proof my work.

@kye I use 240fps A LOT on my FS7. I'd even say I use way more than 4K60 even though its FHD. It does wonders on liquid shots and sport/action. My clients really love it. Its true its not a HFR we see a lot even in todays latest hybrids. I'll admit sometimes whip out the FS7 for this feature alone!

Canon rep at the launch whilst simultaneously neglecting to mention the 8 second delay when switching modes between stills and cine whilst also taking some of the AF capability from you.

This is a great camera someone like me that operates quickly and with a small agile crew. I can fit a R5C, R5, and EOSR all battery grips into one bag plus lenses and audio gear….break them out and attach to a lens and tripod super fast for multi camera/angle shoots. R5C will be my new A camera. R5,EOSR, and C100MK2

Sdi, timecode, internal nds, a Super35 sensor with full VLog and Varicam color, an Oplf filter plus the announced specs, all that in a robust body with the outstanding battery life of the Lumix GH series! Percect dream (camera:). The Gh4 could be coupled with a sdi and xlr extension. Why not offer something like that for the Gh6, just (much) smaller with a much more elegant power solution.

Technically the question was "wider than 12mm". It sounds pedantic, but for me 12mm isn't wide enough for landscapes and architecture, and it's also not wide enough for comfortable vlogging either as you have to hold your arm out basically straight to get a neutral composition.

Wouldn't the Oly 12mm f2 qualify IF you shoot RAW and turn off corrections? It has been many years since I had it.

Now is a good time to watch a few lighting videos and try the various techniques on your little test setup. First thing that comes to mind is putting up a bounce as fill.

How do you do run and gun without IBIS? You know.. I’ve come on here for years and listened to Andrew ask for the one thing that would have made Canon a champ all these years - all we wanted was a decent upgrade to the 5D Mark II - a perfect hybrid camera video shooter. All those years ago, Canon saw the potential when Hollywood was actually utilizing 5D Mark IIs on set. But rather than capitalizing on this moment and continue to create consumer-grade products that were so good - they could be used in Hollywood, Canon instead went the other direction - chose to “monetize” those Hollywood customers with Cinema EOS - purpose -built products specific for video, and much more expensive too! In 12 long years Canon failed to recognize the need for a consumer-grade hybrid - a proper update to the 5D Mark II. Today - More than ever before - photographers are becoming videographers - it’s just the nature of the business. People still take photos, but people want video. In those last 12 years, Canon has only released two more products that are as “perfect” as the 5D Mark II as a hybrid shooter - the 1DC and the 1DX Mark III. Every other product Canon has released has had some sort of diminishing return - what we call “the cripple hammer”. But that cripple hammer is mostly thanks to Cinema EOS, and the mental gymnastics Canon continues to take their customers through in order to “protect” this Cinema market. Yet I haven’t heard of any of those “Hollywood” customers purchasing Cinema EOS products - I certainly don’t see them at the top of the sales charts. Maybe I’m wrong, but I’m pretty sure ARRI and RED are more popular at the Hollywood level? So then why the need for Cinema EOS? To me it’s just a ploy from Canon to force you into buying one product for video and one product for stills. Knowing this past history I went into this R5C announcement with expectations that IBIS would likely be missing - looks like I was right. Without IBIS I just don’t know who this camera is aimed for. In hindsight I guess we should’ve seen this a mile away. We have the C70 and the R5 - had Canon made a “perfect” solution then why would anyone buy the C70 or R5 moving forward? And so perhaps the issue is that Canon has too many products with no focus? It’s no wonder that they’re losing money. Why do consumers always have to trade off with Canon in this manner? Especially when no one has to trade off when it comes to Sony or NIkon. My current camera is a 5D Mark III. I haven’t upgraded not because of cost but because Canon refuses to release a perfect camera. And if I’m spending $10K on the camera, lens, batteries, battery grip, adapters and CFExpress cards - all required for the R5C - then we must demand perfection. Perhaps the R5 Mark II will be the true spiritual successor to the 5D Mark II? Would certainly make sense? But how many more years do I have to wait? And what features will continue to be omitted as part of a stupid effort to keep Cinema EOS “protected”?

Correction: 16 bit is a number from CVP's claim on the C70's DGO. But I don't see how they came up with that number . . . Technically: 2 x 14bit (16,384 gradients) = 15 bit or 32,768 gradients. Still, it is much more than the 12 bit (4,096) in the R5's video mode.

Still think Komodo has it. Global shutter and Recode Raw > Canon Raw. That patent, may it burn in hell, is still doing its job.

Found one for you : https://www.ebay.com/itm/224788726905 Its official name is Cokin G-350

I agree with Ben but I guess kye is also right when claims there's no actually need for ultra high-definition race, except for reframing and/or large format printing IMO : ) I believe frame rate will be the next trend for upcoming camera generations, what else? ; ) Low light, HDR look like to follow the resolution mantra :- )

Are you noticing this look from the RAW as well? If not, it's rather odd and indicates perhaps excessive NR perhaps? If it is in the RAW then that's even more strange and I really would know where that would be coming from...

So 4k 120 in XF-AVC is unlimited I saw one test with 1.5h. Now is the same quality or even better than the R5?

Something that I could not find out if the 4k 120 is oversampled and unlimited too. Anyone has seen something in this regard?

This IS a good point. However, if you turn off the corrections on the Olympus 12mm, you could also do the same with the Panasonic 14mm with the wide-angle adapter. Both would show crazy distortions though (above 5%, horrendous for primes). There's also a point to be made that people might be confusing: focal length is not field of view. For photography, the Olympus 8mm fisheye is the widest and brightest lens for M43, perhaps for all systems. Also, the field of view is much wider than other 8mm or 7.5mm lenses. You can use it for photography, no problem. For video, it's ok on a tripod or hand-held, but if you walk with it, the horizon bounces around. This lens doesn't count in that it's more than 300g. Finally, you can always get wider results with these cameras: GH2, GH5s, and BMPCC 4k. Those cameras have wider sensors than all the typical M43 sensors when shooting video.

Personally, its too much camera for me, but if someone gifted this to me.... I wouldn't say no.... If you check out Kai's video where he tests O.I.S + E.I.S... it isn't half bad.... in my opinion. The only thing is that Video. Off. Picture. switch.... what were they thinking.... again Kai shows that there is a lag too.... this is that thing where if you want to shoot candid moments that 8 second lag between that switch over.... you're just going to miss everything.🤦‍♂️

@leslie You might wanna consider an additional IR cut filter when using stronger NDs. All BM cameras suffer rather strongly from IR polution. They also prefer 5600k over pure tungsten. Great idea with lego lighting.:) cheers

Turns out the Oly 12 f2 IS wider than 12mm (if you can find a RAW convertor that does not correct for distortion). What do i win? https://www.lenstip.com/310.6-Lens_review-Olympus_M.Zuiko_Digital_12_mm_f_2.0_ED_Distortion.html

It depends on how you're using the camera. I love the EVF / IBIS combo for vintage lenses on my GH5 but shooting low angles doesn't lend itself to using the EVF and high angles would require dozens of radical leg extension surgeries to enable me to use the EVF! In-camera Electronic IS is handicapped compared to EIS done in post, because the camera can't predict future motion so easily but NLEs can easily do so. With RAW files there isn't really any advantage to using the in-camera EIS so in that situation you can do a better job in-post, which if you have time to do it will always be a better option. Plus if you're recording in 8K (or as I call it, ridiculous-o-vision) you can process the living bejeebers out of it and it'll still look fine once you downsample to 4K and run it through the YT hammer-the-shit-out-of-it compression and processing.

same 🤣

Look at how this idiot is shooting though... There is literally an electronic EVF. Using that alone would make footage probably twice as smooth. EVF with any IS lens would be totally fine. I've done it with my C70. The main issue is lack of EVF for stability on the C70.

@projectwoofer Well, it does give you that but only out of the micro hdmi.😊 That's sick, all that huge data through that tiny micro hdmi port. But seriously, a 4999 EUR camera without a professional monitoring solution. I mean, i really expected a sdi port. The BSH1 has it , though no FF 4k50p and no internal raw.

Yer the lack of an articulating screen is a real bummer, my canon 60d from 10 years or more ago has one.... Times are tough no doubt about that, i'd hate to be a business owner or company right now regardless of the type of work. Smart phones are wonders of technology, in comparison i feel cameras / video cameras are lagging or dragging the chain perhaps. No one company wants to put a camera together with all the bells and whistles. Not saying i want a calculator on my bmp4k but you know what i mean. Magic lantern did amazing things for my canon, you'd expect canon and magic lantern to jump into bed with each other and sell zillions of cameras, yet its the opposite, touch our cameras and we'll sue your pants off. After the timer incident on canons later cameras, and the way they segment the camera market, well i don't have much love for canon anymore. I do like my p4k, i cant imagine how they could make a cinema camera much easier to use ( apart from a flippy screen ) All i can suggest is you do your research, if camera b has a few extra points in your favour buy that. Your the one using it.

No camera is perfect. I think this is certainly a better effort than what Sony did with the FX3. There is Cinema RAW in there at roughly 3:1, 6:1, and 10:1 compression. There is DPAF v2 with object, face, head, eye detection. Oversampled 4K from 8K up to 60p. 8K60p RAW is there but with need of external PD power via USB-C (not ideal but it is there). The R5C is an imperfect step forward but one in the right direction imho. It’s a proper cinema camera in a Large mirrorless form factor. The FX3 doesn’t even have shutter angle for fucks sake let alone false color. So here we are: the non-overheating R5 everybody wanted WITH full fledge EOS Cinema mode and people are still not happy. Perhaps it’s the S1H people wanted without the garbage AF?…With internal RAW to boot and even better exposure tools? No IBIS but I’ll take that over out of focus footage or being stuck to MF for everything. I’m excited. Let’s see what Sony does. Let’s see if Nikon can actually pull it off with Z6/7 mark 3. MF cinema from Fuji? PDAf from panasonic? Hell will freeze over but we can dream right?

Right, well no IBIS so yeah guess that deal breaks the R5C for you.. maybe go for FX3 or S1H? 😉

I just don't think the Canon Cinema cameras are there in terms of skin tone, color depth, and dynamic range. Don't get me wrong, it looks great... But they're kind of cheating the skin tones. There's this kind of clay look, similar to the processing the iPhone does. I own the C70 and I notice this too. This is great for a lot of applications, but even with "8k raw" this is still the same image since the C300 Mkii. It is not leaps and bounds better. That being said, eye tracking, 10 bit internal, dual ISO, full frame sensor. All of this is incredible to have. I think people need to pick the camera that makes sense for their shooting style. This is a killer gimbal or second camera. Obviously. The sun clips the same as it has since... probably any c-log on any Canon EOS camera.

Actually many manufacturers have been wanting to get out of China since the beginning of 2020. The Pandemic and the whole expansionism contributed big time to it. The Japanese Government even paid businesses billions of yen to move out of China (https://www.bloombergquint.com/global-economics/japan-to-pay-at-least-536-million-for-companies-to-leave-china). I believe many other countries with manufacturing in China did too, and many large ones left are contemplating too. The environment for manufacturing has been losing its advantage for a while now, and the whole friction with its Asian neighbours, was probably the last nail.in the coffin (surprisingly, not Covid or the terrible lockdown so much). Apple seems to be one of the few ones, that has been able to retain much (not all) of its advantage. It pays higher wages than before, but their other sweat shop practices, apparently haven't gone. They paid enormous sums apparently including the majority as political money, to continue running their sweat shops. https://9to5mac.com/2021/12/07/apple-china-iphone-pledge/

I used to have one of these adapters that Cokin made for their A series filters to enable you to use them with compact cameras that, obviously, don't have a filter thread. The smart thing about it as well is that the grid of openings allow you to account for different mounting positions and distances from the lens so you would be able to position it to be snug against the front of the WA adapter. It holds three filters so is quite flexible and is made of plastic so weighs barely anything and folds flat for transport. They are long since discontinued (and I'm fucked if I can remember where my one is now) but might be worth a scout on eBay if it suits your needs.

The notable updates. - The ability to record 10 bit XF-AVC HD + Raw at the same time. Very cool. - Added Time-Lapse recording. - Added EOS Standard and EOS Neutral. Also very cool. I've been bummed since the beginning that they removed these.

I really think is wrong it does 12bit RAW video why it would do only 10bit RAW photo.... is a typo imo

As much as I hate micro HDMI, it does work (especially with a cage offering lock support). But I just don't think the R5C is going to be aimed at shooters with full crews ( focus pullers, directors etc ). Most likely one-man run & gun that needs photo/video inside a single cam..

I hope both of the customers for this camera each buy one. #salestargetgoals

This is why if something has a micro-hdmi port treat it like it doesn’t have hdmi out. That port is so flimsy and shitty and it is directly mounted to the main board on the R5.

All work and no play, makes for a very dull day. There's also the fact, its been raining To remedy that i bought a cheap $13 led light and and lego kit and have been experimenting. A couple of hours of construction later, i had me a fast car again, albeit a miniature one. Must be near 40 years since i played with lego and i'm gonna call it therapeutic and quite adsorbing. Anyway they say to start small. Fairly confident you cant get much smaller than lego and its a convenient size. Learned i need either a brighter main light and or some additional fill lights. I'm thinking a small set like this could teach one a lot about lighting, without a lot of expense well thats my theory. Did i also mention its fun, there's also the possibility, i'm regressing. I don't remember lego having so many fiddly bits. Another thing to note is once i'd finished there were spare parts. Really i hope they included some extras as there was 1 of each of the really small pieces extra. I wasted some time re reading the manual and i'm confident its all assembled is per the instructions.

Contax-Zeiss Sonnar 135mm f2.8 on Sigma FP Shot about 25 mins apart on a very changeable weather wander!

Neither ND nor IBIS? That’s a misstep. Not sure I buy the omission due to heat; there’s a…fan.

Completely and utterly horrid, confusing, and a waste of time. I didn't even make it through 20% of the video even after fast forwarding. I couldn't even tell if the whole thing was shot with the R5c or not.

Worst intro video ever, it is so bad and completely useless.

OMFG is right. I'd say "what the f* did I just watch" but I only made it to 2:27s. I haven't seen acting that bad in a looooong time. Then I thought, "did Canon give a pre-production model to some random influencers and this is what they posted?". Nope. CanonUSA official YT channel. *facepalm*

hi @webrunner5~!

I've bought the super-cheap eBay variable NDs and they're generally ok up until a certain point and beyond that they have the dreaded X in them. I'd imagine that yours would be usable. Even the name brand expensive ones have colour shifts, so just WB through it whenever you adjust it and you'll probably be fine!