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I just did a musicvideo with the GH5 and S1. Guess what, GH5 was ACam. That´s because I could rent it in a package with four batteries, Speedbooster XL, perfect cage, with rods, handle, lenssupport, the perfect mini cinema cam. Love this package. I don´t need a shoulderrig and my handheld camerawork is still fine and fitting, as I treat the camera a serious tool and I respect it. My S1 was BCam with only one battery but the spiffy FD to L-mount adapter from cieco7. I am just too stingy to invest in other extra stuff for this camera, because I am still not fond of the tilt screen mechanism, though screen and its ruggyness is fantastic. In this video it´s both cameras together. And guess what, I love them both and would love to buy a GH6. With Prores and its creamier cinematic image, sensor readout, TC, GH- line ergos and menues it would be a no brainer for me. Putting down cameras is very different from objecting to them. But sometimes we get lost and negative about the certain lacks about in some cameras rather than concentrating on their strengths. One general thing I would appreciate, if people become more appreciative about the mft system again! It´s a fantastic system! I mean, a Lumix G9 or GH5, two six year old cameras, can still put out a highend image. VLog L and VLog in lit situations with that slim 150mbit 10bit codec and at blue/Golden Hour, beautiful. And, like our friend @newfoundmass, I am a great fan of MFT and happy that our friend @webrunner5 is back, as well that I would also love our other kids to join in more again. This forum used to be about what people do with affordable gear. So if GH6 is too expensive, there is still a sub 900 dollar production work powerhouse, the GH5. @kye has been a great fan of the perfect All Intra HD. It made me happy to read about his opinion about it when he started his deep observations of the camera. So here is the video. Both cameras were fantastic! GH5 and VLog, both in their economic but strong 10bit 4K codecs. The performed perfectly as A and BCam, like I said GH5 was A was various reasons. Image to me is flawless with VLog L and Vlog performing beautifully in lit situation and Golden Hour, which I shot this video at. I did the directing, dp-ing, lights, editing and super quick grade. Was the typical onemanband thing. But even with a budget for a crew I might have chosen these cameras. If you are interested I could do a breakdown on lensing and cam choice in a different thread. Some dolly work included as well. cheers

I did follow up on shooting some quick test shots at 1080p, but then got very busy and couldn't get back to this thread. Then, funnily enough, I had to shoot a project in 1080p (client request). I'll post up some stills when I get a mo. My initial thought were that the image looks sharp and detailed. The 1080p pixel / pixel mode looked a bit mushy though. I wouldn't use it personally.

I don't know if you all have been following him on Twitter but... ANDREW REID HAS GONE TO THE DARK SIDE AND GOTTEN A RED! 2022 just won't cease with the surprises!

I'm pretty sure all the older BM cameras including the Ursa have a dual gain sensor.

German testsite Slashcam. Very amazed, by the fact that the GH6 performed equally well as the R5C regarding dynamic range. Here is a translation from their 5RC review, regarding the GH6 surprised them.: "What's really amazing, however, is how well the winner from our last MFT dynamic showdown does: The Panasonic GH6 with Dynamic Boost can "only" come up with 6K, but otherwise delivers a thoroughly equal dynamic range. We will try to present you with more dynamic range comparisons in the next few weeks, which will hopefully result in a more differentiated picture of the current camera market."

Yep, that GH6 grain is very film-like. R5C 10bit looks like there is heavy temporal NR going on which causes that unnatural shimmering, especially when you compare it to the RAW output which is noisy but doesn't shimmer.

Yeah, the Komodo is an amazing little camera. But like you said, there are some crazy deals out there. I often look to see how much the original Scarlet or Raven is going for.

Thanks for doing this! Good to hear that normal 1080 looks good. Can you control the amount of zoom in the pixel/pixel mode? On the GH5 there were two ways of doing it. One was pixel for pixel, more than 2x zoom, and was mushy. The other was exactly 2x zoom, a slightly wider crop, downsampled and with no artifacts.

https://twitter.com/EOSHD/status/1524714142275452930/photo/1 I would have bought a Komoto if it was close to the same price, but there are some crazy deals on the older stuff to be had.

You are correct. All the Fairchild ones were, and even the PK4 is also.

I should add that with the Ninja V it would be possible to do a transform to a log-ish image with a LUT, but I'm not sure if the highlights would be preserved. And then an additional LUT would be required to transform to a Rec709 image. These two transforms can be collapsed into a single LUT at the expense of highlight values above 1. It's possible the entire range could be preserved by underexposing the image and using the LUT to lift the exposure. In summary, if there isn't a built-in way, there probably is a way of forcing the Ninja V or anything else to display a usable monitoring image with some hacks and workarounds.

You are correct, ProRes raw is linear raw the same as DNG. It is no great mystery. In ACES or a similar linear gamma project, the linearity is maintained but the exposure is shifted to account for where middle grey is so that there are superbright values in floating point above 1.0. In editing software besides Resolve, the ProRes raw file needs to be interpreted as log but it should still set it to the correct exposure. And then as you say, you apply a film print LUT to Rec709 or similar. You are meant to display raw images in log because it shows the entire range, before adding the look LUT in either HDR or SDR space. This is the big problem with this camera - people who say it doesn't need log are forgetting about monitoring. There is always an intermediate transform of linear raw to a log format before applying the display LUT since LUTs only work in 0-1 space. I spoke to Atomos, and they could not even say what the colour space is of the Sigma fp when monitoring native on the Ninja V, but I suspect it's somewhat like the OFF profile. This goes back to Sigma not documenting this. So it might be a kind of Rec709 space, but it seems that it's more flat than that. I also asked if there was a way to transform the native image into a known log format and they said no. So I don't believe there's any value in writing down those IRE values, since they are only ever within the context of the gamma encoded space of the image display (even though the underlying image is linear) and no-one can say how the image is encoded. That is why I asked, can you check false colour on the camera itself? If as others have said, it takes the values directly from the sensor. That might also give you some clues as to how to set it on the Ninja V. You can also create your own false colour LUT for the Ninja V.

I know that 4K is, for a lot of projects, the minimum now, but it really would be unacceptable if the GH6 didn't have excellent 1080p. With the processing power that camera has there's absolutely no reason for it to be anything less. Looking forward to your findings @Mmmbeats

If anyone can upload some 12-bit DNGs shot through the ISO range with shadows and something bright enough to clip the sensor, that would be great! I think the following: 100, 200, 400, 640 (if that's possible), 800, 1600, 3200, 6400, 12800. Bonus for a grey card, but not essential. @OleB both your lightbulb tests were great, but maybe what would be easiest for a DNG test is to replicate the second test with the exposure increase via the ISO change, and without the compensation of stopping down the lens. It then cuts out one more variable.

I really hope that once you guys have figured it out you'll post a summary... you lost me a few pages ago!

Yeah, that stood out to me as a real advantage in my imperfect real-world shooting. I've previously found the grain on the GH5 150Mbps 4K mode to be pretty good at higher ISOs as well. The noise on the R5C doesn't seem as nice - and that banding wasn't at all aesthetically neutral!

Great stuff! Simple concept, clean compositions and overall seems like it was well executed. With such strong content and cast it's best just to keep it simple and not have the production get in the way. Well done 🙂

Lots of good discussion on various aspects, but I think perhaps you're being a little unfair. First reason is the Dual Gain sensor. The GH6 DGO sensor is what, the third ever released in a camera? ARRI ALEV, then Canon DGO, and now GH6. If you cast your mind back to before it was released and the speculation about what a potential GH6 might include, there were expectations that it would 'wow' and really stand out from the pack (or that it would need to), and I don't think anyone predicted a DGO sensor. I suspect I might have mentioned it, but if I did it would have been a passing fantasy rather than a real prediction. It was more than anyone could even think of to ask for. and then it arrived in a GH camera. Why isn't this simply blowing away everyone? Unfortunately, the DR from it just doesn't seem to wow. I think there's a few reasons for this. One is that an MFT sensor has an outright disadvantage in terms of light-gathering ability over S35 and FF through physical size (two stops compared to FF and one compared to S35), but even beyond that, the DR measurements just aren't that impressive, compared to single-gain sensors. I wonder if the GH6 sensor has been in the pipeline for so long that it's a DGO implementation of an older technology? Regardless, with it's two-stop light-gathering disadvantage from FF, it didn't rocket to the top of the DR test charts, and that's what people want right, "best ever" headlines - not "best ever (in it's class and taking into account blah blah blah)" headlines. I must admit I'm a little disappointed by its measured DR, especially considering the original S35 ALEV sensor only has one stop of light advantage but has well over one stop of DR, plus it's decade-old tech at this point. I also think we haven't seen enough stuff from this to truly understand what this looks like when pushed to its full potential. GH6 footage is actually pretty thin on the ground, and the meticulously crafted footage (like we all refer to when talking about other cameras) is even rarer still. Second reason is that the GH line is an all-rounder, which is difficult in itself. Lots of competitors do a few things well, and a few things really really badly. The GH line doesn't really have an achilles-heel, and before you say "autofocus" think again - the AF on the GH6 is actually very respectable, it's just not world-class. If most cameras reallocated awesomeness from their killer-features to their weaknesses, their killer features wouldn't be killer anymore. It's like there's only so many awesome points that a camera can have, and it has to choose which features to put them into and which to sacrifice. The GH line has prioritised not having huge flaws rather than having headline features. Some examples. P4K - stepping right over the fact it's a cinema camera and automatically lacks about half the features of the GH6, it's huge and butt-ugly, it's AF isn't even continuous, and has no stabilisation at all. Take the P4K, and think how much extra it would cost to make it a sensible forum-factor, give it functional C-AF, add IBIS, and then, you know, make it a stills camera too. The P4K is literally half the features of a GH6, with a few extra advantages. Sure, it can shoot RAW internally, but if you add an external recorder to the GH6 you get an articulating screen and it's almost still smaller! FP - I really want to love the FP but it's also sort of half-baked like the GH6 is. It makes you choose between uncompressed RAW (which is absolutely huge compared to compressed formats - this adds to the cost of media and add post-processing time which I'd prefer to avoid) and its internally compressed formats that are so lacklustre they kind of negate the benefits of choosing the camera at all. Sure, you can go external and record prores or compressed RAW of your preferred flavour, but you've added almost another $1000 (with cage, recorder, its own batteries and charging requirements, cables, etc) and now you don't have something comparable in form-factor. Also, because the FP doesn't have stabilisation, you'll need to buy stabilised lenses if you want that feature, and with the L-mount that's either adapters or pretty-pricey and limited glass. B&H list two L-mount FF lenses with IS under $1000, but they list 9 in EF mount, one is under $500. So not only does "adding stabilisation" mean you become very limited in choosing the lenses you can to use, but it puts a $500 fee on top. I know - I've been looking! Panasonics FF cameras are also less polished. The S5 doesn't have an ALL-I codec (let alone Prores). I've heard that the lower resolution modes aren't nicely downsampled from the full frame sensors. For a comparison, the GH5 will downsample the full sensor for all resolutions, all frame rates, and all levels of digital zoom. I shoot in 1080p ALL-I codec, in both 24p and 60p, and using 1x and 2x digital zoom, and every combination is downsampled beautifully. As far as I'm aware, none of the Panasonic FF cameras can do that, even the S1H which is almost double the price of the GH6 and a behemoth physically. Thirdly, some features aren't measurable (or simply aren't measured) Stabilisation is one of these. We all know that stabilisation is measured in stops, but this is only half of the picture. The "stops" is a measure of the reduction in movement that's provided by the camera when given some shake that's within its range. To put its 7.5 stops into perspective, it's a factor of 181. So if you jiggled the camera horizontally by 181 pixels, the IBIS would stabilise that so that the movement was within a single pixel - ie, zero blur. It does this by moving the sensor, and the stops is the measure of how accurately the sensor can compensate for the shake. The other variable is how far the sensor can move, and this is the one that no-one ever tests, but it's the one that's more important. The reason that travel is more important is that once you shake the camera by more than the amount its IBIS motors can move, you go from having a 7.5 stop stabilisation to a 0-stop reduction. The GH5 stabilisation was beloved by all because of how far it could move, not by how much it reduced the vibration when it was within range (which was similar to OIS lenses). MFT has an inherent advantage in this sense, but there's no way to really know how much this is in play in reality because no-one tests it. I would imagine that FF sensors have gotten better at this, but I max out the GH5 IBIS regularly, and I suspect others do as well otherwise they wouldn't have praised the IBIS back in 2017, so the last thing I want is less stabilisation! People love to compare the strengths of cameras, but when you start comparing the weaknesses, the GH6 actually does pretty well, because most features aren't so weak that they're worth talking about, or are overblown. I mean, what are the weaknesses of the GH6? It's AF isn't the best in the world - well sure but it beats the living crap out of every AFS and non-AF camera ever made, which until the last 5 years was basically every camera The base ISO of 2000 for the DR boost mode is high - it's 1.3 stops higher than ISO 800 which is the common base ISO for millions of cameras Its battery life is about an hour (I've heard people say 80 minutes of record time) - what was the battery life of the P4K and P6K cameras again? I've forgotten. It's expensive and large for an MFT camera - actually it's pretty small when you consider its got a fan, tilt/flip screen, EVF, records to a very high bitrate professional codec internally, IBIS, and a flag-ship number of knobs and buttons It also has this streaking issue that definitely isn't acceptable but I suspect will get sorted in firmware, and it also hasn't gotten the promised update to implement Prores in 4K and 1080p (which I suspect will also come with higher quality downsampling in those resolutions) and the USB recording.

The GH6 really does seem to handle shadows well, the color holds up.

Just to clarify I have said the GH6 is probably the ultimate run and gun camera. Panasonic always packs in a ton of features at an at least decent price point.

I'm probably the last person who should contribute to this conversation. The last time I bought a new camera was over 5 years ago and the camera was released 5 years before that. With that said, I think the GH6 is the best camera on the market right now. Internal 5.7K ProRes with IBIS, 4 channels of audio, etc... I mean it's $2200! For internal ProRes and an image that comes damn close to the Red Komodo. I wish Panasonic could extend that ProRes license to one of their cheaper m4/3 cameras... maybe a 2K ProRes camera at half the price... that would be a genius move. And with that said, I do prefer full frame. I like using vintage lenses and not have to do math every time I decide what lens to use... especially since you need a speedbooster to get the most from the lens. And with that said... I'm cheap and I know what I need. I have a camera that works perfectly fine. I don't need 6K. I doubt anyone in the prosumer market does. So I'd wait for a big sale or to see when they release their ProRes FW. But man... the GH6 is a pretty special camera. Sure you can get a P4K for $1299, but you're adding a lot of money to make it workable and it's a huge beast of an ugly camera.

Blackmagic have just updated their Video Assist to record Braw from the Leica SL2-S - anyone here able to test it? I'm very curious. Update page: https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/support/readme/5939d7b7a4ab432598476c0bbefc8116

Come on fellas, at least try and keep it on topic…