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Just catching up with the S5II announcement. This is actually the first Panny mirrorless I'd consider as I'm slaved to DPAF since C100 almost a decade ago. A big kudos to Panasonic for finally getting proper video AF. The specs and price of the S5ii are also very impressive. FF 6K30p with 3:2 open-gate is simply terrific for the asking price. Neither Canon or Sony offer these specs at such an entry price point. This alone is very aggressive and makes switching tempting. I've actually sold my R6 so I'm actively in the market for a new mirrorless right now. And this new entry makes my decision making even tougher. I was hesitating in between simply upgrading to the R6 II or getting FX30. Or investing in higher up R5/A7S3. Or even R3. So yeah Canon vs Sony. But the S5II (and upcoming S5IIx) is definitely on my radar now as well. It would be my number one choice as far as bang for buck but actually the last because of these unknown factors: - Lenses. I'm not at all equipped in them and the offering seems a little stale & pricy. - Color Science & VLOG. I know nothing about them and kinda afraid the results and learning curve won't be to my satisfaction. This is really important. - Size/Weight. I've always found the S series the most heavy/bulky system. Well built though.

Well that's it, deal done; S5 and S1H being 'traded' for a pair of S5ii's. MPB collecting tomorrow, new boys on pre-order... I would have preferred a pair of S5iix's, purely for their look (don't need their spec, - anything over 200mbs not required) but as they are not available until end of May/early June and my next season starts end of March... I'm going to miss my S1H for sure, but this is going to be a better pairing for my video needs being: A. Identical bodies. B. Both having a built in fan rather than just the S1H (though the S5 never overheated a single time). C. The AF of course for which I have a need, especially with regard to shooting log because shooting that only made the AF worse with previous Lumix cameras. D. No 30 minute time limit as with the S5 which was a pain. Body A will be paired with the Sigma 16-28mm f2.8 and Body B with the Sigma 28-70mm f2.8 and that's happy days for the forseeable future. My only wish would have been the tilt screen of the S1H (or even the S1/S1R) but that is the ONLY compromise with this camera for me. For my video needs anyway... For stills, sticking with my trusty S1R's for the time being. I had already sold off my f2 Sigma primes. Loved them, but going forward, really wanted something a bit faster for the low light stuff so bought 3x f1.4's, the; 20, 35 and 85. I'm in no rush to replace them and had considered a complete S5ii lineup, but I reckon either Panasonic or Leica will come out with something maybe for next year that will update the S1R significantly enough for me to replace them. The ideal now would be an S5iiR model, but an S2R or something Leica flavoured would do it. On the other hand, I might just trade the pair of them for a third S5ii body as a 3 body set up rather than a 4 works better...except during wedding ceremonies and speeches unless I switch to a 3x zoom set up for those times. We'll see but glad I stuck with Lumix after considering; OM-1, XH2/S and even a wholesale switch to Sony. Faith restored in Lumix/L Mount. Hadn't really lost it as such but I had a concern that they might just blow it and not go phase detect but realistically, that would have been suicide for them.

A pretty good overview:

Yes from what I've seen there is no real wobble at 20mm on the S5ii, looks useable to me. And for everything else Panasonic IBIS alone is better than IBIS and lens IS combination on either Sony or Canon. And goodbye micro HDMI you will not be missed

I will. @FHDcrew At the moment I am in lack of artistic projects and in lack of a creative community. Busy with gruesome grading work.:/

Why don’t you go out and film with your Sony F3 😉

I got my 6D today and tested stills, video, and even ML raw a bit. The video is the typical mushy Canon 1080p, and the only continuous shooting for ML raw adds a 1.42 crop, nearly the same crop factor of the P4K with a .71 focal reducer with a much a worse workflow, so I won't be using that. But the stills are very nice and I'm excited to go out and shoot more. As much as I'n enjoying shooting film again, the cost can add up, so I don't want to go out and shoot casually much. So any camera that makes me want to shoot is always good. Here's a little self portrait I shot on the 6D: Color version: And my heavy-handed attempt at an expired film/cross-processed look:

Now Fuji will have to up its AF game. It is starting to be kinda embarrassing... If Panasonic do a GX10 with a good EVF, PDAF and Ok video, I will be tempted to come back.

Panasonic - like Nikon with the 1.8 S lenses, are doing great things with the few lenses its released. The faster lenses are stupid huge and not doing them any favors at all. But Sony also has the 50GM, which is vastly superior to pretty much any L-mount lens in every way. Panasonic should be dissecting every recent GM lens and try to top them, the size of many L-mount bodies and lenses are a detractor for many. The 50 1.4z is still great and can be found used for crazy cheap prices compared to its performance. Sony's latest GM mk2 zooms make the gargantuan L-mount 2.8 zooms look silly in comparison - they're better optically, better AF with the linear motors and are much, much smaller. Sony also has the recent 24/35/135 GM's that are class leading, and cheaper alternatives in many cases like the 20/35/80 1.8's. And then there are the vast 3rd party options including everything Sigma has in the L-mount. Everyone has a long way to catch Sony on the lens side - the only thing anyone outside of Canon can hope for is to try and stack the spec sheet enough to keep people from choosing Sony or Canon. But as we've seen over the last few years, Sony is the only one gaining market share at the expense of everyone else. Lenses are a major factor in their rise. Chris

Regarding GH6, information regarding image quality is very contradictory. Noise reduction and anti rolling shutter algorithms messing with the image too much to be reliable enough to trump a GH5II by a meaningful margin, if at all. I would have been interested by the promise of a pocket4K image in a GH5 body. But it´s not like that it seems. It has proved to hold onto colour and resolution much better than a GH5s in low light but that on locked shots with little onscreen movement. Forum friends have reported here that digital mambo jambo, 3D noise reduction is degrading the otherwise potentially great image quality from this camera. I hope to get more insight into this, as I am still interested in this intriguing camera. Btw no Prores for UHD modes and no Prores LT is just a super dumb move! No battery grip, wtf. For FF, please, Timecode and 4K60p full frame and open gate, 10bit 422, All Intra, rolling shutter less than 15ms in open gate. Nothing else needed. Make it 3000 Euro. With SDI and internal ND for a 4000 model. Thank you!

Oops. Didn't quite finish the post and it wouldn't let me edit. Here ya go: A lot of the niche manufacturers are doing some really amazing things with their cameras and Panasonic should take the same approach. Black Magic with their internal raw and giant 5" very bright screen. Kinefinity with their design, use of SSDs, electronic ND, dual battery plate, and great monitor solutions, Z-Cam F6 Pro with V-Mount (YESSS), etc. The Ronin 4D is also brilliantly designed and if it didn't have the gimbal on the front, I would buy it in a heartbeat. All of the major manufacturers use the exact same photo-first design (even the Sony FX3 and FX30 and Canon R5c), which just isn't great for video shooting (the Canon C70 is great, but sort of proves the point. Pain in the butt to hold that large of a camera out in front of you and use the dinky screen). Panasonic needs to think out of the box and expand the S1H into a video-creating monster for $4000 - $4500. In my mind that means mostly hardware upgrades (assuming they'll snag something like the A1 sensor): - Electronic ND that works with IBIS - Two Mini XLRs - TIMECODE (criminal that the S5 IIx doesn't have this) - Dedicated top handle (the FX30 does this great) - 4 - 4.5", 1200+ nit screen - you may still want to use an external monitor, but don't make it a necessity). Would also be great if this could be mounted to the side of the handle (like the Mavo Edge). - SDI port - Same PDAF as S5 II - Some other out-of-the-box accessories: a battery grip that has an SSD slot for external raw (rather than having to buy crappy Atomos monitor/recorders). Every time a manufacturer has caught up in the space they did something others were not doing (Sony with small, full-frame mirrorless cameras and then a focus on AF, Fuji with their retro design and aesthetics, Red with 4k and 8k, Black Magic with interesting features and low prices, etc). Panasonic is not going to win doing the same thing as everyone else, even if they do it better. They have to take a leap and offer something others won't. I hope they do.

For sure. Unfortunately, the Varicam and EVA-2 were from the cinema division and not the Lumix division and I think the cinema division is done. However, I still think Lumix could fill the same gap and kind of did with the BS1H, but it was missing too many features to snag any of the Red Komodo, Z-Cam, and other box-like camera pie. A lot of the niche manufacturers are doing some really amazing things with their cameras and Panasonic should take the same approach. Black Magic with their internal raw and giant 5" very bright screen. Kinefinity with their design, use of SSDs, electronic ND, dual battery plate, and great monitor solutions, Z-Cam F6 Pro with V-Mount (YESSS), etc. The Ronin 4D is also brilliantly designed and if it didn't have the gimbal on the front, I would buy it in a heartbeat. All of the major manufacturers use the exact same photo-first design (even the Sony FX3 and FX30 and Canon R5c), which just isn't great for video shooting (the Canon C70 is great, but sort of proves the point. Pain in the butt to hold that large of a camera out in front of you and use the dinky screen). Panasonic needs to think out of the box and expand the S1H into a video-creating monster for $4500. In my mind that means mostly hardware upgrades (assuming they'll snag something like the A1 sensor): - Internal NDs that work with IBIS

The difference in lenses is overall build and optical quality. The Panasonic 50mm f1.8 is vastly superior in every way to the Canon or Sony equivalents, especially in build and function. With that said, it would be good for Panasonic to have a $150-200 lens to get people into the system. I like the 40mm f2 or 40mm f2.8 pancake option. The Panasonic S5 was recently selling for $1500 in the USA and you got a free 50mm f1.8 or awhile and then they switched it to a free 85mm f1.8. I think they should just keep this pricing permanent. After a year or two of using the S5, those users (hooked now with lenses), will be all about upgrading to the S5 II or S2H or whatever comes next. But, like they recently said about "looking forward to the rapid expansion of Lumix systems," they need to expand very quickly and aggressively. PDAF is here, the excitement is up, they are better in almost every way compared to the other brands in terms of IQ, tools, IBIS, video assist tools, ergonomics, look/design, mid-tier lens quality, high-end lens quality (for 24-70mm, 50mm f1.4, etc), etc - I really think Panasonic just have better cameras than all of the competition outside of telephoto lenses and AF - but now the AF is comparable to Sony and easily better than the video AF on Canon's R5c. They need to spend the next 6-9 months releasing at least 2-3 more bodies. Specifically a VERY video focused video at NAB in April (like BS2H or S2H with updated stacked sensor, high-frame rates, electronic ND (please!), timecode, and (probably though I don't care too much) 8k) and then a 47-61 megapixel S5 IIr. A 24mm and 85mm f1.4 in the 500-650 gram range would also be very welcome.

A black marker can fix that 😉 "better communication" would have been even worse, it would have killed sales of the GH6 itself! Agreed. Buying secondhand means someone else takes the brunt of the loss on depreciation, and you're also able to clearly see into the "future" as you know what's coming down the pipeline for the next couple of models. (because they've already been released!)

I sympathize with a lot of people that went with the GH6 for this reason, though it's just the nature of the beast unfortunately. The GH6 felt so long overdue at the time that it's hard to say this, but they might've been better off waiting until they could do PDAF before releasing it. Easy to say that now, though.

Wow that is a fantastic deal with the 20-60mm and 50mm being only £400 more. Am very tempted... Was looking at Canon R6ii to replace the very frustrating R6 but with the Sigma adapter looking like you can get decent AF with Canon EF lenses, the S5ii looks a much better camera for me. The Panasonics IBIS is way above Canons, and also the much better DR, full size HDMI, touchscreen which stays on when you connect external monitor. The S5ii is £779 cheaper than the R6ii, even with the 20-60mm and 50mm deal I can also add the Sigma adapter and it still comes out cheaper than the Canon R6ii. I also trust Panasonic more than Canon to give their camera decent firmware support and make it the best camera they can. Sorry I realise this is Sony v Panny thread and I've just added Canon to the mix

Panasonic (or at least their partner: Sigma) need to play this same game. Bring out an absurdly cheap couple of lenses. Don't care what they are, just make them cheap and preferably more than one. Could be a 40mm f4 pancake for $199. Could be a 35mm to 105mm variable f-stop zoom for $250 Could be a 50mm f2 for $199 Could be a 35mm f2.8 for $299 Whatever, just make a couple of them asap! To draw people into their L Mount ecosystem. As they have to play the same game the other companies are playing. Nikon/Canon/Sony/Fujifilm/Pentax all do this. (yes, even Pentax!) Pentax 50mm f1.8 = $97 Pentax 35mm f/2.4 = $117 Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 = $125 Canon EF-S 24mm f/2.8 STM Lens = $129 Nikon 50mm f/1.8D = $132 Nikon DX 35mm f/1.8G = $180 Pentax 40mm f/2.8 (it's an amazing pancake lens!!!) = $230 Nikon DX Macro Lens 40mm f/2.8G = $280 Nikon 28mm f/2.8D = $287 Canon RF 50mm f/1.8 = $149 Canon EF-M 22mm f/2 = $179 Fujifilm 35mm f/2 = $199 Sony FE 50mm f/1.8 = $248 Sony E 16mm f/2.8 (pancake!) = $248 Canon RF 16mm f/2.8 = $249 Nikon Z 40mm f/2 = $277 Nikon Z 28mm f/2.8 = $277 They need to do the same too for camera bodies, how else can they compete with the gateway drugs of: Nikon Z5, Canon EOS RP, Sony a7C / a7mk3 ?? Let alone the other gateway drugs they all have of APS-C cameras for dirt dirt cheap: Nikon Z30, Canon R10, Sony a6x00 Because as fantastically great as Panasonic MFT cameras are, they're unfortunately not a smooth pathway into the L Mount Ecosystem. Am glad to hear that Panasonic will keep around the S5mk1, as that's a smart move. Because as I'll say over and over again, Panasonic (and Sigma & Lecia) **NEED** a gateway drug (camera) into the L Mount system. Sony does this by keeping around their older a7mk3 (and even a7mk2!!) at cheaper prices. If Panasonic had the S5mk1 available for US$1.7K , then dropping down in the second half of this year to US$1.5K, then the S5 would do well at serving that critical niche point. (and just keep on dropping it down by another $100 each year, until five years from now it's being sold for US$1.1K brand new)

The C200B is on sale at B&H right now. I think it's $2400.

I decided to keep my P4K for video but get a cheap old DSLR for stills (and maybe to toy around with video). I just purchased a "heavily used" Canon 6D with 64k shutter count from mpb for $214. I was gifted $200 for Christmas so I figured "why not?"

I'd love an F35 but it probably won't happen