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I agree and I think this idea is nonsense. I use m43, Panasonic/Sony FF, and yet I preorderer the G9II. So why the hell I bought this "big" and "expensive" m43 camera ? There are a few reasons : - Neither my A7IV or S5II can give me the fantastic stabilization of the G9II with "relatively small" telephoto and super telephoto lenses. - Neither of these FF cameras have an acceptable rolling shutter or 60fps Open Gate/120fps 4K. Yes, the A7SIII has good rolling shutter and it has 4K 120fps, but there are always trade-off (much more expensive, low MP, no crop mode,worse details in 4K 120fps). - While they are a lot of really excellent lenses of the FE mount and a few on the L mount, m43 has a lot of jewels as well. I can't see me stopping using some of my Panasonic Leica or my Oly Pro lenses. Some are irremplacable like the 100-400mm PL, some are outstanding to the point that even comparable FF lenses are no match, like the two f1.7 Panasonic zooms (contrast and colors are wonderful). I also tried to replace my 12-32mm, 12-35mm and 35-100mm with some FF lenses on my S5II and my A7IV, I can't. There are some options for Sony to replace the 12-35mm but they are not compelling for me (weight, price or features associated with the camera). - This is subjective but I love the colors from the GH6 and I expect the colors from the G9II to be almost the same. I don't like the colors of the S5II as much, even less the colors of the A7IV. So at the end of the day, there is no perfect camera and system, but they have strengths and weaknesses. No, we can't get the low light performance of the S5II on the G9II. No, we can't get the FF look at some focal lenghts (like the 50mm GM f1.2) with our m43 cameras and lenses. But as pointed out above, m43 gives a lot of advantage as well. And if we should use m43 only with small cameras, we could not get everything this system can offer with the G9II.

Do we need 8K? Find out why I have changed my mind here. https://www.eoshd.com/news/the-great-8k-debate-why-i-have-changed-my-mind And yes the Sigma Fp-L and Sony a1 have something to do with it 🙂

Also a no for me. Micro pancake lenses on a 1 inch sensor simply can't rival with S35/FF + nice glass. The DoF on an iPhone makes it look like everything was shot at f11. Don't even get me started on "cinematic mode". Then you have the handling/ergonomics. Dials, buttons, aperture rings etc are essential to me. I don't even know how you'd go about putting things like ND's on an iPhone or quality audio. Now for social media or vertical B-roll sure it sounds nice. My biggest gripe I guess is that you have to buy an iPhone 15 Pro to have log. You know they could give you log in other models including older models. If anything pros would prefer to disable all the image processing.

Stop making me want to buy stuff. My family will be planning an intervention at this rate.

No way as I truly hate taking videos and picture with my iPhone, but is a great tool for the times that I cannot or is too impractical to take a larger mirrorless camera. I'm still not sold on the fake DoF although now you can do it after the fact so is less risky. No aperture, hard to control SS, limited low light capability, max 120mm tele... and for me I just hate all the touch UI, no dials, no evf, etc... last but not least no removable storage.... so you need to resort on using external SSD or external CFExpress+Reader that defeated a bit the whole phone idea... Do I use it now yes (13 pro max), will I move to the 15 pro max, probably, would it replace mirrorless camera even for private stuff? Not for me but I'm the one going around in NY for pleasure with a R5+28-70 so everyone is different.

@SRV1981 - I said PROBABLY I would still prefer Android RAW 🙂 Until somebody shares some Apple Log footage that can grade myself or even better, test iPhone 15 with Apple log myself, will hold any judgement. I am skeptical about those comparisons with Sony S Log and FF cameras. We've seen plenty of those over the years with similar claims. I suspect their main purpose is to generate more youtube views. 🙂 Smartphones had never been so good for video, yet nobody throws away their FF, Super35 or m43 cameras and lenses. 🙂 For myself smartphone video will not replace my FF camera and lenses it will just complement them for personal projects and family video. Workflow Android RAW vs iPhone 14 Pro Can only compare with older iPhone model as this is the one I had experience with. Yes Android RAW workflow is more time consuming and space consuming at the beginning You have two extra steps before starting editing: - unpack DNG files from the file container that comes from MotionCam - run exiftool to label them in a specific way so Resolve recognize them as DGN files from a Blackmagic camera However it compensates with easy color correction and grading. With iPhone 14 Pro initial steps are easy and fast, just drag your footage in Resolve. Color correction is time consuming and no so easy, often with extra steps like applying film look with Dehancer in an attempt to hide sharpening and tone mapping. I can do something else while DNGs are unpacked and labeled, those operations can run on the background and do not requite my attention. IPhone grading on the other hand does require all of my attention and skills. I prefer the Android RAW workflow as am able to get the picture quality I like faster and easier. Again this may change with iPhone 15 and Apple Log but need to test it first. One big advantage of iPhone is that it has excellent stabilization combining Optical IS with software one. Raw video on Android often can't use Optical IS or results are not good. At least for some smartphone models. It begs for a gimbal. In general shooting with iPhone is easier and better experience. For me the whole idea to shoot on a smartphone is about having a good camera with you all the time and shoot quality video if you suddenly get an inspiration. You just don't think about it, don't have to take a bag, choose lenses, etc. It is always with you. For the moment Android RAW video is my personal preference but it doesn't have to be yours. 🙂

Yeah definitely can and maybe some pro project too. Just 4k prores is 6GB per min, that like 360GB for 1hr, good thing it can record to SSD which is hell cheaper than fast sd card.

I don't think anyone is questioning the future of Panasonic though ? It is where they are at and/or heading within this specific format that is under discussion as they are in rude health within the FF market. Again, the camera (which as I've said umpteen times looks very good) and the form/format are very different things. The idea of a compact system that offers the "optimal balance of high image quality, compactness and lightweight in cameras with interchangeable lenses" to quote the actual MFT organisation itself is surely challenged when it becomes the same size as a full frame system from the same manufacturer. We need to examine the word 'dead' in the context of what it actually means to a camera system. It isn't 'dead' as in the absolute discontinuation of all MFT products. Which means it isn't yet 'dead' in terms of the stated ethos of it as a format by the MFT organisation as, if nothing else, BMD have just released a camera that actually fits within those aims. We also don't know whether Panasonic might also have a camera up their sleeves (or in their pocket) that will more closely align with that ethos. I'd say that a more appropriate word, as it currently stands, would more likely be 'moribund'. In a hippier time, it might be described as the 'scene' being 'dead' (man). Indicating that what it was is not currently what it is. But what it is might well work for many people so thats all fine too. I was using it to provide some light relief to this thread 🙂 And to show my own innate hypocrisy and how you can't really rely on the meanderings of a random old fella on the internet. I emphatically agree with both of you that the notion of all MFT cameras having to be small is both a nonsense and ludicrous. Which is why I haven't actually stated that. Equally, the notion that all MFT cameras having to be the same size as a FF camera is also both a nonsense and ludicrous. There is room for both. Its just that Panasonic haven't released one for three years which was the ill fated (but actually not without its merits) G100. With the 12-32m kit lens it was around £600 before it was discontinued and it really did fit with the ethos of MFT as we originally understood it and how the MFT organisation still describe it. It showed that when motivated by hatred (Sony's dominance of the vlogging market) that Panasonic could still do it despite the intervening four years prior to that (the G80 launch) they had been making ever bigger bodies. Time marches on, of course, and things change so if the price that has to be paid now (physically and literally) to move the story along from the G80 (which unlike the G100 had IBIS) in terms of video spec then so be it. Of course, Panasonic are not the only MFT player in town so maybe Olympus will offer that alternative. Yes, the extra reach of the 100-400 on MFT would need the Sigma 150-600 to equal on FF L mount which results in a significant size disadvantage. This is an example where it makes sense both as a format in general anyway but also as a camera itself, if the price to pay for that performance has to be that form factor. Thus far, it appears that it must because there is no alternative with that spec. Maybe I will pre-order one after all 😂

There is no good way to judge colour online - lets review all the possibilities: log images are shown this is the purest experience of the camera, but you can't judge anything with this log images + manufacturers LUT is shown this is the best way to judge images, but its random chance how good this will look and doesn't really show the potential of the footage graded images are shown, but they look crap this tells you nothing as you can't tell if the camera is bad, the LUT is bad, the colourist is bad, or all of them graded images are shown, and they look good this tells you what is possible but not what is possible for you. great images could be because the camera is great and colourist is ok, camera is good but colourist is very good, camera is mediocre but colourist is world class BTW, if camera forums and camera YT had the same level of knowledge about cameras as they do about colour grading then every video would be trying to work out the exposure triangle and failing. Even rudimentary colour grading and colour science knowledge online is rare outside professional colourist circles - I know more about these things that most and I am at the very very very shallow end of the pool so if I know more than you do then you're basically no-where...

I have to humbly Disagree with the idea that All M43 Cameras must be Tiny or Pocketable. That's Lucrous. Apple has the distinction of making smartphones that make claims that they can shoot Arri Video Quality or Prosumer or Professional Photo Quality, at a fraction of the price, but there isn't really much truth to that. Regardless of what Hollywood director, whose film has been sponsored by Apple, tells that to you. While almost everyone ALSO wants a GM5 sized Panasonic (especially since Fuji and Ricoh make some superb point and shoot cameras), all Panasonic need not be tiny. They would have issues with overheating, and other issues and look rather amatuer on a Professional shoot. I am comparing the GM5 to the Netflix Approved Sony FX3, the A7Siii, and the Fuji X100v. Panasonic needs the GH, the G and the GM lineups (hopefully something with the GX85's IBIS, but much smaller, probably with 10 minutes recording times).

The size of the arsehole when said earwig has been created by Panasonic's MFT design team.

Possibly because it kind of demonstrates that one of the least most important components of movie making is the camera itself? Beyond a certain point. I’m sure they were not using the f4-5.6 kit lens but some 20k$ cine lenses and maybe less than in some other productions, but whatever lighting etc was needed. We know that even just in commercial jobs, the type of camera you have can get you or at least deny you, the job. ’Average’ tool in skilled hands etc… In terms of sensor though, just how far off a Venice is that of the FX3? Barely anything.

Let's assume you are product manager in a Japanese camera company. You want to add a new video oriented hybrid to your line up. By video oriented hybrid I mean a video camera that can be used for still photography, rather than a still camera that can shoot video very well. Please be specific about the specs. And consider, as a product manager, you should have a clear plan for future updates releasing every 2 years, and at least one firmware update in between. Also be realistic to keep the price at $2k. I don't want to know what you personally want. I want to know what you think the market wants. Thanks.

A couple of years ago I was almost close to buy the iPhone 13 Pro (not the Max because there was no difference with the smaller one and wanted a much more portable device) because of ProRes introduction. Didn't like its implementation. Disappointing colour science and oversharpening as main flaw placed me out of my first iPhone purchase (gifts don't count : D). Seems not this time... so need to go after the best deal how to optimise it for tips & accessories :- ) Any suggestions from out there and people used to iPhone to newcomers?

For me is both, did you notice that most A/B test are in good light, minimal camera movements, static subject, using the main camera and not the wider and tele as they have less quality. Just look at this when moving and using the wide camera a Gopro is much better than the iPhone 15 and a Gopro is so far away in quality than a mirrorless: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEfFk5GR5y0 Somebody with great skills can make very good video out of in iPhone but imo there still no magic to make a super tiny sensor and lens look like a FF camera, the gap is narrowing but is still there.

Even though the average movie goer (or even the average movie reviewer) doesn't know what "a Sony FX3" is, this still helps them massively create this underdog story of we're this plucky independent-ish film going our own way, doing things in our own manner, and we're not like those big studio films that some people are getting turned off by.

And you don’t want the guy who did the Millenium Falcon. Just ONE cup holder. MAJOR oversight.

Just as long as he, she or they (you can never truly tell with Lego people) doesn’t have the standard Lego hands. Which are rubbish.

In terms of pure design aesthetics and handling, I also want this @Davide DB

Yes, but it's been the most popular camera for quite some years! Just look back at the Flickr camera stats from previous years...

Well, I actually have to take it as a game changer or am I only being ecstatic over here, hey folks? Take a look on this second 249... let's also be smartphone camera fellows this time to match the same iPhone 15 Pro Max model too, hey @kye ? ;- )

Totally! The ND adapter never leaves my R5C and the extra stop you get from the .071x adapter really comes in handy (you usually need to put the R5C in 35mm crop mode to use it tho). Also thanks to those adapters, lenses like the OG EF 24-105mm f/4 IS and the 17-55mm EF-S IS have become more popular than ever. Especially with the C70. Personally I just discovered the OG EF 70-200 f4 IS - god it is so f*ckin' light with great IQ. So I ended up selling my OG EF 70-200 f/2.8 IS. Point is, thanks to these adapters - alot of R5C and C70 users in the groups I'm in are rediscovering the EF-L line in a big way.

I hear you, being one of the most "sizeist" users here, but I just don't see the strength of the reaction being proportional. We could make a list of all the things wrong with the G9ii release, or the release of any other model from Panasonic, and we could easily find parallel examples from other manufacturers of things they do that are just as egregious, but when Sony releases yet another camera that overheats, or GoPro releases another doppelgänger camera with microscopic spec improvements, or whoever the hell else waits years and then releases an uninspiring black box, we don't then spontaneously question the future of the brand or the entire format. If someone were to post in every Sony camera thread that FF was dead and Sony was going to exit the camera market because of the latest release then they'd be considered unhinged, but somehow with MFT every camera announcement is turned into a wake.. What will you use it for?

Also let’s discuss workflow for android raw vs iPhone log …

I don't have iPhone 15 and can't share any examples or direct comparison with Android RAW. Few months ago tested iPhone 14 Pro then two months ago Xiaomi 13 Ultra + MotionCam (Android RAW). I like raw video from Android more as picture quality is obviously better. I expect iPhone 15 with Apple Log to be better than iPhone 14 Pro but not by much. I don't see dramatic difference so far between iPhone 14 Pro and 15 Pro with Apple log. Not in the examples published on youtube. Maybe log footage was not well graded. Yes can share some of the clips made by Xiaomi 13 Ultra + MotionCam and iPhone 14 Pro on the thread dedicated to RAW video on smartphones. Here is a frame grab from one of the clips made using Android RAW video. Background blur is natural from the lens, not computational

My bad! It's not a set of Panavision lenses we're currently using, it's Cooke Anamorphics:

Straight off the camera, no further crop. It has the resolution to do it justice. Will shoot some Cinema DNG with it tomorrow

Anyway, I've pre-ordered one.

I know the Single Biggest thing that would make the G9ii sell in the truckloads. ... A Netflix Certification 😎

Right, now I get it. Throughout this thread I thought that people were saying "Look how huge it is..... by giving it the body of the S5 they made it huge" when actually they were saying "Look at how the mk2 is the same size as the mk1 - that's outrageous - every camera update should be drastically smaller!" TBH, if we're going to judge everyone that didn't give us what they could have given us, we'd all better be saving up for an Alexa, because the people who worked on every other camera released in the history of the world are going in front of a firing squad tomorrow at dawn.

Sony FX3, Atlas Mercury and P+S Technik Evolution Lenses (source: IMDB) recorded on a Ninja V. other bits here: https://www.provideocoalition.com/did-the-creator-use-the-sony-fx3-as-an-a-camera/ From trailer it seems all the movie has a extensive VFX work. From what I understand in my ignorance: - the camera is the least of the costs in a large production/blockbuster. - It is not the camera that makes the look of the film but the lenses. - In a big production, where a serious DOP can afford to give vent to his fantasies about lighting, the technical characteristics of a camera are less important. Ultimately, if Fraser/Edwards chose this camera, it is more because of their fixation on being minimalist as pointed out in the opening article. About minimalism.... I still remember in 2009 when Howard Hall first took an IMAX camera underwater for the documentary Under the Sea. Minimalist to the point 🤣

I wonder what you are more likely to find in most homes, an Ikea Billy bookcase or a Canon EF24-105mm f4? Its a close call, I reckon. They shifted so many of them in bundles with the 5DMK2 amongst other cameras because it was absolute bargain as an additional price standalone let alone versus buying a 24-70mm f2.8. Do they do the same with the RF version ? Because that would be the way forward to chuck those in with the camera as a bundle with the lens being at 50% of what it would cost extra which is exactly what Panasonic are doing with the S1 with their 24-105mm As it stands, its the fat part of £1300 for the RF24-105mm which is just not appealing at all. The Z and L mount both have the same problem to some extent but the third party range is what gives the other two the advantage not to mention E mount which just keeps motoring along with options everywhere. Of course, there is the massive back catalogue of EF to adapt onto RF but, unlike Nikon with the F mount adapter, this is nothing unique as all the other mounts can do that too. If I bought an RF camera, I definitely think that it wouldn't see a native RF lens for a very long time and thats probably been enough to keep me away so far as I can do that with everything else but also have affordable native glass too. As it stands, the most flexible mount is Z mount (primarily due to the unique ability to have F mount with full AF) closely followed by the E mount. E and L mount currently have the best options in affordable fast native lenses and Nikon are catching up. The key to that, of course, is the 3rd party support most notably from Sigma.

Not sure why they would get into a market where everyone and his dog seems to be convinced that their current products will render that market obsolete to all but a dwindling niche of people. It would be like Tesla making a petrol driven car. Samsung, Panasonic, Sony, Leica and RED have all tried to make phone based cameras to reach a prosumer/pro market of film makers and photographers. It never ends well. In the case of RED, it was up there with the ET cartridges in the landfill episode in terms of "lets forget that ever happened" failure. I don't even think that Apple are that arsed about selling the software for creators anymore as long as everyone is using their hardware to run everyone else's apps. Whatever profit they were making on FCPX that they now lose to Resolve they can easily recoup with the price gouging on RAM etc. Apple are currently sat on a cash pile of $165 Billion. Set against the entire worldwide market for cameras this year of $5 Billion. When you can release incremental updates of your products every year and still have people worshipping at your feet at the product launches, I'm not sure there is much motivation there to get a piece of a market that - despite our obsession with it - is actually only comparable to, for example, the sewing machine market.

Hi everyone! Another music Video coming along. Shot on the blackmagic 4K with Metabones and Sigma 16-35mm and Helios 55mm. On the outside shots i had ND filters with IR correction. Also there is a small DJI camera in the mix for all the shots from above ( Just put it in a stick) . On this shoot i really missed an autofocus feature. Also i had some problems with the grading in the first half of the song as the lighting conditions were very different in each set up. Maybe i would have needed to have a closer look on the white balance. Maybe also a grading session in Resolve would have helped, i did the grading in premiere.

I would take the industrial design team and lock them in a room with: - A Hassemblad 907X 50C kit - An Insta360 One RS kit - An old Zenza Bronica with grip. Essentially I would want a camera consisting of: A squared brain with buttons, inputs and outputs, and a minimal display (like a ZCam or the front one of a GoPro) that would allow me to configure the machine. A high-resolution 3.5 inches display module to attach to the rear that can rotate as we are used to on a GH5. I am not talking about an external monitor but a module that adheres to the butt of the brain and forms a complete body capable of controlling and configuring it like an integrated display. The whole thing a parallelepiped like an FX3. A Hassemblad-style handle/grip complete with controls and wheels to add to the brain and get the ergonomics of a current camera. Throw in an adapter with ND. Put the pieces together and you have a complete camera suitable for photo and video. If you just use the brain you have a komodo/zcam/BS1H style stuff that you can configure as a cinema rig. add display and handle and you get a complete camera. Hassemblad 907X 5C has everything (but the touch display is built-in) P.S. Choose which piece costs 2K 🙂