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I've lurked here for years but this S1RII stuff has gotten real silly. It's like there's resentment it's not an S1HII even though we all know it's the R series. And the criticisms of the S1RII are especially strange considering the Z8 (which I've owned) was subject to criticism when released (overheating, dynamic range, AF = nice try, but no Sony/Canon, no Bird Detect, not 1 but 2 recalls, did I mention overheating?). Now the Z8 is the model camera the S1RII just can't match. Almost as if firmware updates make a difference. Is Panasonic good at firmware updates? Gee, I dunno. The new Slashcam review certainly seems bullish on the S1RII.

Why get the S1rii? 1) the versatility of the back screen; 2) open gate; 3) tools; 4) great IBIS; 5) decent AF. You won't find that combination elsewhere. In fact, the only other camera with that is the S5ii, but the S1rii is probably better.

They can. They just need to be a little more vocal about their product line such as: “In early 2025 we will be releasing a successor to the S1R and then in the late Spring, a successor to the S1H”. Press release. Bosh. Job done. Shuts the speculation down with a single sentence. People respect integrity. At least the folks that count do. I’m not saying Panasonic LUMIX lack integrity, but a lot of these companies could kill a lot of the stupid shit that goes on by being a bit more informative and less Secret Fucking Squirrel. In my humble opinion.

I'm honestly a little shocked at the reception to the camera on some forums. It provides a fair bit of upgrades to both the S5ii and the S1R while still staying at a lower price point than the competition, and even it's own predecessor. It seems to me that every brand's offerings are more or less the same with little differences here and there while also offering their own distinct competitive advantages. I can't help but notice that many folks want Panasonic to do everything Sony or Canon does, PLUS their own thing. Or that these manufacturers have running checklists that they compare and contrast to each other line by line when developing a camera versus largely doing their own thing. I preordered the S1Rii so my bias is clear, but as someone heavily invested into the Lumix S system I can't see this as anything but a solid camera for their lineup.

Possibly, I don’t really know even coming to S5ii from S5 and S1H. And S1R. I honestly haven’t noticed any real difference but then I haven’t especially been looking and changed my workflow/editing. What I do know is that I am more than happy with what the S5ii produces. Specifically in 6k 30p open gate with my LUT burnt into vlog and using a 1/8th mist VND on my lenses. I have had the very occasional weird lighting effects when shooting outdoor weddings in the evening when there are strings of lights, but otherwise not a single issue that I have ever noticed. Moire, nope. Fringing, nope. RS, nope. Other than perhaps 8k (which I personally do not want or need), I doubt if there is much if any real world difference shooting an S5ii or the new S5iiR…sorry, S1Rii. Oh I am sure there are many pedantic types out there that can prove at the nano-microscopic level there is, but the fact that they don’t have a life is not my concern.

I think I have answered it myself... The compression in H.265 is the result of bad tests. They are using the MP4 mode which has extremely low bitrates. In MOV we have 8K H.265 10bit 422 at 400Mbit, similar to the Sony a1's 500Mbit 8K mode post firmware update. This I have experience of and it was a match for N-RAW as far as the lack of compression, great shadow detail and a fine noise texture goes. There's also a Prores 422 HQ 700Mbit/s mode in 4K/24p, so a reasonable step up from 400Mbit. Remember however that H.265 long GOP at 400Mbit is equiv. to H.264 at 800Mbit so if you see a ton of macro blocking in that I'll be surprised! The ProRes codec has the advantage of being ALL-I though. According to Newsshooter where you can see the full breakdown of bitrates, 4K in H265 MOV is 190Mbit, so equivalent to 380 H.264. https://www.newsshooter.com/2023/05/10/nikon-z8-announced/ Aside from the wide range of bitrates... I like the fact it has no crop in 4K/120p plus the option of DX and 2.3x crop. The 2.3x crop is nice for Super 16mm lenses. Plus the high-res Zoom option for pretty much any crop factor between 1 and 2.3 One last thought, it seems Nikon did agree with the Canon 70d that the right place for the stills/movie mode is under your right hand.

It's actually quite tempting... A pair of used 'like new' S1H's can be had on MPB for basically €3000. Add an 18, 35, 50 and 85 f1.8's from LUMIX or 20, 35, 65 and 90 f2's from Sigma, and I'd be good to go. I'd still need something longer, 70-200 equivalent, but could probably pick up a used older lens for that need. Hmmm... I'm talking primarily stills here, albeit with an option to go hybrid or even pure video if needed and this pair of S1H's in addition to the S9 and pair of S5ii's I already have. All within budget trading what I already have from Sony, Tamron and Nikon.

My gripe with some of the tit for tat comparisons is they almost always ignore the reality of switching costs for folks with established kits. Would a Sony A7iii shooter looking for a higher resolution upgrade be persuaded to switch to the S5Rii versus the A7Rv? Most of the time, probably not. It's hard to get people to switch systems with one camera body, for good reason. Personally, I switched back to Panasonic after 2 years with Sony. The thing that clinched it wasn't actually Panasonic—it was Blackmagic! For those folks looking to start buying into their first camera system Panasonic offers the best value setup both new or used. Some people prefer to buy new things in general so a used Z8 being the same price as a new S5Rii is irrelevant. And, if they don't mind used, Panasonic is an even further better value. What Panasonic really needs is consistency moving forward. It's been a long time since the original S1R and S1H. Release these cameras and establish some sort of regular rhythm to firmware updates and new bodies in the future and they'll regain customers over time. But, one amazing camera wouldn't do it. A good system will.

Agreed. For a new camera you can't beat the value. It's not really fair to hold used prices against it, either. Is Lumix supposed to price it to match the R5 or Z8's used prices? I don't fault anyone that decides to buy those instead, but Lumix can't control that.

No idea when if in 2025 yet but you, me and a few of us risk to not resist to one when will reach the 2500 mark... ;- )

In France, there was some offers last week for the S1RII, like 350€ in gift card, you can also easily sell the S5II for 1300€. It makes the upgrade for about 1900€, it still a lot of money but it is not so bad for 8K, 4K60fps, 4k 120fps with a small crop, internal raw, slightly better IBIS, in my opinion better colors and of course better photo resolution, I think it makes sense mainly for hybrid shooters heavily invested in L-mount. And it is not like there was something better for this mount. Like I said I pre-ordered mine, but if the camera is disappointing, I will go with Nikon and the Z8, like Andrew did.

Yeah I was so set on a Z9 but after doing some tests I got very frustrated with N-log. Exposing it right, grading it. Such a struggle I ended up using the baked profiles like flat or neutral. Maybe I didn’t find the right workflow but log footage was all over the place with often very little latitude. Call me biased but Clog is just so effortless to work with in comparison. N-log really killed my GAS for switching to Nikon..

There is a 700Mbit/s mode in NRAW at 4K 24p which could be good half-way house between too much compression and the huge file sizes of the 8K NRAW and Prores modes. This is among the smallest file size for RAW shooting on any camera, alongside C-RAW Lite 6K on the EOS R3. I have seen this test which shows the compression in the red channel with H.265. What's a bit frustrating is the lack of info about what bitrate was selected and so on... I assume it was graded from LOG. According to Slashcam the H.265 bitrates in MP4 are tiny. https://www.slashcam.de/artikel/Test/Nikon-Z8-in-der-Praxis--Die-bessere-Z9-fuer-Video--8K-RAW-50p-Bolide-mit-Feinschliffbedarf--alles-.html# Will certainly see some compression in MP4. But what about the H.265 MOV mode?

Oh and why not S1R's? Could be an option but whereas MPB have 10x S1H units, they have 0x S1R's. They do as of today have 4x S1's, but I don't think I'd choose an S1 over an S1H...

The S1H is a camera you could buy used today and it'll still hold up 5 years from now, similar to the S5. Both of those cameras have such a lovely, organic image. And as @MrSMWnoted, the auto focus isn't nearly as bad as people made it out to be once you learned how it works. It's a reminder of how fortunate we are that cameras released 6 years ago are still able to hold up to cameras released today.

This is an important point, and has been widely discussed in other forums. The Z8 works well in terms of temperature management as long as you choose one of the coolest running CFexpress cards. Card temperatures have been tested a few years ago in https://www.thessdreview.com/our-reviews/cfexpress/delkin-black-cf-express-type-b-512gb-memory-card-review/4/ though not specifically in this camera. I have the 325 GB Prograde Digital Cobalt card and it's excellent (it was originally preferred by Nikon when the Z9 came out, as their developers found it to perform the best in the Z9), but Delkin Blacks (which are a newer card series) are very popular among the intense-shooting crowd and can be cheaper than the Prograde Digital Cobalt. If you need larger capacity than is available in Delkin Black, then Delkin Power can be considered. Note that the series have been updated by Delkin and the newest cards may be different, but I haven't heard anything negative about the new series. The Z9 has a larger body and better temperature management than the Z8 but the Z8 also does fine as long as one chooses the right CFexpress card for the extended video recording.

It's nearly time for a spring clean where 4 or 5 cameras turn into 1! I have decided to divest in L-mount. The Sigma Fp-L is staying but I'm moving on from Panasonic and the L-mount lenses with no plans to get more. When the Sigma BF comes out I'll certainly consider swapping the Fp-L for it but want to see if it retains Cinema DNG raw video. Nikon Z8 used prices are now under $3000/3000 euro. So it's a cheaper option than the Panasonic S1R II, with a much more flagship design of body and very nice chonky EVF. Of course the autofocus is in a different league and the sensor is a lot faster. I thought about returning to a Sony a1 and selling my a7 IV along with some Fuji stuff. But the a1 prices are still as high as 12 months ago and well above what I'll find a Z8 for. Nikon Zf mount has the nifty Leica M autofocus adapter (latest version) from Techart, and the MegaDap Sony E mount adapter which serves all my autofocus needs without requiring a $15,000 investment in Nikon Zf lenses. Thank the lord. Whereas with the S1R II and L-mount, options are very limited for adapters. Sigma 35mm F2 ART for Sony E-mount on a Nikon Z8 is a tempting duo. Build quality tip top and not too big. Ergonomically fantastic. 8K RAW video and super fast. One of the best range of H.265 codec options and some very good crop modes. 4K/120p full frame mode. So I think it's time to get into Z mount in a big way and commit to it. Would you go for the Z8, or something else for $3000?

Obviously the price makes this more a dream than reality but goodness me am I impressed with it. Some observations: Very light, much smaller than GFX 100, much better build quality and top screen vs GFX 100S, feels like the sexiest camera ever made to be quite honest and really has a beautiful look and finish. Autofocus is much improved over prior GFX cameras especially original GFX 100, it seemed closer to X-H2, maybe not quite as fast but MUCH better than before, although I only tried it with the 50mm pancake. Video mode has so many crop modes. Rolling shutter in 8K is not great. 5.8K mode is interesting. 4K mode is plenty detailed even though it's pixel binned. There is a 2.35:1 crop mode, which looks like cinema on a stick. Anamorphic modes. Fantastic codec too with ProRes. I was able to try out the Full frame 35mm crop mode, also a PREMISTA one for your 40 grand cinema lenses from Fuji. Didn't see Super 35mm? I don't think I did anyway. EVF is still detachable. Very very good view of the action through it. Ergonomics and outstanding. The chunky high quality feel of everything about it and that top LCD panel is just incredible. Absolutely enormous and dominates the top plate of the camera. I want to pick one up but at 8000 euros, will have to wait. The Sony a1 does have a few advantages but I do love the look of the larger GFX sensor especially with vintage glass. The a1 has a faster rolling shutter at full resolution, and in 8K. It has a more flexible lens mount with a wider range of adapters including the lovely Leica M Autofocus adapter. In general, it is the autofocus king really, whereas GFX 100 II I would be mainly sticking to just one or two Fuji lenses for autofocus and the rest manual focus Canon FD / Minolta MD / etc. You can now pick up a Fuji GFX 100 about 4 years after it was released for $3500 / £3500 and going down further with the release of the new one. This was £10k when it was announced! So hopefully in 2 years we can pick up a GFX 100 II for around £4k or something, which is still a lot for most people, but it absolutely will make sense for many, it's just so good.

Just came across this while searching for a C-mount adapter for the Nikon Z8. https://www.amazon.de/-/en/BORYOZA-FX-Z-AF-Adapter-Fujifilm/dp/B0CPBRTMTX/ Crazy if that works as well as the Sony E-mount adapter from Megadap / Techart, with full AF and electronic control.

Shoten has its own. This Japanese guy tested it on Zf. From 3:30 https://youtu.be/xuCYrLGN0Rk

I hope Eterna does well but it’s a tough crowd. The Open Gate will help though, that’s a truly unique sensor size for a motion picture camera. If it does well we’d almost certainly see a version with the XH2S sensor, which would be an equally wonderful camera. I do have an extremely high regard for Fuji’s physical/ergonomic design. They do excellent work where others get cluttered or awkward.

Some believe Panasonic is on the verge of shutting down, a narrative that a few users continue to push. I suppose their decision to release the S1R II instead of an S1H II only fuels that perception. The main criticism of the S1R II is its rolling shutter—something even Panasonic has acknowledged, advising those who prioritize it to choose a different camera. Essentially, Panasonic can't win. Pack everything into a camera, and it's too expensive. Leave something out, and it’s not "the very best." The real question is whether it offers good value—and, like most Panasonic cameras (new and used), it clearly does.

This is the only way for me to test out a new camera, shoot along the normal and see how the new camera compares against the same footage!

I personally would not trade an S5ii for an S1Rii for any of those things. I would however because I wanted or needed 8k. I personally don’t but it could be a reason to someone else. The trade in on an S5ii is now less than 1k so the price to trade on a new S1Rii is around 2.5k. You’d have to REALLY want one to do that! But for photographers, trading up from 24mp to 44mp might be a more valid reason. Buying either from scratch, brand new, is a slightly different proposition but when you can get a ‘like new’ S5ii for approx 1.5k, 3.5k for the new boy makes zero sense to me. Unless someone can convince themselves the upgraded bits and bobs are worth +2k to them. 2k is a whole chunk of glass options!

Interesting and a few things that still give me pause regarding the Nikon stacked sensors... From the linked Newsshooter article: "Because of the aggressive nature of the N-Log curve, it tends to crush the shadows down to try and limit the noise. The problem with this is that you don’t get a lot of information to work with in the shadows." "The other real-world issue with N-Log is that if you use View Assist it doesn’t in any way reflect what the N-Log LUT looks like. If you expose based on what looks correct on the LCD screen or EVF you will quickly find that your N-Log image is underexposed. The last thing you want to do when shooting N-Log is to underexpose because the N-Log curve certainly doesn’t give you much headroom in the shadows. Underexposing leads to severe image noise in the mids and shadows if you need to lift them up." (my emphasis added) I don't think I would describe the VLog coming from the S1 as "agressive" and my opportunity to push around shadows and midtones in post is - to my eye - pretty remarkable. If I was shooting in controlled environments, I wouldn't fret about it but recently I photographed and filmed a full day of moving cattle from from a penned area to outdoor pasture, which included a lot of time in the poorly lit barn/trailer with huge barn doors on a bright sunny day. 14 stops of range? 16? I was thanking the S1 for how little noise it introduces and how well it held highlights as I worked up the images. I have zero confidence in the Z6III in this scenerio even with it's recent firmware update. I think the only reasonable thing for me to do would be to rent a Z8 and use it for several days in the environments I usually work.

Yes the 28-45mm is excellent, the rendering is nice and punchy, the contrast and colors are great, and it replaces (for me) easily a 24mm, 35mm and 50mm. This is also because of lenses like this I want to give a last chance to Panasonic with the S1RII. But I'm pessimistic. The more I see footage from the S1RII, the more I think it is more close than the S5II than the S1, S1H and S5.

No the L-mount alliance agreement goes like this. L squared... Sigma undercuts Leica with sexy aluminum unibody full frame cameras for under $2k. Panasonic charges Leica money for zoom lenses and supplies old sensors to Leica for their 2025 cameras. Leica get to die. Sounds like an alliance to make NATO look dodgy!

Nightmare fuel

Fair play for the correction. I think with any bayer sensor there is a way to invoke moire, if the texture is fine enough and at the right distance. On his closer shots the issue was solved by the 8K sensor, but the S1H with the AA filter should have the advantage in all the other cases and further away from the subject. Is it worth worrying about? Not too much, but worth being aware of. I am still too upset about the S5 body design to care about the S1R II too much, let's see what panasonic bring with the S1H II 7 years from now.

For stills or video, as long as you were aware the AF is not always 100% reliable for forward motion tracking such as entrances and exits. For anything else, the AF is actually pretty decent and sticky. It's just a bit slow to lock on initially in that forwards or subject moving away scenario, but not as big of a deal as some made out. It could be improved by tweaking the settings, using S35 mode, lens choice (zooms better than primes) and shooting smaller apertures such as f8...but some of these are 'workarounds' and we'd all rather stuff just worked without having to align the planets. It's quite funny though that the image is considered 'as good'. It's a 2019 camera vs a 2025. How is that progress??!! But then to be fair, the S1H image was and still is very good. Also a vastly underrated stills camera unless you absolutely had to have the sharpest images around such as for maybe say product photography, but for portraits and events, superb IMO.

I just think they had a chance to do something really nice, and after 7 years did something very middle of the road. Given this is a 3600 euro camera, they could have at least kept the fancy S1H top LCD which was the finest on the market at the same time as just shrinking the body down and trimming some fat. It would have been nice to rub some of the sharp edges off, it has no graceful curves at all. The S9 also looks very basic and unimaginative, yet with a few tweaks and a viewfinder could have looked lovely. It doesn't need to be X100 level, just better than boring and mediocre. S5 II is not the type of body that screams to pick it up for fun. And I really dislike the rear jog dial, it's so spongey. If they had kept the basic S1H body concept to the tee, just added some nice curved edges and shrunk it in size without removing key features or shrinking the screens... that would have been the Pana flagship for the ages. Instead we got pure dullness! The question is, if they are coming out with an S1H II later this year will they also do an S5 II replica, or push out something more exciting?

I understand the cost saving/standardisation perspective but I think Panasonic are definitely taking the piss a bit now by re-using the S5ii body for all their products.

Why would you rather have that, even for stills? 🙂 Apart from the lack of any video mode (which is completely nuts) No mechanical shutter, and a very slow electronic one, which rules out so much nice glass and adapters. And the price is also a bit nutty. The GFX 100 II does so much more, with better ergonomics and lenses too. I can't think of a single area where the Chinese DJI X2D is better. It looks pretty though!