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Even MFT lenses can find a home on the Z mount. Yes it will only be for manual but that encompasses a lot of very fine and affordable lenses (particularly cine) that can be used and the vast majority of those will cover APS-C. https://pixco.com.cn/products/micro-4-3-nikon-z-adapter

There are some significant negatives on the Z8 versus the S1rii: No Open Gate No IN-CAMERA Live View Composite No IN-CAMERA Pixel Shift No Waveforms No False Color No IN-CAMERA 32-bit audio possibilities No anamorphic modes No anamorphic-specific IBIS Not great IBIS at wide angles No breathing compensation for Z-mount lenses The Z8 is about 100g heavier Maybe, they'll add some of these in a firmware update, but then again I'm rather certain Panasonic will also add stuff. These negatives were just off the top of my head, but I imagine there are more. The crazy thing is that the specs today are so good that it doesn't really matter all that much. All of the cameras will do; some just have a few more features than others. What sucks about reviews in general is that you watch them and you cannot help thinking that they are significantly impacted by how the company treated them in the past or present. Apparently, retribution is a real thing in the camera review business.

Part of the fun of this place is deciphering Emanuel's posts 😉

I think Panasonic just need to show a bit of creativity and throw a bit of weight behind the new stuff, they have clearly had to deal with some budget and R&D cutbacks, also perhaps the retirement of some of the old guard engineers from the earlier days. The marketing and product strategy is the biggest problem though, from my point of view. The lenses side is a disaster. It's so important to get this right when establishing a new mount. Mistakes too numerous to mention with L-mount, with the latest being the S9 launch with a pinhole F8 lens rather than waiting 2 months for the compact 16mm zoom to be ready to sell with it from the off. In terms of creativity, they've spent too long trying to imitate Sony's product strategy but in a weird way. So the S1 was to be the 'basic' model like the a7, except now it isn't... So the S5 came along instead, and the S1 appears to be dead. Imagine if Sony had introduced the original a7, left it there on the shelf for 5 years and then replaced it with an a5? Instead Sony built a big system around one badge... a7 is now a huge range of stuff. a7r, a7c, a7s, and the flagships are different numbers so you can tell that they're different. a1 and a9. Right down to the "R" models, and an a7s type model for video (S1H) Panasonic has tried to mimic the basic strategy of the a7 cameras but mishandled the implementation. For a start the S1H should have been "Cinema Lumix" branded so people understood it had cinema features not just video. Still missing from the range are any a7c rangefinder style bodies, R or otherwise! We have the s9 but it isn't equipped with an EVF. The S1R Mark II is NOT a bad camera. I repeat NOT. Neither is the S9, it's great fun. It is the circumstances around them which are the problem and I believe will kill its chances on the market vs other brand options both new and used. I also think that if you're going to start finally after 7 years also copying the sensible Sony approach of unified ergonomics and similar body designs / sizes aka Sony a7 III vs a9, or a7 IV vs a1, and now the latest evolution with the a9 III and a1 II, don't fucking use your cheapest most uninspired-to-use entry level body as the basis for this. Yeah, yeah I know Sony started the same way, but this was in 2012! The standard of Sony's rivals to the S5 and S1R now (the a7 IV and a7r V) are at a much higher level than the entry level 2012 a7 / a7r series, they're a decades worth of evolution. Panasonic has only evolved the S5 body once, and now the S1R II is lumbered with it a gen 2 design when it should by now have been a gen 4 or 5. That is to say, the S1R II should have evolved from 2018 onwards from the original flagship, NOT a pause and THEN stuffed into a mid-range body. It's the same with the G9 II... Great camera, great spec, totally uninspired body design with angular sharp edges and weird button placement. Rear jog dial is also shite. This is the sort of thing the Japanese kaizen is supposed to iron out over the years. They are not like Apple where they come out with a really strong design straight off the bat, they are iterative designers. Considering Panasonic started with mirrorless cameras before anybody else, they have had enough time to refine things. But I think the problem is they have chopped and changed so often, it's as if they start from scratch every few years. Let's consider the evidence... GH1/GH2 - lovely small intuitive cameras, and yeah, filmmaker's kept saying they were like toys, too much plastic but could have evolved into something really nice with the same compact design, just with higher quality materials and an AF joystick. The basic layout was fantastic. Instead they were COMPLETELY thrown out for the GH3 / GH4 body design, the 'pro' DSLR look. OK fine, so this was 2013 and now you have 10 years to evolve a set mirrorless camera concept... but no. These evolved only once into the GH5 which was a lot better but then they chucked that out as well and started again with the clunky GH6, thick vents and all. And look at the G9... Why throw out the original design for the S5 body? They have scrapped more camera concepts than Fran in Barcelona.

It's a sweet successor of the S5II, this S5III sports a great mixture of new features such as 6K60p in full frame with great 60p, being very close in quality to 30p, 45Mpix stills, S1H screen mechanism, eventually a very satisfying shutter sound and feel. And 8K video for the closeup of the bride. 😊 @ND64 They like the SRII for these features: Readout in full frame 6K60p is 15.6ms. Vertical pixelbinning in 60p is providing great quality, which is very close to 30p. They also like the 8K. Battery life is above average for hires 45Mpix cameras, dynamic range is impressive. Best in class Ibis and lowlight capabilities. Great ergo, handling and AF in video. Despite being such a nice package, people manage to film shilly footage with it. Macky is one of the very few who put effort into showing off the capabilities of a camera. He loves the colour btw. Further tests will show, if there is mushyness at higher isos like from the A7SIII. It looks like 4K60 is much better on the SRII vs the Sony, despite having ca four times more pixels, 45Mpix vs 12Mpix. If colour and codecs are og S1 and S1H level, I'd call it a contender. If overheating is a non issue in practical use, I'd call it a winner.

One other thought is that they (LUMIX) have not helped themselves with the naming strategy. S1Rii sets certain expectations. Why not simply name it something new such as S6? It’s a modified S5ii more than anything and sits above, so S6 makes most sense to me.

The deal is done, thank you Foto Meyer Berlin. Sold some stuff, as I realised I didn't need it anyway as the Z8 does it all, pretty much. Z8 has been out about a year already, which is crazy. Still I think 3099 given it's still current is quite generous. Like many of you guys I was waiting to see what Panasonic would come up with after so long. But the S1R Mark II is not for me and S1H Mark II remains missing. I won't pay $3.5K / 500 euros more than the used Z8 for a cost-cut S5 body, no top LCD, worse AF, worse rolling shutter, and a worse mount. Also the S1R II internal RAW codec bitrates are too massive, ProRes RAW only, no 700Mbit custom RAW format like Canon/Nikon are offering with Canon RAW Lite and N-RAW. Although hey, at least Panasonic has internal RAW unlike Sony! Z-mount is equal or better than L-mount for many reasons, primarily: Megadap Sony E mount adapter opens up the entire Sony range of which there is a lot plus allows Sigma full frame lenses in by the back door. Lovely 35mm F2 is small and perfect for Z8. Also the Techart Leica M autofocus adapter is IMHO a must have, and this ain't available in L-mount. Plus Sigma APS-C lenses are in Native Z mount anyway so when I need to go for a very small zoon, 18-50mm F2.8 fits the bill perfectly and the Z8 has enough resolution in Super 35 mode to do it justice. I could not wait another 12 months to 7 years for a Panasonic flagship. S1H Mark II might be really nice... who knows. They're not communicating. Panasonic did not even so much as email me about the S1R Mark II. But the main reason I am out of the Panasonic ecosystem is that the competition is both cheaper and better.

They still have three registered but unannounced camera. One of them is probably a fixed lens. One of the remaining two can be S1Hii.

Nice piece this. I'll give him a sub.

@John MatthewsThanks for that post. Obviously we need to think about any purchase in a "what's best for my use" context and since I was strongly considering either the Z6III or the Z8 (I also considered and rejected switching to Sony & Canon), the things that stand out that would most significantly aid my work are, potential to bring 32-bit float directly into camera (currently doing that externally with an F3 and syncing in post) False Color (fastest way to prioritize skin tone exposure) Live View Composite (event work, flash work, etc) really excellent IBIS (Richard Wong's comparison with the Z6III was shocking in this regard) better shadow noise performance than Nikon's stacked sensor as an H.265 shooter, I know VLog well and NLog seems compromised in this space don't need to change systems. The only functional benefit for me about the Nikons is the potentially better autofocus. Remains to be seen, however. The hitch for me has to do with shadow noise in stills (video seems excellent) but this is a 24mp vs 44mp sensor primarily and that higher resolution would be very helpful in my photographic work. Yes, I would really like to know the specs and timeline of the S1Hii but ... I do think the additional resolution is a higher priority for me.

Interesting thoughts on @Andrew Reid's post.

All of my reverse engineering efforts are currently focused on decrypting my wife's acceptance algorithm so that I can devise a way to get one of these cameras without being ejected from the house. My current working theory is to use the "Yes, I might be a completely reckless buyer of cameras but at least I'm not as bad as@Andrew Reid" gambit. I will combine that with the old stalwart of "Hey, you know how much you love going to Japan ? What if I told you there was a way where we could do something that would almost make the trip free ?". This latter one relies on me floating the idea of buying a GFX100, the savings on which would cover a substantial portion of the trip, but then not actually buying one when we get there. Which earns brownie points for saving money of course * *NB She knows, of course, but humours me

Awesome post! Spot on! Fundamental overview regarding Panny cameras. @Andrew Reid Marketing and communication with the GH4 and GH5 was exellent. Matt Frazer was allowed to do the perfectly right thing. It was exiting to follow the news and to watch the footage. This forum was overflowing with high quality posts and discussions. The launch of the GH5s was already lacking. Their box cameras not sporting NDs is another underwhelming marketing decision. So close yet so far. Their product palette is chaotic. No 10bit GX9 successor, akward releases like a G90, G100 or before that GF5, 7, 8. This was not helping sales nor Pannys reputation to say the least. Is there any native L mount 28mm 2.8 pancake lens out there for full frame sensor coverage? 35, 50, 70, no? Bummer. I think there are some for apsc coverage. Another missed out opportunity, especially in combination with the S9. I know i would have bought a S9 with mechanical shutter and evf and a 28 and 50mm pancake. I dislike taking photos without a mechanical shutter. M39 route for small affordable lenses with a short mount? I guess so. Fiddling around, being an adapter juggler can be fun.:) S1RII is a nice camera and release with S5III being a better name. It's accompanied by lacklustre marketing and communication. The S1RIII looks good by itself. Pannys surrounding enviroment does not at the moment.

Perhaps it would be an S3 by hierarchy then. But yes, I get your point and definitely agree. There were more hybrid/video improvements than photo, I may be wrong though. Perhaps the general reception is mixed since the expectation was already set for what the R is focusing in on. Maybe R is for resolution now (44mp + 8k recording) not just stills…? The camera is fine though. I’m still surprised we’re debating this heavy about a (supposedly) photo first-camera with photo-first compromises on a video-focused forum but let’s be honest and call it like it is: it was DOA for most people not for what the camera could ultimately be but for how behind and underdeveloped LUMIX let their PRO flagship lineup and lens roadmap get in the eyes of the current and potential customers. And uncertain brand confidence in future product releases, making investing in the mount a hesitant choice. The outrage is less puzzling to me when I view it from that angle. But remember, pre- Z9, Nikon also faced the same challenges in brand confidence and future uncertainty. Now folks are switching to Z8, what a time.

I think they all are and you can make a case for or against any of them in this ballpark class whether it be an offering from Sony, Nikon, Canon or Lumix. They each have strengths. They each have weaknesses. It is the system as a whole that counts for your specific needs, plus how invested (or not) you may be in any system already. A clean sheet choice and purchase is MASSIVELY different to someone with multiple bodies and even more glass in a single system. For most, it’s therefore not as simple as Camera Body A vs Camera Body B vs Camera Body C vs Camera Body D, because it’s a MUCH bigger picture than that. In isolation, is the S1Rii a ‘perfect’ camera? For some folks, it might just be. Is it a ‘great’ camera? Again for some it will be and with time, may be considered better than it seemed at launch (S9). Or not as good. Is it better or worse than the competion? It’s better in some areas and not as good in some others but no camera is going to be for everyone. Is it a worthy successor to what came before? Possibly… It’s an upgrade over the S5ii pretty much everywhere, but not by a huge amount, but by calling it an S1Rii, it is designated as a successor to the S1R. Is it a worthy upgrade to the S1R? I think that’s trickier to call… On the whole, I think you’d have to say yes, but perhaps not as much as might be expected after 7 years and this point is one that I think is not helping it’s cause in Feb/March 2025. I still think Panny’s fundamental mistake is not having a road map in principal as in one that we, the great unwashed, are privy to plus we were all expect the S1R mk2 to be a more photo-centric successor to the OG with the 61mp sensor, but it seems to be mostly being judged on it’s video spec. My summary is I think it’s a decent thing as an isolated bit of kit, even better if you are already within the system, but overall the company continues to annoy.

I get your point and hell, I'd consider a used camera for less money even if it wasn't in mint condition! But we can't expect any camera company to price a camera based on what the used prices are, you know? $3300 is still a competitive price and if the Z8 stays at $3400 I suspect we'll see the price edge downward by the fall, along with bundles to make it even more enticing. There are also ways in which the Z8 is a "worse" camera, too, like IBIS, auto focus, cinema assist tools, etc. It doesn't even feel right to call one camera "worse" than the other though, haha, because in the big picture both are really great cameras.

I'm honestly a little shocked at the reception to the camera on some forums. It provides a fair bit of upgrades to both the S5ii and the S1R while still staying at a lower price point than the competition, and even it's own predecessor. It seems to me that every brand's offerings are more or less the same with little differences here and there while also offering their own distinct competitive advantages. I can't help but notice that many folks want Panasonic to do everything Sony or Canon does, PLUS their own thing. Or that these manufacturers have running checklists that they compare and contrast to each other line by line when developing a camera versus largely doing their own thing. I preordered the S1Rii so my bias is clear, but as someone heavily invested into the Lumix S system I can't see this as anything but a solid camera for their lineup.

https://petapixel.com/2025/03/02/xiaomi-wants-to-make-modular-magnetic-lenses-for-its-phones/ There is a curious thing: it is a 4/3 sensor with 100mp - but binned in 4x4 pixel, which results in 25mp images. Same resolution of the sensor that (only) Panasonic is using. Is it the same sensor?

While the translation is difficult to read and there are not a log of details, we can expect to see S1H and more compact cameras from Panasonic. Below are a couple of the comments from the interview. https://qicai.fengniao.com/537/5378995.html In terms of market demand insight, Panasonic is keenly aware of the trend of recovering demand in the fixed lens camera market. With the increasingly powerful cell phone photography function, the competition in the cell phone market has become more and more intense. Fixed lens cameras have become an important direction for cell phones to realize differentiated competition due to their unique functional characteristics, such as the long focal length function, which opens up new possibilities for cell phone photography. Based on this market change, Panasonic is looking forward to the fixed lens camera market and is actively planning the introduction of new products. Although it is not yet possible to determine the specific time of the release of new products, it can be seen that Panasonic in this field has launched an in-depth thinking and layout. In addition, Panasonic in the LUMIX S1H follow-up product planning is also actively exploring the LUMIX S1H as a positioning of the creation of film cameras, in the market has a unique position. With the continuous development and changes in the field of movie micro camera, Panasonic has received a large number of opinions and suggestions from various parties. In terms of product form, there are different expectations from users and the market. Some want the product to be similar to the FX3, cutting out the warship section and focusing on movie and video functions; some prefer to keep the micro-single form while strengthening the video function; and others expect to make it a square camera similar to the FX6. In terms of functional requirements, 8K 60p or even 8K 120p video shooting and built-in ND filters have become the focus of users' attention. In order to better meet the market demand, Panasonic merged with its professional-grade system imaging division in 2024, integrating the technical resources of both parties and engaging in deeper and closer discussions with technicians. Although the launch date of the next generation of the LUMIX S1H has not yet been determined, it can be seen that Panasonic is fully committed to the development of this product, and is striving to bring users an even better tool for movie creation.

Full frame fixed lens camera please, half price of a Leica Q OG.

I'm with you here. Miniaturization against heat dissipation is a very difficult balance to strike. I'd have to think there's many ways that a cinema body is actually cheaper to R&D than a mirrorless stills body.

Who is him as member here on EOSHD or just a lurker? I am curious... That BF/Leica thingy remark is also my point (a 'little bit" more price-conscious...) but not exactly as glass-half-full... ; ) On L mount, Andrew has an unbeatable argument for now at least. No idea what comes next in the future but without that (just launched a few days ago and don't tell me it's S35 and praise at same time the presence of the format on FF devices later on, please ; ) won't be easy... The reference to video on GH series to make the format to last and lasts so far, a hint about my recent criticism when motion picture recording modes are neglected... The trouble with GH7 is... price (I think people should read more @eatstoomuchjam on FF ; ) I concur about that AF observation, that's actually the missing link Panasonic was looking for IMHO too. Thumbs up to his complaints on the customary limitations (of the usual yadda yadda on overheating boring like hell to each release) and to the coda of this YT entry, no less : ) BTW tographer is a funny name for hybrid user or just shooter...

Ah I was referring another input, thanks anyway for your care : ) Much appreciated your care and link : )

The fact that we're comparing Nikon, which until four years ago was called "potato" in videographers community, with Panasonic, which was making pro video cameras when my mother was a young girl, and score points are about "anamorphic modes", is crazy if you think about that. Anyway, feature leapfrogging is a never ending game. You get a capability in brand X that is missing in brand Y, but you get something unique in brand Y that is still missing in X. After two years, both will have them eventually with some differences in implementation. Decisions, in my opinion, should be based on "system advantages", not feature set. I love to have eye control AF in Canon cameras, but RF system is the most restrictive, while the native lens choices is like super cheap/super exotic. But some people would say they have 50% of the market share so there should be good reasons half of people bet on this system, and its ok. I don't think thats a good logic for choosing a system, but at least its an evaluation about the system, not the features.

@hoodlum Thanks for posting this interview. The more I think on it, the more dubious I am of a next S1H having a DSLR form-factor. If the S5IIx is the current video-heavy spec'ed body, and to differentiate from that in a "move the chessboard kind of way" that everyone is crying for, you would need better cooling for unlimited 8K/60p and then internal 32-bit float, internal ND, faster read-out, and the like. I'm not sure that the DSLR form-factor is the way to go. It just seems that a true cinema-spec'ed camera would be so much more efficient in a C80/PYXIS/FX6/what-have-you body ala a bigger BS1H/UB50 with repositionable EVF. Finally time for the EVA2? Again, what do I know about the market and how Panny is thinking about the choices it will be making, but I'm having a hard time seeing the S1HII that would essentially be an S5IIIx in this current mirrorless body.

If I was a betting man… But again, seriously, it never ceases to amaze me how totally thick even some multi-billion businesses appear to be. I said ‘appear to be’ as in maybe they are not, but if they appear to be, to most people, most of the time, that cannot be a good thing. Any press releases, any statements or even comments, should always be vetted and considered. If you are a big Japanese company and let’s say 75% of your market is not Japan, but ‘Western as in North America and Europe’, then have someone ‘Western’ at least read your translated statements so it doesn’t include mention of warships because if it contains mentions of warships, it makes you realise that the vast majority of the text has also probably been badly translated and could be interpreted the complete opposite of what you intended. Some companies just seem to be better at this kind of thing than others…

@PannySVHS@ita149 This guy has some footage to download in a range of codecs if you want to work with it a bit. I have and while there is not much, I am at least seeing there is no longer the need to pull greens out of the midtones, which is a standard proceedure for me with my S1 VLog footage. Curious what you see & think regarding the color smearing in skin tones. (Also appreciate that this might not be the best footage to evaluate that concern.) Edit: youtube video linked now! (sorry sorry)

Exactly, I can't fault you for being a bit more than annoyed at their strategy. A few months ago I mentioned I was eyeing moving over to Z mount but wanted to see what Panny did in 2025. We have our answer it seems.

In-camera is the key because you need to check it on the spot. Only Panasonic does that in-camera. Again, the key is in-camera and checking your result on the spot. Otherwise, you're going to have to go out again. Also, it takes half the time for long exposures. You watch it as it builds. I reckon a cinema camera would be better then. If you're going to slap a Atomos on it, then you need to add that to the price too. Yes, I understand. However, for the wedding photographer lugging this camera around all day, every little bit helps. It's great to look at the hardware specs, but the software increases the usability massively. Also, Lumix is not shy about their firmware updates. No one actually knows what is going to be in-store for the S1rii as a lot of features might be added.

I bet @BTM_Pix has a gadget which can...

Not even AI can do that 🙂

I know I wang on a lot about the Z8 but if any camera underscores exactly where Panasonic have gone wrong, it's that one. 1. Nikon have formed a close custom-sensor relationship with Sony Semi. Panasonic have not bothered, they have gone in as a customer taking stuff off the shelf. 2. Both Panasonic and Nikon have had to start afresh with a new mount. Panasonic had a head start. The L-mount Leica SL came out ages ago. Yet it is Z-mount that attracts me most, as a long-time Panasonic and Micro Four Thirds user. Why is this? The Leica-M mount autofocus adapter from Techart. The Megadap Sony E-mount adapter. The complete lack of any requirement for me to suddenly invest trillions in native mount lenses. Thank you Techart and Megadap. Thank you Z-mount for having the physical and technical attributes that make it so flexible. 3. $3000 mint condition used camera vs $3600 new. OK, so the extra $600 gets you an S1R II but there's no point because it's worse than the $3000 mint condition camera. That's partly because of point 1. Panasonic's off the shelf sensor is behind what Nikon put out 3 years ago with the Z9 which formed the basis for the cheaper Z8. 4. Need and desire issues... I don't exactly have the creative need for what's on offer from them. Again that comes down to the fact that the Z8 and Sony a7r V exist and have done for more than a year! 5. Loss of unique selling points. Again, apart from anamorphic modes, Panasonic don't have much that isn't offered elsewhere. Even Fuji has open gate now. 6. Autofocus. It's been a shitshow. The late introduction of phase-detect AF has softened the blow a bit but it still doesn't work reliably enough. Especially with adapters like the Sigma MC-21. 7. Internal RAW codec situation is iffy. ProRes RAW has crazy large file size and there's no other choice. Panasonic should have at least licensed BRAW for it. Again the comparisons here with Nikon are relevant, due to the REDcode patent situation where clearly Nikon have the upper hand in future development of internal RAW video codecs. 8. Marketing. The Z8 is not pigeonholed with an H, an R, or an S. It is clearly a D850 replacement. This means flagship performance for less money than one. Now this is a philosophy Panasonic have clearly tried with the S1R II and in terms of the specs sheet they have almost succeeded in matching Canon's 2020 model, even down to the overheating. 9. Marketing. The S1R II is sold as a hybrid, when it is the S1H which is supposed to be the hybrid. The S1H Mark II release date continues to be highly speculated at, so why would I buy the S1R II for hybrid use if it might be made obsolete in 6 months by an S1H II? 10. Marketing. When the social media brigade were jetted out to catch hypothermia in Norway, I was not kept in the loop as a long time high profile Panasonic customer, and it was the same for the GH7 launch and S9. I can't help but feel a little bit personally insulted by not so much even a demo camera to try at home, or an email with someone saying Hello, or perhaps an offer to do some feedback / interviews. Point 10 however in no way makes me more or less biased when it comes to the objective reality that Panasonic are fucking up.

Here is the list of compatible lenses

I’d rather have a phone inside the Sigma BF. But I bought a RED Hydrogen so what do I know…

This isn't my experience with the Sigma MC-21 or the Fotodiox ND Throttle adapter. Both work quite well with most EF lenses I have been able to try, including on the S5II with excellent autofocus. And its nice to have an ND filter behind the lens - though this can be accomplished on other mounts with a proper adapter. More generally though, I would agree that L-mount lens options are both uninspiring and limited - especially compared to E-Mount. Basically all I use are adapted Contax and EF lenses, and for this the L-bodies are fine. But in terms of native glass, I have one lens - the 24-105, which is boring and competently utilitarian. Even voigtlander options which were such a strong point of the M43 ecosystem (the f0.95 series!) are non-existent. This I think is really the downfall of the system - it's not even the bodies but the lenses. There's ridiculously priced leica lenses, and bland expensive offerings from Panasonic, or sigma lenses that I am admittedly reluctant to invest in given the overall weakness of the ecosystem. I think one thing that has kept me from migrating from the S1 / S1H is the desire to own a hybrid that supports a good XLR unit. The XLR unit on sony appeals greatly, but 12 megapixel sensors on the video-centric cameras seem lacklustre for photography. I really just want one camera that does everything, and the S1H is 99% of the way there, for me. There are also, in this price range, a hell of a lot of interesting options that one could start to consider for filmmaking - I'm seeing used Alexas, C300 IIs, C70s all kind of reaching into this price range second hand. An interesting aside - I talked with some of the filmmakers behind No Other Land - and while I'm not sure of every camera used, the GH5 played a major role. It's a generational workhorse, IMO, not unlike the Canon 5D MK II / MK III. I still think of what a massive leap the GH5 represented from previous systems I'd used, and how I don't think there's been a hybrid to represent a similar generational leap in technology yet. We're in an era of more incremental progress, which is perhaps why the S1RII feels underwhelming - for not being a 'perfect' camera.

Well that certainly addresses the meagre DX mount lens offerings available for anyone looking at the Nikon Z50ii. It may be down to 3rd parties coming up with these adapters rather than Nikon themselves but it’s all adding up to the Z mount laying out the welcome mat for people changing systems without the double hit of depreciation on their current lenses and laying out for new versions in the native mount.

My gripe with some of the tit for tat comparisons is they almost always ignore the reality of switching costs for folks with established kits. Would a Sony A7iii shooter looking for a higher resolution upgrade be persuaded to switch to the S5Rii versus the A7Rv? Most of the time, probably not. It's hard to get people to switch systems with one camera body, for good reason. Personally, I switched back to Panasonic after 2 years with Sony. The thing that clinched it wasn't actually Panasonic—it was Blackmagic! For those folks looking to start buying into their first camera system Panasonic offers the best value setup both new or used. Some people prefer to buy new things in general so a used Z8 being the same price as a new S5Rii is irrelevant. And, if they don't mind used, Panasonic is an even further better value. What Panasonic really needs is consistency moving forward. It's been a long time since the original S1R and S1H. Release these cameras and establish some sort of regular rhythm to firmware updates and new bodies in the future and they'll regain customers over time. But, one amazing camera wouldn't do it. A good system will.

I agree it's not entirely fair to compare new to used but it's a reality of the market, if you had the chance of a better spec for less money, and it was in mint condition, you'd consider it and so would I. Anyway let's compare new. New Nikon Z8 is currently $3396.95 at B&H, and 3600 euros in Europe inc. EU 20% VAT. The S1R II is $3299 at B&H and $3599 in Europe (including tax) So the new S1R II is not really meaningfully cheaper than a new Z8. But it's a worse camera in several important ways. Although you do get open gate and anamorphic modes. True, if you see it in isolation to the competition (new or used) and just come at it like you are as a Panasonic user, as an upgrade to an S5 or the original S1R then it's a decent upgrade. The original S1R however it must be pointed out is now almost SEVEN years old, so that's a long time to wait for an updated sensor and codec.

Agreed. For a new camera you can't beat the value. It's not really fair to hold used prices against it, either. Is Lumix supposed to price it to match the R5 or Z8's used prices? I don't fault anyone that decides to buy those instead, but Lumix can't control that.

You talk about this narrative as if it's some Fox news propaganda, I am not pushing anything, the logic speaks for itself. Low sales figures speak for themselves. The business logic is that Panasonic simply can't continue like this, they must change and do something about their marketing and product strategy. The Panasonic Microwave Camera is not enough to take sales away from the others. If they are still on under 3-4% market share after another couple of years, that's one activist shareholder meeting away from curtains. They have already fucked up with some of their most loyal users, I am not the only one to switch to Nikon, or Sony, or Canon or Fuji due to the S1R II being in a mid-range body design, with previous features taken away, with a sensor slower than what the competition had 5 years ago at the same resolution, and an autofocus engine which is as far behind the cutting edge as their lens ecosystem is.

They can. They just need to be a little more vocal about their product line such as: “In early 2025 we will be releasing a successor to the S1R and then in the late Spring, a successor to the S1H”. Press release. Bosh. Job done. Shuts the speculation down with a single sentence. People respect integrity. At least the folks that count do. I’m not saying Panasonic LUMIX lack integrity, but a lot of these companies could kill a lot of the stupid shit that goes on by being a bit more informative and less Secret Fucking Squirrel. In my humble opinion.

Some believe Panasonic is on the verge of shutting down, a narrative that a few users continue to push. I suppose their decision to release the S1R II instead of an S1H II only fuels that perception. The main criticism of the S1R II is its rolling shutter—something even Panasonic has acknowledged, advising those who prioritize it to choose a different camera. Essentially, Panasonic can't win. Pack everything into a camera, and it's too expensive. Leave something out, and it’s not "the very best." The real question is whether it offers good value—and, like most Panasonic cameras (new and used), it clearly does.

I've lurked here for years but this S1RII stuff has gotten real silly. It's like there's resentment it's not an S1HII even though we all know it's the R series. And the criticisms of the S1RII are especially strange considering the Z8 (which I've owned) was subject to criticism when released (overheating, dynamic range, AF = nice try, but no Sony/Canon, no Bird Detect, not 1 but 2 recalls, did I mention overheating?). Now the Z8 is the model camera the S1RII just can't match. Almost as if firmware updates make a difference. Is Panasonic good at firmware updates? Gee, I dunno. The new Slashcam review certainly seems bullish on the S1RII.

And the best ratio for that is 4:3.. aka M43, if Pana or Oly were smart about it they really could really make a ultimate content creator camera, but looks like Canon got the better idea than them argh.

Okay but speaking of shills, this one might be the best I've ever seen 😆

Haha. Nice. Must be confident in the autofocus performance then! Although perhaps I am reading too much into it and it tells us more about the state of BBC News than anything camera related!!

Slashcam said the S5II had a flawless and quite "cinematic" video rendering in their review. This is not true at all, the bad processing just destroy the fine details, even more in 4k. So I would take their words with a grain of salt for now. And I found very strange all these reviews showing there is still a good amount of moiré whereas in the video of hopkinsfilms the S1RII looks even better than the S1H. Also it's hard to say because of Youtube compression but I found a video from Vistek showing a comparison between the R5II and S1RII in 8K, and like on the S5II I wonder if these are not the same smoothed out details on skin texture that I can see on the S1RII. His forehead looks more blurred on the S1RII (right image). Never mind, I already pre-ordered the camera, I will compare the video engine to my S1 and S5II, but if it is close to the S5II, I will return the camera this time.

HDMI has very little lag now. Major improvement finally.

So the 6K 60p is a crop with vertical binning according to Slashcam, but still very good detail: https://www.slashcam.de/artikel/Test/Panasonic-LUMIX-S1R-II-Sensor-Bildqualitaet---Debayering--Rolling-Shutter-und-Dynamik--Rolling-Shutter---Panaso.html#4KDebayeringPanasonic