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Exactly... Dissecting every little stat on paper and arguing in YouTube comments over various cameras is one thing... but there's something to be said for mastering your craft and learning your tools. I research the shit out of gear and then after I pull the trigger on a purchase I rarely look back. I keep my cameras, lenses, lights etc...for YEARS. Really knowing how you can push a camera or other tool while out in the field is a solid skill. I have worked with so many camera ops, even DP's on set who said to me, "Oh, I didn't even know this camera had that mode/function... But alternatively, I was working as a 1st AD on a small indie feature a few years back and that DP was really, really good. He was the one person on set who was getting paid full rate. And it was worth paying him with how tight and efficient he was. He also was really good at After Effects and compositing as well as color grading and was going to end up doing that stuff later in post. I'll never forget the lesson I learned on a very full day watching him shoot. He was so efficient with our massive shot list and there were a lot of times we thought we had to go again for third and fourth takes. I would walk over to the director and make sure we were good because I would notice little continuity mistakes or other issues and the DP would always dismiss me. Later at lunch he explained that he knew what we needed and that the background was going to be replaced in post, or he was just going to mask off the extra that walked into the frame etc... So many other inexperienced directors/DP's would have spent hours "getting it right" but been behind all day. So my parallel with the S1Rii here is that I want to be able to put it through its paces and how it will stand up to certain things. I want to know that if I'm shooting an event that I can shoot a wide video clip and know that later I can extract a few cropped stills and it will hold up. Because this is a hybrid camera, I want to really know if it will act like one when pushed. Of course we know it will be fine for most things and the 4k will be great but some of us are looking to push it.

I hear you for sure. You’re definitely right. I think the point behind the nitpicking is to figure out where the current gen Lumix bodies stand in comparison to the competition and last gen, including IQ. It’s been a while since they released a pro body like this so it’s good to see where their focus is now in their positioning within the pro market. Things like downscaling and cropping do factor in to purchase choices just like features, ergonomics, and reliability do. Some want paint brushes. Some want tested utilitarian tools. Some want some balanced mix of both for their money. It may or may not make a difference; some of us just want to know what’s happening under the hood. Because if we’re gonna say that clients don’t really care what we see, how come most of us don’t just pick up a few secondhand 5D3/D810/A7Sii/GH5/C100/P6k/FS7 and call it a day? Some answers to this may reveal legit analysis paralysis. Others, not so much. It’s something every artist or business has to answer for themselves. Like I really don’t care for the FX6 since what I have is good enough, but if owning one fits well into existing clients’ workflows AND gets me more jobs then hey it’s time to consider upgrading. (Remembering that we’re pages deep into a topic discussing video performance for a supposedly photo-focused camera model haha)

S5ii had improvements over orig S5, but lower level of details with oversharpening was annoying, even with 6k VLog and also with a LUT burnt in. It was especially noticeable on extracted stills when viewed from a big screen. If you check Connor McCaskill’s latest S1Rii Youtube clip, he has a download link to his footage. Had a play on resolve, and damn, S1Rii IQ looks definitely better and different than what came from S5ii sensor. Grades pretty effortlessly too. The only downside with Z6iii NRaw along the big file sizes is the NR. Don’t know if the full M4 Max chip is enough to play the timeline in real time with NR, and it is expensive. Have a PC with 5800x CPU and RTX 3080 GPU too and editing is more stuttery with it than with M3 Pro Macbook. The latest Nvidia 5xxx GPUs have 4:2:2 support now, but they are not cheap either, and I prefer the ease of using macOS. A new camera usually means you need to get a new computer for editing too, but with S1Rii that does not seem to be the case. Even M1 Pro would be fine

FWIW, I recently did a post about the doc the wife and I are working on. Some of our production insights there. Examples are posted too, so you can judge if what we're talking about measures up to your standards. Not the first time we've done that either. Yeah, it's a gear site first and foremost, but other info floats around too.

Filmstock Lynch Dune > digital Villeneuve Dune, Filmstock Bladerunner > digital Bladerunner 2049. Oh boy, I´m in trouble now. The original Bladerunner is a stunningly beautiful and groundbreaking scifi neo noir, in which color makes the world materialize like one can touch and breathe it. Bladerunner 2049, though a well designed and high class realization, is rather abstract and reduced in regards to composition, geometry and colour imo. Lighting, though a tour de force of effort and technological prowess, feels streamlined to me. In comparision, light in the original Bladerunner is vivid, lively, wild and untamed, of opulent baroqueness. 2020ies Dune felt hollow to me, when I watched it on Netflix. It looked and felt like a center perspective duotone coloured video game. I just read that it was transferred from digital to analogue and then scanned back to digital. Posh spice! 😊 The 1980ies Dune was fun and a best of 80ies spectacle with a meditative prologue and full of atmosphere, great ambitions and quirky failures, a cult classic with lasting charme and soul. Though I prefer the analogue filmmaking of masters like Lynch and Scott over filmmaking of current times Villeneuve, I would not say that analogue Roger Deakins is better than digital Deakins. I imagine there would be more bad analogue movies than good ones and at the same time more digital mediocrity out there than analogue lacklusters in absolute numbers, due to the sheer amount of digital output. A statement about analogue being better than digital is very general and misses a lot in regards of the beauty and quality of digital filmmaking. The og post is still a good tease for a lively discussion and a well written fun read. It sofore deserves my big like! I do not a agree on the general premise of the original post but I can share its love for originality and sincerity for cinema, though I found that in digital as well. I love the number of quirky, playful, inventive shorts, semi pro music videos, classic and not so classic indies and labours of love, which have been produced since the rise of 8bit 420 cameras. I love the 8bit 420 gems of old days vimeo as well as full scale digital cinema movies like Lighthouse, oops that one was analogue.;) I don't care for most of the high scale Hollywood or Netflix Blockbusters but I love tons of other digitally filmed, edited and graded films and videos I got to enjoy. On a side note, the first Raid movie was an 8bit 422 masterpiece in many regards, the glory of Panasonic AF100 output to an Atomos Ninja. Most of you know that, of course. I still enjoyed mentioning it.:)

Indeed, it's also why I kept my pre-order, the files from the S1RII look much better in 4K than on the S5II. I agree about the Z6III, and the IBIS looks really better on the S1RII too. Anyway it seems some people totally missed my point, of course most clients don't see the difference but if you want the best quality, by example to extract stills or viewing your footage on a big screen, even for family stuff, the S5 and S1 internal recording is just much better than on the S5II. I loved Panasonic before the S5II because their camera had a video IQ very close to stills. But if the aim is to shoot only for clients (and most of them can't see a difference between 2k and 4k resolution), yes the S5II is clearly the better choice, especially because of the much better AF and IBIS in video.

I get where you’re coming from, and I understand that different workflows exist for different reasons. But at some point, you have to ask, are we pushing our tools to be better storytellers, or just finding ways to avoid tightening up our craft? There’s a difference between efficiency and just being lazy. If someone is taking multiple takes to get it right, that’s not always inexperience. It’s making sure the shot actually works without needing to “fix it in post.” On the other hand, the mindset of shooting carelessly and relying on post production isn’t efficiency, it’s a crutch. Regarding not using older gear, some people don’t use those older cameras simply because they want to make their job easier. Newer cameras offer better usability, faster workflows, etc. but still, as everyone allegedly already knows, you can still achieve a high quality look with older gear. It just comes down to experience and knowing how to work with what you have. At the end of the day, I don’t see top level professionals getting caught up in these debates. They pick their tools, use the features that matter, and get the job done. Ninpo33 mentioned a DP who didn’t realize a camera had a particular function…because that DP focused on what helped him execute, not on obsessing over every technical option. That’s the difference between using your gear and getting lost in it.

Yeah. Totally not depressing, that.

I think overall a fascinating post and goes to the heart of why limitations breed creativity, you can't fix it in post.

The forum is overflowing with cool stuff. Just browse around. You could also ask your specific question or post your insights and findings from your filming job or activities.

Exactly. The viewer does not give a damn how it was made. A film or documentary must move feelings or make people think. If they do, who cares about the technical details? Only the insiders.

This take is a bit much. Plenty of bad films were shot on film, and plenty of great ones were shot digitally. It’s not the format that makes a movie good or bad it’s how you use it. Preferring film is fine, but saying digital ruined cinema is extreme. That said, I’m interested in Fuji’s upcoming Eterna film camera. If it delivers high quality in camera color, it could push DPs to lock in the final look while shooting, which is an interesting approach.

I disagree, I really think the video engine is worse, of course much more when using the standard profiles. In 4K the level of details is low but yet these details are over-sharpened. In 5,9K/6K, there are more details but the bad sharpening is annoying. Of course most clients don't see the difference but they can't really see the difference between 4k or 1080P either ... So if use high resolution video modes I want the best quality for cropping, for extract stills etc. If not, even an old GH2 is largely enough to create beautiful images. From my point of view, lowering image quality is never a great thing, I just hope the S1RII will be closer to the S1 and S5 than the S5II.

No, I'm not sure, this is the first thing I will test when I receive the camera. Since I like to crop and extract picture from my videos I can see a big difference between the image processing of the S5II and the S5, I agree V-log is a bit better than the standard profiles, even more in 4k. The S1RII at least seems to keep good quality when using the High stabilisation mode in 4k thanks to the 8k sensor. About the green tint, the last firmware fixed it for me or I was lucky ... Yes I hope they will add 8k raw internal though.

I very much prefer the image of the OG S5 over the S5II X, but people really make a mountain out of a molehill when it comes to the "worse" image. It's really not that bad. In the year I've had it not one client or viewer has complained about the image; in fact it has been the exact opposite! I feel like cameras have plateaued so now people over analyze and overstate every little thing. But virtually all of this stuff doesn't matter to the audience that we are creating these images for. Anyone with any discernible talent will be able to take the S1RII and create compelling images with it. That bride is going to love the pictures you take, the corporate client is going to be ecstatic with the talking head interviews you shoot, the MMA school is going to be psyched with the promotional video you film, etc. As long as it's in focus, the colors are okay, and it's framed well, these folks aren't going to really care if it's a little noisier than the R5II or if the rolling shutter is slightly worse than the A7RV. I don't know how it is where you all live, but there are literally people making money using cheap Canon Rebel DSLRs and kit lenses in my area. I see friends post their wedding pictures, their kid's senior portraits, baby pictures, and all of that stuff on Facebook all of the time. Most of the time these photographers aren't even good at what they do, put people I know still go crazy over them and post these photos they paid for proudly on social media! These photographers still get paid work, not just because they are cheap (that certainly helps!) but because the average person's standards aren't all that high. That's not to say that we should lower our standards, just that we should remember the big picture (no pun intended) and stop worrying about the small things that aren't going to matter to 99.9% of our clients/audience.

Hi Everyone, I've created some new one-of-a-kind fantasy wood textures to share with the community. You'll find them here: TXR - WOOD - FANTASY https://soundimage.org/txr-wood-fantasy/ OGG MUSIC PACKS If you happen to be using my music in your projects, please don't forget to check out my higher-quality Ogg Music Packs. These packs enable you to download all of my music tracks at once for various genres..a real time-saver. You can even download all of my game music at once with my Ogg Music Mega Pack. You'll find them here: https://soundimage.org/ogg-music-packs-2/ https://soundimage.org/ogg-game-music-mega-pack/ As always, enjoy, stay safe and keep being creative. 🙂

I kind of agree, but 2 things initially spring to mind. Thing A, a roll of film would need to revert back to costing 5 dollars instead of whatever it costs to buy & develop these days. Thing B, good luck trying to get this implemented. I feel the same about the other side of my own work, ie, in photography. I would LOVE to go back to being a pure film photographer but the single reason why I do not is a simple one and that is financially it would not fly today. Why, because around 75% of my turnover per job would go straight back out of the door and have to go on buying & processing film and at today's rates. I'd be out of business. Or double my rates and also go out of business because no one booked me. And then 2 other things. Thing C = not all older movies look great. Some...a lot even, look shit to my eyes. Thing D = not all modern movies look shit. Some...a lot even, look superb to my eyes. Summary, I think there is too much rose tinted spectacle nostalgia about 'The Good Old Days' and that everything today is trash. Everything today is not trash, - it's just different times. I am currently re-watching Ripley on Netflix. To my eyes, it is one of the most superb and cinematic creations ever made. Arguably it is not a movie per se, but a series, but actually it's a 6 hour movie in 8 parts. Almost every single frame looks superb. It's a modern day film noir that makes most older film noir look incredibly dated. OK, some of it is actually CGI. The boat scenes with (no spoilers), Tom & Dickie has a huge amount, but that's just a tool available to the modern filmmaker. Anyway, just my opinion. They also make a lot of shit today. Probably 19+ out of every 20 movies released today I would not wish to see, but they do still make some gems when the right people are involved.

When I read that bit it seemed interesting but then thought about for myself what it would mean. I don't have time for my own projects as it is so introducing more seems like I wouldn't have the time for (even though the idea is exciting.) But one thing I can do is write a bit about the challenges I'm having right now in my own projects. That would be kind of interesting to others I think.

I'm keen on our own findings, footage, artistc work, analysis, concepts, our creative work in general and reflection about it. Like in my post above, I am with @kye and @QuickHitRecord on this. Well designed challenges are a great. I'd love that. I don't care about the endless repetition of specs and mediocore youtube links over and over again, which have been bloating some threads. Less hot air, more artistic work and experiments. Like in pre corona times. The cinematography . com forum has tons of that kind of great stuff. Why not getting back to focus much more on that rather than recycling internet discussions.

One topic I find missing is discussion of the creative aspects of our own film-making. Maybe there are too few people shooting things, or too few that are willing/able to share, but to me this is the only topic worth discussing. We all know that the pros can take most equipment and create great images from them, proving that creativity and skills are far more important than equipment, yet the discussions focus on the equipment, the industry politics, the changing media landscape, and everything except what matters - the skills. As much as there are many reasons to hate on other social media platforms, there are many places out there where people post their own work and discuss it on both technical and non-technical levels, creating an opportunity for constructive feedback and creative growth.