Andrew Reid

What you list is pretty amazing, when you have all that (inc. peaking, etc.) what 'cinema quality features' are you referring to that would improve a DSLR? Raw codec? We have Blackmagic for that. 10bit colour, etc.? It doesn't make a huge difference. I'd be very happy with that list alone.

[quote name='RichST' timestamp='1344583553' post='15257'] Very interesting, I wonder just how Sony will improve its video capture ability? Best case scenario is that they do a full sensor scan and downscale it. But I just don't think that's possible at that price point. A c300 type readout would also yield excellent results but again I think that's too high end. Perhaps they've figured out how Panasonic grabs the video capture from its GH sensors and will use something like that. [/quote] My speculation: They won't do a full sensor capture or C300 readout because the 24MP count is too high for stuff like that, instead I think they will do something similar to the GH2 which samples intelligently on the sensor, outputs something like 4MP, then downsamples that to 1080p on the image processor side. Leica R: Good tips Samuel I have some of the same glass and it's great. Prices are steadily going up but you can still get some bargains, mainly outside of eBay in 2nd hand stores along the high street.

[quote name='Rungunshoot' timestamp='1344547920' post='15234'] How bout IBIS? It would be amazing if the camera offered sensor-shift stabilization with little or no crop factor. [/quote] Good point, that would be great on legacy M42 adapted lenses if it worked with non-Sony stuff like the Olympus IBIS does. I am sure we will see IBIS as Alpha lenses don't have optical image stabilisation as standard.

[quote name='mike_tee_vee' timestamp='1344545168' post='15232'] Why mess around with the Alpha Mount? Sticking with it is extremely limiting, and just another example of Sony's insistance on proprietary products. It's a legacy mount. Traditional DSLRs are at a saturation point, while the mirrorless market share is growing. I can easily see Sony placing the Alpha mount on the backburner much like Olympus and Panasonic have with the original Four Thirds mount. In terms of workflow, many of the lenses used on the FS100 will not be usable on an A99. [/quote] Hmm it isn't really a proprietary thing, it is something they inherited from Konica Minolta. It is simply a short straw that's all. Because of all the mounts ONE has to be biggest doesn't it? As I said before, way for Sony to fix this is offer completely non-standard mirrorless full frame mount and create hot swappable mount which you can change. They already have the Alpha SLT mount hot swappable, you can use it on the NEX mount and FS100. You will never see an E-Mount sensor size larger than APS-C. The sensor will not physically fit into that mount circumference and the flange distance is too short to get decent optical performance in the corners. The Leica M flange distance is larger than E-Mount for same reason...optical performance in the corners.

[quote name='tungah' timestamp='1344520414' post='15200'] The "problem" I see with the Sony is the mount. Forget about using inexpensive Nikon AIS glass... and Alpha lenses is hard to come by here in Brazil, at least at reasonable prices anyways. Andrew, what do you know about the GH3? Any info on that? [/quote] Sure Nikon AIS glass is good value, but you know what - I don't have any. Prefer Contax Zeiss. Sadly those will have to be converted to work on the Alpha mount, rather than adapted. Yes the mount will be an issue for people heavily invested in non-Sony glass because they can't adapt it. Maybe Sony have something up their sleeve with the A99 to allow that. So far they have been very supportive of adapting lenses on NEX cameras, even showcasing third party adapter rings in the official Sony Centre here in Berlin and selling them alongside the NEX lenses. For those with smaller collection of lenses, well the solution is to do a bit of eBaying. Here's what I do if the A99 is the hit I think it will be for video. I'll sell my Samyang EOS mount stuff and replace it with Samyang's Alpha mount versions for same price, possibly the Cine editions that were announced today (14, 24, 35). Another lens I use on full frame is Tokina 11-16mm F2.8 at the 16mm end and that is available for same price as EOS mount version in Alpha mount too. Next up I will likely sell my 85mm Contax Zeiss and upgrade to the newer ZA Zeiss version, though of course it will cost £300 more. For those on budget the Samyang 85mm F1.4 is great value for money and in Sony mount too. Then we come to the Alpha glass, there might be some nice choices there (they have a telephoto lens optimised especially for awesome looking bokeh for example that I thought about using on my existing cameras) but really unless you want AF and some zooms you can save money and stick to non Sony stuff. As for ultra affordable, what about Minolta primes on eBay? See, there are options and it isn't the end of the world because of the Alpha mount unless you have tons of L stuff that you can't afford to swap out for the Alpha equivalent. I do agree that the biggest obstacle to Sony's success in the pro market for photography is indeed that people are locked into vast investments in Canon and Nikon glass. If I were Sony I'd make the SLT assembly and Alpha mount detachable from a new mirrorless full frame mount. Essentially imagine the NEX SLT adapter as part of the camera, and it comes off when you need to put on a Canon or Nikon mount instead.

[quote name='hoodlum' timestamp='1344518186' post='15199'] Sony seems to be the only one willing to cannibalize their own products. Every other camera manufacturer tries to project their higher margin products. The RX100 is another example where Sony put all of the latest processing technology and manual controls in a 1" sensor compact camera. It even has the same menu as the Alpha line. I wish others would do the same. [/quote] Too right. All the market segmentation is crappy, just let the individual products stand up on their own and let them be the best they can possibly be given the technology for the price.

[quote name='Germy1979' timestamp='1344514093' post='15195']"They are stills cameras @sshole!!!!" - already, lol.[/quote] Yeah, that got old a long time ago didn't it? Round about the time anyone with a clue started offering video production as well as just photography.

[quote name='Samuel H' timestamp='1344510187' post='15189'] I wouldn't be THAT optimistic. "We wanted to put real great PRO video into this camera" and "we added a continuous LED light on top of it" are somewhat difficult to mix together. I'd bet they've put more effort into AF than in using a great codec. As usual, wait and see... [/quote] Just the focus of the product planner on video is enough to make it better than the current stuff. It will be first time any DSLR has been optimised for video performance. All the Canon video modes are a hack. And the GH2 is a good attempt but weak sensor relative to full frame.

The price that has been rumoured so far has been in $2500 range. Please bear in mind what a properly video optimised full frame sensor is capable of. We're talking massive amounts of dynamic range, incredible low light, full frame depth of field and much better colour than any of the sensors with smaller pixels. People have a common misconception that we have that already with the 5D Mark III and D800. You don't at all. You have 1/10th of that it could be. Because they are optimised for stills not video.

Haha nice analogy. Well the Alpha mount is not the most adaptable, certainly true. Expensive depends on what is in the box though really, and I think it will be explosive. Not literally I hope! GH3 and A99 have major possibility of providing far better image quality and all-round usability / featureset than any of the current favourites, be it FS100, Blackmagic Cinema Camera or 5D. Some on Twitter have been underestimating the significance of product planning too. They say it is just a rumour and proof is in the pudding. But for me the pudding is mostly in the cooking and the 5D Mark III was cooked up for photography not video. The chef in this instance is a videographer. That news alone is enough to have me very excited for the A99.

[url="http://www.eoshd.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/sony-a900-a99-full-frame.jpg"][img]http://www.eoshd.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/sony-a900-a99-full-frame.jpg[/img][/url] [i]Above: Sony's previous foray into full frame, the A900[/i] With Canon this year failing to capitalise in my view, on their huge gains in the video market following the successful 5D Mark II, I have long wondered when one of the big 3 would get it right and give us what we need - a full frame DSLR with equal emphasis on pro video and stills. My friend Sony Alpha Rumors, a blog so often the recipient of genuine information rates this news highly because it is from multiple trusted top sources and I myself have heard whispers of Sony's approach which match, so I don't doubt it. Professional filmmakers and videographers were involved in the planning stages of the camera for 2 years. The A99 strategy is one of convergence and not only will the camera have the best possible video image quality but Sony are building a video infrastructure around the product to support it. These developments are incredibly significant... http://www.eoshd.com/content/8709/top-sources-say-sony-developing-full-frame-a99-as-hybrid-gh2-like-dslr-targeting-professional-filmmakers

[quote name='jgharding' timestamp='1344425319' post='15132']Just as with microphones, where the physical size of the diaphragm simply is a contributing factor to the sound no matter what other tech is strapped around it, it seems the same is true of the image-capture area: you can't fake the physical reality of the size of that part however hard you try. Will there ever be a way to make photo-diodes behave more like film? Some kind of pseudo-lightfield microlens technology but used for traditional capture not gimmicky post DOF control? to broaden their angle of absorption and the spread of light in an organic way? Am I being intuitive here, or absurd? [/quote] I think a lot of the feel of video is the fault of the display technology rather than the actual camera side. I think the sensors we have today are all very closely matched and there's no reason, lens aside, that a smaller micro four thirds or BMD sensor cannot look as cinematic as a one in a camera that is considered 'soft, organic and film-like' like the 5D or C300. Certainly upping the bitrate doesn't make for a less cinematic image or a more electronic video feel. What I believe is happening here is that sharp and detailed images are done a disservice by laptop screens, LCD monitors, even some high end TVs and projectors because they are too clinical, too punchy and too vibrant. The fact that the modern lenses are also this way, conspires against the sensor and yet we too often blame the camera for giving us a 'video-like' image! Certainly there are some cameras that are more cinematic than others but the bigger varying factors are almost certainly in the display side of things, and the lensing. Remember the film guys even accuse the Alexa and F65 of looking 'too digital', and we know that is not the case. Lots of beautiful organic and soft cinema out there shot on the 5D and GH2 let alone the Alexa. It is all about hiding the digital nature of an image with the right projection format and the right lenses. As a DP at least you can fix one of those, the other you unfortunately don't have as much control of!

The camera in handheld twilight mode is completely insane in low light. Layering 6 shots together is done so intelligently that even if you have moving crowds and traffic in the shot you don't get ghosting, just amplified signal to noise ratio and cleaner images. These were shot handheld(!!) in extremely dark areas of Berlin in the middle of the night. Shutter was as low as 1/8 in some cases, and I was still getting pin sharp images with no tripod. In fact the images look like long exposures on a tripod, because before the RX100 that was the only way you'd be able to get shots like this, frankly. [url="http://www.eoshd.com/comments/gallery/image/68-dsc00810/"]http://www.eoshd.com...ge/68-dsc00810/[/url] DSC00810 Album: Sony RX100 Handheld Twilight Shots Uploaded 08 Aug 2012 - 07:55

Forget the hack, you are no longer going to need it. Cannot say any more. Photokina... I will be there!!

$3000, another choice, another 'film stock' to use for the scenes that suit the look. It is great to see. The sensor size isn't as important as getting rid of all the dodgy compression, mud, aliasing, moire, 8 bit colour, 4:2:0, steep highlight roll off, banding, lack of detail, weak dynamic range and smudgy un-film-like noise you get in Canon DSLR footage. I see none of that being a problem on the Blackmagic Cinema Camera judging from John's footage which is about as honest as the camera. The BMD is needed to bust the myth of the Canon DSLRs being 'the best' for digital cinema under $3k, just because a few celebrity shooters have done great things with them. It really is looking like a $3000 digital film camera. When I shoot with mine, I may be proved wrong or disappointed so only then will I know for sure so it makes sense to hold off in terms of final judgement, but I am predicting I will like it. By the way if what I know about the GH3 is correct we are in for a treat.

[quote name='tony wilson' timestamp='1344313338' post='15036'] captains log star date july into august 2012. for a while now some of the crew been distracted by mindless moronic sports events. the federation love promoting sports they think it keeps the scum from riot,rape and my favourite murder. i william tiberius shatner kirk have bigger fish to fry. 1.does spock still love me is the relationship getting stale. 2.is he still turned on by my 20 pack abs 3. is scottie really scottish 4.who can dance the macarena better captain kirk or the french scum bald captain prickhard. i get a sense a feeling in my tight nylon space pants that we are getting close to another big war. question for the log. what will come first ww3 or bmc giving the prototype to another tester. [/quote] Kirk: "Captain! We're approaching the war with $15,000 phaser guns which are obsolete. Our red $20,000 warp drives with $1500 SSD drives are also outgunned!.... Incoming Blackmagic mothership!!!" Canon Picard: "Beam me up scotty!!"

[quote name='John Brawley' timestamp='1344323916' post='15044'] The camera has a native or natural ISO of 800. Although it has lower ISO settings and you do get a slight improvement on noise in blacks, you're basically trading highlights in for a lower ISO. So shooting at ISO800 gives the MOST amount of DR when shooting in ProRes. As far as the noise.... I've said this before. The camera doesn't do any in-camera noise reduction or image processing, even when shooting ProRes. That means the images are very honest and you get everything. Including noise that IS there with other cameras, but is usually masked by processes beyond your direct control as a user. jb [/quote] Thanks for that John. I don't mind film grain, the noise has a nice fine texture to it. I think some of the blacks would have been better off crushed a little bit in the grade to hide some of the more honest parts of the image :) It is good to see an honest image that gives a lot of options to work with in post and that is what we want as test footage. Thanks for uploading. PS to those who can't download, you need to be a Vimeo Plus member.

[quote name='Chris Santucci' timestamp='1344336105' post='15047'] $3,000. + SSD = ? [/quote] $3,240. (240GB) Does that answer your question?

All shot in full resolution mode. The phone can do an internal downsample to improve low light, giving 8MP, 5MP or 3MP images instead. But this is exactly the same as resizing a 38MP still to 8MP, 5MP or 3MP yourself in Photoshop. Better results to be had in post from the full files, rather than restricting it at the time of shooting to a lower res.

[media]http://vimeo.com/47013561[/media] New Blackmagic Cinema Camera footage is in the wild, and this one is downloadable in glorious high bitrate 1080p. Although it isn't the original DNG or ProRes rushes it is the closest we've come to a representative video yet. http://www.eoshd.com/content/8703/most-significant-clue-so-far-about-blackmagic-cinema-camera-performance

Why would anyone want to shoot with a phone over a DSLR for video in low light? They're both rubbish in that regard. It isn't much of an appeal. The stills are though. For me even though the iPhone does really nice resolution and bitrates with Filmic Pro, it is still just a curiosity feature. Given $700 it is a bit of a no brainer what camera to use for serious video, and it isn't a 808, an iPhone, or a Galaxy S3.

Um. You're missing the fact that the 4S has more detail in video mode and less compression.

[quote name='KarimNassar' timestamp='1344028553' post='14937'] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]I think we must not forget that it was not made for us it's a consumer camera.[/font][/color] [/quote] You will be surprised Karim ;)

That isn't typical, sorry to hear that. Looks like you may have a faulty unit.

Tried the CameraPro app and I don't think it is worth even $3. It crashes when entering expert mode settings, and it doesn't do anything in stills mode that the built in camera doesn't, apart from crash when you set the JPEG compression... And video quality seems the same too. Compression issues are the main thing that is wrong with video on the 808, so if Filmic Pro comes to the Nokia store (unlikely) then it could be great.