markm

Cameraboy Some speculation. Would that lead to the sort of softness we see in Genesis do you think? Maybe its got a filter for moire and aliasing that adds to the softening we have seen?

What would make me really happy is to find a crop tele mode perfect for Super 16mm and monitor out that works in tele mode and priced the same as the GH2. After all I think that is a reasonable expectation that normally happens in the evolving world we live in. I'm not sure Santa or customer expectations would be part of Panasonic HQ Long term strategy though. Maybe convince a customer what expectations ought to be. However tomorrow could be a I'll eat my hat day. Hope so I like hat sandwiches Why should improvements mean a higher price. After all the majority if the work has been done and money recouped from the GH2.

Genesis was shot with the benefit of very good lighting that basicly could put this in line with all the luxuries and benefits of the Zacuto challenge 3 IE Bruce Logan as a member of the ASC His skill with lighting is a master. Another thing is the colour correction was professional so we need ungraded footage to make any judgement. This was where BMD and their campaign was so useful to those wishing to do camera tests. I guess we will see.

The important thing is while they all share the same sensor with each other and no one else then how are our interests being served. I guess if Panasonic wanted to lock the hackers out then by locking their own sensor people would moan but by putting Sony's in then no can. Also it can help them leave m4/3 after all is there any future for the format now. Yes the GH2 frame size is 18.70 x 10.50 mm and will now be slightly smaller and yes we just lost crop mode and most likely the ability to use hacks for different things IE Driftwoods night and Day or colour corrections for different light levels etc. The GH2 on the Zacuto challenge had arguably the best picture of the lot. Albiet within its confines Now that must mean resolution and colour rendition work well. As for its limitations you have to make sure exposure is set right to get great images.and it's 4.2.0 8 bit BUT thats at the bit rate and various settings emplyed by Driftwood lpowell etal The GH3 has a lot to live up to and you might find good and bad like Improved low light less banding issues that could come with less resolution no crop mode and colour rendition that is not as good as the GH2. The GH2 is a form of open architecture for experts like Vitaliy and who knows what else could come from this. The GH3 will almost certainly be closed. We need some tests done to find out exactly where we stand with the GH3. Maybe the GH2 will become a one off and sought after camera in the future.

I'd like to see what would happen if BMD wanted to buy Sony sensors for their camera. Quite happy though to share it around with other competitors. Wonder what that could mean? Seemingly Panasonic don't intend to push their sensor crop idea IE crop mode could be perfect for Super 16mm Crop mode perfect for 16mm frame size with monitor out What happens when they want to bring in a replacement for the AF101. Can you imagine if Panasonic had made a multi aspect sensor that cleanly and perfectly catered for Super 16mm and standard 16mm lenses. A new model for the Panasonic AF101? Wouldn't that have made more sense By putting in a better sensor in the AF101 and adding high bit intraframe And/or 10 bit 4.2.2 out they could have totally cleaned up.

Also funny how Nikon's D600 and now the GH3 all using Sony sensors now. Ooer.

What happened to the Tele mode? This was such a useful feature with my 16mm film lenses. I guess if the Tele mode has gone it means I wont have to worry about losing the external monitor anymore. Was hoping all that would have been fixed on the GH3.

Genesis looked quite cinematic but I have to say a lot of the shots especially when the camera was in low light were quite soft.. There was a shot of the girl in town though that looked very sharp. One of the things about the GH2 is the way you can use lots of different hacks for different conditions. I figured out why I was having problems with Driftwoods hacks I'm using a sandisc 32gb but only 30mbs write speed and I really should use the 95mbs card even for Andrews hack. I think I need to see some resolution tests and what sharpening might be doing. After looking closely at Genesis I'm not sure I'm ready to swap my GH2 yet.

Andrew The GH3 does look a nice camera for messing about with and if the price is low enough I could buy one as an upgrade to my GH2. Although this time around I will probably go for a larger sensor like the [b]Sony nex ea50eh f[/b]or messing. For the first time though we can get into the professional arena with the BMC and the BMC 4/3 is my main priority and will be my main cam. Nothing else even begins to cut it for me. I will truly have a baby Alexa. Good times ahead.

Sorry Andrew will disagree with you on this one. Now people dont forget this is just my opinion so need to insult me with personal attacks or fanboy defences. The original camera run ONLY at 24fps What use is that apart from internet films and vimeo test fan films. Can't record sound seperately and synch it without steps. Only useful for making films to transfer to celluloid if you could afford it and were dumb enough to do it as AVCHD at 8 bit 4,2 0 and 23mbps put paid to any of that. So zero use as a film camera and zero use as a normal one. They did upgrade it to 25fps MUCH later on AFTER Vitaliys hack and AFTER everyone had been crying out for 25p. The camera was intentionally crippled surely we can all see that. How could Vitaliy, Driftwood, manage to get so much more out of it if this were not the case. Working on the assumption it was deliberatley crippled you have to ask what has changed and then have a close look at why the GH3 does what it does. Effectively it trumps the GH2 hacks and may actually stop hacking Next it allows the four thirds lenses to carry on in case people might think panny have deserted it. I'm sure they will desert four thirds next time round though. The GH3 is it an answer to the BMC or to the slew of new cameras coming out now or are they all trying to squeeze Black magic out and recapture what they are losing along with all their mates. Because what they stand to lose is the ability to drip feed cameras with slight improvements. Segment the pro from the consumer and maximise money by small upgrades year on year. Simply because its got so bad (The crippling) That Black Magic can take off the shelf parts and make a camera that has pro res in built and RAW Throw in software worth about a £1000 and sell the whole lot for £2100. NOW forgive me for being cynical on the way we have been treated and are being goat herded into our pens again. I would think different if the new cams just simply had 4.2.2 10 bit out and decent sensors NOT crippled with bad processing. Come on this has gone on long enough and beyond a joke. I am annoyed with camera manufacturers and the way they have done business I applaud Black Magic and want to support their ethos I dont want to see certain maunfacturers herd us all back into our compounds with glossy sales campaigns and guru speel in order to do it. There is no reason why camera manufacturers cant output 10 bit in fact they have to take steps to prevent it from doing so.

[quote name='nigelbb' timestamp='1347633274' post='17983'] That is total crap. The video image using the standard firmware is very decent indeed especially V1.1 that enabled 24/p25p at 24Mbps. There are plenty of people using the GH2 without any hacks as the image is plenty good enough & it doesn't hang/freeze & need the battery pulled to reboot it. [/quote] No offence intended. My perspective is from making films. Not consumer stuff. The GH2 was perfectly adequate without the hack for me to shoot test stuff rehearsals BUT the hack makes it usable at a professional level within its limitations. As far as the camera without the hack is concerned to my mind its unusable professionally. jgharding Just my own opinion on this based on what I've seen and become suspicious of. I think they will try to dominate and control the market with damage limitation promotion and for a little while a little uncrippling if not now then in the future a return to crippling unfair competition deals and fixing. Funny in any other area we would have competition rules and laws.

The GH2 would have been awful were it not for the hack SO Two major concerns. 1) Has it got clean hdmi 10 bit out? 2) How much is it. I don't think we'll see a replacement for the AF101 camera which with a better sensor and 10 bit out would have CLEANED up. Panasonic would have sold bucket loads. SO either there is something wrong with their marketing or deliberate crippling policy So excuse me for being cynical but this could be a token camera to keep those who invested in 4/3 lenses happy and put Vitaliy out of a job. After that is done why would they improve the image at all when they can improve the price. Everyone else will perhaps move on to a larger sensor camera. Later Panny can come out with its own upgraded larger sensor AF101. Call it an AF F3 and sell it for £10,000 I don't know why but I keep getting this image in my mind of manufacturer executives gathering together in some board room and deciding where to steer us in order to drip feed us on the same old, same old. Year in year out.

[i]Heh Heh Same sensor as the sony 99 Same hdmi output too. The fight to claw back the market from Black Magic has begun in earnest. When they win we get the consumer prize in a few years of back to cripple heaven.[/i] [i]If Sony provides Nikons sensor they must have some sort of working agreement going on. Nikon could easily give us 10 bit uncompressed out as they have no high end to protect. So why dont they. [/i] [i]One bit of advice I would give to Black Magic and all those who want to take on the big boys. Don't tell anyone until the cameras are ready to ship. Remember the old saying "Loose lips sing ships."[/i] [i]However I think Black Magic have a product that squashes out of existant any of the offerings from all the manufacturers as far as picture quality goes. That is a fact that shouldnt get overlooked in the horses for courses arguments and quickness of post as well as the battery type arguments. To me PICTURE IS KING and that crown goes to the BMC.[/i]

[quote name='cameraboy' timestamp='1347556417' post='17907'] that was my point... there is more than just a sensor for image quality ... [/quote] Yes I agree and to use an anology why put three wheels on a car when you can put four. Unless of course you want to cripple it.

[quote name='cameraboy' timestamp='1347555878' post='17903'] f3 and fs100 share same sensor ... [/quote] Yes but not the same processing. Sorry - I think it's important to add that as many might think they get the same picture!

No mention on what the clean hdmi out is so I think it's not something they consider a selling point Even the interviewer doesn't ask the question which err everyone will want to know. I wonder if it has crop modes and what they might be. That could be as interesting as a Nikon D4 without the soft focus. Especially if it sells for about £1000 and has 4.2.2 hdmi. My guess is it's a three grand Sony money spinner with bells and whistles and not much else.

[quote name='TC' timestamp='1347447265' post='17825'] Brand new 24 MP full frame sensor. Want it in a stills optimized body? You can have it. Want it in a video optimized body? You can have it. Clean HDMI out on both. [/quote] So the HDMI is 4.2.2. 10 bit out?

[quote name='TC' timestamp='1347435778' post='17821'] It is the camcorder announcements that are interesting. And the conclusion is simple. Canon is dead. Sony has arrived. [/quote] Sony has arrived but does it have 10 bit 4.2.2 out. My guess is not. Sony have arrived to late with same old same old and an offering of full size sensor and 60fps to show something new has happened. My GH2 Will outperform this camera in a face off with Andrews hack. If it has 8 bit 4.2.0 out or 8 bit 4.2.2 My GH2 will be perhaps be beaten if the sony has an outboard recorder IE another £££ expense. BUT so what I want to move on to the latest technology. Black Magic that has a prores recorder as standard and Kinefinity!. Maybe Sony should move out of consumer camera production. They seem to want to hold onto the technology for their broadcast division to much. Maybe they should move out of the consumer camera arena altogether.

[quote name='matt2491' timestamp='1347241028' post='17672'] Lit by the sun you mean... Just kiddin :P [/quote] The sun is a nightmare practical light that constantly changes all the time. Imagine your house light dimming brightening and moving. Controlling it working with it is a massive part of the job on a film set. Happy times spent for sound waiting for aircraft to pass and clouds to move let alone setting lights reflectors and all sorts of stuff to get the picture right.

I think most of the world know you're a DP Phil. Welcome to the forum!

It's the sensor holding things up? Surely the manufacturers have had enough time to make them. Oh dear, hope there is no jiggery pokery going on.

BMC with MTF lenses This is wonderful news. AMAZING.

My only moan would like to be able to use other lenses. Phil Bloom is not a DP in the movie sense of the word. This is a PRO camera that delivers a PRO picture. If I was a movie DP reviewing a C300 I would see it as an overpriced toy for fun. I totally get where he is coming from and his review is perfect for those likely to be in that world. If I was a docu, internet, working quickly, maybe alone, holidays weddings corporate, lower end TV shows and I was to review an Alexa on this basis I would have to consign a £40,000 camera to unusable because of its lack of luxury little gadgets and slowness. A lot of so called professional opinions are bandied about but in the end there is only one thing that matters. What the tool does for you. The camera delivers RAW and prores in a small box that is the most user friendly camera to date. Either its of use or it isn't. It never said it was anything else than what it is. And it gives the best picture up to an Alexa and even then do you want an outboard recorder and the costs that go with it Let alone the fact it delivers full 10 bit prores. I couldnt care if it had no sound. Or it was limited to 3200 5500k I couldnt care less about f stop display or battery power. This is a very special camera that was once only for the high end of professional. I feel very happy to have this tool available at this price.

[url="http://philipbloom.net/2012/09/05/bmd/"]http://philipbloom.net/2012/09/05/bmd/[/url] Have to say this is a GREAT very long review that covers everything. One thing though he did place the emphasis I feel a tad to much on what the camera could do for him and the camera is all about making proper film films. I really don't know how he gets all over the place and manages to make all these films. You have to admire the guy.

[i][quote name='Mei Lewis' timestamp='1346919218' post='17428'] Your diagram and the sentence: Is wrong. The C300 has a _larger_ sensor than the Black Magic. You're getting confused about resolution, sensor size and what 'crop' means.[/i] [i][/quote][/i] [i]He was using an analogy so it it is obviously something else.[/i] [i][i][quote name='Mei Lewis' timestamp='1346919218' post='17428'][/i][/i] [i]Similarly your resolution comparison is flawed - of course the Black Magic shows more details, you've effectively used a longer lens. [/quote][/i] [i]Maybe you should take that up with John Brawley?[/i]