theSUBVERSIVE

I don't think this will hurt their reputation because what could be worse than the complete lack of innovation from Canon regarding video on photo/hybrid cameras ever since they entered the Cinema market? Sony took more than two generations to get overheating completely right - spoiler alert: making the cameras bigger helped, who would have guessed that? - and people kept buying Sony anyway, if people are still willing to overlook Canon's past decade and get onboard again, at least they are bringing something new and compared to the last 5D, it's a big jump. The bad part is that maybe even in 4K it might overheat, a compromise in 8K, something most people don't need, is more acceptable than in 4K, which is already the standard. But even with the overheating, at least they are pushing technology and competition forward, so despite the "catch" I see that as an overall positive for Canon - although their bar was set pretty low to begin with... hahahaha... But their latest Cinema camera were well received, the jump people expected from the previous generation in some models came now and reviews have been very positive. But we'll see... Sony is relieved, at least they won't look that bad for not bringing more than 4K with the so-much-rumored-and-awaited A7SIII - since the S1H 6K still can't get AF right and Canon's 8K overheats.

Canon is a big company with plenty of R&D, much more than Panasonic's Lumix + Varicam divisions and Sigma combined, I'm positive they can get their hands on whatever processing node they want and put together a camera that doesn't overheat if they wanted. The same way that Sony could have avoided overheating issues if they didn't want to shrink the camera down so much in the beginning - they knew about it since even the NEX cameras before had that issue. The positive is that Canon was more transparent about it from the get go, so I'm pretty sure that if Canon wanted, they could have chosen either the Sigma or the Panasonic solution or even both combined, but they chose not to. When the specs were out, everybody was asking themselves what was the catch. Would it be the crop factor, maybe a paid firmware, maybe there was no catch at all, but then there was. The rumors about the A7SIII seems to point to a 4K camera, so no 6K or 8K, but possibly 4K120p. I wonder what Panasonic will do for their GH6, they should once for all get their AF shit together.

When these cameras were not out yet, a few years back, I thought that Panasonic should pack video-feats in the G9 just like upcoming GH5. At the time I though the GH5 would be something like the GH5s but with IBIS, so it would offer better low-light like the A7S line up, better rolling shutter and readout speed but the G9 could still offer compatible V-log L capabilities to work as a B-cam for video. That way, you could have higher-res pics with the G9 and better video with the GH5 and they would complement each other pretty nicely, in a similar way Sony does. In the end the G9 didn't get the video-feats - well, until now -, the G9 and GH5 ended up sharing the same 20MP sensor and there was a separated GH5s with better low light, multi-aspect sensor and no IBIS. Panasonic has backed down from the early promise of 8K by 2020 for the GH6, they showed their 8K camera with organic sensor, but from what I've read, it's a power hungry sensor, so it doesn't look like the technology is quite ready for consumers cameras. Will the GH6 or G10 come with ToF AF? G10: higher MP count IBIS reliable continuous AF for sports high-speed and high-capacity buffer maybe dual-gain circuit if they can 4K 10-bit GH6: new 20-ish MP sensor dual-gain IBIS 240+fps slow-mo maybe 4K90p or 120p? 4K60p 10-bit internally reliable AF without hunting/pulsing in video S1H's hinge/fully articulated screen at least the same RAW recording as the S1H It seems like a reasonable list, the major doubts are the new sensors and ToF AF or PDAF, but if Panasonic can pull that off, they will be a pretty good pair for photo, video and hybrid shooters, enough to keep the Micro4/3 interesting without disrupting their S-series.

I think it's an interesting compromise. It's not like Leica was known for video and people had that kind of expectation anyway. When it was launched, Panasonic was not part of the L-Mount Alliance, but still, it kind of packed everything they were able to put in it regarding video-oriented feats - it was the only FF with 10-bit. Most people will still use it primarily for stills and not video, but the feats are there and in a better capacity than let's say, Sony A9 II - which was expected to pack everything for stills AND video, the Irony is that even Canon went all-in with their 1DX MKIII but Sony kind of turned into Canon... hahahaha... For Panasonic and Leica it's also a good deal because Panasonic saved their video feats for the S1 and, of course, the S1H, the S1R having a more limited video capabilities while the SL2 comes as a Leica version of the S1R but with all the video feats the S1R doesn't have, so in that sense, these 2 cameras are not overlapping each other, it's a some sort of win-win for them both. Leica is still able to offer video feats as a bonus and despite the SL2 and the S1R being very similar internally, they are different.

If they do it right, this camera could help Panasonic gain a lot of traction in the higher-end market and the timing is quite good since it doesn't look like Sony or Canon will be announcing any camera soon. But despite recent announcements from them, they also might be aiming Tokyo 2020 for their 8K cameras too, who knows. Edit: oh, after watching another interview, it's mainly for broadcast, so I don't know when they might use this sensor for a Varicam/Cinema solution

That's not really how you measure "focusing". Is Sony trying to grow and improve their APS-C cameras as they are doing with their FF? No, not even close. Did Sony release new weather-sealed versions of their old lenses or high-end cameras to pair with the expensive lenses? No, people are still waiting for the NEX-7's substitute - plenty of people asking for an A7000 out there... hahaha... Is Sony's APS-C system development comparable to Fuji's APS-C in the same timeline? Not really, even with Fuji releasing larger format sensor, they still have a pretty good line up for APS-C, the X-T30 being the latest. Fuji just needs to find a way to implement IBIS on more cameras and solve the heat problem so the cameras are not limited to 10 or 15 min in 4K. I think it's pretty fair to say Sony is NOT focusing on APS-C as they are on FF. Like I said, they are just making low-maintenance release just to show they are still there - and because it still selling well, I suppose. But it's not worth the R&D for a higher-end tier when they have FF for those people. With the rumors of the FX cameras coming soon, I doubt Sony will push new video feats in their A9II or the A7SIII. The original A9 was already weirdly crippled in video, historically Sony has been doing that for video, they save it for their video cameras, so I don't see why all of sudden they will change that. It would be a nice surprise, but it just seems unlikely. Despite the A7SIII being a more video-oriented camera, with the FX cameras coming, it doesn't feel like Sony will be sharing its video feats with the A7SIII and so far, there is no sign that the A7SIII will be coming anytime soon.

@BTM_Pix Thank you very much for your reply. I wasn't even sure if in-sensor was possible in an interchangeable lens system. From what I was able to understand, there are a lot of different ways to implement LIDAR technology and one of the things I've read is that one LIDAR can interfere with each other. Is that true for all implementations or just for some? Because it would be an issue to have interference if there are two or more cameras. From what I've read, you can use one device that emits the laser and then you could use a CMOS sensor as a receiver/detector, if so I wonder if this would be a good option for an interchangeable lens system. Does anyone know the difference between hybrid CDAF/PDAF and Dual-Pixel AF? Does Dual-Pixel AF suffers the same degradation/banding as hybrid CD/PD AF?

@BTM_Pix so how does it work for all the different focal length? You cross the data between what the camera knows about its lens and focal length with the data the LIDAR sensor gets? So as long as it's calibrated the LIDAR knows what the camera is looking at? Also, how does it work for continuous AF? It uses the camera's own algorithm to track? If you were to speculate over how Panasonic could implement ToF AF in their future camera, how do you think it would be the best way for them to do it? Is it even possible to make the normal camera sensor have some in-sensor LIDAR capability or does it have to be a completely separate sensor? If it has to be separate it would have to be implemented in a place that won't be easily obstructed, so probably near the EVF - like mounting on the hot shoe. But I wonder if it's possible to make it in a way that the LIDAR sensor can see the same as the main sensor/lens. Sorry for all the questions but I'm just trying to understand how does this work or what could be done by a manufacturer to make it even better. If they cross the data of the LIDAR with the lens data - like DFD does -, plus the data they get from AI regarding how to identify a subject, how to give priority to eye tracking - like Sony does -, if they combine all of that, they should get a pretty good AF.

I agree with what you are saying but I don't think it's that simple because that's not how majority of people will look at it when making the decision to buy it or not. Different people have different uses and Sony appeals for a wider public than Panasonic does. Videographers know about Panasonic, but until Panasonic can solve AF, it will be harder for them to be the best selling hybrid camera. Despite the DFD not being that bad as a photo AF, it still gets the bad rep. Even within videographers, Panasonic became a "niche" product because a lot of people now use video AF - since all of the other manufacturers offer at least a decent solution - without the micro back-and-forth DFD has and they are much smoother. With Sony basically focusing solely on FF, people that can't afford FF or want a more budget friendly solution might go Panasonic but now even Fuji offers a compelling camera for this market as well. Indeed Panasonic got much better in color - back from that yellow-orange-ish color rendition Panasonic used to have - and now it has a pretty natural and accurate color right off the bat. It got easier to grade and not having 10-bit, kills it for Sony - for those that need it. Regarding the image, Panasonic got so much better and offers much more than Sony does now. But that's not really making Panasonic outsell Sony and I'm pretty sure Panasonic didn't go FF just to keep their niche, they will need to solve the AF if they want to sustain 2 mounts and expand their brand like they say.

Regarding the A7SIII, there are a few things that I think it's highly unlikely that Sony will put on an Alpha camera and top the S1H. It feels like at least a couple of times Sony stepped back and went back to the drawing board for the A7SIII because of Panasonic - it should have been out there already. I'm pretty sure Sony is still debating if they should or should not put 10-bit 422. Can it record unlimited time? Will it overheat? Can Sony's IBIS match what Panasonic offers? Will it have a fully articulated screen? Can it output a full-size HDMI? Will it record RAW? Maybe Sony will finally use a 10-bit codec but I don't think they will offer unlimited time and better IBIS, a fully articulated screen? I'm not sure either. I don't think the A7SIII and the S1H will be aiming at the same market, Sony will probably excel the S1H in a few areas like AF, probably full-sensor readout speed and less rolling shutter, maybe a better high-ISO, slow motion and some other sensor-related-tech. The A7SIII will probably be a better A7SII with all the advancements Sony can put in this camera, but I highly doubt it will pack the same kind of feats Panasonic is doing with the S1H. There was a rumor about Panasonic working with time-of-flight distance AF, which is clearly Panasonic's major weakness compared to all other cameras when it comes to video. Sure, not everybody needs AF and a lot of people still prefers MF but it wouldn't hurt Panasonic if they could provide a comparable AF, at least one that it's there if you need. If Panasonic really implements a better AF, more L-mount lenses, it will be much harder for Sony to keep up with Panasonic if they don't step up in some other areas. So I don't think that Sony can compete with the S1H in its pros, same way the S1H won't appeal to the same type of crowd the A7SIII, even though the S1 is pretty well balanced all-arounder hybrid camera, until Panasonic figure AF out, a chunk of this market will still be Sony's. The full V-log implementation it's a very welcomed addition, I really like Varicam's color.

When Sony bought some stock shares from Olympus, didn't they become partners - at some level? With Olympus helping Sony developing lenses or something? Could that have played a role as of why Olympus didn't commit to the L-Alliance? I don't think they intend to be a Micro4/3 exclusive manufacturer - and I don't even know if they could sustain that - but I don't think Sony would be open for Olympus to develop their own E-mount camera, so the L-Alliance would be the better route and much better than developing their own system with a new mount. Sigma is offering mount swap for their FF lenses, which is great for people that are already invested in it, plus, they will sell their lenses with an L-mount. Not only they will benefit from that but consumers will benefit even more. The lack of fully articulated screen and PDAF are big question marks for Panasonic S cameras. The articulated screen might be due to the cables connection and the hinge of the articulated screen, but the lack of PDAF can't even be explained. Regardless of how invested they are in the DFD tech, I'm pretty sure they could manage to use PDAF, in the mean time since Dual Pixel showed up, all other manufacturers caught up to have better AF based on PD, Panasonic is the only odd one in the market. Sure, they can eventually come up with a reliable AF tracking for video with the AI DFD but during the GH5 development announcement, they talked like the AF was just as good as any other but that didn't pan out, so it becomes harder to buy whatever Panasonic is saying about the new AF.

If this is really a thing - which I think a lot of us have wondered before, why not do like Sony A7s and A7R? Low Light and More Pixels - I think a new and more powerful processor is indeed important since Tracking AF performed different when just outputting the signal through HDMI compared to tracking and recording in camera. Which means it was a bit of a bottle neck as it shouldn't have any difference in performance. Canon might have Dual AF but so does Samsung, even Google used in the Pixel 2. I don't know if Google has a patent of their own, but I'm pretty sure Samsung's is not the same as Canon's, so it's possible for other companies to have similar tech, so it wouldn't surprise me - even more if people will HAVE to pay the extra - if either Sony/Panasonic developed something similar or they are indeed paying for it. Low light was one of the topics people said the GH5 couldn't keep up with the competition, but video AF was something that even more people complained about. So I think it would make sense for them to try to step up their game, be if with the combination of PDAF and CDAF or something like Dual Pixel.

A couple of years ago I described what Sony could do to make a real PRO FF mirrorless. An A9 24MP FF E-mount, high frame rate burst with a bigger form factor, no overheating and bigger battery but I thought Sony would put an articulated screen and touch screen as well. That what made sense to go after Canikon and it seems that that's what they did. "One that could have around 24MP with fast readout that could do both 4K in Full Frame and 1:1 pixel 4K in APS-C/Super 35 mode. Not to mention great slow motion and burst frame rate." "The A9 will pack everything Sony can, the A7 family was just a study case and preparation because the plan was to make the A9 go against the big boys, Canon 1DX and Nikon D5 but doing so in a Sony fashion, full of big technological advancements." "I wonder how much will this A9 cost, maybe with the grip it will be at least $5000. Another interesting point is if Sony will pack advanced video feats in this camera." "There are two ways to look at the A9, one is that the A9 is a natural evolution of the A7 series but for me, I think that the A7 cameras existed so the A9 could exist. It’s like they used the A7 to fund the R&D of the A9, but they needed time and enough technological advancement to pull that off after the A-mount experience failed and also to make it worth announcing against Canikon’s big boys. I also think that this is why they haven’t made a bigger form factor for the A7 and I’ve said before, when I say bigger, I’m not saying DSLR-like, simply a bit bigger would do. Enough so overheating is no longer an issue and the camera doesn’t have any form factor compromise, for me, overheating has become a way to separate and justify bigger and more expensive cameras."

There is no option to bake LUT into the footage - for now. But hopefully if enough people ask for it, there will be. I've asked around and this is something some of the Lumix ambassadors were also talking with Panasonic. As far as I know for now, all you can do is to convert a LUT to Varicam .vlt and use it, the function is called V-log L View Assist and it only works in V-log L and although it would be very interesting if Panasonic could open that option for other picture profiles, I doubt they will. But the ability to select, preview and bake a LUT in-camera would be very useful and welcomed.

I asked Sean Robinson about it but his reply was a bunch of marketing mumble jumble that didn't even make sense, it seems they simply wanted the 4K, 6K and 8K progression, even though nobody actually cares about that. I even asked why don't they release a 5K video then instead of just open gate hi-res anamorphic or since the 6K Photo is a 10-bit 420, will the hi-res anamorphic be 10-bit 422. Or as H.264 doesn't support HLG HDR, so does it mean that when Panasonic releases the HLG firmware there will be H.265 4K 10-bit 422 files as well? But he didn't answer any of that. It seems that the EVF is basically the same as the Leica Q. The only other manufacturer that uses a 3.2" 1620k LCD screen is Canon, so it may be the same, who knows?