Leang

what is your system spec?

I am really getting tired of these stupid low light lighter tests.  i mean for true cinematography this is absolutely ridiculous.  I AM BEGGING TO SEE TESTS WITH SOME SAL 300 OR 500'S at 240fps!

I knew 7Eleven would step up their commercials!

what a great review.  besides the phase detection technology for the A series, just imagine practical fps shooting with cine lenses.  As I mentioned from the very beginning, overcranking is an art and can be used for so many fields.  so excited for this camera tbh.

that's no aliasing on the ceiling.  those are aliens going through the air ducts.  7 meters!

[quote author=Axel link=topic=657.msg4898#msg4898 date=1335792915] I have a film review from 1977 on [i]Star Wars[/i],Star Wars was the first of the openly stupid big blockbusters. Films that no longer offered an alternative to the collective conscience of TV (which Huxley portraied as Big Brother in [i]1984[/i]). There still is a lot to love about cinema, but it's roots have already been cut off. Let 48p come. Why not 480p? Why not 40k? Does all this matter at all? [/quote] well we all know Hollywood in what it ethnicity it favours...there was a conspiracy theory on how many theaters 20th Century Fox distributed globally, more than half not reported, and only focusing on the profit.  This is huge cultural politics!  There are insiders that Oliver Stone and Lucas did blow at an event which they discussed how certain executive producers were biased morons to anything powering American Jews in show business.  this makes sense.  If you look at the clothing of Jedi's and royalty it's no different than Paul Newman's outfits in Ben Hur or the females like the ''princesses.''  Think about it.  ımo Star Wars is more of a knock-off of Ben-Hur than anything Kurosawa all the way to the dialogue.  Lucas was a genius to introduce adapted plots and convince executives as to what the visual analogies would be and they would be, and then playing them like fools with rights he wanted soon after.  Look at the outfits of the generals and admirals from the Empire.  what WWII enemies do they resemble?  anyways the point is to understand why Star Wars was pushed to be the number 1 hit ala superb science fiction for the modern age of cinema.  20th Century Fox wanted to prove that.  all political bullshit if you ask me.  Oliver Stone wanted to use a black actor for his sequel to Wall Street and they said absolutely not.  go figure.  aside from the gear BOY is there a bigger picture to worry about!  lol Long live Marlon Brando. 

''we're not filmmakers, we want to promote & manufacturer barebone infrastructures for imagemakers.  kind of like science channel shows on nerds making robotic wars''

would be interesting if some hacking FPS manipulation profiles can be done with this cam similar to Panasonic's HPX line.  some cine lens tests are a must see.  I must admit the image stabilization still reacts nicely at high FPS seen on the speed boat shots.  not a fan of the nex glass but they obviously have to market it.  would like to have seen some zeiss vario zoomage.

[quote author=HurtinMinorKey link=topic=637.msg4792#msg4792 date=1335547276] [quote author=Leang link=topic=637.msg4765#msg4765 date=1335508558] btw don't bore me with David Fincher stories..  if you want to talk about real filmmakers from the heart then talk about Alejandro González Iñárritu and his DP Rodrigo Prieto - raw real world storytellers! not some facebook or redone euro tattoo movies because hollywood wants to make a profit..  boring scripts but there's a sucker born every minute [/quote] I was willing to give you the benefit of the doubt untill now, but you just outed yourself as a complete tool.  Rodrigo Prieto was the DP on Brokeback Mountain, which is the biggest cliche storyline ever. Even South-Park was making jokes about gay-cowboy movies 5 years before this movie came out.  He (Prieito) has never produced anything that approaches the beauty and storytelling of Fight Club.  He can have all the "heart" in the world, but he lacks the talent of the best. [/quote] wow.  just shows what you really know about the underground world of filmmaking and prestigious festivals.  Had you known anything about who I had mentioned like Alejandro González Iñárritu and HIS DP Rodrigo Prieto (who have worked together on storytelling trilogies) you would've at least had something of an opinion besides the fact that you went on some tangent about ''gay-cowboys'' and jokes.  It seems like you're trying to give a subtextual message that you don't like gays or something else.  To mention that DP's have no concept of visual storytelling is far right ridiculous.  ''he can have all the heart in the world, but lacks the talent of the best.''  what are you talking about?? 

[quote author=bwhitz link=topic=637.msg4753#msg4753 date=1335479368] [quote author=Leang link=topic=637.msg4733#msg4733 date=1335429414] this is amateur talk.  how can you say any of this?  sounds like a 14 year old just joining film school and not understanding film theory or the chemical aesthetics of film... [/quote] And this is this is pretentious film-hipster talk. I care about the motion characteristics of film and the aesthetics of the 35mm format. These are available digitally. Digital is also better for the speed of production and actors. Faster set-ups, more locations, actors can stay in character longer, ect. Nobody watching a movie gives two shits about the "chemical aesthetics of film". That is such an asinine point you have actually blown my mind with stupidity. Film theory has nothing to do with "film" in the literal sense of film stock. ...god that was such a stupid point. You sound like a brainwashed film-industry-obsessed lemming who thinks they're hot shit cause they shot a crappy short film about relationships and coffee shops on academy 16mm once in film school. Get over yourself. The only people threatened by digital are those who do crappy work and relied on expensive film-stock as a way of separating their derivative student films from others. Film still looks good, but so does Red, DSLRs, Alexa, and bla bla bla. Everything shoots film-looking footage now. Get used to it. Shooting on film is not going to make something better anymore. That era is OVER. There are filmmakers who want to tell stories and entertain an audience... and then there are film-makers who have self-esteem issues and just want to play with expensive gear to make themselves feel more important than others. You fall into the latter. [quote author=HurtinMinorKey link=topic=637.msg4740#msg4740 date=1335454589] So you think that David Fincher is an amateur? That being said, if we compare the same director (and same DP) using different camera's, I think you'd have to agree that Fight Club(Film) looked better than either The Social Network or Girl With the Dragon Tattoo (RED EPIC). [/quote] Yea, seriously... who calls somebody an amateur because they prefer the look of digital cinema over film? That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. But yea, honestly, I like the look of Dragon Tattoo and Social Network over Fight Club. I love how clean the blacks are. It's a clean modern look, but with the motion characteristics of film. [/quote] you guys are weird.  you like to yield details to your biased information and regurgitate the basic benefits of digital.  I never said anything against David Fincher nor did I say anything against DIGITAL!  maybe you feel embarrassed for what you said?  hopefully.  follow all my posts I'm not against digital at all nor against anything you're trying to portray.  I am against anybody that disrespects the basic tools of filmmaking which is a camera and the film.  you just can't go around and dismiss the essense of ''film'' by saying there's ''nothing magical about it.''  did you ever help create the elements for finer grain and detail in Fuji or Kodak stock?  digital camera technology has been trying to improve latitude and curve info so that it can be just like film besides the agenda for more resolution and detail and the medium for capture.  if you're trying to say that the future is digital then yeah we all agree.  but you can't just say there's nothing ''magical about film.''  there are some rules of respect for any club you join regardless of opinion.  btw don't bore me with David Fincher stories..  if you want to talk about real filmmakers from the heart then talk about Alejandro González Iñárritu and his DP Rodrigo Prieto - raw real world storytellers! not some facebook or redone euro tattoo movies because hollywood wants to make a profit..  boring scripts but there's a sucker born every minute

[quote author=bwhitz link=topic=637.msg4727#msg4727 date=1335420985] Can't tell if you're actually being serious or not. There is nothing that magical about film. It sounds like you're just glorifying it for the sake of glorifying it. Personally, I actually prefer Red's image to film. The Social Network and Dragon Tattoo are two of my favorite movies visually. To say that they're not cinematic looking is just crazy. [/quote] this is amateur talk.  how can you say any of this?  sounds like a 14 year old just joining film school and not understanding film theory or the chemical aesthetics of film...

[quote author=biginvegas link=topic=631.msg4647#msg4647 date=1335353927] [i]we go to the cinema to dream, not see things too clearly.[/i] Love that comment by the way. Andrew and y'all, you've all lost your minds. We are living in the cinema digital age generation, it has begun... this is  fun , I love reading about new technologies, latest camera and equipment designed to make that picture of yours just a little more cinematic but you have to jump into the deep end of filmmaking, sharks and all. Work with what you have and use the look from the specific camera and lens [i]you own[/i] to tell your story.  There is no Hollywood, broadcast bias or cabal  telling you your shit 'aint good enough because it was shot on a GH2.  They don't care, they want authenticity and courage from you. This film in Berlin last year was shot on a 7D, one lens, a monopod, crew of one, zero budget. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCBRhgic2Jw The filmmaker lives in Calcutta... My point is Andrew, can you use this unique platform of yours to mix it up just a little! [/quote] nasty B&W tones and some shots hightlight clipping.  they probably decided to go B&W because it was better than grading color.  simple music video DSLR techniques...  if it gets too easy like this then we should worry about the future of cinema criticism less the gear!  sorry I'm just judging by the framing for most of these shots

[quote author=Paul Watt link=topic=637.msg4683#msg4683 date=1335370859] So much vitriol from many who have not seen the clips, or any 48fps 3D.  Why all the hate?  So Peter Jackson took a risk and tried something different.  No-one's forcing anyone to make any aesthetic choices for future films.  Do whatever you like.  I find it a bit hypocritical that people criticize new technology when it's someone else pushing the envelope, then bemoan the fact that they can't get their hands similar technology at an affordable price. [/quote] best response so far.  lots of hypocrisy.  I remember when Lucas said the future was digital and even some movie brat filmmakers protested against the format.  look where we are today with cinema cameras.  some purist filmmakers stick to film for their own creative reasons.  it all becomes ironic.  Lucas imo is a true innovator in filmmaking.  If I'm not mistaken by interview but Cameron went into motion picture because Star Wars blew his mind away and wanted a piece of the 'action' as well. 

yeah but most of these fantasy tales are geared to the children masses.  just like all that Harry Potter shit that kids die for.  doesn't matter what format it is in.  this 3D fantasy is surely going to impress kids than their frequent tv programs, and it's not like the parents of these kids are going to complain or know jack about the stuff talked about in this forum.  i mean its 'the hobbit' who cares. however there are some dynamic styles that call for this new trend in 3D cinema.  scifi action works best imo.  I would love to have seen Black Hawk Down shot in 3D-4K-48fps to be honest!  the Video gaming industry is HUGE, and some gaming 3D rigs are insane with graphics.  60fps games are something special in the gaming world when you have a pimped out PC rig.  high resolution gaming graphics share a similar culture but in a more micro level. 

I just hope the GH3 handles low light and noise like never before with a newly improved Venus engine that can give similar compression to their AVC Pro line. with an amazing new sensor from Lumix even 8-bit 4:2:2 would be great.  Panasonic introduced their new Micro P2 line which imo seems like any SDXC with the Panny sticker.  obviously cards continue to push bandwidth and speeds.  duhh of course the SD format is cheaper to manufacture than existing P2 cards...that's literally their justification.  they should have rolled out Micro P2 earlier for the sake of the AF100 or at least make it AVC Intra100 like the rest of their high HPX line.  10-bit 4:2:2 would have been so nice for the AF100.  we should expect at least a compact varicam the same way Sony introduced their lower end CineAlta F3.  Panasonic better shape up their shit man seriously

[quote author=FilmMan link=topic=626.msg4593#msg4593 date=1335224511] Black Magic will have an effect on the big boys.  Did Red have an effect?  Here's some info: 1.  Number of hits on BM  plus 100K a while back.  That is a significant number. 2.  BM is an established company.  It isn't a start up. 3.  They understand workflow.  Look at their current business. 4.  Get in with the majority.  Grab a market niche that is in disarray. 5.  Product appears to be ahead of the curve (it could be competing with Red and C300 in picture quality- more info is needed, but that is the talk). 6.  Will this camera be the only one produced if it is successful?  Will they stand still?  Will they eventually offer 4k if needed?  I think most people know the answer.  So if they establish a good base, then they can grow with it. Look at what Canon did with the DSLR.  They are moving into the motion picture market now.  DSLR's had a huge effect on video camera sales.  Look at how the Canon Mark 5D2 change the playing field.  Now there exists BlackMagic.  It is still early but if they deliver then it could have a serious impact. Have large companies in the past, not only camera companies, lose market share when other competitors came to market?  Once you lose market share, then it could take years to recoup if at all.  These are different times.  The internet has changed the playing field. [/quote] BMD is taking over the world!!! there's no room for any type of competition!!!!  companies never steal competitive ideas!!  we're on a sensor outsourcing age!!  everybody hide! ... 

Workflow is a serious term in the industry.  You need to know what workflow you and your team decide on in order to get the best results and completion for the project.  For any project the motivation should be the content not the gear.  Everybody can acknowledge this.  Comparing these two cameras are like apples to oranges.  Might as well list every current trendy camera. Workflow and practicality go hand in hand.  If you can convince anybody that working in 12-bit RAW and grading is a breeze on your non high end grading monitor then go for it.  It's a fact that not everybody can work in these environments in post nor will have the patience to.  If you assume post pro houses share the same speed workflow like your indie room think again.  It's not a DSLR domain. As far as the FS700 workflow becomes a bit more universal with NXCAM.  later on upgrade to 4:4:4 RAW 4k recorder's a nice future plus as we wait for the stupid marketing wars of 4K televisions.  When major networks start broadcasting 4K as a standard I think this cam will be obsolete!  4K Home entertainment is going to be nice in the next couple of years if youre willing to invest.  4K Cinema in theatres is nice when you know the film was shot in 4K and understanding the workflow to make come to life.  Until then this cam is still badass with its overcranking which will suit every style of television programming.  Every now and then I enjoy wildlife cinematography or sports programs.  In general the Japanese pretty much make the protocol agenda for the future.  The talk of big brothers falling to new innovations such as BMD... I mean cmon.  To be totally honest I still want to invest in a couple of GH2s!  thanks to this site.

[quote author=garypayton link=topic=622.msg4543#msg4543 date=1335131780] and with SSDs you can live without Thunderbolt [/quote] Thunderbolt is a huge convenience transfer protocol.  not everybody is going to hot swap their SSD's and offload via SATA III to their mainboards.  for someone doing simple shooting and coming back to their studio with a days shoot of just one SSD can just plug their BMD cam via thunderbolt and transfer to their master backup.  transferring 200GB takes some time!  Thunderbolt is fast, and for those with new macs dont need to buy Thunderbolt cards. way faster than USB 3 or Express34.

[quote author=OverCranked link=topic=596.msg4492#msg4492 date=1335035281] You could almost anticipate the slomo shot coming at you in every Afganistan doc or the skateboard guy ... Oh - and the pun was intended with the profile title. LOL [/quote] I am glad more people focus on image quality.  separates real filmmakers from the wannabes.  any day and night would Michael Ballhaus favour an inspiring filmmaker with a dynamic shot using a Bolex @ 64fps over the many million DSLR users just framing subjects doing NOTHING and thinking they've made a masterpiece because their product has DOF of film. 

I think this all started with those miniature 2/3 CCD security cameras (with C type mounts) that standardized remote control software, and hackers realized they could recreate an interface.  people don't realize but there are many companies that specialize in sensor technology for many professional fields of imagery.  this has been around for a LONG time.  just because a sensor developing company markets '4K' doesn't necessarily mean you're going to get an image like an F65!  a sensor is nothing without the many other outsourced processors and mainboards.  this is the main reason to why products are expensive.  again, A SENSOR IS NOTHING WITHOUT SPECIALIZED PROCESSORS.  as geeky as it may sound, but just imagine computer engineering geeks talking about which future processors will make which sensor ''the best.'' cool links btw.

[quote author=Sara link=topic=596.msg4448#msg4448 date=1334945629] Is part of the reason thunderbolt is included is to monitor from laptops?  More and more laptops will have this connection.  Not portable but it is a very accurate and customizable and upgradable.  Laptop stands, even those connecting to a tripod are cheap. [/quote] thunderbolt is more aimed for transfer protocol.  as SSD's get bigger and better this protocol is perfect to offload 512GB to your master backup drives.  USB 3 or PCI Express 34 transfers atm can't compete with thunderbolt.  SSD dock stations via USB 3, express, etc... now seem a bit more redundant with these type of file size industry standards.  or connecting the offload to a 6 slot + workstation seems too physical.  I must admit BMD's method of marketing non proprietary SSD forms is the DIY of filmmaking.  :D

[quote author=christianhubbard link=topic=596.msg4438#msg4438 date=1334938168] It's about the story. You dont need a camera that does 240fps to tell a story. You can slow it down in post if the effect is NEEDED to tell the story. (which 95% of the time, it isn't) Does it sometimes enhance production value? yes. I love slow mo stuff. But when I need it, I'll be happy to rent out, because it isn't that often. [/quote] well to be honest I am not putting off BMD's cam.  I'm just saying 60p or 50p would have seemed standard.  If one is a fan of slow mo then we all know digital rendered slow mo of anything under 30fps is more of a ghosting spread effect even at small percentages.  twixtor's nice, but better when you have more frames to rock.  you have to shoot specific for a post effect under 30fps.  this is why I am just saying that the FS700 (and 4k ready) with 240fps at 1080p is going to be great.  and who knows what Sony's markup will be now that BMD is around with their new cam.  please believe that I'm not an avid Sony fan.  I am just hopeful that a firmware update to at least 60fps will be available for BMD.  just because it's $3k doesn't warrant it the next best thing for serious all around cinematography when the client demands it.  also I'm not too fond of this Fisher Price aesthetic too.  :(  however, it doesn't mean I'll not consider buying it because of general image quality.  but let's be realistic about ''filmmaking'' in regards to elite festivals.  image isn't everything.

[quote author=christianhubbard link=topic=596.msg4428#msg4428 date=1334928799] If you think you need slow mo (which you probably don't, no one really does) [/quote] a little toooo bold there... you should really rethink cinematography.  I guess this all depends on your subjectivity of filmmaking. 

this camera is too overhyped imo.  24, 25, or 30p is not sufficient enough for filmmaking.  overcranking is something unique in telling a shot (from the story) or for sports enthusiasts.  I was watching the Patriot just a couple of days ago and the overcranking done in the film is really well done.  right away I was thinking of the FS700 because to me FULL HD 1080p is good enough.  I think the FS700 is really going to shine in all directions.  60 or 50p is a bonus for post slow mo digital effects for whatever NLE you're rocking.  maybe they can revise the firmware before release and implement 60 or 50p the same way Sony and Panasonic are doing atm.  notice atm!

I knew Fisher Price would step up their game and co-produce!