Bruno

Andrew, since you own both the BMCC and the 5D3, it would be nice to know what you think their place is when compared to each other. Assuming you need a hard drive and a battery pack for the BMCC, they're kind of close in price, so what are the advantages and disadvantages you see on these two affordable raw shooting cameras? When would you choose one and when would you choose the other?

I understand people being upset with the delays, but saying the camera can't do what it says in the box is another thing, that would be quite serious, and most would probably just get a refund, I don't see them trying to sneak that one without a big explanation. SD cards speed is not a problem with 1080p 2:1 compressed raw. They'd need roughly 50mbps, latest toshiba cards can do 240!

According to Grant's e-mail the Pocket cameras are shipping, surely you could wait a couple days for the first reviews before assuming it can't do what's on the specs list. Could even save the non believers some embarrassment.

  I did say that, and they probably wouldn't be annoyed at all, some BMD users would probably even make fun of Canon users. Also, I wasn't just saying it, I do think their C line-up should have the prices cut to half, then they would probably make some sense.

  If they're bought it doesn't mean it's the end of BMD, and they've been doing just fine even before they had cameras on their product line-up, so I don't see why they'd go broke just like that, especially when offering products in such high demand.   Also, even if they did, it's not like all existing cameras would suddenly stop working, is it? How many thousands of films have been shot on long discontinued film cameras?

I can totally appreciate how that sucks for those people, I wouldn't be happy for wasting $1000 just like that if it happened to me, and I always defend that companies should have ways to compensate recent buyers when they do something like this, even if they split the difference, I believe a $500 voucher would have been a good solution in this case.   However, regardless of how much this may suck for early adopters, this is indeed a good thing for the industry and the indie community, which in the long run will be a good thing for these same early adopters.   So am I still a lost cause? :)

I remember when the MFT mount was first announced, someone from BMD said it was a passive mount that could maybe become active in a future upgrade. Does anyone here have an MFT mount camera? Does it come with the electronic components that would allow for this to be added later on?

I wonder if the people pissed off because of the price drop would also be pissed off if Canon dropped their C cameras to half the price.

Many stereo rigs use the SI2K cameras since they're small, some rigs even have them mounted side by side with smaller lenses. These cameras are probably not cheap though, even though they're quite old by now.

I think the price was too close to the 4K camera...   The 4k camera offers not only increased resolution, but also a s35 sensor size (very welcome) and compressed raw (much more manageable files), two serious downsides to the original camera, so I guess that with price tags of $3k vs $4k, the "old" camera would not seem that appealing anymore. The new price tag separates it into a different segment and now the 3 different models all have their own place in the market. Definitely $2k is a great price, even $2500 would have been great!   For owners bitching about the price drop, they need to know this is what happens, it's how it goes! People keep complaining that camera makers are not giving them all they could, keeping features out and inflating prices with tiny updates, but when someone has the balls to make a price cut like this and actually offer the technology as cheap as they possibly can, then their own personal interests come up and they quickly point the finger and feel ripped off. It's evolution, deal with it!   I also don't think this affects the Pocket camera, I never saw them as competing products, if anything, the pocket camera is still a better choice, as the sensor size matches the mount better, you can use 16mm glass, you get an active mount and you get compressed raw.   Now they just need to add compressed raw to the BMCC. (Audio levels on ALL camera models would be great too, but it seems to be asking for too much, they'll probably release a 6k camera for $500 before that happens :)  )

This is a good move. When the 2 new cameras were announced I said here that the original BMCC wouldn't make sense anymore unless they brought the price down, looks like they agree on that. It the pocket cameras are indeed shipping, all the fuss was a bit exaggerated! Even regarding the 4k camera, 3-4 weeks doesn't look like such a serious delay.

  Check out the testimonials section, it looks like it does work on OSX.   However, check the FAQ too: "The GPU must be supported by the Operating System AND have a compatible Thunderbolt Driver."   I think it's way overpriced though, if this becomes popular I don't see why it should cost more that $100-200.

They don't really ever promote using third party accessories right off the bat, they want to promote their products as self contained computers, but people have always used external hardware with any computer, the point is, as long as you're buying their computers, I don't think they will have a problem what you're plugging them into. Why is it different than a hard drive? All macs come with a hard drive, it doesn't mean they don't like you plugging in an external bigger hard drive.

  I don't think they would care at all. A macbook air with a huge external device like this attached to it is hardly a serious competitor to a macbook pro, not if you're looking for a portable solution. They even promoted this kind of upgrades when they introduced the thunderbolt ports, the only reason you don't see more of them in the market already and much cheaper is because there's not much demand yet.

And another one I had posted in the new Mac Pro thread:   http://www.magma.com/expressbox-3t

It sounds like you don't like these BMD cameras, which is odd to say the least, since no one really knows how well they perform yet. :)   Complaining about their lateness is one thing, but bitching about the quality of cameras that no one has really tested yet makes you lose some credibility and look biased.   Anyway, why don't people just move along? Too offended to wait? Get something else, don't waste even more time trying to convince people who think differently how wrong they are. That's why diversity of offers is good, there will never be this ONE camera that will end them all.

[quote name="peederj" post="39391" timestamp="1374888939"The Heroic Pro Cinematographer that we're supposed to emulate saying the sensor on the new 4K camera sucks is devastating publicity.  [/quote] If a $4k super 35 global shutter 4k compressed raw/prores camera sucks because it only does 12 stops, I wish more cameras would suck!

The thing Is not any company can pull it off like Apple does, they've gotten products manufactured and delivered at stores that no one had even imagined they were working on, let alone produced and delivered. Anyway, even without the secrecy and rumors running around, no one would be pointing them the finger if they hadn't made an announcement.

I think the main question in the air is "are they being naive or are they being deceitful?". That's what no one seems to be sure of, but whatever the answer is, they need to change their ways, maybe be more vague with release dates and say a trimester instead of a month, especially when announcing products so early on. Or learn with the big guys and don't announce anything at all, it's out when it's out.   But there's another important point, I doubt anyone here would be questioning these (apparently) 2 week delay (for the BMPCC) and 1 month delay (BMPC), or making a huge fuss out of it if they haven't had problems with their first camera, so I'd rather give them the benefit of the doubt and see how they do. If by September they have both cameras shipping I don't see it as a big deal at all and I'd say they managed to do it right this time.

I think the Tokina 11-16mm works on the 5D as long as you just use it as a 16mm lens.

"A Legendary 19th Century Lens. Reinvented For Use With All Nikon F & Canon EF Mount Analog & Digital SLR Cameras."   http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/lomography/the-lomography-petzval-portrait-lens  

If you don't like the RX100 mark II you can always get an RX100 mark I with a wooden handle for $2k. http://www.hasselblad-stellar.com It's the redefinition of ridiculous...

Have you even read what I wrote? Personally I think it's a good thing you're not doing what they are doing, but why keep bringing them up? They're living in their small little world, it seems to work for them, I don't want anything to do with it though, as I don't think it has anything to do with indie filmmaking ot any kind of filmmaking at all really, but can't you just ignore them? And seriously, interrupting your daily filmmaking work to reply to what you think is an idiotic comment is quite idiotic to say the least.

Andrew, it looks like you resent not being seen by the DSLR community in the same way Bloom & Company are seen, it looks like you resent not being sent cameras to review and having to wait and buy them like everybody else, but you know you have to play their game if you wanna get that, you can't talk shit of most makers and cameras for one reason or another and then expect them to treat you as just another publicity venue, which is what the other DSLR bloggers are for them. There's nothing wrong with not playing their game and speaking your mind, but you can't have both, so if you decide to be a free spirit and not play the game those guys play, then you need to stop bringing this up constantly, you're giving it too much importance and showing inferiority, let them be in their own little world and you just focus on yours, whatever it is, because the fact is you can't have it both ways.

I understand you'd do pre-orders, you run a camera website, you have all interest in posting reviews as soon as possible, but for everyone else, I don't think anyone gains anything with pre-orders. If pre-orders were placed with Blackmagic Design directly (in this case), it would be a different case, but with resellers you never know, the reseller next door might not do pre-orders and have them in store way earlier than you get yours. It's happening now, some people are still waiting for their BMCCs while B&H has them in store.