jonpais

?

A five-week class with a professional cameraman for $600.00 would be money better spent than on all this gear.

I'm sure if you asked him, Tom would try to explain. I thought you had the GX80/85? Then why do you seem so gleeful that the G80/85 does (or doesn't) meet your expectations? Why do you keep posting here if you dislike the camera so much?

According to Tom's tests, the a6300 has twice the dynamic range of the GH4. Why do you think he didn't reach for the Sony instead of the lowly Panasonic to shoot this episode? Because professionals choose their equipment based on many factors, not just test charts. What lenses you use; your skill as a photographer; and your editing and color grading ability are going to make more of a difference in the end than these test charts. Kendy Ty could do more with a $400.00 Rebel T3i than you or I could do with an Alexa.

As Tom Antos says, "It really comes down to your skills as a photographer. All of these cameras can be used by serious filmmakers." The camera they used for their discussion at the beginning and end of the 'shootout' was a GH4. The Lumix G85 could have been intercut seamlessly with that footage and nobody would be able to tell the difference.

What focal length do you usually use? The 12-35mm f/2.8 is fine for the purposes you mention.

Ten stops is an excellent result, especially for a camera that cost me only $725.00 USD. It is similar to the GH4 and around the same as an Ursa Mini 4K costing $3,500.00. There are other factors aside from dynamic range to consider when purchasing a camera, such as usability (ergonomics, EVF, stabilizer, etc.), reliability, ecosystem (compatible lenses), image quality (WB, skin tones, color reproduction, etc.) as well as cost. If I'm going to shoot out on the street, I know which camera I'll be taking with me: the G85. Because with the GH4, I'll have to bring along a tripod, a gimbal or a monopod just to keep it from shaking. Any one of the cameras Tom tests can yield excellent results in the right hands. If you're vlogging or producing content for the Internet, you're probably not going to reach for an Ursa Mini.

@Cary Knoop Those are ND filters he uses for the chart. They are not perfect gray or perfect black. Each camera Tom uses reproduces the colors differently. Different lenses also have different color reproduction. That is what color correction is for.

@Vesku And I've shared half a dozen lens and camera tests here with the GH4, and what I'm seeing from the G85 is cleaner shadows, improved color, better skin tones, more accurate white balance, the first EVF from Panasonic that I'd call great (I've owned the GM1, the GH3, the GH4, the TMC-900 and the G85), all at a rock-bottom price. IBIS alone is worth the upgrade. The G85 is the perfect vlogging camera. Cinematic look involves much more than dynamic range. If you're primarily interested in shooting candles and fireworks, maybe the micro four thirds system isn't for you. For extreme low light, I'd go with full-frame or an APS-C sensor. The G85 isn't going to make the grade if you're shooting at ISO 3200 all the time. The X-T2 isn't a low-light beast either, but it can take you to ISO 6400. The thing is, if you just shoot dark gray walls with it at ISO 6400, it will look pretty awful - but if you're shooting interesting action with people, nature, whatever, you hardly notice the noise. Professional colorists use tools like Neat Video all the time to clean up noise and throw in some film grain in afterward. And this is speaking as someone who was about to give up entirely on Panasonic and stick with Fuji.

@Vesku The G85 does not clip highlights more. Is greater dynamic range what's holding you back from creating your masterpiece? All you seem interested in is tests.

Dynamic range is on par with the GH4. Why do you go on week after week asking these nagging questions? What's your point? Do you have any footage you'd like to share?

Cool. Maybe someone had messed with the calibration on the floor model of the MBPr I was using. I think I'd go psychotic if all my videos look like that when I get my new Mac in a few weeks. Apparently, nobody in Vietnam uses peripherals with their Macs. I visited two authorized resellers this afternoon, and hardly any dongles at all, except for chargers and hundreds upon hundreds of USB-C to USB cables, in a myriad of colors. And one tiny dock called Le Touch with two USB ports, a USB-C port and a card reader for around $40, but it looks like something you'd find in a dollar store back home, so I didn't pick it up. Crazy town!

I meet a lot of folks here who are still fond of their 10 year-old Canon EOS 30Ds with 2GB memory cards as large as a credit card. ? Panasonic owners are kind of a cult - I know of only two filmmakers here who shoot with a Lumix. Every day, people ask why I don't shoot with Canon. And when they show me the jpegs they've just shot, they're always overexposed with a strong bluish cast. ?? It's not that the GH4 is bad, it's just that the G85 is that much better for what I do, which is accosting strangers on the street and stealing their souls. With the GH4, I felt as if it was more difficult to peer into their consciences; I think there is something about the vibrations emitted by the IBIS that helps break down their defenses, enabling me to capture their true likeness that they take such pains to conceal from the world.

I'll have a look-see this evening. A touch off-topic, but... The other night, I was showing my G85 field test video to a buddy on his Galaxy, and it looked like I'd shot everything in vivid. I wasn't at all surprised, since I already knew the default setting on Samsung phones makes everything look radioactive. Then, this afternoon, I watched the same video again on one of the new touch bar MacBook Pros, and it was even worse - the footage looked like an XT2 on steroids. Where faces that were slightly orange in the clip on my 2013 MBPr 15" and 27" iMac, the people looked like their skin was on fire, bright pomegranate. And the contrast - I almost always shoot in the shade, with contrast turned way down, but the same video was snappy as hell in the showroom. I was going to test out my Voigtlander with the G85 this afternoon, but I felt so sick after seeing those nauseating colors, I just went home. Do my clips look like vomit on your monitors, too?

@webrunner5 Maybe you'll get your wish, but I'm not expecting any miracles when it comes to dynamic range.

Just like frame rates, 10 bit vs 8 bit is no magic number. Some camera's high frame rate results are better than others, and some manufacturer's implementation of 10 bit will be different as well. Not many of us are expert colorists, either. Secondly, unless you are pushing the color around to extremes, 8 bit can hold up very well. I try to get white balance in camera as close as I possibly can, then do mild color correction and perhaps throw on a LUT, and I've never run into banding or artifact issues, and nobody has ever said, gee, Jon, it looks okay, but too bad you didn't record 10 bit. Here and here is more about 8 bit vs 10 bit.

From what little I've seen, Sony's Slog on the A7R II looks crisper, Panasonic's Vlog looks like it retains more information in the highlights. For those who shoot log, it would be great if Lumix users could get great looking 10 bit Vlog straight out of the camera. Guess we'll find out shortly.

The G85 has less noise than the GH4, images are cleaner. Skin tones are still unmistakably Panasonic, but improved over the aging GH4. I struggled for years to get good color from my many Panasonic cameras, the G85 looks from my first outing like it will be significantly easier to get WB correct. In fact, the best colors I've seen with the GH4 have been with V-log, but why should I go through that hassle? User interface: menus are pretty much the same - if you've ever handled Panasonic cameras before, the menu will be familiar, and is a breeze to navigate. Ergonomics: the G85 is more compact, but has a nice grip; it is very solid feeling; the layout and feel of the dials, buttons and wheels is improved; Panasonic may not make very pretty cameras, but they're reliable. Battery life: one battery with the G85 lasted me an entire morning of shooting. The EVF is gorgeous, especially coming from the GH4 - it's large and bright, and it is possible to see the entire frame with glasses on. GH4 EVF - not so wonderful. Stabilization - with the G85, you can just pick the camera up and begin shooting without a rig, impossible for me to do with the GH4. Files: the G85 shoots MP4, the GH4 shoots MOV. No difference when importing to Final Cut, you can import and begin editing immediately, or transcode if you like. From all the stuff I'd seen and read here in the forums, I really half-expected the images from the G85 to be grossly over-sharpened, with hideously aggressive noise reduction, clipped highlights and crushed blacks. In fact, if that turned out to be the case, I was even prepared to sell off all my u43 lenses and cameras and stick with my Fuji X-T2. Thankfully, that wasn't the case, and I plan to use both systems. If cost is a factor, B&H is selling an open box G80 for $780.00 USD.

I've been shooting people on the street here for nearly five years now and seldom run into any problems. South Korea, where I lived before moving to Vietnam, was a different story. I had to shoot stealthily with a telephoto lens. ? I own both the G85 and the GH4, and I would strongly recommend avoiding the latter. And I am trying to sell mine! ???

Thanks, i'll check it out.

I will need at least 6 different cables, adapters, dongles or a dock and a few less cables, which could be expensive, depending on the brand. I ordered a MBPr one month ago, it should arrive within the next month, but I won't be able to do anything with it if I can't find the connectors I need. The problem is, none of that stuff (except the USB-C to micro USB cable) is even available in Vietnam. And neither the Apple Store, B&H or Amazon will ship genuine Apple peripherals to Vietnam. Oh, and the Authorized Reseller where I ordered my Mac? The only cable they currently carry is the lightning to USB-C.

Thanks! No, I haven't got the EOSHD profile yet.

@liork Will do. It's the rear screen that is inaccurate. Here's a bunch of clips of my first outing with the G85. First impressions: the handling and image quality are hands down superior to the GH4. Skin tones are markedly improved, and the layout of the dials, buttons and wheels is more convenient, such as having the play button on the right side rather than on the left. The EVF is bright and beautiful, but the flippy rear screen looks about the same as before to my eyes. I have little doubt that the G85 is the best mirrorless 4K for the money today.

So I'm noticing that when WB looks good in the EVF, it looks reddish in the LCD. Maybe somebody already brought this up?

The Sigma will be far better, and instead of f/2.8, you're getting closer to f/1.2 or something. And from what I've shot, even wide open, the Sigma has very acceptable sharpness. Sigma has much better build quality than the made in China 12-35mm. You'll be able to get great bokeh. You asked about Canon glass and a speed booster, but you don't say why, or how you'll be using it, so it is impossible to give any recommendation. If you plan on doing a lot of traveling, the Sigma is heavy as hell. The 12-35 would be the way to go if you plan on flying the camera on a gimbal. If autofocus is important to you, you would be better off sticking with native glass. Finally, there's the expense. With a Metabones, you're looking at around $1,500.00 USD or so. The 12-35 must be going for around half that.