Cinegain

I don't just have one camera, I have multiple that each serve their own purpose. So... a while ago I'd pick up the E-M1 for stills and GH4 for video. BMPCC for that lushed filmic look. FZ1000 for traveling and the LX100 for silly stuff around the house or just to throw it in a bag or coat pocket. Now the move, for me personally is, to have both GH5S and G9. One for production style video shooting and the other for stills. And absolutely, it's looking mighty good! Gorgeous IMAX-like EVF, top LCD, you can top-up the battery on the go through USB, up to 6.5 stops of stabilization and improved processing compared to the GH5, with better tonality and such. For that you do lose out on some recording length and other high-end video features, but if you are not too bummed about that, it will probably serve you well for both stills and video.

You mean, like... I'll be informing the authorities about this!

You mean... that flexible zoomrange making you give up quite a bit of shallow depth of field possibility? Well yeah... Neways. As I'm wandering around I'm reminded of some previous things I've been keeping an eye on over the years. Like, before MFT there was FT. And there was for example the Panasonic Leica D Vario-Elmarit 14-50mm f/2.8-3.5 and I remember having seen the very pro and expensive SWD line-up by Olympus which was supposedly better. Now... I just noticed that the 14-35mm f/2.0 SWD is for sale at Park Cameras for around a thousand bucks, whilst everywhere else it's over 2000! Does anyone know if this would be a gem to use in 2018... or does it not make sense at all. From what I remember from previous research, forummembers were going crazy for these (like, way back in the day though). Believe they don't do automatic lens correction for jpeg (distortion, chromatic abberation correction). You could do that in post if the lens profile is availlable (or manually) in your editing/developing software.

Hum, now with the GH5S being that good at higher ISOs... the Olympus ED 12-100mm f/4.0 IS PRO suddenly has gotten more interesting. I wonder if the IS works on Panasonic bodies... - seems that way! Noice. A sudden gem with that MF de-clutch as well.

For me... after years of shooting the GH2, the GH4, the GH5... there's finally a worthy upgrade. I kept on saying: 'the GH5 and E-M1 Mark II are trully remarkable cameras... I just wish they had an APS-C sensor inside for the one reason that the 4/3" sensor has always been tricky regarding dynamic range, lowlight high ISO performance and color' (although color has greatly been improved in cameras that came out after the GH4). Back in the day I went with the GH2, one of the reasons was that it shot great video AND had dedicated compact lenses native to the sensor size, which made the overall system really compact. With that being a priority for me FF is out of the question. The two most interesting mirrorless APS-C systems are by Sony and Fujifilm. But Sony have showed no interest in releasing any more compact lenses native to the APS-C sensor size... and keeping the body itself compact I think is the wrong concession as it only leads to issues. I'd then be leaning more towards Fujifilm, but they've been rather traditional in the past and only have been making progress regarding innovation and video more recently. Still think the X-T2 is not quite there yet, but possibly a X-H1 that's rumored would. So, no FF and no mirrorless APS-C quite yet for me. Another option would be getting a cinema or production camera that instead of thin brittle footage gives you thick pushable material to work with. Problem is, aside from the JVC GY-LS300 is that if you're invested in the MFT system, your lens collection is basically rendered useless. And once you add all the options, accessoires, powersupplies and storage needed to operate a true cinema or production camera, be it a EVA1, VariCam LT, Blackmagic URSA Mini, Sony FS, Canon Cinema EOS, Kinefinity Terra, RED, ARRI, etc, you're looking at spending a 5 figures amount! That's not a very friendly 'up' from the GH-range. Plus, again, it's a different ecosystem, so you'd also need to get a new lens line-up. And if you'll still be using MFT lenses for their compact size with MFT bodies for stills, you can't exactly switch out one lens for another, theferefor are spending even more! Now, with the GH5S, I'm finally getting that performance I felt was lacking in the previous cameras. Not that you couldn't make it work, but it was just very restrictive and indeed some shots you just couldn't pull of perfectly because of it. You are getting that lowlight high ISO performance finally, and how! I'd never think I'd see that in a 4/3" sensor anytime soon (atleast not until the implementation of the now still early stage organic sensor tech with rich colors, high sensitivity low noise performance, loads of dynamic range and global shutter implementation). I think dynamic range went somewhat into the shadows, mostly into the highlights. You can really see into the shadows now, especially thanks to the better ISO performance. The highlights don't clip so harsh at a certain point, but roll off smoothly. Of course, you didn't really see any of that in Kai's video, because he was shooting V-Log L in a very low contrast scene... *rolls eyes*. Overall I think it just holds up really well. And another thing that's greatly improved is color. So really, I do not have to look at APS-C mirrorless systems or cinema/production cameras anymore if I have the GH5S. Lack of sensor stabilization. Well yeah, of course it's always nice to have, but we started out shooting with the 5DmkII, GH2, GH4, BMPCC, A7S and to this date still many, mostly traditional DSLR, other cameras and it was no different then. It still isn't if you're rocking a Samsung NX1, Fujifilm X-T2, Canon 5DmkIV, 1D C or 1DX mk II, Nikon anything or high end cinema camera. And we've all seen the reasons for why this feature might have/has been omitted from this release. The lack of any good C-AF... listen, that's not something new with Panasonics either. And until they address that, as they've addressed the sensor performance right now with new technical advancements, that's not going to change any time soon. And again, take these cameras mentioned earlier, we've all been there already and we made it work. It's just that simple. We wanted to shoot like industry professionals and now we can. We stabilize our cameras ourselves and direct the focus with intention by focus pulling one way or another and not relying on C-AF. Plus, if you get into commercial video production and start to land bigger fish, you can put a high-end cinema camera in the rental budget and you'd have already come to terms with the areas of stabilization and focus. To me... it's a great option to have. And I see it as an 'up' from the current line-up for someone that wants better performance, but wants an up that's also in the financial whereabouts of their previous camera. Getting into new ecosystems, especially if you're sticking to MFT for stills in a compact fashion, could turn out rather expensive. And this GH5S will only set you back 500 bucks more than the GH5 launched for. Coincidentally you might rock the Lumix G9 next to it for stills capture and providing you with still quite nice video features and most of all with in-body stabilization. That should have your bases covered. You should really regard the GH5S as the GH-range up for cinematographers. If people comment with 'No IBIS, no buy' or 'Fail!', I think they fail to see this camera is just not aimed at them. They should wait for a possible GH5V, a Casey Neistat signature edition vlogger's camera with Canon licenced DualPixel AF and 6.5 stops of body image stabilization or move over to something else completely. Casey did. He now rocks the 6DmkII. Which btw is a camera without sensor stabilization, just sayin'...

The gents over at Extrashot seemed to really like the 1080p overall. Probably because it might downsample better than the GH5. The 240fps slowmo looked really good. You would get moiré if you'd shoot that way with a brick wall in the background however. They've also tested C-AF btw, and it's still a bit half-assed. And it will remain that way until they change up their approach and incorporate new tech in that area I'm afraid. Yeah, I remember people were afraid for this in combination with anamorphic lenses. Where you wouldn't want the sensor to 'roll' on you, because it would skew the anamorphic effect. Also, if you have a lens with noticable vignetting, you'd see it shift. Then there's all the other reasons people have mentioned. Partly operating noise that can be picked up by mics. Issues with heat dissipation. Sensor access for effective data pulling and what the industry pro's were saying is that with shaky cars, explosion shockwaves, etc, the free floating sensor would pick up vibration without being able to cancel it out, which wasn't the case when they'd cram a GH4 in tight or risky spots. It's also been stuck in the old GH5 body, so there wasn't really a way to incorporate it. And even if they would be able to with a GH6... some industry pros apparently simply wouldn't want it period.

But hey... while they're at diversifying they might as well release a GH5V for the vlogging community with Canon's licenced DualPixel AF & the G9's 6.5 stops of stabilization.

They... probably need it to look 'good' for people that just bought a Panasonic 4K HDR television that's loaded up with factory overdone settings..?

Yeah, before the GH5 was even announced I was already hoping they'd make a stills focused GH5 and then a cinema range one called VC5 (VariCam5). I guess instead they released the hybrid GH5, then the stills GH5: G9 and now the GH5S. Bit weird. But ok. True. True. (Just personally I don't care for fullframe or getting into another ecosystem (lenses)).

I mean, the GH4 had it... with the YAGH brick thingamajig. Didn't the E-M1/5 Mark II have something along the lines of timecode as well?

I'd go and say it's actually more of a stills feature (to go low shutterspeed without camerashake effects). But I nontheless agree. However, this isn't your ordinary mirrorless camera. It might not be a pocket or a micro, but it sorta is a compact cinema camera. Something we haven't seen in the Panasonic line-up. Something to finally gap the bridge between the GH range itself (and preserving your MFT ecosystem) and their VariCam line-up as well as a Blackmagic, RED, Sony FS, Canon C, etc camera that will set you back thousands of bucks! For that it doesn't actually do any uncompressed stuff, but alas.

Well, this would be just that. I mean, not quite. But I didn't think you were able to pull off DR and lowlight high ISO performance with a 4/3" sensor. But the general idea of a fairly compact standalone cinema camera it is. Of course, it's in now such body with such-like specs. So it's still more like the BMPCC that came to market more resonably priced than we expected for what it stood for. And lacks IBIS... well, I kinda took that into consideration as well of course. Dunno, I would be quite happy, personally. Now I just want to see footage!! C'mon already!

Depends what that would mean to ya. For you that might mean ProRes and Raw. For me it would be having a 'pocket cinema camera'... well replace 'pocket' with 'fairly compact'. Just an all-in-one handheld device that shoots filmic footage. I'd be happy with any image that doesn't have 'video' written as much over it like Panasonics might have in the past and has some more cinematic properties to it. Now we get different flavors of LOG footage with some bit-depth and bitrate to it. If that is combined with a huge dynamic range (most challenging bit with previous 4/3" cameras) and pleasant highlight roll-off... in a wayyyyyyy more practical and usable body than the BMPCC. Then by all means to me that means it's a worthy successor. And it would have huge advantages because it is more practical: just think of ergonomics, battery life, vari-angle screen, EVF, interface, HFR, exposure and focus aids and overlays, etc.

In that case...

Depends though. If you do like the more advanced video features (where the G9 doesn't cut it for ya), but you don't shoot in a cinema camera way (studio/set style set-ups, tripod, dolly, rigs, gimbals), but more handheld, then it's still the one. I really regard the GH5S possibly being the true follow up of the BMPCC.

That was my idea going into this. Basically makes the GH5 obsolete. No need for a hybrid when you can have one dedicated stills cam that shoots video rather well and to have a dedicated more cinema-like camera for shooting the way we used to do with the 5DmkII, T2i/550D, GH2, BMPCC etc. Emulating the approach of a cinema camera, but with a compact, relatively affordable consumer (easy to operate) camera. So... now I have the GH5 and G9, then I'll ditch the GH5 for the GH5S.

@jonpais It is why they left out V-Log L with the GH5 and shipping it with the GH5S though. Still more in the hybrid space... it was released before there was a true split in flagships (if they had that 100% figured out before... not sure). That's why we think the GH5 might not make the most sense anymore with both G9 and GH5S around. Although, non of these are really from their 'pro' departments. Sony has the CineAlta and Broadcast & Pro A/V space, Panasonic VariCam and non-Lumix broadcast/pro A/V cameras, Canon the EOS Cinema range and X-series broadcast/pro A/V line-up, etc. As this is Lumix... it's still predominantly coming from their consumer line-up. Not to say they don't serve the pro video market, it just doesn't necessarily come from that department alone. -- regarding lack of IBIS, that actually was one of the first things that came to mind when we were talking about a possible successor to the GH5 that was more hardcore a couple of months ago. I kinda was put on that train of thought after having seen Luke use a tripod dolly to get the shot and sorta put it together with the hardcore minded BMPCC and other cinema cameras that lack sensor stabilization and earlier reports that a free floating sensor would generate heat and data access issues for the most efficient data pulling, which I thought this might be all about. Still curious to find out now how many stops of DR it will have and how good it really is in lowlight, as I said, I'm not expecting anything good above ISO6400 and am only expecting a jump in improvement like we've seen GH5 VS GH4. Of course, new lowlight optimized sensor tech (dual native ISO especially) and the low megapixel count (yet the A7RII VS A7SII regarding lowlight... it's not really that much of an advantage to go less pixels) might make a significant difference, so we'll see. Kinda curious about the external output as well. I was sorta expecting something in terms of data management and compression to heavily been effected, perhaps even internally. Oh well, a few more hours. :D

Fuji always has nice color, just, they've never really been into video that much and have only realized highlighting that now as well, so they're a little behind. No sensor stabilization either, whilst the others have implemented that already. Sony usually needs the most tweaking in-camera and in post regarding color and otherwise has those mentioned issues. Panasonic has come quite the way over the years. After the GH4 we've seen the G7 and others that were actually very pleasing, the G9 gets lots of love in the first reviews, but the GH5 is sorta around that level, has better high-end vid features. Would definitely wait for this GH5S announcement tomorrow, though, could be a cinematic beast!

Yeah, there you might find golden stuff like Zach Goodwin and his T2i adventures back as well.

Olympus 17.5mm f/1.2 These darn sweetspot range lenses. * that would've been the Voigt, the Olympus is just 17 (where they have the f/1.8 as well)

Disappointed with you. This has already been mentioned in the appropriate topic days ago.

Yeah, I'm attracted to its simplicity of operating, but I have to agree the actual performance wasn't all that great. But then again, Olympus cams now include a video feature called 'Old film effect' to dirty up your footage, because it's the flaws that ultimately gives it some character. Unfortunately for Olympus, that's a thing you can't really go and fake. Part of flaws and personality is that it's authentic. Maybe that's the thing about GH2 footage. Sort how CCD gives you its own vibe as well. Bit of a roughed up nose from fighting VS cosmetic rhinoplasty (intent as well)... or aged wine versus grapejuice.

Just change your computer time & date!

Yup, and again, that's something I've repeated just on the last page... Things I mentioned earlier last year:

That's exactly what he means..? The G9 is that cheaper and true hybrid option. GH5 is still a video cam first I'd say. I mean it has that V-Log L, HLG, DCI4K, Anamorphic, 10-bit, high bitrate, waveforms or vectorscope overlays, unl. rec time etc and of course the IBIS. So you know. Not that there isn't a space for it... and of course that's exactly what Panasonic needs and wants. But far less people now will be intrigued to get the GH5, because they're bound to lean more one way (consumer: bit of 'casual' stills & video) or the other (high end video production). Especially with a GH5S (supposedly) coming out at 2499,- it's certainly something else.