elgabogomez

Lost in La Mancha is a very interesting documentary/bts of a movie Terry Gilliam couldn’t finish.

The best cheap anamorphic camera is more likely to be the z-cam e2m4 at us$1500, it records open gate 4:2:2 10 bit pro res hq internally. The gh6 in open gate is long gop and 4:2:0 in h265. Same issue the S1H has in open gate, no all i and no 4:2:2 and since the internal all i 400mbps 16:9 or 17:9 is so good, you feel like you are missing so much by going open gate.

I feared that looking at the trailer, no “filmic look “ or not looking like the originals… In the end of revolutions, the matrix turns into a highly colored popping world, maybe they are trying to convey that look?

I’m not getting anywhere close to a canon r5 for the overheating issue, the dynamic range is not that good other than in 8k raw and I’m not ready for an 8k workflow. The r3 is really interesting… but is 6k dollars and at that point, you can be thinking Komodo or fx6 for very real benefits (red raw, global shutter… vari nd, real video camera)

This is going to sound like a 180 degrees turn, but I was forgetting one feature the s1h has that no Sony (outside of fs, fx line) has, c4k! That is the sweet spot the panny reaches, 10bit, 4:2:2 all intra in 3840x2160 AND 4096x2160 internal recording. That is the combo that matches prores or dnxhr and can be considered the standard for quality video. And the reason I didn’t include the S1 and S5 is because they don’t offer the intra option Internally. Not everyone needs c4k but excluding it is classic Sony.

I do anamorphic shooting as is one of my obsessions, the S1h is close to be perfect for anamorphic but has several shortcomings. The open gate mode is 4:2:0 h265 long gop and there is no way to upgrade from that, not even externally. The s35 anamorphic mode is not full 4perf height, it’s 15mm height instead of 18mm. The rolling shutter is exacerbated when on anamorphic to jelly town. Full frame anamorphic is something quite recent (Cooke and panavision) and now vazen and sirui, all of them in the last 3 years. So unless you adapt projector scopes, that leaves the rest of the anamorphic lenses in the world in a middle ground between being cropped on the s35 mode on the s1h or not covering the open gate mode. I would have loved the Bs1h to solve either the rolling shutter speed or the 6k open gate mode to be 4:2:2 all i (even down sampled to 3240 x 2160 would do it for me) or come up with a 4perf crop… Back to the Sony 7 iv, how much worse is the rolling shutter compared to the s1h is something to pay attention. But for 24 or 30 frames in 10bit all i and 4k 60 slow motion (which in the Sony is also all i and not 4:2:0 like the Panasonic) which is a “line in the sand standard for quality video footage I think (again in my opinion) very comparable.

newfoundmass, what doesn’t match the s1h video in the a7 iv in your estimation? They both are fullframe, they both can record 4:2:2 10bit all i or long gop, they both have log profiles and hlg profiles, full hdmi output, usb c transfer and charging… Other than no timecode option I see them as quite comparable

In my opinion it matches the S1H in video at a lower price. Downsides are no raw out, no 6k and no anamorphic modes. Upsides are autofocus, a lot more lenses to pair with… But the rolling shutter might be the achilles heel of the a7 iv.

Yes it’s lighter… until you add a battery behind and a monitor on top/side. There are a few things that cooled me down from original excitement from “oh! This is my next camera!!!” to “hold on, no ibis? Same price as s1h? No included battery/charger? “ Still nice idea but other than sdi I don’t think it’s a better option than an used S1H.

Up by this point in the discussion, I think both of you (tupp, kye) are deep into your own trench and will never settle with the other. Yedlin’s test is for the world he is living in which is of world class feature film budgets, not “everyone’s regular 4:2:0 cameras “ or “monochrome, foveon or ccd sensor cameras”. Moving pictures have a way of pulling you into a story, engaging the viewer with more than pretty detailed pictures. Once you consider that filmmakers (world class directors, producers, cinematographers) are the target audience for his tests, it gives both of you and your valid points a perspective and a way to back off to more productive discussions.

Something is wrong with those recording times, on a 128gb card I get around 40 minutes of c4k 10bit all-i on the s1h, that is 400mb per second. On a 64gb card I get an hour and 10 minutes on an a7 s2 and that is uhd 4k 100mb per second (long gop, 8bit). Surely 150mb per second should give you close to the 3 hours you seek on a 256gb card.

Red still has the patent for compressed raw recording, atomos got a deal with them and was able to have the prores raw, canon got a deal with them and is able to have canon raw lite. Blackmagic created Braw to avoid a Red lawsuit and is in the clear. Everyone else can’t have internal compressed raw on any camera. Now s1h can send out the hdmi signal for compressed raw to two different formats, so no, I don’t think internal raw is coming to any Panasonic camera any time soon.

Like everything in life, context is paramount. The example of the ursa/a7sII is (without context) quite misleading. First it depends on what Ursa, 4k, 4.6k, pro, g2. Second it’s not useful to compare one shoot with one camera with a shoot (even if it’s the next day) with another camera (unless you are shooting exactly in the same conditions. And thirdly, I wouldn’t use an ursa for any shoot that I would consider using an a7sII, the Sony in log starts at iso1600, most ursas you wouldn’t want to use 1600 for anything. The size and weight of both is a great differenciator for the types of use of each one. On the other hand, I agree resolution isn’t everything and a 1080p image of anything blackmagic is quite a good image, mainly (for this tread about “k”s and resolution) because it’s not as compressed and in every ursa, it’s downsampled from bigger sensor resolutions. And that’s precisely why I bought the a6300 in 2016 for, it downsampled 6k sensor info to give a 4k image, which at the time I wanted for a 1080/2k delivery. Now the context is this: I use anamorphic lenses and they are not “sharp” and with a 2x lens in a 16:9 sensor you crop a lot on the sides and I wanted as much resolution as I could cheaply get for that. The gh5s was not out yet, the bmpcc4k was very limited in dynamic range or iso, there was no 4k mirrorless canon, nikon or Fuji cameras.

In all seriousness, at the time of his postulates, Netflix was rejecting the arri alexa for not being native 4k (and other platforms were following suit) and in Mr. Yedlin’s line of work it was really creating issues during pre production or in pitch meetings. On the high end there was the alexa65 but not everyone wanted the hassle of it (limited sets of lenses, a lot more power hungry) and for many pro cinematographers it felt preposterous for the producers to select the camera package on specs basis instead of them proposing a package based on the artistic look. I think it was not meant for lower budget photographers/videographers/Indy dps to stop us from buying a 4k or higher resolution camera. At least at personal title it didn’t deterred me from buying a sony a6300 at the time his first video came out.

I saw his first part video when it came out and liked his theories, then the last Jedi came out, I watched it... by the time the second part of his comparisons came out, I liked Yedlin a lot less 😉

https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=24187 monoprice is a good quality- low cost cable maker, I’ve used their cables for years specially for micro hdmi. Not angled unfortunately

Appalling rolling shutter? Nah! The 1d C had bad rolling shutter, the original A7s, the Sony a6xxx series... The S1H is fine. Obviously the new sonys are better, so is the R5 or the ursa12k

35mm motion picture film doesn’t struggle to match 4k, just look at a film like the matrix in 4k blu ray ultra hd, or 2001 space odyssey or the original blade runner... They look amazing! None of them share a common look per se, but nothing shot on digital after the transition to the alexa, red or sony cinealtas beats them. You have to remember that digital means pixels, pixels means squares and thus it cannot give the same type of detail the film grain of layers of color being burnt by light in the negative. A grain is a random shape (I know that 4k blu is a digitized image -converted to pixels-) in the original frame. The resolution threshold for what looks good has been surpassed in digital cameras I give you that, and once the film copies reached the theater we watched movies in the resolution degradation was maybe less than hd and maybe that’s what we want to mimic.

As someone who does stills as a hobby/family memories, the idea of browsing through video to get a still is not desirable, I think of photography as “freezing the moment “ and video as “getting the mood” so the shutter speed is a tool that video capture doesn’t do for me in the same vein as deliberately hitting the button in the exact moment. If I were doing event photography I might think different.

I may have come too strong “against” MF, let me digress: gfx100 had me researching 645 lenses to build a set with the kipon focal reducer to propose to a project. The new 100s is more affordable and closer in handling to the mirrorless ff cameras so it’s definitely an option. But if you consider the price and think video first, you could get a red Komodo, a Sony fx6 or a canon c70 and all 3 of them offer huge advantages for video/cinema work. The fact we can have MF in the conversation for a project is a milestone in itself, but you still have to consider lenses, codecs, nd filters, battery options, rigging, monitoring... you know? Camera and sensor size/look is only the beginning.

I think the gfx100s has a chance of big popularity considering it’s a day after the announcement of the Sony a1 at a similar price point, but honestly the difference between 35mm and these “medium format” digital sensors is kinda like the difference between apsc and full frame. You still need a “speed booster” to get the real look of the 645 lenses of yesteryear... I think the industry is better off with “open gate” 35mm sensors and anamorphics, even 1.33x has a look so similar to the alexa 65 that I think that’s where the “film look” will be for big time productions in the next 5 years. Between the s1h, the a7s3 or the fujifilm gfx that shoots 4k I will prefer full frame cameras as they have more lens options, less rolling shutter and full hdmi connections. The Z cam e2 f6 is the cheapest open gate full frame camera right now and it even has a plethora of lens mount options to play with whatever lens your heart desires (even m43).

Their mirrorless cameras are called Z but lack refinement and exciting new features, there are cinema cameras named “Z” that lack name recognition and service centers around the globe... Maybe a partnership for a Nikon Z cam FM cine ultimate camera!

VLC is a weird, unpredictable program. It can read dnxhd and dnxhr files, but gets tripped by prores on occasion (4k prores) sometimes it reads s1h h264 4:2:2 10 bit files (24p) but sometimes it just reads the first seconds and then gets stuck buffering, h265 gets read fine if the drive it’s reading from is ssd but not a spinning drive... there’s a 30% chance it will read files without issues. I switched to media player classic for reviewing material, sad really as with vlc I can Desqueeze anamorphic footage and even change colors to something somewhat watchable in log footage. On braw footage, Blackmagic has a raw viewer so you don’t have to open resolve to review footage.

How is the s1h outdated?? Last I looked, movies were shot at 24fps, tv at 25 or 30 depending on region, and in most cases still delivered interlaced. If theater quality still means something, it’s still finished as 2k. If on Netflix, Amazon or similar, I’ll concede the bump to 4k is a “given” but it’s still 24p, 25 or 30. How any of that is outdating the s1h?