TheRenaissanceMan

Best Buy hasn't worked on commission since the mid-90s. That said, my store never had a problem letting people pop a card in the camera, provided doing so didn't screw with the security hardware.

It was shot on film (with several scenes on Alexa), so I'm not sure what he's getting at. My local theater has all new 4K projectors. I can't say I see much of a difference between the films mastered in 2K vs 4K. Maybe on the super high end blockbusters, but that difference in look can also just come down to aesthetic differences between them and many (not as huge budget) 2K films. Maybe my eyes aren't keen enough, or I'm too focused on the films themselves to suss out resolution differences. 4K content over the web is generally too compressed to look any better than 1080p imo, especially at typical screen sizes and viewing distances. I worked at Best Buy during the 4K boom. When people are evaluating a new TV, they're generally standing quite close, a distance they'll never watch from in their home. When they get the set back to their living room and sit at the typical 8-12ft viewing distance, the bump in resolution over 1080p is negligible. Imo, 4K display makes way more sense for projectors (large screen size) and computer monitors (short viewing distances) than it does for TVs. Most real videophiles are rocking either a late model plasma or a new OLED, and neither choice is about resolution. I myself have a 1080p projector that constantly amazes me. Sizes that large have a hugely different feel to a TV, and really let you enjoy every ounce of resolution. I'll probably pick up a 4K model when someone competes with Sony in the consumer 4K space, or maybe go back to a TV once OLED gets farther along its race to the bottom; Sharp is slated to start making OLED panels for the other manufacturers this year, so we'll likely see prices dip by 2018. TV manufacturers also have yet to agree on an HDR standard. Some support HD 10, some Dolby Vision, a slim minority do both. And different streaming services support different standards: Netflix content is HDR10, Amazon Prime is all about Dolby. If you're happy with your current display, get something with universal compatibility or wait for that fight to be decided before you jump in. That's not even getting into cameras, which I'll post about when I haven't just spent 18 hours on set.

It's only the 3rd or 4th option from the top, so I just scroll down quick and change it. Not a big deal; never really inconvenienced me. Also... There's plenty of information out there on a camera this old. Why buy it if you know it doesn't have the controls you want? I've never used the auto exposure modes, so I couldn't tell you. Sounds like maybe you should've gotten an EX3 instead.

Gorgeous rendering. Razor sharp, too. The 58 can come across a little harsher on detail than the rest of the set, and has edgier bokeh, but it's still solid and an important focal length to have.

What do you mean by "frame shutter"? I can set my frame rates and shutter speeds without issue. Also, I finally picked up a blackmagic video assist for my F3! Still need to do some more tests, but @BenEricson is right: beautiful, clean images that are very hard to make fall apart. The Assist has some quirks, like selecting "lines" to get peaking instead of the "peaking" option, but is otherwise well-featured and amazing value for money. Looking forward to shooting some 10-bit on something worth sharing!

$150 speed booster. Done.

No surprise there; the Sigmas are notoriously clinical. I'd say your results are specific to the lenses chosen, and not to native and speed boosted lenses on the whole. The results with my Leica 50mm Summicron-R or my buddy's SLR Magic 50mm APO would be markedly different.

It's always more about the artist than his brushes. That doesn't change the fact that good tools make it easier to do quality work quickly. I'm also fairly sure most of the crash cams in Fury Road were Blackmagic. For sure the Snorricam on Tom Hardy at the beginning was the 2.5k.

I use BP-60. More affordable than V-mount, nice capacity, and us F3 users get to use one battery system across all our cameras.

Veydra, Voigtlander, or SLR Magic. Not the most compact, but solid metal primes that provide lovely imagery with little fuss. Veydra are the sharpest and have the best mechanics. Voigtlander have the fastest apertures and are the most widely available. SLR Magic are the most affordable and (imo) have the nicest aesthetic.

@jagnje Another option is the Minolta Rokkor 24mm f/2.8. Legendary lens; Leica even licensed the optical design to use in their R line of SLR lenses. You can find one around $150 if you look carefully, and a lens tech will convert it to EF mount for $100-150. Comes out to your budget on the dot. Plus there are plenty of other great lenses in the line, so building a matched set is no problem. Minolta even worked hard to keep all their lenses consistent in color and contrast, even adjusting their coatings for each lens design to keep everything matched perfectly. Google "Minolta Rokkor Survival Guide" if you want more details.

Couple questions for those who have a handle on shooting 5D RAW: 1. With the new 12-bit and compressed RAW, what are you looking at for record times? And what cards are fast enough to keep up? 2. Is the post workflow as simple as "convert raw files to DNG, then load into Resolve"? 3. Can you get full resolution, realtime playback of your clips in camera? At least in 1080p? 4. Is the HDMI output active while shooting RAW? 5. Any other operational "gotchas" that might deter someone from choosing 5D RAW as an option?

But in terms of being smaller, lighter, and cheaper than the C200, it leaves something to be desired.

8-bit for the internal 60p is pretty disappointing... I'm sure the image and overall package will be superior, but I was hoping for the internal specs to at least outdo the GH5. Have they said whether the SDI/HDMI output will be 10-bit in all recording modes? If so, pairing this guy with an Atomos Inferno or Odyssey 7Q+ would really unleash its potential.

Did some digging on the optical cement front. Here's a list of all the adhesives offered by Summer's Optical, along with a brief description to go with each. Any further questions I'm sure could be answered by their customer service department. I'm guessing our best options would be F-65, UV-69, or HS-2. http://www.optical-cement.com/cements/products.html#anchor720308

Would also love an answer on what adhesives are safe for use on lenses...that's an expensive mistake to make.

I have DPed with raw cameras plenty of times. It was the much more ubiquitous and well-supported cinema DNG, but still. It works very well for certain projects and certain shooting styles. My preferred way to work actually, but I'm still green and un-specialized enough that I don't get to do that as often as I'd like. In my experience, shooting 10-bit 4:2:2 simply represents the best compromise between quality, file size, and workflow. It makes things look good for my clients, reasonable file sizes for me, and good vibes from post. The C200 competes with 3 other cameras: Ursa Mini Pro, FS7, and EVA1. All of those cameras have internal 10-bit 422 codecs. I don't find it unreasonable to wish this one did too. The C200 indeed hasn't lost me work. I think it's a very solid camera for many users, and as I've said repeatedly, it seems like a great camera that I wouldn't judge anyone for liking or using. In fact, I even said a few rentals are probably in my future. I'm simply laying out the reasons why I personally am disinterested in it as a purchase. Seems like things are getting a bit hostile in here, so I'm going to withdraw from the discussion. @mercer, I'll shoot you a PM about lenses. Cheers.

But I still refute that point on the grounds that: -owner operators need enough media to last the day -offloading is not always practical or possible -using MP4 does not produce acceptable results for me/my clients, both in terms of footage specs and actual file quality (I've played with samples) But I feel like I've explained my position in excruciating detail; you can either accept it or not. Good SD cards I (and most shooters) have in abundance already, as most guys I know buy extreme pro, regardless of their camera's bit rate (just to be safe). My local Best Buy has 128GB SDs good enough for the EVA in stock regularly--if I need more, I can go get a couple or send a runner. It also has two card slots, so you can get 256gb in the camera at a time even if 128gb cards are the only ones available to you. The C200 only includes one CFast slot, so no such luck. The C200B is interesting if you're using a gimbal or flying the camera on a drone, but no top handle or screen means no XLRs or touch screen AF, which to me are big reasons to get the camera in the first place. I use Leica primes, SLR Magic primes, and Contax Zeiss zooms, so I feel you on adapted stuff. No PL option or locking EF mount is a real bummer. If they can give it a locking style mount by the time the camera ships, I think it'll buy them a lot of goodwill. Honestly, this could be a good choice for a feature rental, especially if your local renters include media in the package. Great low light, nice latitude, easy to grade without paying for a real colorist. 4K doesn't matter much for festivals, but it can't hurt to have for flexibility in post. If you only need 1080p and manual lenses, the F3 is still an amazing workhorse with a great image. My business partner and I use two of them paired with Shoguns, and I've had almost no complaints. It's a great price these days, too. Worth a look if you'd rather own!

Also, keep in mind there are still a lot of question marks surrounding the EVA, including the most critical point: what does the footage look like? Kinda important, that. We have the broad strokes, as we did when the GH5 was announced, but once the final product is there to see, I could see some people changing their tune. 10-bit Varicam image quality to dual SD cards in a 2-pound body sounds VERY attractive to me. Announcing a "winner" in this product segment is premature, and ultimately kind of silly. The FS7 has sold well, as has the FS5, and that line still has benefits not shared by their competition (adaptable and well-supported mount, name recognition among producers, timecode, the ability to speed boost, high quality HFR, internal 10-bit, etc). The EVA will likely do great. The C200 is already #2 in cinema cameras on B&H. There is no "best." Those days are over. There's only different. This is the point I was refuting. Mine are not 1 or 2 fringe use cases, but the kinds of situations I encounter all the time, spending day in day out shooting video for both money and pleasure. I never denied that the C200 was a powerful camera, or that the RAW was very exciting; in fact, I spent an entire paragraph of my first post in the topic praising Canon for including it. My point was simply that the lack of a 10-bit codec hurts the viability of this camera for me and others like me. Believe me, I'm not the only one. Take a peek at DVX User. The camera is already a smashing success, and it has a lot of points in its favor. If I were a different kind of shooter, I'd be all over it. Side notes: -I wouldn't exactly call $7500 for the camera alone (plus media, power, etc) to be in the range of "low-budget filmmaking." -If you buy used tungsten lights designed for filmmaking (dirt cheap on eBay now that LED is gaining steam), you can pin your gels to the barn doors where they won't "melt in 10 minutes." That's nuts! Your considerable talents would be better served focusing on your scene than finagling subpar lighting tools. -By not buying CFast cards, you can make room in the budget to go up to that couple on the beach and slip them a twenty to relocate.

The documentary was destined for broadcast, and post wanted 10-bit for some compositing stuff with stock photos. XF-AVC isn't yet an option on the C200, so Raw would've been my only choice there. The actors weren't blindly improv-ing for 5-10 straight minutes. They started by working directly from the script, then the director would talk to them about the character and encourage them to change the words up for their comfort. Then the actors would add new lines and topics, and feel their way to a richer, more natural conversation. This meant the conversations had to play out in as long a take as possible, at least in the first angle, as otherwise the dialogue would suffer. Very cool working method, and we got some great stuff. More to the point, I was hired on as the DP. You've never worked professionally, so this may be new to you, but I would never presume to tell my director how to work with his actors. I'd never work again. As the shooter, my place is to collaborate with the director and bring his vision to life. "You shouldn't work that way" or "I can't work like that because my camera..." etc are not options. Commercials and corporate work are generally for broadcast, meaning that I'd have to use RAW. Also, this was another instance where clients requested 10-bit 422. In addition, it had to be delivered to their post people for a relatively quick turnaround. If post called me and said "what the hell is this codec and how do I edit it?" and I answered with some shit about the Canon utility and how great it'll be once NLE support is widespread, guess who's never hiring me again? We were not able to have electronics within a wide radius of the Tesla coil, as there was a risk of the field it creates frying anything nearby. Also, all available house power was going to lights and the robot, and we had a generator to handle the coil. There was nowhere to set up a DIT station, and we were shooting somewhere pretty of of the way, so no extra personnel for that either. Plus, as you said, it wouldn't be ideal. We would've needed to bring down the robot arm, dismount the Faraday cage, change out the card, format, re-mount the cage, run the camera, then re-position the robot arm. And that would've taken 2-3 people to do quickly--people who were needed to reset the rest of the scene elements in a timely fashion. We were shooting night exterior, and we only had one day with the coil. There was no extra time to wrestle with media. That's why I say this camera falls into no-man's-land. The 8-bit isn't good enough for me and many of my clients, and the RAW isn't practical for many shooting scenarios I encounter day to day. And the fact remains that I need enough media for a full day of shooting; it's an actual problem, not a straw man argument. For you personally, shooting RAW all day with minimal media may be a viable option. For many of us, it is not. Implying that we are being disingenuous or lazy for pointing that out is reductive and misleading.

Ah, you're correct. Would love to get a 10-bit 2K recording or two to play with. We'll have to just wait and see on the codec update. Who knows, a beefier 8-bit might do the trick for a lot of people. Why is the EF mount a no go for you? Plenty to put on it besides just EF glass, and SLR Magic primes adapt just fine. Or do you have reason to need PL? Yeah, that's definitely what I'd use for an UMP46. Still gotta get hands on with that guy sometime. There's some concern that it won't work with the C200 because the camera won't record with the card door open, but maybe someone will find a work around. I really wish I liked the FS7 sensor more, because it's the only competitive option in this bracket with a mirrorless mount and a 10-bit codec. I nicknamed my buddy's FS700 "the noisemaker," because that sensor is just lousy with it! Not an attractive image overall either, imo. I have a great story about that; if I'm not feeling too lazy tomorrow, maybe I'll make a separate topic to tell it.

Maybe to a hobbyist. But there are many real-world shooting scenarios in which cards cannot be dumped on site, or when doing so would disrupt workflow. Documentary shoot. We're stealing shots on a ferris wheel that plays a pivotal role in the story. Get our lead actor, get our gear. Each little pod has 2 sides that fit 2 people each, and we want our subject alone in the frame. So one camera op, and our director running sound. We ride this thing for a few hours, asking questions and watching this guy soak in the memories of this ride, and the surrounding scenery (which we're also getting scenery of when our guy has to leave--his time was limited). In that situation, how could I have offloaded every 15-30 minutes? Another shoot. Gaffing a micro-budget feature. Very actor-focused. Mostly 2-camera, lots of improv. We're often running 5-10 minutes takes, and really letting our actors play it all out and find what works. Were we supposed to stop the director and actors every couple of takes to say "sorry guys, hang tight while we swap cards"? Not that we had the personnel to have someone wrangling data the whole day anyway. Say you're not shooting for yourself. I DPed a corporate spot a while back. Nothing huge, but a good door to have my foot in. We had two producers on site to keep an eye on things, myself, a gaffer, and a sound guy. Cards went off to their in-house post team straight afterwards. If I'd told the client ahead of time that they'd have to provide an on-site data wrangler or pay me to bring one on, they would've just hired someone else rather than incur the additional costs. Small commercial for a juice company. Not trained actors--they insisted on having the company founder on camera. Only problem is that the guy's not good on camera. Like... At all. Flubbed every line, stammering, kept making this weird snarly face without realizing it. We're way out away from the building to get the background they want for his big moment. High sun, huge contrast situation. Being able to say "don't worry, we've got all the time in the world" was hugely helpful on that shoot. If we'd had to send runners all the way out to the main office and back with cards every couple takes, I doubt we would've gotten the footage we did. Not without a second shoot day, which the client wouldn't have done. Short film I DPed. We're doing a huge lightning effect; during the climactic fight, the witch shoots a lighting bolt from her staff our valiant hero in his suit of armor. The effect works by doing 3 passes: one with the witch holding her staff up, one with our guy in the suit and a huge 12 foot Tesla coil, and a clean plate pass. Our effects guy says we need to do all 3 passes in one single shot, without cutting. Camera is surrounded by a Faraday cage on a motion control robot, so that it won't fry from the Tesla coil. That means every take, we had to set up the knight and coil, replace them with the witch and a lighting gag, then get it all out of frame for the plate. We easily ran at least 15-20 minutes per take, and needed to squeeze every drop of image quality from these shots in post. I simply don't know how I could've accomplished that setup with 2-3 cards of limited capacity. Even if it is possible to offload cards on the day, having enough media to last the day, and of large enough capacities not to have to offload them once or twice an hour, makes things much smoother and easier on you, your crew, and your clients' nerves. For an owner-operator, it is an essential part of your package. What if your client wants a run and gun shoot that you estimate will create 5-6 hours of footage, and they want it all in 10-bit 422? You have to be prepared for that and any other scenario, or you've lost the advantage of owning. TL;DR: For some users, offloading as you shoot may be a viable option; however, it is not a viable option for all users or all shooting situations.

That's still a very big "if." Don't go patting any backs until it's official. The 8-bit HDMI/SDI output leads me to believe the camera's processing pipeline is only set up for 8-bit and RAW. That said... If this baby gets a 10-bit codec, I could see it absolutely ravaging this market sector. Producers like the look, shooters like the ease of use, post likes the files. Win win win.

I see now that you already have the Tokina and want 20ish mm equivalent. Whoops! If you're alright with manual focus, definitely look at some of the older Nikkor glass in that range. It's one of the few vintage lineups I'm not familiar with, but a quick Google search should bring up some solid advice on which ones are worth seeking out. Edit: not sure why I quoted myself. Whoops again.

Wait, really? That's interesting...very excited to get my hands on some files when the update comes through. Call me crazy, but I'm just generally not a fan of the Canon look. Maybe it's the years of DSLR footage, but it just screams "processed video" to me. Not judging you guys who dig the aesthetic, but I'm over it. And I'm familiar with CFast as a format...not sure why someone went to the trouble of explaining it to me. But up against the mountain of devices that accept SD and SSD, compatible devices are a pittance. Local availability is a problem too. If I'm on location and we need more media than we thought, where can I go to buy fast, large-capacity CFast cards? My local best buy has SanDisk Extreme Pro SDs and SSDs up to 128GB and 512GB, respectively. I think they have one mid-speed speed 32GB CFast card, which would give you..what, 3 minutes of Raw Light? If it can keep up with the data rate? The price of CFast cards is also ridiculous, especially when you take into account the monstrous Canon file sizes. That wouldn't be such a problem if you could output RAW--or at the very least, 10-bit--out the HDMI or SDI to an SSD-based recorder, but that's not an option either. Someone at DVX User did the math, and I think a full day (8 hours) of suitable media cost a couple grand more than the camera itself! Granted, I almost never shot 8 hours of footage in a single day, but even 4 hours' worth would be a ludicrous expense. My SD and SSD collection is pretty much as relevant now as at was when I started it 5 years ago. CFast has some question marks in that regard, as even the CFA has announced CFExpress as their format of choice over CFast. A cursory Google search will confirm this, as have my friends in the tech industry. http://resourcemagonline.com/2016/10/the-cfast-vs-xqd-battle-is-already-over-stop-buying-cfast/68002/ So while CFast is a fine format for the present and has many benefits, it's too expensive to be a disposable purchase and not solid enough to be an investment. For me, that is. YMMV.