Liam

diggin H

Just got accepted to The Center for Cartoon Studies which is in a teeny tiny town in Vermont, so sort of the opposite plan for the moment but I'm not sure I'm convinced moving to a more active place would make me more plugged in.. that's obviously been a thought though /:

I've been trying to find people to partner with to make films for a long time... You CAN do it alone.. and I made 6 films that way, hoping it would help me meet people to work with. It did not. It is a little bit of a dead end to make films alone forever. There are mediums where you can actually work alone - novels, comic books, and animation are all on par with film, or better in some ways. Film requires the most resources. Novels are the hardest to find an audience for. I might only be a cartoonist now, and not a filmmaker. Cartooning takes the most practice and time (sort of). And still no audience, but I can finally make my stuff. I do think there's an issue right now where people are not trying to partner with amateurs. A director who might go somewhere and an actor who might go somewhere, if they can communicate, should spend all their time together. But the amount of time both are just saying "no" back and forth is crazy. This is part of the reason that the "don't work for free" trend bugs the shit out of me. Mildly successful filmmakers are all just super popular - they have a little posse who worship them, they can raise stupid amounts on kickstarter, and they don't let anyone else in. So, I hope this was helpful and tragic.

Lol, if you heard me say buy a new camera... that's on you

I actually saw a really good clip of his first first feature (My Best Friend's Birthday?), which he called practice and threw away.. not sure the budget on that one. But we've definitely got an apple and an orange in the mix

Think I recall in the full clip, RR keeps going on about how you should practice by making a film every week... but QT is just will not stand for it

A mailing list is slightly unusual today. On youtube there's best, second best.. something good can be 50th and not worth your time. The one thing they get in the mail won't be compared to or compete with anything, and I'm sick of explaining... As for "trying" hmm.. never thought of that! Worth a shot! These are all buzzwords, but I'm glad some people think it sounds inspiring. Offer anything concrete, please.

In 50,000 years, hopefully sooner, (if we're still around) there won't be jobs at all, or money, or famous people. That was all a bad idea in the first place. So yeah, we're really solving stuff.

I was saying... Vimeo is where everyone goes. Make your own path, and in a way you won't have competition. I know there are millions and millions of artists. Yeah, I'm definitely looking for peers, before "fans" For that, you don't need to be the best. I feel like you're saying both.. idk if "have peers" is advice. I'm tryin ?

I would think if you can't find an audience on vimeo, you're totally normal, because vimeo is full. It doesn't have to mean anything about the quality of your content. I'm trying to say I want a route where I'm not competing at all. that's a real thing, but I think anyone who's done that has had to do it on their own... not use what they were told works by a mildly successful blogger etc

These all sound nice... I hope it's not crazy to ask if they actually mean anything. I obviously like what I do, and I think I'm actually doing it. finished like 10 projects in 2 years, and started others, so I'm working. not sure about knowing your target audience... do most authors know that they're writing for men age 21-49? Or do they take whoever shows up? And how does it help me to know? Getting it to the right people is definitely my goal, but not a lot of filmmakers are discouraged from Vimeo, right? It's kind of a catch all. Are there actually niche options out there? Or is the thought that I'm probably not getting it to the right people just easier to handle, because it means I'm the one doing it wrong? as for mailchimp... I mean there are countless things I could spend a hundred dollars a year on, and I will not do them all. Like I said, I just do not know how it's supposed to help me at this stage. Maybe it's just what I'm looking for, but it appears to be branding and tools for people with an audience (not me). I was mostly interested because of Adrian Tomine's mailing list for his comic that started in like 1991. I don't know how he found people, but I don't want something too like.. idk, fake. I guess there could be a service that makes email into another social platform where people scroll and see me on a list. wouldn't want that, since I'm already failing there. My ORIGINAL question I guess was... You just ask everyone for their emails, or? Maybe if I did a local art show, I could ask for emails. And then they could tell their friends, and my products would have the signup... I'm sort of looking at blogging... sounds like agony and could be another investment etc etc... interviews with other artists could be fun. Have you seen Eighth Grade? 1 view, 0 views, 0 views, 1 view... yeah, I don't know how that's supposed to work either before I'm already famous

Yeah, he's obviously really good at certain things.. or, building an audience.. and only that. But even the way he does that depresses me. I hate whining about things being a popularity contest, but I mean... I stopped getting new followers on vimeo probably 4 films ago. Somehow fewer views etc with each new one... I've gotta try instagram at least for promotion stuff, I guess, but it feels as hopeless as youtube really.. viral stuff can go super viral, but if you have nothing, an audience won't just appear. I'm actually applying to school right now, but it's crazy, even trying to just learn more can be a path where someone can put up the wall and say "not good enough!"

It's over a hundred dollars a year, which could be fine if it's helpful, but I can't make heads or tails of what it's even supposed to do. If it helps me send emails, I'll look at it later. Yeah, I'm just spiraling out again because yesterday I got rejected from the worst film festival ever. But I do make a lot of stufd and post it places. I'm not trying to make a living, I'm just trying to gt any sort of audience to help the constant feeling I'm delusional. I enjoy my work, but staying sane with no support isn't easy. I make films and comics, and write books because I've been changing it up because nothing is working. But yeah, I'm not sure if my whiny specifics are necessary here. Lot of people I've been a fan of, way back in the day, were using a mailing list, and maybe I'm embarrassing myself again, buy I just don't know what the basic premise is.. just ask anyone and everyone for their addresses? I hate Casey so goddamn much. Good for him and all, but jesus christ.

To my knowledge, this is a helpful tool if you're already working that way, but maybe won't help me get people won't quite help me get going..? Correct me if I'm wrong I feel pretty able to send emails, so an expensive tool won't be my first step

Might not be ideal for a filmmaker, vs like an auhor or cartoonist, but I'm curious.. Seems like fans that sign up for a mailing list might be more enthusiastic or feel like they're part of something (?) It's kind of old school or underground in a cool way maybe Maybe it's in direct conflict with a vimeo page.. like if people already follow you, they might just get pissed that you're also bugging them through email Idk. No idea how I'd build one etc Maybe this is basically what patreon is for now Just antsy and struggling like always to reach anyone.

This is sort of an old project, because I kinda gave up on it. It doesn't quite tell the story the way I wanted it to, but I like the way it looks and decided I might as well share it. and again, the disclaimer that it's maybe not at all relevant because it's animated, sorry

@Damphousse he may not be making tooons, but yeah, it was interesting. I can message you his name if you want. I just don't want that to become part of the discussion here - like is he a hack etc.. And yes! Thank you! Plus like most computers lol, I'm reading this thread kinda baffled.

The point is also that not a lot of other people are doing it. And that it's in person. Blurays would be newer but probably actually less likely for everyone to be able to watch it. And with DVDs, there's a case with the cover on it that could get you interested in the film, and it looks like a product. So.. I didn't feel too crazy, sorry. Maybe I WILL go back to 2004.. when people were nicer!!

Maybe an alright alternative? A travelling filmmaker passed through here a little while ago with his merch and made a decent haul and has a good following from it. Not sure how he gets a "gig" though. Logistics? Arts festivals? Flea markets? Is it pretty pointless since there's Vimeo?

just a rough little thing.. again, not the right place to share it, so you may ignore

This kinda sounds like your thing

Yeahhh.. I'd do that if I had film buds. *cries a lot, but in a cool way*

I don't think anyone would invest in me, and I kind of don't want anyone to. If they would, i'd just use that supposrt to make films and not feel enough like a failure to want to put this together. There's also something weird and slightly cultish about it being our whole community... like it would become all about the horrible $16,000 local film just because everyone was involved in making it, and everyone would still be trying to reject the $0 budget film that I actually like. If I started giving power to everyone here who thinks they're a filmmaker, I might not even attend in the end. Plus there's already the much more popular festival in my city, which I am somewhat trying to fight against, with the whole "Slamdance" vibe. I'm surprised to hear I'd need insurance... can't anyone invite anyone to a meeting room in the library? Can't I insist we're friends just hanging out? I'd love to make it international and include people from here especially, but I think I can feel it getting too big again..

@Xavier Plágaro Mussard see, I was kinda thinking if it's mostly the filmmakers that would be fine, since we're keeping it small anyway and not trying to become famous. Accepting all of them was like the entire point of it too, not caring if they "suck" because idk if my films suck either, and I'm probably mostly doing it for exactly those people. I also think they'd all be happy to talk about it.. I don't know if they would submit their film if THEY were embarrassed about their own films and thought they sucked. @sanveer I could see some benefit to really limiting the run times, in case the others are going to have a hard time sitting through it. There might be only so far you can go to be accepting and understanding of others in your postion.. good stuff to think about, thanks guys! Maybe I could scatter in some really short "ringers" from really good filmmakers I know? Who probably won't attend, but just to give it some momentum?

I'll save you a seat just in case, @kaylee!