Django

I'm not recommending him anything in particular, we're just talking shop and comparing cameras. There are enthusiasts with high budgets and also high expectations. There are pros that are very budget conscious and don't place priority on specs. There are Canon fans, Panasonic fans, Sony fans. FF fans, S35 fans, MFT fans. Etc. I don't know who is who when on gear forums, I can only give you my perspective.

I dunno sorry but that's a really goofy way of looking at things, especially if you're a pro. Buy the best camera you can afford that fits your requirements wether that's specs (resolution, codecs etc) or i/o's ergonomics etc. Obviously be smart and on the lookout for what camera will be a better long term investment rather than short if the camera is at the end of a cycle. The FX3 is imo a much better investment and solution than the A7IV. First it doesn't overheat. That alone is key. Then you have all the cine features including LUT support. The fast readout sensor, A7IV has terrible RS. And of course the cage-less body and top handle with XLRs. If you're on a budget or don't need FF then the FX30 makes even better sense. S5ii is also very competitive. Why wait a year or two if you need the camera today? Don't get me wrong, I don't buy cameras often at all, in fact much less than your average person around here. When I find a camera I'm comfortable with I stick with it forever. And I rarely go for flagships when they are new (I skipped R5, A7S3). But there are plenty of excellent options in the $2K-$3K region right now both new and used if you're in the market for an upgrade. So many in fact that it is hard to choose!

Most Alpha Sony shooters are FF at this point. Sony kind of abandoned APS-C even on the FX line. Its only now making a return mainly thanks to FX30 and some new APS-C lenses. But with speed boosters its actually kinda more versatile than FX3/A7S3 which cannot shoot Super35 crop modes due to 12MP sensor. No EVF and no mechanical shutter does mean its not a great hybrid and Sony for some silly reason doesn't give FX3/30 shutter angle or WFM. And no DCI options either. Still as Ironfilm says its the ideal side-kick to a FS/FX camera (has TC) and a great compact video option for the Sony ecosystem. I'd have already bought one if it wasn't for XH2S. Stacked sensor, 6K Opengate & ProRes is just so hard to overlook. Plus with EVF and solid stills performance. It ticks so many boxes. But the Fuji look is an acquired taste and won't play friendly with most production houses. Its pretty much relegated to indie or standalone shooting. Resolve doesn't even support F-Log2 yet for an ACES workflow. And yet despite all those rational reasons to avoid Fuji and stick with Sony, I'm still VERY tempted by XH2S.

The chroma smoothing thing is real but overblown imo. Its a pixel peeper thing, in real life scenarios it rarely matters. Skin tones when shot properly are amazing. The 4K120p is amazing. Better than the class leading A7SIII. Here is some XH2S 4K120p footage shot in 8-bit 264 standard baked profile: Yes the image is sharp but hard to beat such a clean rich detailed 4K120p with no moiré. Any other Bayer sensor camera and that fabric would be moiré artifacting like crazy. And that's in the lowest 8-bit setting.. Its easy to pick apart issues but you also got to know how to play cameras to their advantages. I prefer softening a sharp detailed image then the reverse. Just pop on a vintage / cine lens and something like a Pro-Mist filter and you'll already get a much softer image.. add some film grading, halation etc on the very chunky robust ProRes codec and you've got yourself a very cinematic image with film like grain:

Honestly I'm shocked. No real explanation either which seems like a giant slap in the face of their community.

As I'm getting closer to pulling the trigger on a XH2S I'd just like to revisit the infamous chroma smoothing issues. How big of a deal do you guys think this is? Like in practice when does it really bother you? It seems to me its only really noticeable when shooting foliage from a distance. But unless you're a nature landscape shooter I don't think you'll run into glaring issues. In another thread someone just mentioned Fuji has the worst tonality and color separation. That and the over sharpening. My reply was this is due to X-Trans. No AA filter and the chroma smoothing issues mentioned here. But the upside is more detail and a much more filmic-like grain at high ISO due to less chroma noise. I mean we tend to focus on the cons of X-Trans but there are pros as well, Fuji aren't crazy and stick with it for a reason. That being said my main gripe is with the red channel. Reds are often pinkish, you can see it right there in the thumbnail below if you compare the red square to the ProRes RAW. The red is missing richness and has some pinkish hue: Is there any solution for that? Like any color correction or LUT that fixes the red channel?

That's because Fuji use X-Trans CFA pattern vs Bayer. There are pros & cons to that. The pros are less chroma noise at high ISO and hence a more film-like noise. Absence of moiré and no AA filter which explains the perceived extra sharpness. The cons are chroma smoothing in the color channel. This can be a big issue to some, or not at all to others. Seems like its especially problematic when shooting foliage from a distance. I don't really do that so haven't ever noticed much glaring issues. Only thing I've noticed when shooting Fuji is issues in the red channel which can be annoying. But overall I love the Fuji color science, the film simulations, F-Log etc. Sharpness should be turned down to the max in camera, again the absence of an AA filter can be kind of shocking but it does add detail so I guess that's more subjective. First time I'm hearing about that, you're talking about the H265 right? impossible to edit on M2 Max sounds nuts, you really sure of that? RAW bypasses the X-Trans CFA so explains why you get the color info back. I've been messing around with ProRes HQ footage from XH2S and find the IQ brilliant. Super chunky robust files that grade beautifully. In fact I'd be tempted to say its the nicest IQ I've seen from a mirrorless. YMMV. S5II was rather disappointing, the tiny h265 files just feel paper thin when pushing the grade. S5IIx with ProRes will surely be much better. Overall Canon does have the richest colours & nicest skin tones. But it can also feel a little exaggerated. I dunno I'm really tempted to switch back over to Fuji. again 6K Open-Gate with fast 14-bit readout and ProRes is just a winning combo imo.

Yes that's because XH2S uses a stacked sensor capable of 14-bit readout under 30fps. Going above or using Flog1 drops the readout to 12-bit delivering lower RS. 4K120p goes as low as 3.9ms. If you add to that 6K open-gate and chunky ProRes codec options, you have one of the most solid IQs in mirrorless. This to me makes XH2S best bang for buck camera for ultimate IQ.

X100 series has always been widely popular, perhaps even more now with social media etc. What I just found out is that Fuji are having trouble producing it due to the global parts shortage hence why the resell price skyrocketed. As a happy Leica M9 owner I have zero use for an APS-C pseudo rangefinder but the one thing it does have going for it is the flash + leaf shutter combo allowing super fast sync if flash photography is your thing. For that alone I would consider one if/when the prices get back to normal..

https://www.eoshd.com/news/2-years-later-canon-quietly-removes-fake-overheating-limits-of-eos-r5-in-firmware-update/

For the whopping asking price ( 7299€ !!!) it kind of is behind imo: No DCI options, no waveform, no LUT support, no pro / RAW internal codec etc. I'd much rather get an R5 for 3500€ now that the overheat is fixed. Sony just refuses to give you these pro video features on an Alpha camera. They barely even give you them in the FX3/FX30. Still some very clear segmenting going on with them.

Nice roundup. I think the FX30 and R8 could have also got mentioned but overall I agree with your assessment. I was all set on a FX30 just because I have an FS7 with some really nice e-mount glass but I can't quite bring myself to it knowing that Fuji just has such better specs. Lack of EVF and mechanical shutter on FX30 is I'm afraid a deal breaker. My personal Fuji candidate remains XH2S for the stacked sensor and open-gate. Some pretty good deals both new and used are also now available. It really doesn't make sense for me go Fuji as a Canon & Sony lens owner but I feel so passionate about Fuji, I miss the film simulations etc.. they are just creatively inspiring as well as absolute beasts in the specs area. A bit quirky ergonomics and not perfect AF but the rest really makes up for it. So yeah I'm really leaning towards Fuji at the moment as my next camera despite economically meaning a major lens investment.

@Attila Bakos As a colorist do you know of any solutions to get the loss of colour back in post on the internal codecs or is it just gone forever? Fuji XTrans is usually touted for its color science and film simulations which is why its so disheartning and even confusing to watch these findings where it seems in fact very poor in this domain versus any other typical bayer sensor. I don't know what to make of it..

Studio cameras have no battery and no internal storage. Kind of a shame as I actually do like the studio camera form factor for tripod shoots. Anyways this presentation was a total snooze fest for non-broadcast shooters.

sounds more like firmware updates ?

The codecs are the same, except for C300's 12-bit 444 2K. As for Log, Canon Cine line has Clog2. The hybrids only Clog & Clog3. Grading is great and pretty effortless on the R series, anything you throw at them pretty much comes out good. I find I need to tweak much more on any other log profile.

Surprisingly close (bit less detail and worst highlight rolloff) considering 6K RAW vs 4K 10-bit. PS: A is BMPCC6K & B is FX30

Yeah 4k120p seems to be the low point of the camera. It has a rather huge 1.62x crop on top of the 1.5x Super35 crop so that’s a really tiny sensor area that’s going to require tons of light not to be noisy! i don’t use 120p outside of short specialised shots so definitely not worth paying double for just better quality 120p. R5C also hasn’t got IBIS and has that terrible battery life. It’s an otherwise very impressive camera for its 8K60p RAW alone.

Broadcast cameras maybe not, but broadcast lenses they've done for over +60 years and the real mojo when it comes to video/film is in the lenses in my opinion (camera bodies and technology evolves every 6 months..): GH series brought affordability to the market.. well initially at least!

No you are twisting my words. I didn't imply they were in the cinema category, I stated the "others" are in the photography/lens business for almost a century. And I am saying this as a photographer first, videographer/filmmaker second. This obviously has an impact on video/film side as well but that wasn't my main point at all. Adding "advanced cinema/video" features doesn't make you less soulless. Fuji X top dials, aperture rings on lenses & film simulations is what I'm talking about. CS, Log & RAW video are equally important and demand specific know-how to be well implemented, not just listed on a spec sheet. They treat imaging like they do TVs. Specs, specs, specs. Its all product. No artistic philosophy, community, service. Canon for example offer pro cinema services at their Burbank facility (and equivalents around the world): https://theasc.com/articles/opening-the-canon-burbank-facility Fuji just had FujiFilm Day at the ASC Clubhouse: There is a real tangible long standing culture around lenses and pro imaging. You're just further proving my point. You're saying Panasonic is just catching up. I'm saying CaNikon/Fuji have been at it for almost a century. Six years ago, Canon had its entire Cinema line available. 1DC brought 4K to the hybrid market in 2012. That's eleven years ago! Canon started the FF revolution. First 8K mirrorless camera in 2020. First RAW internal hybrid. Etc. Simply not true:

No what I said was concerning the camera manufacturers. Content is created by creators. There is a big nuance there to understand. I stand by my words that Sony/Panny aren't photography/lens companies at heart. And it still shows. Go look at a big Panasonic trade show event .. 98% will be about home entertainment. Lumix cameras are a fraction of their core business.. You're entitled your opinion but I find Lumix is among the worst. GH series was way too over-sharp with fake V-Log L up to GH5. Now we're seeing way too much reds on S5ii that give nasty blotchy skin tones and you've got heavy NR issues too.

Sony sensor not lens! Also just to be clear, I am not claiming that Sony/Panny cameras = soulless images. The camera's DP and post/grade will be the determining factors. Stick some nice vintage glass to any sensor and it will increase the mojo.

CaNikon, Fuji & Leica have a long history in camera/lens making, we're talking 80 to +100 years. This reflects till today in their cameras. Fuji can use a Sony lens but has a completely different processing, the X line isn't even Bayer but X-Trans. This doesn't stop at the sensor level, a camera is way more than a sensor. Fuji has film simulations and the X line was based on retro camera dial ergonomics. Sony & Panasonic come from a consumer electronics background.. and it shows. They are totally utilitarian tools. That's the soullessness I'm talking about. And yes I'm talking about the mirrorless line from a hybrid camera standpoint. High-end cinema cams is a whole different ballgame where Sony & Panny are competing with ARRI/RED.

Yeah I can't say I'm exactly thrilled about going Sony either. I come from photography and have always gravitated towards historic camera companies: CaNikon, Fuji, Leica. There is something a little soulless about Sony, Panasonic & Samsung (RIP) in my opinion. They focus hardcore on specs but not so much the art form. That is what separates "video" from "cinema" I guess. I'm talking in terms of design, philosophy, color science, DCI options etc. But yeah Sony dominates the whole broadcast, production, post segments so almost no choice if you wanna play nice with them.

lol.. I do find it interesting to see these younger cats see the light so to say. But sensor size aside, the FX30 does have a more detailed 6K oversampled IQ than A7S3/FX3 and the lower 3200 dual ISO can be more useful than 12800. Only in low-light does the FX30 suffer compared to the FF versions.