Owlgreen

It's not about 422 vs 420. The 6k modes all have 420 color sampling. If you want 422, you get at most DCI 4k resolution. This means the 6k modes recording 420 chroma record more color samples than the 422 modes. It's, at least partly, a matter of overly aggressive noise reduction, which is on even when using NR:0. Thanks to Michael S for pointing this out. The pink blotches can and do appear in 422 footage, and in rec.709 grades, albeit in slightly different parts of the picture than with PQ grades. One way to partially prevent it, is to use ISOs higher than 640, such as 4000, to overwhelm the always-on NR.

Do me a favor and read the whole thread back. I asked a technical question specific to one specific mode of one specific camera. Many people offer pertinent, useful information. I am very thankful to them, and they've helped me to mitigate the issue. You and one other guy, both of whom have never shot with the camera, come in and offer no pertinent, useful information whatsoever. You just say a bunch of condescending shit, call me uninformed and unserious, brag awkwardly, and say I shouldn't use the camera in the specific mode I am interested in. I never asked if I should or shouldn't use the camera or that mode. I don't care what what you or anyone else thinks on that question. I like lots of cameras for different reasons. They all have their own peculiarities and charms. I think 8-bit cameras can be great. I think the PXL2000 is gorgeous. I love Super-8. I adore the F35. The GFX100 looks like a blast to shoot with. The S1/S1H have a ~36x24mm mode. This is unusual and interesting. Charming. I want to be able to use it from time to time. Not for everything, but sometimes. You and the other guy made a big deal out of the colorsampling in that mode being 4:2:0 rather than 4:2:2. That only a fool would shoot something with 420 chroma. The 422 modes in this camera are 4k. That means a 6k 420 file has more color samples than any of the 422 modes. But that doesn't matter. You came in with zero pertinent information and zero respect, so I gave you none back. I asked a technical question and you and the other guy responded with patronizing opinions. AKA bullshit. Your opinions are worthless to me, so keep them to yourself. To everyone else reading this, thank you for your advice and input. For a long time I've felt this board was a special place. One where massive egos don't dominate the way they often do in motion picture contexts, but rather information, knowledge and curiosity does. I still feel this way.

😂 I don't suffer fools.

Thanks, Panny, I will keep this in mind.

Michael, thank you, I think you pretty much pinpointed the cause, and at least somewhat of a solution, to the pink macroblocks. Noise reduction can't be turned off, so it needs to be sort of overwhelmed so as not to produce big uninterrupted pink puddles. Shooting ISO 4000 breaks up the pink so it is more tolerable. It's still there, but less noticeable. The pink macroblocking is also there in rec.709, it just moves to different parts of the picture relative to rec.2020 PQ. It's also there in the internal 422 codecs. I also captured some frames from the live HDMI feed of the camera into a Blackmagic Intensity card as Quicktime uncompressed 10-bit RGB files. The pink is still there. Maybe it's more correct to call it color banding, but the pink is its most noticeable hallmark. Having the NR:-1 option would be nice. That alone is probably worth the extra grand that the S1H costs. Shooting ISO 4000, I'm okay with the S1 V-Log open-gate image. It has flaws, but I can live with them. I like having a full frame open-gate tool. If it turns out there's a bug, and a firmware update eliminates the pink/color banding altogether, I'll be even happier.

Interesting note in the S1H 2.0 firmware update from a while back: "There were cases where color banding appeared in 4:2:0/10-bit video recording in some situations. This bug has been minimized." There's no such note in the S1 firmware updates.

Sadly, HLG clips the highlights a lot earlier than V-Log. Problematically so. Both 422 and 420 internally recorded codecs show the issue. The 422 codecs are also lower bandwidth (150mbps vs 200mbps) and h.264 instead of h.265. I'll try writing Panasonic support and see what they think. Maybe the V35 input transform is technically "incorrect" for the S1 V-Log.

I meant to write, "Neither is anyone forcing you to butt into threads you have no knowledge about." My apologies, I missed the memo that since you don't have a way to view HDR then none of us should talk about it. Must be nice to have the universe revolve around yourself.

Again with the gear shaming! Can you read the name of this website? No one is forcing you to shoot video with a photo camera. My god, only peasants do that! Why are even here, since you think you are too good for this place? Neither is anyone forcing you to butt into threads you have knowledge about. Thanks for nothing Mr. Very Serious Cinematographer person! 👍

😂 Jesus fucking Christ! Correct me if I'm wrong, but you have never even shot with this camera! What the fuck is with this gear-shaming, chroma-shaming, gamut shaming? You come across as a giant asshole. I'm doing an experiment. I want to shoot open gate V-Log 6k on the S1 and I want to grade in ACES for PQ output. It has nothing to do with professional standards. You have no experience with the specifics of this premise, so your supposed advice offers nothing! If I want to shoot full frame 16:9, I can and will shoot the fp. Why not just jump into every thread and tell people to shoot an Alexa? Then they will be serious! Unfuckingreal.

Thanks, Mercer. I've tested the internal 422 codecs and the color banding is there as well. Shooting ISO 4000 instead of 640 hides the issue in noise to a pretty acceptable degree.

My guy, I'm sure your mother is very proud of you. Sadly, she didn't teach you any manners. You have contributed nothing to this thread. Have you ever even shot with this camera? Based on your completely generic suggestions, I suspect not. Your condescenion is unwarranted. Please leave.

Thanks, Panny. I will do this, but the open gate mode is the only mode in the camera which really interests me. Also I think the issue is more to do with compression and noise reduction than 420 vs 422 chroma. And all the modes max out at 150-200mbps. What was your fix? I've been able to mostly hide the issues by adding film grain. I do have a deeper appreciation for the fp's image now. 12-bit at 2400mbps is pretty uncompromised. Not always the most practical in the field, but I think it's worth the trouble if you don't need to shoot a ton of coverage. I look at it a bit like a 16mm film camera. I wish it too had an open gate mode, but you can't have everything.

👍 Cool story, bro. When did this place get so full of unhelpful trolls? WTF?

If It's a matter of preference. If the sensor is there, I want to have the option to use it. For some things I like the 4:3 aspect ratio and don't want to be losing sensor and lens coverage on both axes. If I wanted to shoot something with the Sirui 50mm 1.6x anamorphic lens, the S1 open gate would yield a 2.4:1 aspect ratio instead of a 2.84:1 aspect ratio were I shooting 16:9. I prefer the former. Obviously cropping gives a endless number of alternative aspect ratios for any and every camera, but as a matter of principle I like to crop as little as necessary. My ideal sensor would probably be square.