kye

I think this thread needs a reality check, and luckily Caleb Wojcik just posted one. Some of the points he made were: He loves the image but the camera is a pain to use and so often stays at home in favour of his 2 x C100 mk2 It was expensive, and the battery life, proprietary accessories like touchscreen, storage, media readers, handle, chargers, and everything else cost about $25K US about two years ago In fact it was so expensive that he left it locked up because of fear of using it (despite having insurance) It's hugely heavy and impractical to use, he had to buy four batteries because two wasn't enough, and it basically requires a team to build and operate it In summary - two years ago one of the most affordable cinema cameras cost $20K plus, was such a PITA to use that he didn't take it places, and he used C100s instead. Now in 2018, they release a 4K60 RAW cinema camera that costs less than 10% of the above RED, is smaller than the C100s but a significant margin, gets similar battery life, is easily hand-holdable, works with all kinds of third-party accessories, and comes with a free copy of an industry leading NLE. Anyone who bitches about the battery life, size, cost or anything like that clearly don't have the faintest idea what a real cinema camera is like. Get a grip - you're just embarrassing yourselves.

I don't know about the ergonomics of them (the GF3 is nice though) but the difference I remember was that there was one control configuration that the GF1 had that the later models didn't have, and the reviews I read of the GF1 were saying that was the killer feature. IIRC it was something you don't get unless you got for much larger and more expensive bodies (how the pro bodies have more control wheels) but then the larger bodies aren't as great for travel. Anyway, good times - if only they had built in 8K RAW video and we'd still be using them today!!

Thanks I watched a few reviews of the Oly's and those quirks seemed a pretty big price to pay for me. I do pretty well with the XC10 so I suspect that I have relatively steady hands. I think that's the state of the camera market at the moment, there are cameras with spectacular specs but also significant weaknesses, and real-life always requires a balance of performance across most of the features. The pic I posted is an extreme example but it happens enough for it to be what I need to plan for rather than the exception. With IBIS there are three things that I see to consider: How far the sensor can move How much motion is left when it is stabilising within its working range (stops, EV) What behaviour happens when it gets close to the edges My personal opinion is that how far it can move is more important than how many stops of motion are left. The difference between 5 and 5.5 stops is nothing if one of those sensors can stabilise your hand shake and the other one can't travel far enough and has to let some motion bleed through. If we were to get those two cameras and shake the shit out of them while both were in their working stabilisation range then you wouldn't be able to tell much difference between 5 and 5.5 stops, but if one is within its range and the other isn't then the comparison would be between 5 and 1 stops, or 5 and zero stops, which will be night and day.

I'd encourage you to also do it.. it's a bit of work to set it up, but once it's setup it has very very little maintenance. I auto-pay the hosting invoices and every couple of years I have to renew the domain name, but unless there's a problem that's basically it. If you have tech questions then PM me, happy to help

Interesting video interview of Yosuke Yamane at Photokina on the origin of the S1.. Of note was the part where he says "In developing full frame cameras, we have decided to target professionals in both photography and videography categories". I'm not sure how good the translation on this is, but it's unlikely that it's an error saying that it's targeting professional videographers. He was talking about the ergonomics at the time, but I think it extrapolates. He also spoke about how they've lead the market previously and the culture around their camera development is of new challenges and bringing things to customers that exceeds other companies offerings. Of course, who knows what that really means - 4K RAW, 4K60, 6K, 8K, or if it's just a FF GH5(s), but it's probably a good sign from our point of view about the video specs.

With all the new cameras I guess it's the season for it! On a more serious note, good to hear you were fortunate, and +1 to the advice you gave. I have my own domain name and as such can give every site I sign up for a unique email address. Therefore, when I get put on a SPAM email list I can look at which email address the email is to, and see which site has been hacked. It happens quite frequently and the sites basically never tell you that they've been hacked, so it's going on all the time in the background. The internet used to be like the Wild West, and still is, but now it's like a B-movie version set in the future with AI and hacking and the pirate bay and the Silk Road ???. Luckily there are little islands of refuge like EOSHD

A couple of months ago I shot this little test video to trial if I could give up IS and use the Canon 700D and 18-35 f1.8 as my main setup. I was also inspired by this thread, thus the choice of music. Thoughts and comments are welcome, but remember it was shot and edited in a day or two, so if you want to be critical then be sure to post your own work to show me how it's meant to be done ???

For me it is a simple equation.. if you want IBIS for use with MF / vintage / cine primes then this is the camera. I think that "50 reasons" video is quite compelling.. partly because it wasn't 7 reasons, and because the reasons were "it has feature X and P4K doesn't", not the usual "feature X is 7% better" that these videos are normally full of. The fact that "It's also a stills camera" was only one of the reasons was quite telling I think!!

Sorry to hear you're getting hassled.. maybe Andrew could send them a virtual hand-grenade for being out-of-order! PM sent

Awesome to hear @kaylee When does it premier on EOSHD?? ???

The sad thing for me is that I have an excellent internet connection, but Vimeo still plays badly. I get around it by using a video downloader to download Vimeo videos, watch them and then delete them. So I can't watch a Vimeo video in 1080 (let alone 4K) but the download software can download the video in 4K at faster than real-time (eg, I can download a 4 minute video in under 4 minutes) so it's actually the player and not their servers that's the issue in my case. Either way, YT works fine and Vimeo doesn't.

I love these videos! If only they weren't so misleading... I'd like the "Filmed on ONLY the Pixel 3" version!

I am also interested in old primes, so OIS is out, and I'm sure that most cameras IBIS would do a good job but I sometimes shoot at longer focal lengths or when I'm doing difficult movements and that's where I could use the extra help and want the best IBIS I can get. This is me a few weeks ago in Pomeii doing a fake slider shot: This kind of stuff is why great IBIS can't always be replaced with mediocre IBIS or a gimbal or tripod / monopod / steadicam / shoulder-rig / easy-rig.

I read a few in-depth reviews of the GF1 where people described it as the perfect travel camera (for stills) and that inspired me to buy my GF3 which I found to be excellent in basically every way. IIRC the GF1 had some kind of unique control configuration allowing you to adjust the important parameters, but they changed it on the updated models for some reason. I ended up with the GF3 in full-auto and most of the time it knew what I wanted and left me to think about being creative instead of being a camera technician. That's the way it should be, and many of my best shots came from it. My GF3 even had a metal body, which was appreciated when I dropped it once onto concrete and it hit the corner just next to the LCD - because it was metal it just dented a bit and everything is fine, if it was plastic I fear the LCD would have been collateral damage!

No worries. I agree that neither bitrate is sufficient for our purposes, although they seem to be sufficient for YT bottom line, which is what they were optimised for! It's a pity that Vimeo doesn't provide a good alternative because their quality is much better, but Andrew recently did a poll and more than half have video pausing problems, and a third can't ever watch a video without them (me included).

Good info, thanks I've shot hand-held forever, and even before I was into video I shot a lot of long exposure stills hand-held with tiny cameras, so my jedi gimbal hands aren't too bad. What I want is something to take the edge off. I shoot hand-held because I like the freedom of movement and speed of shooting, but in terms of movement I want somewhere between the shaky-and-distracting-as-crap look of no IS and the too-smooth-slightly-drugged-floaty look of gimbal footage. I would also like to be able to do a passable hand-held pan or tilt if I'm in a pinch. The level of movement from a shoulder-rig is probably about right, but I find myself frequently in situations where there isn't time or space for any kind of camera support so IBIS is where it's at for me.

I did some testing myself to work it out, and long story short is that if you watch a video in 4K (or 1080p60 I am told) then the bitrate of the stream from YT is considerably higher. Here's the thread if you're curious: https://www.eoshd.com/comments/topic/26746-getting-good-video-quality-on-youtube/

If no IBIS then it's a GH5S competitor. Lots of pros use the A7SII for video work on gimbals, so it makes sense to have a version that goes after RED and the like. 4K 120 isn't so far fetched.. The data-rate for it is 4 times that of 4K30, and 8K30 is also 4 times that of 4K30. I don't know where the most difficult part of a data pipeline is, but they're probably very similar engineering challenges. If they're looking to differentiate it from the A7SII then those features will definitely do it, and it will mean that it's not completely replacing the previous model.

@Sage I've just settled on a GH5 and am interested in the GHa products. Can you give a brief outline of how they work? I assume that there are some custom settings or a LUT that you configure the camera with and some other LUTs that you apply in post? Also, does it work with the HLG profile (which will probably be my preferred profile)? I'm grading in Resolve and have had a lot of success grading C-Log by having a WB/exposure node then the conversion node and then the grade, which I understand is how you recommend using GHa? Thanks

Wife talked my into the GH5. I read reviews that the Olympus had better IBIS but was sub-par on everything else, so GH5 it is. I have the XC10 and the IS in it is good but not great and I can get the odd walking follow shot that works out because I've been working on my ninja walking techniques for a while now. Mostly though it's me doing fake tripod shots, pans, or sideways/forward slider shots without moving my feet, so I'm all good with those and they're my bread and butter moves, so it should be great for that

Indeed we were! It depends on the size of the rig you're willing to take. For me, my tolerance doesn't go that far! But in general, yes, that's the best approach. I find that without an easyrig you're taking the full weight of the setup (plus your arms) and eventually that will result in shake from your arms, so an easyrig will help with that too. Dude, you crack me up! I don't think it would take an easy rig to make me look like a doofus.. I'm well on my way already!!

Excellent question.. "VALUE" is a concept that people often find vague and confusing, but it is absolutely critical to what you are trying to do. It's also difficult to describe, but I'll try Value is something that people are willing to pay for. Maybe that payment is in money, maybe it's in their time, maybe it's in their attention. The whole idea of this stuff is that you create something that other people are willing to pay for. If I see that Casey Neistat has posted a video I make a judgement about if it's worth my time to watch it. ie, my time is valuable, but is what I get from watching the video more valuable to me? If so, I will click play and watch it. If I get bored or whatever during the video I will stop watching, but if it keeps being of value to me then I will keep watching. If it's really valuable, I might subscribe, hoping to trade more of my time for more valuable content. If I think it's valuable to other people I will share it. With the release of the BMPCC4K lots of people have shared videos about test footage and first impressions and the like. These people who post those videos do so because the content of the video is valuable (or at least, they think it's valuable). If I watch a video and it's a waste of time I'm not going to share it, unless I think it will be amusing to waste other people's time, which means that I get some amusement, which is valuable to me. One person who got the BMPCC4K posted an 8 hour live stream of them not unboxing it. It got shared because it's kind of funny, considering that everyone else unboxed it with excitement, so seeing someone not care if different and interesting, and gave me a laugh, and I like laughing, so that's valuable to me. Does that make sense? Business used to be pretty simple - people would sell you something for money. Sometimes it was a physical product (carton of milk), sometimes it was their effort (hiring a plumber), sometimes it was their time (getting legal advice, or taking a course). Now things are more complicated and involve lots of people, but ultimately each party involved (the creator, YT, advertisers, etc) each trade something they have for something they don't have that is more valuable to them. Vimeo isn't full. If you start a channel that gives tomorrows winning lottery numbers each day then just watch what happens.... This is where we need to talk about quality. People will follow the best quality providers they can. If Masey Nice-hat starts a YT channel and is better than Casey Neistat then I will prefer watching Macey's videos, and if I only have time to watch one channel, would unsubscribe from Casey. If you make the best content on a service, people will watch, like, share and subscribe, just like the closing comment on every YT video. Peter McKinnon hit 1M subs 9 months after starting his channel, and this is why - he made better videos than most people. The other element is sales.. SALES is telling people about your product. I used to think that sales was a bad thing. The old "pushing people to buy things they don't need and can't afford to impress people they don't like" thing. Now, I think of sales a bit differently. People have time, money, or skills and they also have needs or wants. They want to exchange what they have for things they want or need. Sales is about matching peoples needs or wants to products or services that will genuinely help them. It's about solving problems. If you make a good video or write something good, then going out and telling people about it who would be interested in it isn't pushing at all, it's about helping. People who are bored want entertainment. People who want to know more about the BMPCC4K want information on it. People who want to know how to tie a bow-tie want a (short!) tutorial, preferably with a video or pictures. This is what I mean when I say make something valuable and go out and tell people about it.

After watching a couple of reviews of the E-M1 Mark II it doesn't look that good for video.. Max Yuryev certainly said to skip it. It looks like it's got the best IBIS but the other features are all sub-GH5. The noisy audio pre-amps was surprising. The E-M1 Mark II quotes 5.5EV and the GH5 quotes 5 stops, but it's also how far the sensor can move and tilt as well. Is there a performance difference between the G85 and GH5 IBIS? Think of the bill for foliage! Although, the free manure would lower the fertiliser bill for the garden and partly offset running costs!!

I shoot hand-held but don't like shake, as it doesn't suit the style of my films. I'm looking for the best IBIS to pair with vintage manual lenses, so no dual-IS for me. People raved about the IBIS in the GH5, but I've heard that Olympus have bettered that with the E-M1 Mark II? If so, is that the best IBIS? Basically, I want something as close to a gimbal as I can get in-body. I'm open to digital stabilisation too, as long as it doesn't completely butcher the image quality.

This is true, but not the whole story. The better a camera is the easier it is to get good results from it. If you take two cameras and give them to 1000 film-makers the best operators will make good output from both cameras, and the worst operators will make awful films with both, but it's the people in the middle that might have enough skill to get good results out of the better camera but not enough to get good results out of the less good camera. I think it's about both the people that end up buying it combined with how easy it is to get great results with.