kye

It is where it's heading and I agree. It's just pretty damn difficult to film something today with next years camera! Comparing the P4K to cameras in the future should wait until we get those "P4K vs A7SIII vs Panasonic S1 mkII vs GH7" or "P4K in 2021" threads that are inevitable. Mostly EOSHD talks about cameras in a relatively sane way, but this thread has started to remind me of those smartphone reviewers who give a 1 star rating because the included AI doesn't make their bed for them.

I haven't flown myself, but I've seen a lot of YouTubers go up and it seems like a tough environment. Apart from the motion of the heli I think I've also noticed that it's really windy up there? Especially when you get the doors open and are hovering (not going with the wind) and that's the time you want to take shots! I seem to remember the wind potentially blowing the cameras around a bit. Maybe someone with experience can confirm?

Great thread. Wouldn't it just be a matter of bitrate though? 120 is difficult in those busy deep DoF shots because the amount of data available for each frame is low and the IQ suffers accordingly because there's so much information in the frame to try and fit into that limited data. I never understood why manufacturers didn't just scale the bitrate up with the frame rate - the idea of slow motion is to conform to the native frame rate..

I want IBIS and was also wanting AF until I recently changed approach. If I didn't need either then I would be all over this camera like a rash. I would just buy a few more batteries. If anyone doesn't like changing batteries then get a V-Mount and power it externally, the port is there. If some camera company turns around tomorrow and releases an 8K RAW camera that has 27 years of battery life then it doesn't change how good this camera is, or the fact that there are plenty of battery options, both for the people who want a small setup or those who want to rig it up and have a large one that will run all day. and if anyone doesn't like that it has the word "Pocket" in the name and it doesn't fit in your pockets then I really don't know what to say....

I think this thread needs a reality check, and luckily Caleb Wojcik just posted one. Some of the points he made were: He loves the image but the camera is a pain to use and so often stays at home in favour of his 2 x C100 mk2 It was expensive, and the battery life, proprietary accessories like touchscreen, storage, media readers, handle, chargers, and everything else cost about $25K US about two years ago In fact it was so expensive that he left it locked up because of fear of using it (despite having insurance) It's hugely heavy and impractical to use, he had to buy four batteries because two wasn't enough, and it basically requires a team to build and operate it In summary - two years ago one of the most affordable cinema cameras cost $20K plus, was such a PITA to use that he didn't take it places, and he used C100s instead. Now in 2018, they release a 4K60 RAW cinema camera that costs less than 10% of the above RED, is smaller than the C100s but a significant margin, gets similar battery life, is easily hand-holdable, works with all kinds of third-party accessories, and comes with a free copy of an industry leading NLE. Anyone who bitches about the battery life, size, cost or anything like that clearly don't have the faintest idea what a real cinema camera is like. Get a grip - you're just embarrassing yourselves.

I don't know about the ergonomics of them (the GF3 is nice though) but the difference I remember was that there was one control configuration that the GF1 had that the later models didn't have, and the reviews I read of the GF1 were saying that was the killer feature. IIRC it was something you don't get unless you got for much larger and more expensive bodies (how the pro bodies have more control wheels) but then the larger bodies aren't as great for travel. Anyway, good times - if only they had built in 8K RAW video and we'd still be using them today!!

Thanks I watched a few reviews of the Oly's and those quirks seemed a pretty big price to pay for me. I do pretty well with the XC10 so I suspect that I have relatively steady hands. I think that's the state of the camera market at the moment, there are cameras with spectacular specs but also significant weaknesses, and real-life always requires a balance of performance across most of the features. The pic I posted is an extreme example but it happens enough for it to be what I need to plan for rather than the exception. With IBIS there are three things that I see to consider: How far the sensor can move How much motion is left when it is stabilising within its working range (stops, EV) What behaviour happens when it gets close to the edges My personal opinion is that how far it can move is more important than how many stops of motion are left. The difference between 5 and 5.5 stops is nothing if one of those sensors can stabilise your hand shake and the other one can't travel far enough and has to let some motion bleed through. If we were to get those two cameras and shake the shit out of them while both were in their working stabilisation range then you wouldn't be able to tell much difference between 5 and 5.5 stops, but if one is within its range and the other isn't then the comparison would be between 5 and 1 stops, or 5 and zero stops, which will be night and day.

I'd encourage you to also do it.. it's a bit of work to set it up, but once it's setup it has very very little maintenance. I auto-pay the hosting invoices and every couple of years I have to renew the domain name, but unless there's a problem that's basically it. If you have tech questions then PM me, happy to help

Interesting video interview of Yosuke Yamane at Photokina on the origin of the S1.. Of note was the part where he says "In developing full frame cameras, we have decided to target professionals in both photography and videography categories". I'm not sure how good the translation on this is, but it's unlikely that it's an error saying that it's targeting professional videographers. He was talking about the ergonomics at the time, but I think it extrapolates. He also spoke about how they've lead the market previously and the culture around their camera development is of new challenges and bringing things to customers that exceeds other companies offerings. Of course, who knows what that really means - 4K RAW, 4K60, 6K, 8K, or if it's just a FF GH5(s), but it's probably a good sign from our point of view about the video specs.

With all the new cameras I guess it's the season for it! On a more serious note, good to hear you were fortunate, and +1 to the advice you gave. I have my own domain name and as such can give every site I sign up for a unique email address. Therefore, when I get put on a SPAM email list I can look at which email address the email is to, and see which site has been hacked. It happens quite frequently and the sites basically never tell you that they've been hacked, so it's going on all the time in the background. The internet used to be like the Wild West, and still is, but now it's like a B-movie version set in the future with AI and hacking and the pirate bay and the Silk Road ???. Luckily there are little islands of refuge like EOSHD

A couple of months ago I shot this little test video to trial if I could give up IS and use the Canon 700D and 18-35 f1.8 as my main setup. I was also inspired by this thread, thus the choice of music. Thoughts and comments are welcome, but remember it was shot and edited in a day or two, so if you want to be critical then be sure to post your own work to show me how it's meant to be done ???

For me it is a simple equation.. if you want IBIS for use with MF / vintage / cine primes then this is the camera. I think that "50 reasons" video is quite compelling.. partly because it wasn't 7 reasons, and because the reasons were "it has feature X and P4K doesn't", not the usual "feature X is 7% better" that these videos are normally full of. The fact that "It's also a stills camera" was only one of the reasons was quite telling I think!!

Sorry to hear you're getting hassled.. maybe Andrew could send them a virtual hand-grenade for being out-of-order! PM sent

Awesome to hear @kaylee When does it premier on EOSHD?? ???

The sad thing for me is that I have an excellent internet connection, but Vimeo still plays badly. I get around it by using a video downloader to download Vimeo videos, watch them and then delete them. So I can't watch a Vimeo video in 1080 (let alone 4K) but the download software can download the video in 4K at faster than real-time (eg, I can download a 4 minute video in under 4 minutes) so it's actually the player and not their servers that's the issue in my case. Either way, YT works fine and Vimeo doesn't.

I love these videos! If only they weren't so misleading... I'd like the "Filmed on ONLY the Pixel 3" version!

I am also interested in old primes, so OIS is out, and I'm sure that most cameras IBIS would do a good job but I sometimes shoot at longer focal lengths or when I'm doing difficult movements and that's where I could use the extra help and want the best IBIS I can get. This is me a few weeks ago in Pomeii doing a fake slider shot: This kind of stuff is why great IBIS can't always be replaced with mediocre IBIS or a gimbal or tripod / monopod / steadicam / shoulder-rig / easy-rig.

I read a few in-depth reviews of the GF1 where people described it as the perfect travel camera (for stills) and that inspired me to buy my GF3 which I found to be excellent in basically every way. IIRC the GF1 had some kind of unique control configuration allowing you to adjust the important parameters, but they changed it on the updated models for some reason. I ended up with the GF3 in full-auto and most of the time it knew what I wanted and left me to think about being creative instead of being a camera technician. That's the way it should be, and many of my best shots came from it. My GF3 even had a metal body, which was appreciated when I dropped it once onto concrete and it hit the corner just next to the LCD - because it was metal it just dented a bit and everything is fine, if it was plastic I fear the LCD would have been collateral damage!

No worries. I agree that neither bitrate is sufficient for our purposes, although they seem to be sufficient for YT bottom line, which is what they were optimised for! It's a pity that Vimeo doesn't provide a good alternative because their quality is much better, but Andrew recently did a poll and more than half have video pausing problems, and a third can't ever watch a video without them (me included).

Good info, thanks I've shot hand-held forever, and even before I was into video I shot a lot of long exposure stills hand-held with tiny cameras, so my jedi gimbal hands aren't too bad. What I want is something to take the edge off. I shoot hand-held because I like the freedom of movement and speed of shooting, but in terms of movement I want somewhere between the shaky-and-distracting-as-crap look of no IS and the too-smooth-slightly-drugged-floaty look of gimbal footage. I would also like to be able to do a passable hand-held pan or tilt if I'm in a pinch. The level of movement from a shoulder-rig is probably about right, but I find myself frequently in situations where there isn't time or space for any kind of camera support so IBIS is where it's at for me.

I did some testing myself to work it out, and long story short is that if you watch a video in 4K (or 1080p60 I am told) then the bitrate of the stream from YT is considerably higher. Here's the thread if you're curious: https://www.eoshd.com/comments/topic/26746-getting-good-video-quality-on-youtube/

If no IBIS then it's a GH5S competitor. Lots of pros use the A7SII for video work on gimbals, so it makes sense to have a version that goes after RED and the like. 4K 120 isn't so far fetched.. The data-rate for it is 4 times that of 4K30, and 8K30 is also 4 times that of 4K30. I don't know where the most difficult part of a data pipeline is, but they're probably very similar engineering challenges. If they're looking to differentiate it from the A7SII then those features will definitely do it, and it will mean that it's not completely replacing the previous model.

@Sage I've just settled on a GH5 and am interested in the GHa products. Can you give a brief outline of how they work? I assume that there are some custom settings or a LUT that you configure the camera with and some other LUTs that you apply in post? Also, does it work with the HLG profile (which will probably be my preferred profile)? I'm grading in Resolve and have had a lot of success grading C-Log by having a WB/exposure node then the conversion node and then the grade, which I understand is how you recommend using GHa? Thanks

Wife talked my into the GH5. I read reviews that the Olympus had better IBIS but was sub-par on everything else, so GH5 it is. I have the XC10 and the IS in it is good but not great and I can get the odd walking follow shot that works out because I've been working on my ninja walking techniques for a while now. Mostly though it's me doing fake tripod shots, pans, or sideways/forward slider shots without moving my feet, so I'm all good with those and they're my bread and butter moves, so it should be great for that

Indeed we were! It depends on the size of the rig you're willing to take. For me, my tolerance doesn't go that far! But in general, yes, that's the best approach. I find that without an easyrig you're taking the full weight of the setup (plus your arms) and eventually that will result in shake from your arms, so an easyrig will help with that too. Dude, you crack me up! I don't think it would take an easy rig to make me look like a doofus.. I'm well on my way already!!