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Personally, I'd really appreciate the extra digital zoom capabilities, but for shooting 1080p (as I do) the 6K sensors are just as good and most cameras don't give you the digital zoom options that I'd really like, so the resolution of the sensor is secondary in that sense. Also, if the battery life is crap and it overheats, then it's giving me zero footage rather than even sub-optimal footage, a pretty fundamental issue. The other issue is that if you're using the sensor to get a 4x digital crop (1080p --> 8K) then your lenses will be by far the limit to the quality rather than the sensor. You might find that a 6K sensor upscaled to 8K has the same level of fine detail as an 8K sensor without scaling. Assuming you have a fast enough machine. Many people would argue that any decent machine can edit 4K, but with many cameras shifting to IPB, 10-bit, h265, decoding that footage in real-time is no small feat at all. If I end up with a GH6, which lacks the 2x zoom function from the GH5, then I'd probably just program a mode to be 4K 1:1 and swap to that and then crop in post. Hardly ideal, but would give me a bit more reach and still be downsampled to 1080p.

8K (and more!) seems to be coming, if we want it or not. How important is it to you and what would you use it for?

Unusable is (normally) a word that is relatively useless because: It says that the AF performance falls below some specific threshold of performance that is not quantified and isn't disclosed, so there's no way to know if it will be good enough for your needs. I have determined that Canon and Sony AF is unusable for my needs (seriously - I'm not being dramatic) and I use MF because of that. The word is normally used by people that mostly shoot their mouths off online, but rarely shoot anything other than camera tests (if they shoot at all!) 🙂 If only! The primary purpose for 8K cameras is to sell 8K TVs, so there's no way they're going to let overheating of 8K MILC cameras get in the way of selling 200 million TVs each year! It there any chance they'll release one for this camera? The giveaway might be the little port that it plugs into... Considering that 8K is 16x the data of 1080p, and 6K is only about 8x the data of 1080p, there's quite a substantial difference.

My bad! I didn't see the thread when you posted it. Nothing to see here, please move along....

Was it Fuji that had a screw-on fan that attached to the back of the camera and took power from the camera? or am I remembering another brand?

I think this is an aspect that gets overlooked by people that aren't out filming on their feet all day. My own equivalent is that I have to be able to hold my camera in-hand for a whole day, only resting during breaks for food and bathrooms etc. If it's not in my hand then it's not ready to film and so I miss shots and we all know that even barely usable footage is still better than the shot you didn't get. This is one of the reasons I sold my Sigma 18-35, it was just too heavy.

The press release doesn't say a whole lot: https://company-announcements.afr.com/asx/ams/0f93042b-44f6-11ed-810a-2616002949eb.pdf Atomos states that: "it has completed development of a world class 8K video sensor to allow video cameras to record in 8K ultra high resolution" they "acquired the intellectual property rights and technical team from broadcast equipment firm, Grass Valley five years ago to develop a leading-edge 8K video sensor" and, they are "actively exploring opportunities for commercialisation and is in discussion with several camera makers who are showing great interest" Does anyone know anything about this? @androidlad perhaps? Could this mean that cameras without the Sony sensor look might be forthcoming? Could Atomos be moving into the camera industry? Their external recorders are what, 70% of a camera already - just lacking a sensor and some mics and chips to connect everything up?

Remember kids... when venturing into new camera territory always wear your protective equipment - you never know what dangers lurk in the dark... Has anyone seen a glimpse of the dreaded hammer?

I'd take a 20-bit in-camera audio over a 16-bit one any day... plus the preamps are still likely to be better than most MILCs! But "on a production" really is the differentiating factor, considering that my production is me out in the jungle (urban or otherwise) waving about 1.5kg of camera equipment around and generally hoping not to stick out too much 🙂

If we put a Nagra and a GH5 into a particle accelerator and smash them together do you think that would work? I mean, surely 1992 tech could fit inside the 2017 GH5??? 🙂

I'm still using my GX85 as my pocket cam for small outings and it will be my backup camera for bigger trips with my GH5. While not being the best image quality outright, it's a pocketable fully-manual camera (with focus and exposure assist tools!) MILC with 4K 100Mbps codec, IBIS, and a tilt-screen plus an EVF, it's still one hell of a package.

But what it did make me think of was that maybe someone else should put a much nicer sensor on a board and then see about getting a RAW signal off that. Can you buy sensors from Fairchild individually?

I did contemplate the Raspberry Pi camera when the RAW hack came out, but I realised that it doesn't matter if it gets a RAW hack or not, the hack won't improve its limited DR, ISO performance, and the fact that you'd have to go DIY on the colour science. If I learned anything from the Alexa 35 release, it was that ARRI have an entire department just dedicated to tuning the sensor, and another entire department dedicated to processing the data that comes off that sensor, and both of those happen before the ARRI-RAW data is written to the card. Who is doing that on the Raspberry Pi camera? Some engineer who probably doesn't know anything about imaging except for implementing the standard circuit that the sensor manufacturer put in the spec sheet.

I think that's a direction that many dominant businesses are going - IIRC it's often called a "walled garden" or "closed ecosystem". Essentially, by making people buy everything from you, you can make your products shittier and people will still stay because you've made it harder to leave. If Sony makes their cameras work with other lens manufacturers then you can take your lenses with you to your new system, but if you own Sony everything then there's more things to re-buy, and therefore, a higher cost to switch brands.

In addition to my previous comment, I do recognise the enormous effort it would have taken for Cinemartin to get anywhere close to a working prototype, let alone close to a finished product. However, that doesn't mean that they are exempt from criticism or having fun made out of them. Not being able to take a joke or two for what they are is a character flaw that is quite counter-productive.

It looks like quite a lot of people took that from your post. I definitely did. I also found the joke amusing too.

That's what I was asking, but to put it further into perspective for @IronFilm, I was thinking about 32 vs 16-bit audio, not 24-bit, as cameras only do 16-bit! I know my wallet could afford an external recorder, but the size of my rig definitely can't. Of course, the question is quite theoretical as the chances that a camera implements 32-bit would have to be pretty darn low I'd say!

Interesting and potentially a way to eliminate a serious annoyance / workflow limitation. Crimson Engine did a video recently talking about the things that the market actually wants in a cinema camera, and one item he mentioned was that many formats aren't playable in the OS, so I take that to indicate that there are a decent number of people out there that care about this aspect.

I had to google that! 😆😆😆 Regarding the camera though, I saw this review in my feed - IIRC it's a mixed bag? Is the film for it expensive?

Predicting the future is much harder than people realise. IIRC most people who predict things get them wrong, but there's a cognitive tendency for people to change their memories of their predictions so they weren't wrong (or weren't as wrong as they actually were). I've definitely experienced this when I've predicted something and wrote it down, then later on read my predictions and realised they were worse than I had remembered they were. I hear people regularly predict things and then later on their recollection of their predictions is substantially different to my recollection of their predictions. Writing down your predictions is quite brave, I think. Sharing them with the world even more-so! 🙂

One claim for 32-bit was that you could adjust gain so that you had lots of headroom and therefore wouldn't need a safety track in addition to normal level audio - do you think that 32-bit actually achieves this in reality? I know lots of folks recording video in uncontrolled conditions (e.g. travel or docos) would appreciate a built-in safety track... for me personally, going straight into my camera is always limited to stereo and that means I have to choose between mono+safety or stereo without a safety, when I'd rather just have both.

Unless you have a reason to have part of your signal path in 1080p. I shoot GH5 using the 1080p 200Mbps ALL-I mode so that I can edit in 1080p smoothly on my MBP laptop without rendering proxies. Before I settled on that workflow I did comparisons between the 5K h265 open gate Long-GOP mode, the 4K h264 Long-GOP mode, and the 1080p ALL-I mode, using my sharpest lens, stopped down, on a subject directly lit with harsh lighting and lots of fine detail, and then pixel peed my heart out trying to see differences. They were there, but WOW did you really have to look HARD to find them.

The original claim by @The Dancing Babamef was.... My reply was simply that YouTube is good enough to show the difference between: Resolution X sensor -> Resolution X timeline -> Resolution X YT upload Resolution >X sensor -> Resolution X timeline -> Resolution X YT upload It doesn't matter if X = 4K or 1080p, YT quality on both of them is enough to see differences. I think people form the opinion that YT is completely useless and don't think it can do anything because of the way it handles grain (i.e. a bloodbath) and the high quantity of very low quality uploads where the footage has been crunched way before it made it to YT. I'm yet to understand what makes a YT upload look worse or better, but there is definitely a lot of variation across different channels / videos. In terms of a 4K sensor -> 1080p timeline -> 4K export-> 4K upload, that can benefit hugely from a little bit of sharpening. Most of the people that think that 1080p is completely inferior to 4K are seeing the extra YT bitrate from the 4K YT stream, or are simply looking at sharpness, which is easily compensated for in grading.

I know a small amount about linear power supply design, so if you can get a good image of the circuit board I'd be happy to have a look over it and see what I can see. If it's using a normal AC transformer / rectifier setup then your options will be limited based on the secondary windings that the transformer has. Often transformers will have dual secondaries to enable them to be put in parallel or series depending on if there's 220V or 110V being input. Lots of older products would include some sort of switch that would connect the pins in the right way so you could have either 110 or 220, but I don't see those much anymore. Still, the circuit might be modifiable.

From memory the GH5II wasn't a bad update on the GH5, with a few useful (albeit incremental) improvements. I think it didn't get a lot of attention because it wasn't flashy and due to the fact it wasn't the GH6, but my recollection is that it's definitely a better camera than the GH5.