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thebrothersthre3

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    Panasonic S1 4K 10bit video mode to be present at launch with Hybrid LOG Gamma

    In: Cameras

    Posted

    9 minutes ago, deezid said:

    H264 can store 12 bit video. With a log gamma it can easily store 16 or even more stops.

    Yep, that (and sharpening off as well of course) with real V-Log and V-Gamut would be a killer in its price class.
    But wouldn't it rival a Varicam 35/LT/EVA-1 too much with all image "enhancing" bullshit turned off?

    Yes but the codec will be 10 bit H264 not 12 bit, which I am assuming is more limiting. 

    Atomos Shinobi (monitor only version of the Ninja V)

    In: Cameras

    Posted

    18 minutes ago, newfoundmass said:

    The thing about trying to appeal to shooters on a budget is that there are a lot of affordable options to compete with. Are they as good as an Atomos monitor? No, but there are quite a few sub-$200 that are "good enough" when you factor in price. So much competition out there that I don't really see the point in this. 

    As others have said, I'd just throw down the extra $200 or whatever to get the recorder if I'm spending more than $200-250 on a monitor.

    This will be true if more cameras begin to shoot in ProRes and/or RAW, but I think there will always be a market for external recorders until that happens. 

    Yeah I don't see why internal prores hasn't happened yet. I guess for less pro users smaller files are appealing.

    The 4K Fuji X-T2 is here

    In: Cameras

    Posted

    2 years later and these are selling used for around $500! Just got one about a week ago. Its really not a bad camera for what you get. Great color science, internal log, downsampled 6k with decent rolling shutter, respectable low light performance. 3 years from now it will be amazing what cameras like the XT3 or GH5S or Nikon Z6 might be selling for. 

    Shot this a couple days ago with the XT2. 

     

    Atomos Shinobi (monitor only version of the Ninja V)

    In: Cameras

    Posted

    20 minutes ago, KnightsFan said:

    I wonder if Atomos is seeing the end of mainstream external recorders in the coming years. For a while, Atomos had a niche market of being the best option for people on a budget to record higher quality footage. Back around 2014, I had discussions about external recorders, and my position was that they were a bad long term investment, since I thought it was only a matter of time before internal recording was higher quality. Now we've got several photo/video hybrids and budget video cameras that shoot 10 bit, and even a couple that do 422, essentially removing the benefit of an external recorder as far as quality goes. I know there are still benefits to external recorders and will be for the near future, but as internal codecs and formats continue to improve, I predict that fewer people will buy external recorders.

    I think it's smart for Atomos to both pursue higher quality with ProRes Raw, and to also expand to building dedicated monitors for the market that is satisfied with improved internal recording.

    As far as this product, it has some cool features. I'm sure it's a fantastic screen, and the Analysis tool looks amazing. I would prefer more physical buttons and less reliance on touchscreen, though.

    I agree on the touchscreen part. 

    I'd get an external recorder if Fuji offered CDNG 12bit 444 output. 

    Atomos Shinobi (monitor only version of the Ninja V)

    In: Cameras

    Posted

    I'll probably pick on of these up when they start popping up used. 

    I think having a bigger screen is super useful and I really have no need to record externally. This one is pretty bright and has half the power consumption of a Ninja V as well as being half the weight. For me 5in is the ideal size. Bigger than that and its too bulky for small SLR's. 

    The Nikon Z6 will be the firat consumer camera to output 12 bit video

    In: Cameras

    Posted

    6 minutes ago, DBounce said:

    12 bit, 444 and raw are important if green screen or correcting for exposure are important. But generally not so important. I’m mostly shooting 8 bit on the C200. It’s nice to have the option of higher bit depth, color or raw, but there are trade offs in speed and size that take precedence imo.

    Then there are things that make life easy every time you go to shoot. Things like reliability, AF, ergonomics, menu navigation, media type, flippy screen, etc...

    Combine that with easy post processing and you end up with a camera that is a pleasure to work with. 

    Definitely and I'm mostly in the same boat. However for those who do need it there's now an option in a very compact cheap package, with a pretty remarkable full frame sensor. 

    Panasonic S1 4K 10bit video mode to be present at launch with Hybrid LOG Gamma

    In: Cameras

    Posted

    3 minutes ago, Cliff Totten said:

    So S1 HLG is capped at roughly 12 stops. We know full VLog is coming as a paid upgrade. However, if they keep it capped at 12 stop in VLog as well?....that makes the upgrade far less attractive. You might as well get the same 12stops in HLG and record to ProRes from the S1's 10bit HDMI.

    I would love to be a fly on the wall in Panny's HQ meetings about the S1. I would love to listen to them debate each other on how they properly cripple the S1 to protect the EVA-1 and Varicam....as well as this new L-Mount camcorder in development.

    Why would they advertise full Vlog if it will be capped? I don't know if HLG is capped, it may be just the sensor in video mode doesn't get that great of dynamic range. Its only doing 10 bit HEVC. But yeah I agree, the upgrade wouldn't be worth it if Vlog isn't offering more dynamic range. I take that back, the good thing about Vlog is there are a ton of LUTS for it. The other good thing is H264 in vlog will be edit ready(for some systems). HEVC is kind of unusable without transcoding for most people. I wonder if 72mpbs HEVC is equal to H264 150mbps.

    I kind of doubt the S1 will take away from Varicam sales much. I can't see anyone wanting to get a Varicam settling on an S1. 

    Clearing up the utter bull**** in this Tony Northup Panasonic S1 video

    In: Cameras

    Posted

    5 hours ago, Kisaha said:

    Very true, ergonomics (except some measurement facts, like screen brightness/viewfinder quality/limited touch screen capabilities/e.t.c) are somehow subjective.

    Personally, I am considering the GH5 - especially with m43 lenses - a bit bigger and heavier that I wanted it to be, and A7 cameras (even the iii) a bit smaller and lighter, especially for full frame lenses.

    The P4K is "unnecessary" wide!

    Can you comment on other aspects of the S1 experience? AF? Overheating? Menu and operation similarities with the GH5?

    I find the GH5 body perfect in terms of comfortable handling. I like small bodies as long as the grip is nice (the original BM Pocket is a good example). However I'd gladly take a larger body if If a smaller one means overheating. Everyone has different preferences of course. 

    I actually think the Fuji cameras are a good compromise for smaller body and smaller lenses. Their 23, 35 and 50mm f2 are tiny, and the 18-55 is pretty small too considering its a zoom lens. Again though the grip on the XT3 and 2 is too small for my taste, I'd prefur an XH1 size body. 

    Panasonic S1 4K 10bit video mode to be present at launch with Hybrid LOG Gamma

    In: Cameras

    Posted

    9 hours ago, sanveer said:

    I would start believing real dynamic range figures once DXOlabs get their hands on the S1 series. Many othe sites have infamous figures, both dubious as well as uninspiring. 

     

    It's not a BSI sensor. That was clearly listed at a few places including the Dpreview.com comparison with other 24MP mirrorless full frame cameras. Apparently the new micro lens arrangement would have an issues with a BSI sensor (light fall off due to angle of incidence, and introducing all kinds of colour and other noise). Also the improvement in low light between FSI and BSI could apparently, be easily negated by the new micro lens architecture (along with sensor design and some great processing).

    Which also explains why Panasonic is completely averse to PDAF because they don't want to substitute missing portions of the image and improve parts of the image by heavy processing (I personally don't agree with their viewpoint). 

    Not according to the kind folks at Cinema5d.com. According to them the difference in more in the ballpark of 1 stop (or about 0.8 stops on the GH5s, being 9.9 stops for HLG and 10.7 stops for VLog-L). 

    Thats odd, people I know have found more dynamic range in HLG. Which to me makes sense as Vlog dynamic range is capped on the GH5 and GH5S. HLG having a half stop more DR brings the GH5S closer to the BMPCC4K, which makes sense because they both share a similar sensor. 

    IMHO the best test of dynamic range to me is over under tests on human subjects. You can see where skintones become unusable and its just more practical then those charts Cinema5d uses. Just in terms of noise for instance the XT3 shadows are cleaner than the original BM Pocket, however the pocket maintains colors much better where the XT3 starts looking washed out. 

    The Nikon Z6 will be the firat consumer camera to output 12 bit video

    In: Cameras

    Posted

    The Z6 certainly has drawbacks but external recorder or not Full Frame 12 bit 444 is a really cool option for $2500 or under. Motion Cadence is not something that can be fixed in post but getting 12 bit 444 out of 10 bit files isn't something that can happen either. I don't think anyone other than the types that hang out on these forums will call you out on motion cadence. If one needs auto focus switching to internal recording is not a bad option. Nikon lets you import custom profiles to the camera so no internal log is not really a big issue IMO. I can say I am pretty excited about what Nikon will do next, not so much for Canon. 

    Saying that I am certainly the type to chase the film look or else I wouldn't have purchased the original BMPCC and have pretty much decided not to purchase any full frame cameras. 

    Anything cheaper than the FS5 for 4k120 RAW?

    In: Cameras

    Posted

    The Pocket 4k will probably be my next purchase in 2020. The URSA mini 4k is tempting too but its hard to beat the Pocket's size and price point, and image quality for that matter. 

    The FS700 odyssey combo is amazing but I don't think I'd like the ergonomics. There is a thread going on DVXuser about if the FS700 is worth it in 2019, everyone was still happy with theirs and weren't even planning on switching, that says a lot. 

    What type of connector is this????

    In: Cameras

    Posted

    1 hour ago, androidlad said:

    It's Nikon proprietary, non-standard DC connector

    ah that makes sense, thanks man

     

    48 minutes ago, Cinegain said:

    Yeah

    But you can probably get like a Andoer / third party more traditional plug one...

    -- https://www.aliexpress.com/item/EP-5C-4-0mm-1-7mm-EP5C-EP-5C-DC-Coupler-EN-EL20-EN-EL20-dummy/32819120166.html

    Yeah I wanted to get it from a US supplier so it will come faster, the ones with the Nikon plugs are a lot cheaper I wanted to save a few dollars lol. I could always cut off the plug and replace with a traditional DC plug.

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