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I think the S1 will hold off with RAW external until after the S1H is introduced. That will hurt sales of the S1H and also confuse marketing. Have you compared the S1 to the Z6? Looks like I might need to save up for the S1. Are the S1native lenses good for cine manual focus? And the release a camera and then wait for additional features to be added will not last long if companies keep doing this.

When do you think RAW will be released? Do you think Panny will give RAW to the S1 so soon with the S1H hitting the market?

Did Atomos say how much better Nikon's ProRes RAW will be compared to there 10 bit external video? And based on the conversations you had with them when do you see RAW hitting the Z6 and Z7? This update and what Atomos is doing is really going to set these cameras apart and draw a before and after line in the sand. Have you seen any Nikon RAW footage in person?

Canon will bounce back. Market share can drop but Canon still produces quality products and beautiful images. They have all the tech know how to pull anything off based on high end cine cameras and lenses. They do have to show the consumers some kinds of road map moving forward. How will they address the cine line, the low end consumer and the pro-consumer line ups. Today's cameras and video is vastly superior to gear that came out 5 years ago and the proof is the C100, Canon Ti and Andy A7 model from back then. Video specs have been pushed beyond what theses camera could do 5 years ago. Lenses do have a long shelf life but there is a reason why cameras get retired and you can't buy them anymore. It's also crazy to think how dominant Canon could be if they would lead the way in providing up to date specs and innovation. Here's to Canon and them actually listening to what consumers want.

Sorry but Nikon hasn't done a disservice to the people that bought the Z6 or Z7. I posted info today from Atomos and in two different social media areas they said ProRes RAW is coming later this year. This isn't just Nikon saying this but Atomos the company they teamed up with. I'll say it again this is from today and not 3 months ago. In todays market and You Tube speed of light blow back, if you give a date for an upgrade or release and you delay that delivery, the You Tube influencers will damage your company beyond repair. So please everyone don't listen to a pure Nikon hater as to when and what's coming next from Nikon or Panasonic. In summary Atomos is the one paying the fees to RED for producing RAW video record on the Atomos. That's Atomos and exactly why people us their products. Nikon does not pay that fee and neither do other companies that are relying on external RAW recording. That really sums up why Atomos and Nikon and Sony's FS5 go external to record ProRes RAW. Here's one update from Atomos about teaming with Nikon's and delivering ProRes RAW.

I was just saying Cine Gear was happening. Atomos will be there.

No he's not. There's no default setting. Why didn't he shoot everything on vivid profile? It's not the same on any camera. Max doesn't know how to set these cameras up or is being deceitful. No Z7 camera looks like that out of the box.

More Info about ProRes RAW and Atomos Nikon

Atomos on Facebook. ProRes RAW is coming to the Nikon Z6 and Z7

I noticed the software updates also. The Z6 footage looked great. Did the Z6 always have timecode setting with the Z6? Doe this make it pass Netflix specs as a A Cam? Not more then any other camera company. I am getting antsy also waiting for at least an announcement on ETA. Who has Atomos or Nikon connections? Give us a a little info. Here' you go everyone. Atomo response to a You Tube comment.

I agree. My issue with the Kinefity is availability, lack of reviews and comparisons to BM and Z-cam. You have to give Z-Cam credit for being transparent and an A for effort. The Z-Cam has no display screen so you have to have the Ninja or higher screen recorder out of the gate. Z-Cam seems determined to make it's mark in cine world. What gives you that idea? Nikon and Atmos announced it they said it comes out in 2019. Look how long people waited and wait for the P4K. If you have solid info pass it on but the knee jerk reactions are crazy. Atomos is more invested in ProResRaw then Nikon and it's going to happen.

For all the Z6 owners. How are you using the Z6? Anyone have the Ninja? What are the good and bad characteristics of the Z6 that you've had to deal with?

3 BlindMean does lots of video work and he's a good knowledgeable You Tuber. That 85 f1.8 will look amazing paired with the Z6 for video. Anyone looking into this don't listen to the negative ones. Good post @Timotheus This is happening in October for east coast people. Cine Gear Expo Atlanta http://www.cinegearexpo.com/atlanta-expo?sf199520077=1

No I paid $1,950 for my Z6 with 50mm 1.8 and 64g XQD card. And I sold my A6500 to help pay for the Z6. So my Nikon Z6 was actually a good investment on my part. It's already paid for itself X 7 over. If I buy the Atomos Ninja for it to record 12 bit ProRes RAW from the Z6, then I pay them one time. And that's it. The Ninja has other features and looks like a great product. So how much am I paying Atomos for that Ninja? That Atomos HDMI cable is $30 on Amazon. Thanks @webrunner5 You needed to cus at me and throw out insults and the minute you're proven wrong you run and hide. That's not very noble of you my friend. To everyone else I'm sorry for engaging the same was with runner5. Thanks to everyone for providing information in this thread. Upward and Onward.

You said Nikon and Atomos would pay out the ASS. Nikon and Canon and Sony don't have to pay because "Atomos DID have a patent agreement with ProResRAW" So you were wrong again. Nikon wouldn't have to pay because Atomos is covering that part.

Sorry @webrunner5 you should have looked at Atomos' business model. I did and figured it out.

I would call you a dickhead but I'm trying to ignore that you called me an ignorant bastard. Your own comments above contradicts you last 4-5 post that RED won't let it happen, etc, etc. You defended that to the end of days and now I'm an ignorant bastard and so much so that you come back and say "Nikon and Atomos is going to have to pay for Everything they sell to Red on that camera". Who the fuck cares if Nikon and Atomos has to pay RED? Are you that stupid that you have to change the argument that you lost from RED won't allow Nikon to do RAW to "Nikon and Aromos have to pay RED to output RAW". No shit Sherlock. That's what Atomos built that side of its company on. RAW out pout to Atomos recorders. I since you have old brain I'll break it down further and say Atomos is probably paying Red and not Nikon or Canon or Sony when those brands record out to one of the Atomos recorders. You clearly don't understand the output RAW to the Atomos and how that probably observes Nikon of any infringements. That actually would explain why Nikon is going RAW out to an Atomos and not internal. This puts the burden on Atomos to deal with RED. RED also didn't lose that suite to Sony.

And Sony sues RED. https://www.forbes.com/sites/erincarlyle/2013/04/08/sony-strikes-back-at-jim-jannards-red-patent-infringement-lawsuit/#4809657c2e28 Did you read the article? Did Sony destroy all the F5 cameras and stop selling them? NO You take a little information and try and make it fact. Here's a question: Why WOULD RED care what Nikon does with 12 bit Pro Res RAW? They don't. Sony is already using ProRes RAW with the FS5 externally. Again RED is not filing suit and going after Nikon or stopping them from releasing ProRes RAW from the Z6. Yes you summed up what I found online. Firewater / Webrunner 5 seemed to remember or do a search about RED and is trying to claim RED is stopping Nikon from releasing RAW to the Z6. RED didn't win that suite. The F5 is still being sold. Time to put up or shut up with your non-sense post.

I did not dig deep enough to know Sony SemiConductor was doing it's own thing or was able too. Here's why it's great for us and not for Sony, and that it Sigma, Nikon, Panasonic, etc, etc are pushing the development and output that that sensor can do. People think Nikon is doing very little to take advantage of the Sony sensor it uses and that the sensor is doing all the work. That's simply not true. Nikon knows it has a brand name that only Canon can compete with. I wouldn't be surprised if Nikon release a S1H type Z camera. Why? Because it would support the same Z lens mount, Nikon is already cracking the video code and it's part of the same process that Nikon uses if they build the Z8 or Z9 next ben cameras. I really don't think the S1H is going to be the only camera with those specs. It's all about money.

Sony Shares Specs for Six Full-Frame Sensors, Including a Quad Bayer Chip https://petapixel.com/2019/07/25/sony-shares-specs-for-six-full-frame-sensors-including-a-quad-bayer-chip/

Thanks Cliff If you look at the latest firmware from Nikon for the Z6, they fixed a lot of smaller issues that seemed like house cleaning. It may not be connected to Pro ResRAW but it's good they addressed issues and updated the firmware. Once the Pro ResRAW is released for the Z6 would it be better to get the Shogun 7 over the Ninja V? Does anyone know the price point of the Sigma cine camera? It seem like Sony opened a can of whoop ass on itself with selling the IMX410 to the competitors. Why? because all these other companies are beating Sony to the market with cine cameras that out perform Sony cameras. It makes you wonder what Sony's game plan is.

That's my point. You don't know the newer stuff but you jump around like you do. Again post WHAT THE RENTAL HOUSES SAY. Please. I want to hear that one. Rental houses aren't touching the Z6 or S1 right now and they rent cine gear. They also know as much as we do on RE RAW and Pro Res RAW and legally what issues hav happened or might happen. Rental houses will get into the S1H and then the S1 because the cost to rig these out hits that rental mark. DP's are great tat the craft they do and they have knowledge that is valuable but they also get left behind by technology so much that they don't shoot anymore. I know 70 year old DP's that are still shooting in Hollywood. I also know DP's that are technical shooters that have no cinematic bone in their body. You say you don't give a rats ass about photography but photography and cinematography are connected. That's were you come off as a non creative shooter and not a cinematographer. . Good post Zeng. It goes to show people on this board with watch You Tube influencers and drink the Sony Kool-aid but not be able to weed thru the bull that's been thrown at the Z6. The Z6 is as solid as the S1 from what Ive seen.

Hey Lukas - I haven't used the S1 yet. I have used the Z6 on commercial video gigs and even next to the FS7. Advantages of the Z6: - AF tracking is great in video - Adapted lens selection is massive - IBIS is solid - I think the S1 might be better but source footage from he S1 showed the same issues as the Z6 (neither is perfect as you get digital image morph on the S1 at times) - 12 bit RAW Pro Res is coming so that could be important if you need it Back up your talk then webrunner5. You keep talking like Jethro who's taking to many shots last night. Please post links on where you get all your knowledge and how Nikon is full of it for telling everyone they are giving the the Z6 12 bit RAW capabilities. I've asked you over and over to explain yourself and you go on a long RED rant that at some point had ordered and then changed your mind because they were talking too long. You don't make sense and you don't back up anything technical with facts or proof. You vocabulary has been plastic faces, crushed darks, and it sucks ass. You probably also said "shit color" over when you defended Sony over Canon a week ago. Please share you knowledge and tech us all.

What are you talking about? Nikon to Atomos to Pro Res RAW is what were talking about. RED RAW to Atomos will be the same issues for any camera maker including Nikon, Sony and others for RED to approve. Nikons RAW is Pro Res and nothing to do with RED. Nikon has already shown Pro Res 12 bit RAW footage from the Z6 and it was't compressed to hell. You can articulate what your talking about because technically you're not up to date on Nikon RAW and what's been show or how it will work. Pro Res RAW is already out on the market thru Apple and RED didn't stop it did they? Who controls the market RED or Apple? Seriously give up on the Nikon hate because they delivered a great camera and great video from a camera that shares the same Sony sensor as the S1. Your post are You Tube influencer hatred for no reason. And again Nikon just released it's third firmware update for the Z6. As of now they are keeping the schedule as promised. Hey Geoff_L - I know you don't want to compare the S1 and Z6 yet but can you give any feedback on how the S1 video was compared to the Z6? And has the S1 been used on a gimbal yet or is the weight and size an issue?

You're flat out wrong. Nikon's color science is Nikon. (you're the guy that defended Sony's color science just last week). I posted samples of test video I shout with my Z6 and you say nothing. Why is that? I haven't shot with the S1 but the comparisons I have seen and video from the S1 looks very close to the Z6. I said this from day one. You have shot, graded or worked with any Z6 or S1 footage. Put up some links that back up your comments. I have as good an eye as anyone else and to be honest I hope the S1 is better then the Z6. I'm all for that. Nikon just released firmware 2.01 and this is from Nikon that never did this in the past. 12 bit RAW Pro Res is coming and RED has nothing to do with it. RED can't stop Pro Res RAW. Take a look down this page and see that little Nikon Z6 on the page. https://www.atomos.com/proresraw