jgharding Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 I'm engrossed in this one, it's fascinating! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FilmMan Posted September 9, 2012 Author Share Posted September 9, 2012 JGHarding, You'll like this. 1% added this today. [b][i]In daylight it still works, ramp down is good, ramp up is a little too fast I think. 1 second polling for BR and buffer is a little too slow, would like .5 seconds. Bit rate is a little bit jaggy (follows card write) but better quantizer used overall than CBR function or VBR function and mostly stops overruns unless they happen really suddenly or scene is already too big to encode. I set buffer warning to like 50/60% and had success at ISO 80-2500. [color=#FF0000][u]Low points of BR are usually above default rate of 40.[/u][/color] Footage is overall 1GB per minute. A 7minute continues shot was ~7GB. [color=#FF0000][u]Average BR is over 120, peaks 160-200.[/u][/color] The drop downs aren't really noticeable in watching, I have to see if they show up in post but I doubt they will as BR at worst quantizer is still usually very high. [/i][/b] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgharding Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Wow! That's quite some bitrate control! For the sort of work I do 1GB per-minute is fine, awesome, let's keep watching and hope this matures into a release... :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgharding Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 If they can get it to work up to 3200 and 6400 ISO that'll be great for the low-light shoots that I love so much... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXX Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 I didn´t even understand half of the programmers talk, but I´m exited nevertheless ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FilmMan Posted September 10, 2012 Author Share Posted September 10, 2012 Sounds interesting. Perhaps too hopeful or not? 1% programmer: [i]600D already does ALL-I 176mbps.. I've gotten past 200 for short periods. I'm actually trying to slow it down at this point. Card sustained is only 160. T4i will probably do like 400mbps in UHS-1. 2k and 4:2:2 can probably happen if we get at what's being fed to the encoder.[/i] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FilmMan Posted September 11, 2012 Author Share Posted September 11, 2012 Latest from 1% programmer. A very interesting read... [b]Quote[/b][indent][b]because there is no interframe dependence[/b][/indent] [b][i]Yep, I frame dropped from buffer almost immediately. P frame sticks around for a while while its doing more passes, etc. The P frames are only a little bit more compressed and really the main reason to use them is file size/buffer. 1GB a minute is hardcore no matter how you do it. Also, no B frames yet... Gop3 is where its closer to old file sizes and doesn't write almost all the time. I think the I frame has to be like 10-15% bigger for the same quality so instead of a decent 130mbps you end up at 160-170mbps and you actually do crash if the encoder slows down or the card does. Should test gop of 2,3-6... any more than that and too much is held in the buffer. Qscale drops like a stone when the buffer warning comes on but it ramps up right away with the faster polling. You can turn on debugging and watch it. Qscale with canon functions only moved by one. With slice you can go from 128 to 87 instantly. [color=#FF0000]I think canon was really going for consumers and smaller files rather than quality. They want you to buy a more expensive camera rather than using a 600D, etc. [/color]The weird thing is that they don't like offering swappable lenses on their camcorder offerings. Heavy grading will really show if the bit rate dips matter or not. If a few frames get all funky out of a whole sequence then we'll know. Other cameras: 50D = Did not change gop. 550D = no breaking 4gb limit so you'll have all of 4 minutes of footage. 60D = untested for both limit and gop. T3 = can probably pull it off 5d3 = different encoder, different hacks 5d2 = don't have one and nobody has really looked in on it. Encoder also slightly different. CF cards should in theory do more than 20MB/s write. A1ex has one so he'd be the guy to try it. But still have to hack the 4gb limit and 5d2 is the same generation as 550D so maybe only 32bit value for file size [img]http://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/Smileys/default/sad.gif[/img] What's left? MJPEG might end up giving better results and actual full frame video, none of this 1600x960 crap. Although maybe native recording and resizing later might give better results for regular H.264 than in camera resized 1920x1080. [color=#FF0000][size=6][u]I can continually take shots at S1 which is like 2592x1728 so 2k video seems possible. [/u][/size]Ma[/color]x file size per frame would be like .83MB to get 24p out of that. .67 for 30P... not a whole lot of room. SD interface max speed at 48mhz is 25MB but no card seems to want to keep up. How good can you get at that data rate? Line skip is likely so it can fit the entire frame into reduced resolution without resizing the whole image and taking up CPU time, etc. It IS controllable since 600D has 1:1 crop and even zooming. But the issue will be that the frames are bigger and more complex to encode.. hence static and trees are very evil. Right now, encoder in the hand is worth 2 in the theoretical stage. [/i][/b] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FilmMan Posted September 11, 2012 Author Share Posted September 11, 2012 Let's keep our fingers crossed. Not a for sure deal though. Be hopeful. There is now a fair bit of talk of [b]4:2:2 and 2K.[/b] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P4INKiller Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 Man, am I glad I did not sell my 550D. Best of luck to these people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgharding Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 2K 4.2.2 sounds lovely, though I'd be happy if they just get this ALL-I high bitrate out into our hands :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hidalgoserra Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 Sorry for the super lame question, but there is no 7d in the list? im missing something? thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FilmMan Posted September 11, 2012 Author Share Posted September 11, 2012 [quote name='hidalgoserra' timestamp='1347372434' post='17769'] Sorry for the super lame question, but there is no 7d in the list? im missing something? thanks [/quote] No 7d. Internals different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hidalgoserra Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 Thanks filmMan holy crap, so no turnaround? hacks or magic spells to have it working on it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgharding Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 No one has yet managed to run any code on the 7D properly as far as I know. It's a bit of a lost cause, when the 550D and 600D have much better image quality through ML2.3, and 7D support hasn't even begun. The only benefit of the 7D is weather proofing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FilmMan Posted September 11, 2012 Author Share Posted September 11, 2012 [b]From the Magic Lantern site:[/b] [b]7D support[/b] We didn't give up, but we are not able to start the main firmware from user code. Currently it is possible to blink the LED and draw on the screen, but that's all. The problem is the dual DIGIC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigelbb Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 [quote name='jgharding' timestamp='1347377497' post='17776']It's a bit of a lost cause, when the 550D and 600D have much better image quality through ML2.3, and 7D support hasn't even begun.[/quote]I thought that the image quality of all the Canon APS-C sensor DSLRs was the same. They are using the same sensor after all & Magic Lantern is more about improving functionality than anything else (unlike the GH2 hack which doesn't alter functionality at all). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt2491 Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 This is friggin exciting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FilmMan Posted September 12, 2012 Author Share Posted September 12, 2012 Hey everyone, Andy600 from Magic Lantern had two 3 second clips put up for a quick look via download. He was testing the higher bitrates. I downloaded his clips and color graded one of them. It is posted below. Note: The clip he had for download was compressed, so I was working with compressed footage. It was very robust to grade even though it wasn't the original. Forgive me for my color grading as I use a tv as a monitor. His camera was the Canon 600D. [url="http://vimeo.com/49267057"]http://vimeo.com/49267057[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgharding Posted September 13, 2012 Share Posted September 13, 2012 [quote name='nigelbb' timestamp='1347387943' post='17781'] I thought that the image quality of all the Canon APS-C sensor DSLRs was the same. They are using the same sensor after all & Magic Lantern is more about improving functionality than anything else (unlike the GH2 hack which doesn't alter functionality at all). [/quote] It is, without the hack applied. Magic Lantern is a much deeper hack now. They've improved the noise level of all the ISO settings, as well as highlight roll-off for certain settings. The 7D is locked to the default bitrate (48mbps I think), while ML2.3 equipped 550D for example, will peak at 120 or so in high ISO high-complexity scenes if you use a fast card, it's far nicer as the noise is easier to remove, it isn't mushed into the image. The higher bitrate footage has more detail and grades a little more subtly. They're also close to cracking All-I 160mbps for 550D, 600D etc. So it really is a hack not only for amazing still and video functionality, but also improving the bitrates of the camera. The release versions are also incredibly stable. My biggest bug-bear with the 7D lack of ML though, beside the lower bitrate, is no live histogram or peaking, I don't think I could do without those now! It is waterproof though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgharding Posted September 13, 2012 Share Posted September 13, 2012 There is a chance that it will be opened up to ML, but a few have tried and failed. It seems the different hardware (two processors) and the like are stopping them from exploiting the camera running code on it. At this stage most people appear to be working on the more popular XXXD models, or the newer 5D iii, so I think the smart bet would be to write off ML on 7D. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.