Shining a light - Sony A7S II first impressions & 4K S-LOG 3 clips for download / grading

[Rand Thompson]

Nice, at the end of the day, if you're in the right places and build the right relationships, you're going to get amazing footage no matter what camera you use. So good luck and have fun! I'll be shooting my first big (well, short at around 30mins) documentary early next year in London and am slowly putting all the gear together so I can be the ultimate one man band.

Good Luck to you!!  Hopefully in the not too distant future I will be able to say the same. However, for now, my talent level will be keeping me on vimeo  with my 1:30 to 3:30 minute videos with unlicensed music.

[Liam]

Good Luck to you!!  Hopefully in the not too distant future I will be able to say the same. However, for now, my talent level will be keeping me on vimeo  with my 1:30 to 3:30 minute videos with unlicensed music.

have a recommended license free music source?

[Rand Thompson]

have a recommended license free music source?

 I've been too lazy to even look for one. Plus, most of the licensed music that I do hear with videos on the net just seems overly generic.

[Liam]

 I've been too lazy to even look for one. Plus, most of the licensed music that I do hear with videos on the net just seems overly generic.

sorry, I meant license-free (unlicensed). like where you get the music you do use

[Rand Thompson]

sorry, I meant license-free (unlicensed). like where you get the music you do use

All of the music you may hear in any of my vimeo videos all come from my own personal music library collection.

[Liam]

All of the music you may hear in any of my vimeo videos all come from my own personal music library collection.

alright, just curious, and off-topic. thanks

[Rand Thompson]

alright, just curious, and off-topic. thanks

No problem Liam.

I may have used the wrong term. When I said "unlicensed" I meant music I didn't get a license from the artist to use.

[William Reynish]

Went to see a soccer match and tested out the 1080p slow mo in the a7sII. All 100p. Really annoying that you can't pick 120p when in PAL mode. You can't even switch to NTSC mode on the fly. If you do, the camera erases your card! The whole idea of using the concept of PAL/NTSC is really stupid. Just let me pick the framerate I want

In general, this is a great camera, slightly let down på crap menus, crappy button layout, crappy record button, stupid inability to use the shutter release for movie recording, etc. It's great engineering with a pretty rubbish UI. Really a shame that Sony doesn't seem capable of making a good, simple, quick user interface. Instead its over complicated, convoluted, slow, with loads of wading through illogically organised menus. Come on Sony, fix the UI!

 

 

 

 

[BrorSvensson]

Went to see a soccer match and tested out the 1080p slow mo in the a7sII. All 100p. Really annoying that you can't pick 120p when in PAL mode. You can't even switch to NTSC mode on the fly. If you do, the camera erases your card! The whole idea of using the concept of PAL/NTSC is really stupid. Just let me pick the framerate I want

In general, this is a great camera, slightly let down på crap menus, crappy button layout, crappy record button, stupid inability to use the shutter release for movie recording, etc. It's great engineering with a pretty rubbish UI. Really a shame that Sony doesn't seem capable of making a good, simple, quick user interface. Instead its over complicated, convoluted, slow, with loads of wading through illogically organised menus. Come on Sony, fix the UI!

 

 

 

 

I shoot the sony A7 which have the same wierd ntsc/pal problem. I shoot my regular 25fps stuff on one card and have one setup up for 60p slowmotion. Its not a great solution but atleast it works.

[Jara Moravec]

Andrew, could you also add to your tests 5D RAW - I am sure it is one of the darlings of EOSHD crowd and it would be great to see DR comparison as well as colour rendition. I am seriously tempted by this camera but cannot see it as my A camera - the user experience is horrible - strange ergonomics, too small body, recording button (!), badly organized menus, feels very consumer rather than Canon clear menus. 

Also, watching Andrew's test shots, was the stabilization on? It seems to have a lot of that microjitter as if the stabilization was off. I dare to say 5D with IS lens yields better, smoother results.  

[Nicolas MAILLET]

Andrew, could you also add to your tests 5D RAW - I am sure it is one of the darlings of EOSHD crowd and it would be great to see DR comparison as well as colour rendition. I am seriously tempted by this camera but cannot see it as my A camera - the user experience is horrible - strange ergonomics, too small body, recording button (!), badly organized menus, feels very consumer rather than Canon clear menus. 

Also, watching Andrew's test shots, was the stabilization on? It seems to have a lot of that microjitter as if the stabilization was off. I dare to say 5D with IS lens yields better, smoother results.  

Hi,

 

i've just tested A7SII compared to 5DIII RAW... Dynamic is better with the A7SII. But also definition, stabilisation, compressed codec with a little better results than 5DIII big size files... Even when you have to take pictures : i found an EVF with peaking to be a fantastic choice to make All Manual pictures... i didn't do my focus manually on my 5DIII and i just say to myself this is a good thing as it is fast !!! Optical viewfinder is not enough to adjust your focus... EVF with Sony is just the right choice to be fast and accurate for pictures. I've discovered it today for pictures...

 

In fact i wasn't ready to buy an A7SII and let my 5DIII go... but this evening with the bunch of tests i've done i can't say an other thing that : Bye Bye 5DIII. You've done an excellent job so far during these years, but RAW video is not that enough now... A compressed codec like XAVCS 8 bits gives better results with much much less heavy files... And workflow likes it too... Does'nt have to do .MLV to DNG now... This is true you can't push it too far... but this is what i thought about 8 bits codec (I'm using for the first time) : if you control well the exposure and the color temperature when you shoot, this is all ok in post... RAW video is a bit more forgiving... but not to much...

 

The only major problem (that is a serious one to me) is that reds on A7SII are not true... and i don't know how to tweak it to bring them right... In fact they take some orange tints instead to stay right red...

 

Here is what i think right now... and i can assure you this was not going to sound like this with a poor codec like the Sony one faced to RAW 14 bits... You know what... i couldn't had think i could say this : I love this A7SII... Just a good tool to make some great footage. Not for job more serious of course, as the colors are a bit strange sometimes but a great camera for personal jobs without a doubt.

 

 

 

Even though you're totally right for the tinyness of the camera... and menus etc etc... this is all bad... But with a little practice i think it will be ok. 2 days with it and i'm more familiar... Have some horrible cramps at my fingers though as it is way too small... lol

[Jara Moravec]

Hi,

 

i've just tested A7SII compared to 5DIII RAW... Dynamic is better with the A7SII. But also definition, stabilisation, compressed codec with a little better results than 5DIII big size files... Even when you have to take pictures : i found an EVF with peaking to be a fantastic choice to make All Manual pictures... i didn't do my focus manually on my 5DIII and i just say to myself this is a good thing as it is fast !!! Optical viewfinder is not enough to adjust your focus... EVF with Sony is just the right choice to be fast and accurate for pictures. I've discovered it today for pictures...

 

Hey, thanks for sharing this. As long as you are good at grading, it seems Sony can lead to great results. Any chance to share any of your tests before you say final goodbye to your 5D?

[Nicolas MAILLET]

Hey, thanks for sharing this. As long as you are good at grading, it seems Sony can lead to great results. Any chance to share any of your tests before you say final goodbye to your 5D?

Yes i'll share some tests by the end of the week if i can.

[hmcindie]

I read those "A7s is better than 5d raw" reviews when the first A7s came out. Also when the GH4 came out. They were never really true. Same with the a7s ii.

I just shot with the A7s II, a7r II and the 5draw. Though I used the 5d raw myself, and the rest were b-cams so it wasn't  completely fair comparison. Slowmotion was pretty nice on the A7s ii but that's about it. For short turnarounds, the A7s II like the mark I is better. For stuff where you can fiddle, the 5d raw is still nicer. No compression, no macroblocking, great looking grain etc.

[Alex Moreán]

But 1920x1080 25p or 30p full frame looks good, right? I mean, not like 60p,all pixel binded and broken... 

[Nicolas MAILLET]

Here is a test with big high contrast.

 

Intention was to keep highlights to the maximum and to see where the blacks could go... 5DIII is out of order when speaking of dynamic... Noise is too much for my eyes.

[Nicolas MAILLET]

My sweet fantastic daughter on the beach this morning :

A7SII SLOG 3 Gammut.cine Tiffen VND 23.976 fps 1/50 1600 isos Sigma 35mm 1.4 Art closed to F/2 to avoid vignetting

Graded In Resolve in almost 1 minute...

Some macro blocking due to the VLC grab compression setting

Don't think we have plastic skin tones right here. Pretty ok with this camera... I have some great results in almost all domains compared to a 5DIII. Maybe not a good enough camera for stills i'm ok. Not enough reactive and too small size (12MP).

 

In fact i'm very impressed with this camera. It is far from perfect but it is a pleasure to use SLOG3 on a consumer camera like this. It has its limitations with 8 bits but i'm ok with that, i'm not using it as if it were a 12 bits RAW camera... It sure has limitations, as the most annoying is the yellow spots when you push too far the blacks... but anyway, this is a consumer camera, UHD, image stabilisation, fantastic dynamic range, saving data on SD card, and powered by an Anker astro E7 power bank that lasts more than 12 hours for 45 euros... directly connected to the USB port...

 

WHAT ELSE ?

 

In serious jobs, with good controlled lights, i'm sure an A7SII or an URSA mini would both do the job right... And nobody would still see a big difference... but in bad conditions, the A7SII is here while others are not... My BMCC and BMPCC are great tools even in the dark as it merely sees what my eye can see, and noise is not really a problem when you don't push blacks... But when i compare BMPCC and BMCC to the A7SII... i feel more comfortable with the A7SII even if its colors are less manageable... In fact i've just done some tests by night and poorly lit places, and if you control every shot by double checking the color temperature and the exposure, the A7SII is fantastic... Just ETTR every time and you have always good results... In post, gamma, lift and contrast have to be well controlled with waveform graphic.

By now i'm pretty satisfied from what i can get with this camera, tests in the beginning have been hard, coming from 5DIII RAW, but now i can see how Sony functions with this little camera... More tests to come soon as i'll use it as an A-cam for a project Wednesday.

[hmcindie]

Both of those images look kinda bad. Unfortunately this forum doesn't allow links to images straight? Here's my test:

a7s II (100fps 1080p) after grading:

5d raw (60fps 720p) after grading:

5d didn't shoot her face (different framing so I could pick and choose) so don't mind that. Even in the mode that 5d is usually frowned upon (720p60), it still looks better to me. A7s II is full of little compression artifacts. No compression at all in the 5d raw shots. WAY more color information. Some could say that the A7sII has more information in the shadows. Maybe slightly. But even in this kind off extreme situation the difference is negligible. I'd always pick the 5d raw. And would anyone say that the 1080p slowmo is that much more detailed?

Frame two of the A7s II shot where the explosion was bigger:

Her face was never in the 5d raw shot so don't compare that area haha. Focus was slightly off in the a7s. (not a scientific test but from a shoot)

 

[blafarm]

So, now that the firmware fix has been released, and since you previously indicated that Part 2 was already written, I'm looking forward to reading it.