Nikon D5 versus Canon 1D C for cinematic 4K video - which wins?

[Shield3]

The D5 doesn't do anything better than the 1D C at all and it isn't even cheaper if you consider the used prices of the 1D C.

Also there are a few unknowns about the D5 such as how well the codec holds up. H.264 4:2:0 at lower bit rates will have to go some to beat 500Mbit/s 4:2:2 MJPEG.

The 3 minute limit is a pretty serious restriction and will be a deal breaker for many.

Anyway since we can get very good low light 4K full frame for $3k with the A7S II with a much more adaptable lens mount, the D5 is a pretty pointless endeavour altogether for video... Even if it had been full frame, it would still be poor value for money compared to the Sony's image.

Completely agree with Andrew, but he and I have owned 1dc's.  I got 1 hour 4 minutes with a 256GB CF card (not even a 29 min limit) and it's real 4k - not UHD.  Plus....it uses EF glass natively.  3 minute time limit is for kids.  Nice to see Nikon finally made a 12/14 FPS shooter like Canon did...4 years ago.

[Luke Mason]

Dont know about the D5 or D500 but the D750 has 13 usable stops. Neck and neck with the bmcc raw in my side by side test.

i'm talking about video dynamic range not RAW stills from Nikon.

Unless Nikon develop a log profile (not just flat), it will never reach 13 stops in video

[Mattias Burling]

i'm talking about video dynamic range not RAW stills from Nikon.

Unless Nikon develop a log profile (not just flat), it will never reach 13 stops in video

Its higher in Raw stills.

Ive shoot plenty with both the D750 and the BMCC. They have the same amount of usable DR. The BMCC is rated at 13 stops.

Ive also comoared it to C-log and it has more.

[Mars]

The D5 doesn't do anything better than the 1D C at all 

Don't you expect the AF and high ISO to be better?

Kind regards, Martin

[IronFilm]

For 99% of us here, what the D5 can or can not do specifically does not matter to us. Because I won't be buying one any time soon, or even in the next 5yrs (maybe maybe by then it might have dropped in price low enough to buy one on a laugh. For instance I almost purchased a D2Hs for the hell of it recently).

Instead what is so very significant about the D5 announcement is what it represents for video from Nikon, that they're bringing out 4K video the masses. Unlike Canon there is no restricting it only to their ultra high priced C line up, instead *EVERY* pro sports/journalist/etc photographer with a D5 will also be able to do 4K clips. Same can't be said for the 1D X users.

Even more so, Nikon has added 4K video to their APS-C level camera. (could you see Canon doing that?? nah). Nikon hasn't been shy in putting better video into their lower end cameras than their models above it (remember the D5200 being a better choice than the D800? http://www.eoshd.com/2013/02/is-the-cheap-nikon-d5200-a-better-option-than-d800-for-video-no-moire-aliasing-and-good-detail/ ), so I wouldn't be surprised if the D7300/D5600 gets 4K as well. (maybe even the D3400?? Though maybe that is too low end... might need to wait for the D7x00/D5x00 to get it first). D620 could arrive this year with 4K as well.

And for the poor Canon fan boys this is good news as well, as just maybe maybe this might prompt Canon to finally add 4K to their line up DSLRs! (other than their C range)

Because no matter how many cameras Sony/Panasonic/Samsung add 4K to, well... Canon probably doesn't care too much (incorrectly so), as they don't recognise them as their direct competition. But Nikon is their direct competition, if anything will make Canon feel compelled to respond it is this, just like what happened when Nikon brought out the D90 and changed all our lives.

Thus we should all be quite excited by the D5/D500 announcement! As it will cause a ripple that will create a bigger impact than many of us expect.

[joema]

...what is so very significant about the D5 announcement is what it represents for video from Nikon, that they're bringing out 4K video the masses. Unlike Canon there is no restricting it only to their ultra high priced C line up, instead *EVERY* pro sports/journalist/etc photographer with a D5 will also be able to do 4K clips. Same can't be said for the 1D X users.

The use of 4K by the video community is rapidly evolving. This in turn drives product design decisions by the manufacturers. The 1DX was released nearly three years ago, and the design phase was at least a year prior to that. Few people shot 4K four years ago so the 1DX is not a revealing indicator.

...Nikon hasn't been shy in putting better video into their lower end cameras than their models above it...for the poor Canon fan boys this is good news as well, as just maybe maybe this might prompt Canon to finally add 4K to their line up DSLRs! (other than their C range)...no matter how many cameras Sony/Panasonic/Samsung add 4K to... Canon probably doesn't care too much (incorrectly so), as they don't recognise them as their direct competition....

There is no question Canon is moving slowly on various fronts, not just video. If they are going to change, a key indicator will be the 5D Mark IV. We just will not know until the specs are reliably determined.

Re Canon doesn't recognize Sony/Panasonic/Samsung as direct competition, maybe that's so but Nikon definitely does. We know this because Nikon spent considerable time during the D5 release talking about how much better the D5 AF system was than mirrorless cameras for high-speed sports applications. That doesn't even make good sense -- of course a D5 has better AF in that situation. The fact Nikon even made this strained comparison indicates (at least in some quarters) they are concerned. Canon obviously saw that so it will be interesting if they ever wake up and change course.

[IronFilm]

Also interesting to note that the D500 started development at the same time the Panasonic GH4 was released (as GH4 was the first ever ILC with 4K), in early 2014.

[Andrew Reid]

Also interesting to note that the D500 started development at the same time the Panasonic GH4 was released (as GH4 was the first ever ILC with 4K), in early 2014.

Maybe that's why they thought crop 4K was where it was at.

[IronFilm]

True, GH4 does crop in for its 4K a little.

[Luke Mason]

Its higher in Raw stills.

Ive shoot plenty with both the D750 and the BMCC. They have the same amount of usable DR. The BMCC is rated at 13 stops.

Ive also comoared it to C-log and it has more.

My comparison using IMATEST shows D750 has precisly 10.3 stops of DR in video, flat mode.

C-Log on 1D C shows 11.7.

[Mattias Burling]

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

The D5 cannot be compared to the 1DC. It's not a matter of 1.28x crop vs 1.45x, it's simply that the Canon will be recording video while the Nikon will not, in three minutes. Simple. 3 minute limit AND 1.5x crop is an extreme measure to tale for overheating. Canon just added an additional heatsink and made it work on the 1DC back in 2011. They have no excuse not to reach similar performance in 2016, not to mention exceed it greatly. 

The 1Dc shoot 4K DCI. Has EU tax limit liftes, has MJPEG 4:2:2 500mbps codec. Similar MP sensor and size, 12/14fps stills, same coverage OVF, kick-ass AF system, Dual cards that handle its full potential with no added cost, C-Log gamma, a prefectly clean 2K 17:9 HDMI output, Probody with similar battery life. I really don't see much in the D5. Nikon just kept up with the 2011 1Dc, but just in stills performance. The D5 will have more raw DR and the 1DC has massively higher-end video. 

It's great Nikon sports shooter finally get 1Dx/C performamce and 7D MKII performance too really (a much needed camera and is a massive photography hit, Canon was killing that entire sports market with the 7DII 10fps and new 100-400mm L) 

Video. They haven,t caught up to Canon, which doesn't cost much more than the D5 as of thia moment new, and costs less used. 

By the way we're talking about relativity. I am sure the D5/D500 camera can produce oscar winni g dramas in FF 1080p mode and shoot lovely landscapes with wide lenaea and 4K, but we're just comparing to what's out there not as cameras contained within themselves. 

I am personally still interested in the D500 for my Nikon VR glass. I am hoping for an even better 1080p HD than the D7200/5500/750 that I quite love. The UHD isn't limited to 30min so it will be GH4 2.2x 4K with netter colours and lowlight and stills so I vonsider it a bonus for getting the odd wide detailed shots or for stock footage. I hate the m43s and smaller image aesthetic though, so hoping for that good 1080p. Who knows, perhaps it has full manual control in video mode, massive DR in FLAT, good audio qualiy, C100 1080p detail level, these are not things that are mentioned in the spe' sheet. 

All in all, for video the 1DC really dwarfs the D5 announcement. While the D500 Nikon 4K camera with D800 body at 2K is quite interesting. 

** The 1DC log certainly has more dynamic range than the D750 Flat. I don,t care about software tests it's just a higher range when shooting with the camera. Quite a bit larger range to deal with both in luminance and colour and noise floor. 

[Nikkor]

Well remember that the canon 1DC is a dedicated video camera, the 1DX is not and that's what the nikon is.

I keep insisting on the Active D-lighting, this sounds like some marketing shit, but it means that the processor is very powerful and can give some serious DR on 8 bit files, depending on how it's programmed to adapt (flikering?) it will be something very interesting. It's only for 1080p, but together with a custom picture profile this will give images that don't need grading.

[Luke Mason]

Nikon just announced in a road show that the 3min limit of 4K on D5 will be removed by a future firmware update.

[Shield3]

Also interesting to note that the D500 started development at the same time the Panasonic GH4 was released (as GH4 was the first ever ILC with 4K), in early 2014.

You mean Milc, right?  The 1dc is still an ILC and it was out before then.

Well remember that the canon 1DC is a dedicated video camera, the 1DX is not and that's what the nikon is.

I keep insisting on the Active D-lighting, this sounds like some marketing shit, but it means that the processor is very powerful and can give some serious DR on 8 bit files, depending on how it's programmed to adapt (flikering?) it will be something very interesting. It's only for 1080p, but together with a custom picture profile this will give images that don't need grading.

The 1dc is a 1dx that shoots 4k video.  It's no more of a dedicated video camera than any other Canon body (no XLR, no peaking, no ND, etc).  How that became a "dedicated video camera" is beyond me.  The "C" badge does not tell the story.

[Nikkor]

You mean Milc, right?  The 1dc is still an ILC and it was out before then.

The 1dc is a 1dx that shoots 4k video.  It's no more of a dedicated video camera than any other Canon body (no XLR, no peaking, no ND, etc).  How that became a "dedicated video camera" is beyond me.  The "C" badge does not tell the story.

... You said it yourself, the 1dc is a 1dx that shoots 4k video. The difference is a heatsink the 1dx doesn't have.

[lafilm]

The D5 cannot be compared to the 1DC. It's not a matter of 1.28x crop vs 1.45x, it's simply that the Canon will be recording video while the Nikon will not, in three minutes. Simple. 3 minute limit AND 1.5x crop is an extreme measure to tale for overheating. Canon just added an additional heatsink and made it work on the 1DC back in 2011. They have no excuse not to reach similar performance in 2016, not to mention exceed it greatly. 

The 1Dc shoot 4K DCI. Has EU tax limit liftes, has MJPEG 4:2:2 500mbps codec. Similar MP sensor and size, 12/14fps stills, same coverage OVF, kick-ass AF system, Dual cards that handle its full potential with no added cost, C-Log gamma, a prefectly clean 2K 17:9 HDMI output, Probody with similar battery life. I really don't see much in the D5. Nikon just kept up with the 2011 1Dc, but just in stills performance. The D5 will have more raw DR and the 1DC has massively higher-end video. 

It's great Nikon sports shooter finally get 1Dx/C performamce and 7D MKII performance too really (a much needed camera and is a massive photography hit, Canon was killing that entire sports market with the 7DII 10fps and new 100-400mm L) 

Video. They haven,t caught up to Canon, which doesn't cost much more than the D5 as of thia moment new, and costs less used. 

By the way we're talking about relativity. I am sure the D5/D500 camera can produce oscar winni g dramas in FF 1080p mode and shoot lovely landscapes with wide lenaea and 4K, but we're just comparing to what's out there not as cameras contained within themselves. 

I am personally still interested in the D500 for my Nikon VR glass. I am hoping for an even better 1080p HD than the D7200/5500/750 that I quite love. The UHD isn't limited to 30min so it will be GH4 2.2x 4K with netter colours and lowlight and stills so I vonsider it a bonus for getting the odd wide detailed shots or for stock footage. I hate the m43s and smaller image aesthetic though, so hoping for that good 1080p. Who knows, perhaps it has full manual control in video mode, massive DR in FLAT, good audio qualiy, C100 1080p detail level, these are not things that are mentioned in the spe' sheet. 

All in all, for video the 1DC really dwarfs the D5 announcement. While the D500 Nikon 4K camera with D800 body at 2K is quite interesting. 

** The 1DC log certainly has more dynamic range than the D750 Flat. I don,t care about software tests it's just a higher range when shooting with the camera. Quite a bit larger range to deal with both in luminance and colour and noise floor. 

I agree with this. The 1DC captures absolutely beautiful images. It's really inarguable. The video quality from the 1DC will still be relevant 5 years from now. I understand the price turns people off and no dedicated focusing features. But at the end of the day it comes down to gorgeous 24 fps motion and man does it look good. Even without using the log feature, the colors the cam produces are still true to life.

[hmcindie]

Well remember that the canon 1DC is a dedicated video camera...

It's also a 1DX. 1DC now in Finland costs the same amount as a 1DX, 6000 euros new.

 

[neon]

given nikon has no movie body variant, this is a pretty pointless comparison

I'd still take a sony over the 1DXC anything but I wasn't expecting the still photography model to really do much with video in much the same way the 1DX still photo variant did nothing meaningful with video. Who knew

[IronFilm]

Nikon just announced in a road show that the 3min limit of 4K on D5 will be removed by a future firmware update.

Great news! Have a link to that?