1dx mark ii, 4k 60fps?

[mkabi]

DPAF is a game changer. The technology is amazing- it allows fast, accurate focus with no hunting. Someday we'll be able to see DPAF pixels on screen to help with manual focus, much better than peaking. Here's how the hardware works: https://www.learn.usa.canon.com/app/pdfs/articles/Canon_Developers_Interview_nonfacing_pressquality.pdf

(Sony has this too, for example, on the A7R II).

You know what though...

Chances are, it won't work with MF, FD or other legacy lenses. So I guess focus peaking is a miss...

[hmcindie]

I thought peaking would be great. Until I used it myself with the A7s and it usually was a bit off.

But the ML enabled sharpening of the output image (instead of peaking) is great! It shows where the focus actually is way better than some white or red lines. I usually take out the focus peaking so having it or not won't affect my shooting style. But I will miss the magic lantern sharpening for focus.

[kgv5]

I thought peaking would be great. Until I used it myself with the A7s and it usually was a bit off.

But the ML enabled sharpening of the output image (instead of peaking) is great! It shows where the focus actually is way better than some white or red lines. I usually take out the focus peaking so having it or not won't affect my shooting style. But I will miss the magic lantern sharpening for focus.

Right, ML screen sharpening does wonders, much better than their own peaking and the one i have seen in a7sII (a7sII in real life has lower screen quality than 5d3, checked them side by side. Additionally peaking dots was making a lot of mess).

[hmcindie]

Right, ML screen sharpening does wonders, much better than their own peaking and the one i have seen in a7sII (a7sII in real life has lower screen quality than 5d3, checked them side by side. Additionally peaking dots was making a lot of mess).

Yup. I was shocked by how bad the lcd was on the A7s compared straight to the 5d3. Just in image quality. Even the LCD on the goddamn Amira is worse! I shot with that thing in the snow and it was ghosting like craaaazy. The 5d was chugging along, no problem. 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/n423v8w64khndhs/_BK_8220_small.jpg?dl=0

[Santi Deva]

On 1/2/2016 at 7:44 PM, Andrew Reid said:

Speaking from my 1D C experience...

MJPEG is 500Mbit/s so the data rate for the CPU to handle is insane. Editing off an SSD or RAID 0 like I do the drives aren't a bottle neck, it's the CPU.

What compounds the problem is that MJPEG doesn't seem to be well supported with hardware acceleration.

The Mercury Engine in Premiere for instance seems to revert to software rather than hardware accelerated by Open CL or CUDA when it comes to MJPEG.

H.264 and H.265 may be more complex with the clever compression but it is hardware accelerated.

You will effectivly be editing MJPEG 4K 60fps at 800Mbit/s in software mode, on the CPU only. The effects will take ages to render too.

1D C 4K 24p is 500Mbit/s (same on 1D X Mark II)... this is tough enough, you really need to transcode to ProRes.

Again speaking from direct experience with the files, the H.264 4K from the GH4 and A7S II can be edited natively on my machine in Premiere with smooth playback especially at 1/2 res in the timeline monitor. MJPEG doesn't even play back smoothly when I reduce the playback res, which again points to the lack of proper support of such an old dated codec in a modern NLE.

Canon have made a mistake.

I'll mos def buy a 1DXmk2 when it comes out, and I'm trying to figure out which hardware should I buy to set up a RAID 0, which seems way cheaper than SSD drives to work with the 4K MJPEG files. Could you please, Andrew, share what hard drives and RAID are you using? Thanks in advance.

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

Since it looks we'll be shooting Technicolour Cinestyle on the 1DXII if we want a LOG workflow, 

This is trying Cinestyle on 1DC.

 

-sharpness off, contrast off, saturation -2, colour tone 0. (default Technicolor settings) 

-6400 ISO,

-horrible domestic florescent lights,

-high shutter to get sharp frames (hence 6400). 

-24-105mm F/4 L @ 105mm f/4. & 85mm f/4

Surprised me the cleanness at 6400 since I've been shooting on a Nikon D5300 lately and 6400 looks like a noise festival with colour bands as guests. This damn clean. 

 

Do you think Technicolour Cinestyle will be usable for Log worflows? (the posted images are at least 90% representative of the native MJPEG file grabs) so you can try grading and see if it fits LOG grading workflows.

 

What I love about the 1DC? 

1- It's SOFT. Like Red/Alexa. When I say sharpening off, it turns sharpening off. Simple ha? No, ALL the cheaper new 4K cameras I've tried and bought stillnhave sharpening at zero. It seems like a very easy firmware fix but they don't do it for some reason = inherent Video look.

2- The body size and weight. It makes me feel like a big man, probably to compensate for an inner psychological issue, or physical  

[Oliver Daniel]

13 hours ago, Ebrahim Saadawi said:

Since it looks we'll be shooting Technicolour Cinestyle on the 1DXII if we want a LOG workflow, 

This is trying Cinestyle on 1DC.

 

-sharpness off, contrast off, saturation -2, colour tone 0. (default Technicolor settings) 

-6400 ISO,

-horrible domestic florescent lights,

-high shutter to get sharp frames (hence 6400). 

-24-105mm F/4 L @ 105mm f/4. & 85mm f/4

Surprised me the cleanness at 6400 since I've been shooting on a Nikon D5300 lately and 6400 looks like a noise festival with colour bands as guests. This damn clean. 

 

Do you think Technicolour Cinestyle will be usable for Log worflows? (the posted images are at least 90% representative of the native MJPEG file grabs) so you can try grading and see if it fits LOG grading workflows.

 

What I love about the 1DC? 

1- It's SOFT. Like Red/Alexa. When I say sharpening off, it turns sharpening off. Simple ha? No, ALL the cheaper new 4K cameras I've tried and bought stillnhave sharpening at zero. It seems like a very easy firmware fix but they don't do it for some reason = inherent Video look.

2- The body size and weight. It makes me feel like a big man, probably to compensate for an inner psychological issue, or physical  

 

I had a tiny little go at this - a bit rushed but not too bad.

The jpeg doesn't have much information in it but it's not a bad flat image from the 1DC. Would really need to use proper footage. 

The 1DX II is on my rental to-do list when it's released, so I hope something works! (LOG based). 

 

 

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

1 hour ago, Oliver Daniel said:

 

 

 

Skin is horrible here and very low quality. you have to click on the image then click ''full size'' on the lower left to get the full 4K image.

 

[Oliver Daniel]

30 minutes ago, Ebrahim Saadawi said:

Skin is horrible here and very low quality. you have to click on the image then click ''full size'' on the lower left to get the full 4K image.

 

Probably missed a trick then!

Yes skin is rubbish due to highly compressed jpeg, if I've got a min I'll follow your instructions and give it another whirl. 

[Oliver Daniel]

52 minutes ago, Ebrahim Saadawi said:

Skin is horrible here and very low quality. you have to click on the image then click ''full size'' on the lower left to get the full 4K image.

 

Quality is much better from the full size 4k image I didn't know about. 

Quick 2 minute job in FCPX. 

Again would need house proper footage and see what it looks like in motion.

[Nikkor]

I'm getting eye cancer ^^, the problem might be bad fluorescent light with wrong WB.

This is how I imagine it looked in RL, the second is correcting for overexposure and colorshift

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

10 minutes ago, araucaria said:

I'm getting eye cancer ^^,

So am I.

It might be Cinestyle isn't good with the 1DC (and hence probably 1DXII) because under the same conditions Portrait looked lovely.  In real life it wasn't that it had much more pink/red that Cinestyle turned to gray.

Nonetheless I could get this from it (cinestyle). 

 

[Nikkor]

You have to get the purple out of there , another thing is that I would avoid bright backgrounds especially with dark skin. (I think Im underexposing/pulling too much, but meh)

[Oliver Daniel]

7 minutes ago, araucaria said:

I'm getting eye cancer ^^, the problem might be bad fluorescent light with wrong WB.

This is how I imagine it looked in RL

 

(-horrible domestic florescent lights) 

There is definitely a white balance problem caused by a green tint coming from fluorescent lights.

 

(-6400 ISO)

Colour is greatly affected at higher ISO's, there isn't as much information compared to a properly lit image at ISO 800. 

 

Also I remember CineStyle being rather rubbish on my Canon 60d - the colour was utterly destroyed. Got a few good results. 

Combine the high ISO, bad lighting and Cinestyle together and the image is near impossible to grade to a professional standard. 

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

Mine (redish/brighter) is the closest to how it looked in RL. It's a very quick shot of my grand-daughter in the living room, nothing done.

 

What subjects/shots/scenes would you like to get/grade in 1DC Cinestyle?

 

I'll have it back in hours to play. But it's sadly 9pm here so no natural sun examples till tomorrow. (this time will upload lossless TIFFs)

 

(Cinestyle compatibility with the 1DXII is a very important matter, as the 1DXII is my next camera but I want to hand out Log when I get asked to, especially since it'll be a long term use for me until 8K comes or something)

[Nikkor]

I think there is also something about cultural differences. Whenever I see pictures of arabic countries, there are many dark interiors or nightscapes that are filled with extreme bright fluorescent lights. That's something you won't encounter in western domestic spaces.

[Oliver Daniel]

2 minutes ago, Ebrahim Saadawi said:

Mine (redish/brighter) is the closest to how it looked in RL. It's a very quick shot of my grand-daughter in the living room, nothing done.

 

What subjects/shots/scenes would you like to get/grade in 1DC Cinestyle?

 

I'll have it back in hours to play. But it's sadly 9pm here so no natural sun examples till tomorrow. (this time will upload lossless TIFFs)

 

(Cinestyle compatibility with the 1DXII is a very important matter, as the 1DXII is my next camera but I want to hand out Log when I get asked to, especially since it'll be a long term use for me until 8K comes or something)

 

Thanks for sharing Ebrahim. 

I'm taking a part in this as i'm very interested in the 1DX II - but only if we can get a decent HDR/smooth highlight rolloff log profile for video mode. 

It would be cool to get: 

• Properly exposed/lit face in daylight and tungsten at native ISO. 
• High dynamic range wide shot with harsh shadows and highlights. 

If possible.

 

[mkabi]

So prolost flat it is till C-log.

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

7 minutes ago, araucaria said:

I think there is also something about cultural differences. Whenever I see pictures of arabic countries, there are many dark interiors or nightscapes that are filled with extreme bright fluorescent lights. That's something you won't encounter in western domestic spaces.

That 100% true. You have sharp eyes.

6 minutes ago, Oliver Daniel said:

Properly exposed/lit face in daylight and tungsten at native ISO. 

High dynamic range wide shot with harsh shadows and highlights. 

 

Will try my best.

But remember while the Cinestyle on the 1DC will have the same colours & gradeability & overal stamp, the 1DXII sensor might be different, for example have a higher DR sensor, but it's worth a try anyway to get a sense of our only Log option on the 1DXII. 

@Andrew Reid Help us out with some Cinestyle/Prolost 1DC grabs in your environment too please if you have the time

[Nikkor]

Btw, do you use iso 6400 often? I'm a low iso sucker, I can see the colors fall apart at iso 200 on my nikon d800 (raw stills). I know the canons handle high isos better, but still, there is no magic. The postprocessing the 1DC is doing I guess helps masking the colorful noise, but still the colors are fucked up. I can imagine that if you had done that scene with iso 100, the skin would have more "secondary" colors, which is something noisereduction kills badly.