Petition for Samsung NX1 hack

[kidzrevil]

I've tried installing the hack on my nx1. I am at the step where you have to activate Bluetooth but the Bluetooth option on the camera is greyed out and wont let me select it. Any idea what could be the reason why ? 

[Otto K]

You are probably running in factory mode. Do you have file info.tg on the sd card? How do you use the hack? Vasile or Kino Seed zip? 

[vasile]

8 hours ago, Pavel Mašek said:

Custom bitrate for Normal mode would be great but I did not want to ask you - it might look like I am complaining. (it seems I am only one who would welcome this option)

Well I cannot stop anyone from asking, but I will keep with my "no promise" vow.

And "keep that in mind" does not constitute a promise BTW, in case you were wondering :-)

[kidzrevil]

@Otto K fixed it, I had to reset my Bluetooth/wifi settings.

@vasile I am in love with this hack ! I just got it installed and at 160mbps the files are looking awesome. The detail and the motion cadence have been improved. The extra bits are making my handheld footage look very fluid. You truly have done something incredible with this hack

[AaronL]

On 4/21/2016 at 7:28 AM, BopBill said:

22 minutes ago, kidzrevil said:

@Otto K fixed it, I had to reset my Bluetooth/wifi settings.

@vasile I am in love with this hack ! I just got it installed and at 160mbps the files are looking awesome. The detail and the motion cadence have been improved. The extra bits are making my handheld footage look very fluid. You truly have done something incredible with this hack

I hear a lot of people talk about motion cadence, but I cant seem to find much information online. can anybody explain what it is exactly and how you are noticing the difference. 

[MountneerMan]

1 hour ago, kidzrevil said:

@Otto K fixed it, I had to reset my Bluetooth/wifi settings.

@vasile I am in love with this hack ! I just got it installed and at 160mbps the files are looking awesome. The detail and the motion cadence have been improved. The extra bits are making my handheld footage look very fluid. You truly have done something incredible with this hack

@kidzrevil, I have heard a few people mention 160mbps and it It sounds like this might be the sweet spot. Have you tried any other bit rates, and it so what have you been finding?

[SMGJohn]

Yeah I hear a lot of people talk about the motion cadence and motion overall in video improved with higher bitrate, I cannot seem to replicate this on my camera for reasons??

But my AMD card have smooth video motion that just kicks in automatically whenever a video plays I am not sure whether that is removing it or something or perhaps I am looking at the wrong things? Do anyone have an example?

[outerbeat]

2 hours ago, MountneerMan said:

I have heard a few people mention 160mbps and it It sounds like this might be the sweet spot

It's just about sd-cards mostly. This bitrate is perfectly utilize nowadays sd-cards speed and works without errors or lags. I've tested now like ten 64 GB sd-cards wide variety of prices and vendors, they pretty much the same when it comes to speed of NX1 sd-card driver (? idk how it calls) and top bitrate which I can use is no more 190 for now, but I'm going to test further  

Sandisk Extreme Pro UHS I 95MB/s 64GB is fastest one that I've tested. I can use it with 190 mbps easily, it works fine, but to be sure I just fly with 180 mbps.

Strange thing, when I did first testing of bitrate hack, all of my cards goes with "card is too slow" message when I tried to record video, and first bitrate, that any card allowed me is 140-160 mbps. But IDK how, when after some shooting with 140-160 mbps bitrate I've put the same sd-card but with 180-190 mbps option, run record, it goes with same error after 3-4 secons video... and after that allows you to go with 180-190. After that it goes smooth and pretty fine with 190. Can't say the reason, I don't know it, but I can recommend this way to any testers - just go first with 200 mbps, wait for "card is too slow" message, go second time, go third, if message still appears, turn off the camera, set 190 mbps, run 1-2 record with error message, and maybe now you can do 190. If not - go to settings and decrease bitrate one step more, repeat previous step "with 1-2 errors"..

Second sweet spot of bitrates - is size of sd-card. Actually, this one works with "record limit" hack. This hack allows you to record more than 30 min video. For UHD@30 it's 76 minutes with sound and not limited without audio (one user on dpreview said that but I didn't test this yet). So, now you have 76 minutes limit, ok. And now we can set 120 mbps bitrate for UHD@30 and this is a truly sweet spot for this two hacks - now you can record like 74-75 minutes 120 mbps UHD@30 video without any fear to get the error message or crash without message at all (NX1 did this with 4K video that exceed time limit 76 min). It is very cool!

50 minutes ago, SMGJohn said:

Yeah I hear a lot of people talk about the motion cadence and motion overall in video improved with higher bitrate, I cannot seem to replicate this on my camera for reasons??

But my AMD card have smooth video motion that just kicks in automatically whenever a video plays I am not sure whether that is removing it or something or perhaps I am looking at the wrong things? Do anyone have an example?

One page before I've posted the test results of my bitrate hack test. There is 4K video file that I create from two 4K footages one 80 and other 150 mbps. They just heavily destructed (only luma curve + brightness + contrast) for more visual reference, left side - 150 mbps source, right side - 80. Both recorded in UHD@30 with identical setting and environment, only difference is the bitrate. Scale to 300% for better proof and to eliminate influence of export bitrate. Can you see the difference between them? For me it's obvious, and this test - is how I actually open my eyes to see all the power of High Efficiency Video Codec implemented in H265. Highly recommend to learn about it, worth knowing. 

If by "motion cadence" cinematorgaphers means some sort of undescribed mixture of shutter speed, framerate and limits of modern encoding process, but from "artistic point of view", then I can tell, bitrate hack definitely improve this, yep. I'd say HEVC theoretically wins in this field when it comes to any lossy codec, and it improves greatily from bitrate hack. Overall quality of picture is improved, each frame is far more stable in terms of color, light - all this parameters, that goes to codec and being encoded, and this goes more smoothly, this also applies to the serial set of frames.

[Sawstory]

New nx500 for 500 USD, sound as a good price matching its name. the offer for 24 hr though!

https://www.komplett.dk/product/837650/digital-foto-video/systemkamera/kameraer/samsung-nx500-16-50mm-ois-brun

[kidzrevil]

I have been recording with 160 mbps but I have tried 180 mbps and got the card is too slow message. 160 mbps seems to be the sweet spot but it lags the camera after you end a recording. Still it isn't too bad and the quality is evident. I noticed my handheld footage even at higher shutter speeds did not look jerky. Some may say the improvements are minor but its very noticeable to me since I shot a ton of stuff on the nx1

[SMGJohn]

36 minutes ago, Sawstory said:

New nx500 for 500 USD, sound as a good price matching its name. the offer for 24 hr though!

https://www.komplett.dk/product/837650/digital-foto-video/systemkamera/kameraer/samsung-nx500-16-50mm-ois-brun

They do not ship outside the Nordic countries, the Danish, Norwegian, Swedish and Icelandic Komplett only ships to their respected countries despite Komplett being in Norway you cannot buy from DK site to Norway for example you gotta go to Komplett.no and same for Sweden, Komplett.se

Technically the NX500 is cheaper on eBay brand new because you got the VAT you have to apply in Scandinavia, if you get the seller to ship it as a gift with no price tag on it, you can sneak it through the import check without paying a VAT for anyone thinking this is wrong, our governments have enough cash they just waste it anyway.

[vaga]

@Otto K Is there any confirmation that your memory dumping hack works so that video recordings don't crash at 70 something minutes?

[vasile]

7 hours ago, kidzrevil said:

I have been recording with 160 mbps but I have tried 180 mbps and got the card is too slow message. 160 mbps seems to be the sweet spot but it lags the camera after you end a recording. Still it isn't too bad and the quality is evident. I noticed my handheld footage even at higher shutter speeds did not look jerky. Some may say the improvements are minor but its very noticeable to me since I shot a ton of stuff on the nx1

hope you find it useful ;-)

[outerbeat]

7 hours ago, kidzrevil said:

I have been recording with 160 mbps but I have tried 180 mbps and got the card is too slow message.

At first my Sandisk Extreme Pro can do only 160 mbps, and I shoot all my stuff in 150 mbps for little headroom, it works vwry well without crashing or lags. After some time situation changes, now I run with 180 mbps, but tested 190 and it goes well on the same sd-card. Maybe you can try this too, but maybe it just some deviation, not much to say

7 hours ago, kidzrevil said:

but it lags the camera after you end a recording

How is it appears? Little delayed reaction between you press the record button and it actually stops the video? If so - count me in, same experience here

7 hours ago, kidzrevil said:

my handheld footage even at higher shutter speeds did not look jerky

And this one is the "motion cadence" also
 

[Pavel Mašek]

1 hour ago, outerbeat said:

Little delayed reaction between you press the record button and it actually stops the video?

Strange - I have not noticed that so far with 180Mbps. It seems to be same as it was with 80Mbits but maybe I am not sensitive about that.

[outerbeat]

1 hour ago, Pavel Mašek said:

Strange - I have not noticed that so far with 180Mbps. It seems to be same as it was with 80Mbits but maybe I am not sensitive about that.

Yes, I need to add that delay appears not all the time, only a few times, but noticable, like 3-4 seconds between I push the button and camera stops. Also that applies to turn-off process, it's longer now with the bitrate hack

 

 

 

 

[kidzrevil]

@outerbeat @Pavel MaÅ¡ek im using a uhs-ii card by lexar. Maybe its time to go over to Sandisk ? I'll try the 150 mbps. Hopefully the hack doesn't affect the audio since lag is present when you stop recording. Im hoping the bitrate can be pushed higher by disabling audio recording 

[MountneerMan]

14 hours ago, kidzrevil said:

I have been recording with 160 mbps but I have tried 180 mbps and got the card is too slow message. 160 mbps seems to be the sweet spot but it lags the camera after you end a recording. Still it isn't too bad and the quality is evident. I noticed my handheld footage even at higher shutter speeds did not look jerky. Some may say the improvements are minor but its very noticeable to me since I shot a ton of stuff on the nx1

This is with vasile's bitrate hack v3.0?

If you have some time it would be nice if you could post an update on the NX summary thread regarding the status of the bitrate hack. I tried the v1.0 bitrate hack but have not tried anything since. From what I understand theirs are now options to change the rate of more than just the PRO setting?

[outerbeat]

2 hours ago, kidzrevil said:

@outerbeat @Pavel MaÅ¡ek im using a uhs-ii card by lexar. Maybe its time to go over to Sandisk ? I'll try the 150 mbps. Hopefully the hack doesn't affect the audio since lag is present when you stop recording. Im hoping the bitrate can be pushed higher by disabling audio recording 

Let's just test something, if we can? There is huge BS going around sd-cards performance, and I just return one to distributor - Kingston claims that one of their products can do 80 Mb/s write speed, so I bought it. Naturally, I can't record not only any DCI4K or UHD, but all 1080p in pro bitrate, it can do 1080p30 in HQ mode at best. But any test in Windows or MacOS tells me that card works perfectly with great 80 Mb/s which can provide smooth record for video bitrate up to 640 (!!!) mbps. It's just a total crap actually, this record speed in sd-card specs doesn't say much for us.

It seems that vendors of sd-cards can't test their products in real applications such a cameras or so, or just doesn't want to share this info with us. It seems only for this matter exists such documents, like Blackmagic chart of compatible sd-cards (page 20 of this document) where we can find table of tested sd-cards, which can be used in their 4K recorder. It records in ProRes, so we can easily establish actual speeds of this cards, cause ProRes bitrates are well known. So, for any use of bitrate hack I'd highly recomended use one of this cards from Blackmagic document:

Transcend SDXC UHS II 180MB/s
Lexar SDXC UHS II 2000x 300MB/s
Delkin Devices SD 633X SDHC UHS I 80MB/s
Delkin Devices SD 633X SDXC UHS I 80MB/s
Sandisk Extreme Pro UHS I 95MB/s
Lexar SDXC UHS II 1000x 150MB/s
Lexar SDXC UHS II 1000x 150MB/s

Also this ones might be not so good option:
Sandisk Extreme Pro UHS II 280MB/s
Lexar SD 633x SDHC UHS I 95MB/s

Strange, you see, that in real life test brand new Sandisk Extreme Pro UHS II with astounishing 280MB/s is totally loses it's predecessor Sandisk Extreme Pro UHS I with only 95MB/s

So, I've tested main parameter that I could imagine to connect with actual situation. You can do this also, it's very easy. Download any app that can measure IOPS by 4kb blocks random write, I use this one: CrystalDiskMark. Here is my findings:

Kingston SDXC Class 10 UHS-I U3 90/80 MB/s
Sequential Read (T= 1) :    93.726 MB/s
Sequential Write (T= 1) :    22.861 MB/s
Random Write 4KiB (Q= 1,T= 1) :     0.111 MB/s [    27.1 IOPS]
Random Write 4KiB (Q= 32,T= 1) :     0.119 MB/s [    29.1 IOPS]

Transcend SDXC Class 10 UHS-I U3, 95/60 MB/s
Sequential Read (T= 1) :    94.381 MB/s
Sequential Write (T= 1) :    67.108 MB/s
Random Write 4KiB (Q= 1,T= 1) :     1.054 MB/s [   257.3 IOPS]
Random Write 4KiB (Q= 32,T= 1) :     1.292 MB/s [   315.4 IOPS]

SANDISK Extreme Pro SDXC Class 10 UHS-I U1 95/90 MB/s
Sequential Read (T= 1) :    94.381 MB/s
Sequential Write (T= 1) :    93.421 MB/s
Random Write 4KiB (Q= 1,T= 1) :     1.224 MB/s [   280.9 IOPS]
Random Write 4KiB (Q= 32,T= 1) :     1.398 MB/s [   331.2 IOPS]

 

29 minutes ago, MountneerMan said:

This is with vasile's bitrate hack v3.0?

If you have some time it would be nice if you could post an update on the NX summary thread regarding the status of the bitrate hack. I tried the v1.0 bitrate hack but have not tried anything since. From what I understand theirs are now options to change the rate of more than just the PRO setting?

V3 and V2 are the same in case of NX1

In V2 which I use all the time there is option for changing bitrate for 5 slots, but I can't use any HQ mods. for some reason it works on my NX1 only with PRO bitrates, which is sad but I'm gonna wait for it

[sandro]

SD card speed depends a lot on the controlled used by the reader/host. And of course the kind of test you're doing.

@outerbeat when you record video the camera will use sequential writes not random 4K why are you interested in that?