GH3 vs G7 in 1080p mode

[Stab]

Hi,

I just ordered a Panasonic G7, will receive it tomorrow. I shoot weddings and my next wedding is monday so I will not have much time to test it out in the field.

I actually ordered it as a replacement for my G6 which I use as a ceremony cam on a tripod, but now I started to wonder if the G7 should actually just replace my GH3 as the main cam.

Why do I like the GH3 and still shoot with it? Besides the great battery life, the HDMI-out for an external monitor and great 1080p image (IMO), I often want to use slow-motion in my edits and therefore shoot a lot of 1080p at 50 fps.

Now I know that the G7 also shoots 1080p at 50fps. So now I started to wonder if maybe the G7 should become the main cam. 

I can't find any comparison video's for the 1080p modes unfortunately. Does anyone here knows any of these video's or actually has or had both and can tell me more about this? How does the G7 compare to the GH3 at 50 / 60fps? Is there any improvement in terms of dynamic range, noise, colors, detail, etc? 

Thanks!

 

[TheRenaissanceMan]

Hey Stab!

Fellow GH3 shooter here also looking to pick up a G7. The GH3 is indeed still a great 1080p cam. Robust build (I've dropped it on cement twice and it didn't even blink), decent low-light up to 800/1600 (the noise is very grain-like and monochromatic), wonderful ergonomics (although I'd kill for peaking), efficient codec, and legendary battery life (I've gone through a 10-hour shoot without changing batteries once). 

That being said, the new 4K Panasonics really kill it for IQ, especially when downsampled to 1080p and/or externally recorded. The EVFs are also a big step up, especially the G7's. 

I haven't seen much of the newer Panasonics in 1080p. Not a lot of comparisons out there. The GX7 is supposed to have a very similar/the same sensor as the GH4, so this might give you a vague idea: 

Noam Kroll has a little article about 60p on the GH4 as well: 
http://noamkroll.com/slow-motion-work-on-the-gh4-why-i-always-overcrank-at-60p/

Here's what I can tell you from my own anecdotal experiences:
-The newer cams have nicer color, especially for skin, and better separation of color channels. This makes for easier CC and nicer footage in general
-The newer cams have less rolling shutter in 1080p. I'll often switch my friend's GH4 to 1080 for gimbal/handheld shots, where you won't notice the resolution dip anyway

-The newer cams have more range in the highlights and a nicer roll off. 
-The newer cams do away with the GH3's weird purple cross-shaped flaring around very strong light sources (drives me BANANAS)

-The newer cams have CineD, which, combined with the Leeming LUT, provides my favorite version of Panasonic GH color science
-The GH4 is a little better in low light in 1080p, and the G7 a lot better

Hope that helps!

[Xavier Plagaro Mussard]

G7 has more resolution, use that on tripod and 4K to have a general shot. Operate the GH3 to have close shots.

 

[andy lee]

The G7 is in my view the finest Panasonic camera on the market right now

[Fredrik Lyhne]

I would to a test in 50p and compare before your decide your main camera. Keep in mind that the G7 only has 28Mbps while the GH4 has 200Mbps and the GH3 has 50Mbps in 50p. 

The G7 definitely has a nicer image in 4K and probably also 1080p even with the lower bitrate. 

I agree with everything TheRenaissanceMan says especially regarding the Leeming Lut and Cine D. Before I got the Leeming Lut I shot with the Natuaral profile like Andy recommends. Check out this thread for amazing tips: 

 

[Stab]

Ok thanks guys.

So the G7 probably is just a better camera overall, even in 1080p modes. Will do some quick tests today.
Probably lower noise, better colors and more detail from what I understand.

Will it also grade as good? Or is the 28 mbps actually not holding up so well as the 50 mbps from the GH3, when let's say, applying Filmconvert and grain?

Last question. When shooting HD, do you use AVCHD or MP4? And is there any quality difference?

[andy lee]

G7 does grade well just be aware if you push it heavly in the grade you can see micro blocking , im talking really push it hard , 24 fps and 25 fps is fine at 50fps the files are getting a bit thin so get the look right in camera first and you are ok , avchd all the way for 1080p

[Stab]

Thanks Andy!

Will do some testing soon and see how it compares to the GH3. Also, will see how my PC handles all different types of footage on the timeline. GH3's mov 50fps, G7's MP4 4K and G7's AVCHD 50fps. Sounds crazy now but that's how it might end up after a real shoot. 

[Stab]

Alright, did some tests today.

My observations so far:

- G7 in 1080p 50fps in MP4 or AVCHD mode is 99% the same. So don't have to worry about that. Will just use AVCHD for 1080p then.
- G7 1080p vs GH3 1080p with low ISO's is 99% the same. The GH3 has a bit more magenta in the colors and the G7 more green. Which one is 'better' I don't know. Probably the G7 is a bit more natural looking.
- G7 vs GH3 in 1080p mode in low light and high ISO's: Starting from ISO 1600 the G7 starts to be really a lot cleaner. ISO 3200 and 6400 is unusable on the GH3 due to too much noise but the G7 is a lot cleaner. Might even be usable at 3200 and 6400!
- G7 at 4k mode, downsampled vs GH3 at high ISO's. G7 is EVEN CLEANER at 4K mode.
- G7 at 4k mode vs GH3 at 25p -> GH3 is smoked. 

I don't see any gain in DR however. The colors are slightly different but no big deal. Slight color correction fixes either. So the big improvements are cleaner high ISO's and of course better detail and no more moiré (!) at 4K mode. Too bad I can't use an external monitor with g7 but luckily it has focus peaking. So at least I can see the focus good enough on the small screen. 

I'm thinking now of shooting the wedding on the G7 as the main cam. Use 4K for 90% of the shots and downsample in post. Then use 1080p 50fps for the slowmotion shots. They look about 95% the same as the shots I'm currently making with the GH3 so I don't need to 'get used' or anything to what I'm seeing.

Computer had no problems with 4 different types of footage on the timeline so that's great as well. 
I only need to find out how to make the Warp Stabilizer work on 4k clips on a 1080p timeline. It simply doesn't work. When I 'nest' the clip and apply WS it actually works, but it crops the image very weirdly and like 200%.

Anyone knows how to do that?

[Stab]

Ah I found out how to apply the Warp Stabilizer to the 4k clips on a 1080p timeline. I just use 'nest' and that does the trick to be able to apply the WS. Great.

[aldolega]

To get rid of the crop without having to nest, just right-click the clip and click "scale to frame size".

[Stab]

Ah thanks for the tip. I was zooming out 50% but I guess this is much faster