An adventure into the Panasonic GX85/80 begins - and a look at the Leica Nocticron for Micro Four Thirds

[timepresent]

Trying to pick a lens for the camera... what have others found to work best? (I have been looking at panasonic 14-140 3.5-5.6 and panasonic 35-100 2.8. I don't see a big difference in the quality of the footage. I like how versatile and compact the 14-140 is and the option of 2.8 on the 35-100.)

Also -- wondering if there is any solution for panning jitters? Does the lens affect this? 

Thanks!

[omnilink]

Hey guys,

Quick question and thanks for your amazing work and feedback here, any idea how could you achieve a good audio setup/rig with the GX85 ? Specialy for outside documentary.

Or if you an show us your rig !

Thanks a lot !

[jonpais]

I'm no expert by any means, but I've done recording outdoors with the GH4 where I had an assistant hold a boompole (I prefer the Rode) along with a Rode mic running into a Sony audio recorder. I used the camera's audio to synch using Plural Eyes, though I guess FCP X already has synch capability. I don't see the lack of a microphone input to be such a handicap, as on-camera sound is unlikely to yield very good results, particularly when doing interviews. Actually, using a shotgun mic on a boompole still captures tons of ambient noise - a lav mic connected to an external recorder would give far better results. The only scenario where I can see the lack of a mic input being a serious handicap is for a single-operator shoot. For the best sound, I would not use the Panasonic's built-in preamp anyway, even if it had a mic input.

[fuzzynormal]

3 hours ago, omnilink said:

Specially for outside documentary.

When I'm following one person, I put a ew100 wireless lav mic on them and forget it.  In my shoulder bag I carry around the receiver/Zoom recorder.  And I monitor the audio with headphones as it records.

If it's a bigger group, then an audio op with a boom pole and shot gun is required.

Shotgun on the camera?  No.  Not a fan of that.

24 minutes ago, jonpais said:

For the best sound, I would not use the Panasonic's built-in preamp anyway, even if it had a mic input.

You're right that one can't get the best audio recording to the cheesy preamps of these hybrid cameras.  But, for b-roll, I've found that the audio is quite adequate when using my EW100's, and it certainly is a lot easier to handle as a one-man-band.

[Tarik Dobbs]

4 hours ago, omnilink said:

Hey guys,

Quick question and thanks for your amazing work and feedback here, any idea how could you achieve a good audio setup/rig with the GX85 ? Specialy for outside documentary.

Or if you an show us your rig !

Thanks a lot !

Have you given any thought to the Zoom h2n w/ shockmount for on-camera mount option and/or sony bluetooth + rode smartlav + recorder for off-camera mount option

[fuzzynormal]

48 minutes ago, Tarik Dobbs said:

the Zoom h2n w/ shockmount for on-camera mount option and/or sony bluetooth + rode smartlav + recorder for off-camera mount option

The off-mount recommendation is a pretty practical suggestion.

With my EM5II, I can record directly into the camera from the hot-shoe mounted EW-100 receiver, which works great and is as bulky and non-streamlined as I ever want my cameras to get; don't like a lot of crap hanging off them.

However, as mentioned above, when shooting with a camera like the GX85, and no audio input is possible (or if you want the extra fidelity) then carrying around the receiver & recorder in a small shoulder bag has worked quite well me.

[mercer]

20 hours ago, fuzzynormal said:

Ugh, syncing b-roll audio...

Honestly, this is probably the biggest reason for you to go with a Mac and FCPX. The auto synching feature with FCPX is nothing short miraculous. The lightning speed and accuracy blows me away every time I use it. 

[John Matthews]

On 6/10/2016 at 10:11 PM, mercer said:

Honestly, this is probably the biggest reason for you to go with a Mac and FCPX. The auto synching feature with FCPX is nothing short miraculous. The lightning speed and accuracy blows me away every time I use it. 

I really don't understand why people even care about having a mic jack and headphone jack. Knowing you have poor audio REQUIRES you to pay attention to it, get the mic closer to the subject and just sync it. I'm OK for having the jacks, but rarely do manufactures include good preamps... yeah the GH4 and G7 have the mic jack, but it won't beat a zoom H1 ($100), correctly positioned, and perhaps hooked up to an even better mic. What's the big deal?

[John Matthews]

Couldn't help noticing that when I import converted DNG files and apply VSCO Kodak Porta 160 NC - (one of my favorite looks), it hardly changes the original RAW file's skin colors... just increasing the highlights, but the overall saturation and skin color seems very similar. Other cameras that I've used over the years had a much bigger change when I applied the same Preset. Interesting.

[John Matthews]

On another photography-related note, the GX80 says in its specs that it has a max flash sync speed of 1/160, but I and others have found 1/250; so, that's good news!

[Fredrik Lyhne]

Here's a video I made comparing the GX85 in Natural vs the GH4 with Cinelike D + Leeming LUT which is my favourite GH4 image. I'm by no means a colorist, but I think the results are ok. May need some additional tweaking here and there. What do you think?

For some reason when I upload videos in 4K instead of 1080p the video get's more orange. Anyone else noticed that?

 

[John Matthews]

28 minutes ago, Fredrik Lyhne said:

Here's a video I made comparing the GX85 in Natural vs the GH4 with Cinelike D + Leeming LUT which is my favourite GH4 image. I'm by no means a colorist, but I think the results are ok. May need some additional tweaking here and there. What do you think?

For some reason when I upload videos in 4K instead of 1080p the video get's more orange. Anyone else noticed that?

Thanks for this. It needed to be done. I'm not sure for the color-shift upon uploading. However, you might want to try the Standard Profile instead. I've had good luck with that... but in the end, it's just a matter of personal preference. I'm finding your GX85 sample too pink in the skintone, but then again, I don't have a perfectly calibrated monitor and, as you mentioned, Youtube might be doing something to your file. Personally, I've just decided to use Standard (-3,-5,-5,-3), with shadows at +2... It seems good to me. I think the most important is to turn off all sharpening and noise reduction- you can tweek the rest in post. Also, I just leave it at something that suits the project to keep the look consistent. Finally, I've been choosing only from sunny and incandescent WB and just letting the colors do what they want- again, consistency being the goal.

[John Matthews]

I've decided to coin a new word:

jackitis [mass noun] filmmaker condition in which a camera cannot be used due to the absence of a microphone jack.

[Vladimir]

So does anyone have 4k external recorded footage to compare it with some 10bit material? And can anyone say whats the max DR that camera can deliver? 

[Fredrik Lyhne]

@John Matthews I'll try the standard and compare it to natural next week. I was expecting the magenta comment  I know I should just start the grade from scratch but I wanted to see what you thought about it first. Grading skin tones is really difficult!

WB is tricky and needs more testing, but I agree that sunny is a good starting point in the summer. 

Which image did you like the best, GH4 or GX85?

[John Matthews]

1 minute ago, Fredrik Lyhne said:

@John Matthews I'll try the standard and compare it to natural next week. I was expecting the magenta comment  I know I should just start the grade from scratch but I wanted to see what you thought about it first. Grading skin tones is really difficult!

WB is tricky and needs more testing, but I agree that sunny is a good starting point in the summer. 

Which image did you like the best, GH4 or GX85?

In this case, I really don't like the magenta (very noticeable on the wall)... I'd prefer the GH4 image because I prefer a warmer image... but it also has a problem in that it seems to pull to orange... again, with my viewing experience. And what about you?

[Fredrik Lyhne]

2 minutes ago, John Matthews said:

In this case, I really don't like the magenta (very noticeable on the wall)... I'd prefer the GH4 image because I prefer a warmer image... but it also has a problem in that it seems to pull to orange... again, with my viewing experience. And what about you?

I agree, GH4 is better but it's a little orange. Thanks for your feedback!

[The Chris]

TCS reviews the GX with many names

 

[John Matthews]

1 hour ago, The Chris said:

TCS reviews the GX with many names

Saw it. I feel like they were very dismissive of the video capabilities due to its lack of a microphone... (jackitis- look above) and I think they didn't really know how to use it (they must have used only default settings and cranked up the electronic IS). They misrepresented its 5 axis IBIS by calling it 3 axis IBIS + 2 axis IS in lens. They left out the fact it doesn't overheat and that the GX85 model doesn't have a max recording time. Finally, they said a 1" sony sensor has more dynamic range. The conclusion was simply that it's more of a still camera... whatever. I wonder what the GH5 review will look like for these guys... or maybe they'll learn how to use the camera first. I like their show though.

[sanveer]

29 minutes ago, John Matthews said:

Saw it. I feel like they were very dismissive of the video capabilities due to its lack of a microphone... (jackitis- look above) and I think they didn't really know how to use it (they must have used only default settings and cranked up the electronic IS). They misrepresented its 5 axis IBIS by calling it 3 axis IBIS + 2 axis IS in lens. They left out the fact it doesn't overheat and that the GX85 model doesn't have a max recording time. Finally, they said a 1" sony sensor has more dynamic range. The conclusion was simply that it's more of a still camera... whatever. I wonder what the GH5 review will look like for these guys... or maybe they'll learn how to use the camera first. I like their show though.

I was also surprised by how disappointed they seemed with the video on the GX85. Though I really liked the skin tones in their video. Also, while a mic-jack is desirable, not having it isn't the end of the world. Also, I noticed they forgot to mention the HDMI out along with monitoring in-camera, being one of the better features (like Andrew mentioned). 

Though, I feel Panasonic should go the Sony way and have Log profiles on all their cameras. Even if they are paid firmware updates. I feel Panasonic isn't extracting the maximum resolution possible from the sensor. 

Also, I feel Panasonic needs to work on their RAW photos. They need to move towards the 14-Bit RAW side. And, I have (only) a gut feeling, that it's the processing that's stopping them (and not the sensor). 

5 hours ago, Fredrik Lyhne said:

Here's a video I made comparing the GX85 in Natural vs the GH4 with Cinelike D + Leeming LUT which is my favourite GH4 image. I'm by no means a colorist, but I think the results are ok. May need some additional tweaking here and there. What do you think?

For some reason when I upload videos in 4K instead of 1080p the video get's more orange. Anyone else noticed that?

 

I am curious. What was the real colour of the wall behind this guy???