An adventure into the Panasonic GX85/80 begins - and a look at the Leica Nocticron for Micro Four Thirds

[Orangenz]

12 hours ago, Vesku said:

Looks like cineD. Horrible orange skin tones. Highlights and colors are clipping badly. Is the G85 dyn range so bad?.

My fault on the white balance there, also this is natural setting as you know gx85 does not have cineD. Personally I like it as that's what the skin actually looks like under orange lamps (flame). Also set the highlights to spot clip as I didn't want the editor to have to colour grade too much on their $50 software. The GX85 does highlight clip easier than the GH4. Apart from the fairy lights the only lights here are a tungsten spot from the roof and a fill panel on the floor, ie. a very high dr situation. Thanks for the feedback!

[Cary Knoop]

13 hours ago, Orangenz said:

Shot this on GX85, 25mm 1.4, and 42.5 1.7 

 

Nice recording!

Orangenz, out of curiosity why did you not upload this 4k onto YouTube?

I think your white balance is fine (but perhaps you corrected it in post?), but I find the footage a little under exposed (which is the source of those strong red and orange tints). 

If you look at the scope it is mighty crowded in the black and shadows region. 

I disagree with Vesku that highlights are clipping. 

Lighting is a bit uneven, some of the reflections are a bit harsh. 

I don't know how many lights you used but it is sometimes worthwhile to point one towards the ceiling to get a nice diffused base light of the whole scene which allows you to place the main and key lights a bit farther away.

And great bokeh balls!

 

[Vesku]

18 minutes ago, Orangenz said:

My fault on the white balance there, also this is natural setting as you know gx85 does not have cineD. Personally I like it as that's what the skin actually looks like under orange lamps (flame). Also set the highlights to spot clip as I didn't want the editor to have to colour grade too much on their $50 software. The GX85 does highlight clip easier than the GH4. Apart from the fairy lights the only lights here are a tungsten spot from the roof and a fill panel on the floor, ie. a very high dr situation. Thanks for the feedback!

Panasonic naming and models are easy to mix   In contrasty lights I use lower iso and contrast -5. 

[Orangenz]

14 minutes ago, Cary Knoop said:

Nice recording!

Orangenz, out of curiosity why did you not upload this 4k onto YouTube?

I think your white balance is fine (but perhaps you corrected it in post?), but I find the footage a little under exposed (which is the source of those strong red and orange tints). 

If you look at the scope it is mighty crowded in the black and shadows region. 

I disagree with Vesku that highlights are clipping. 

Lighting is a bit uneven, some of the reflections are a bit harsh. 

I don't know how many lights you used but it is sometimes worthwhile to point one towards the ceiling to get a nice diffused base light of the whole scene which allows you to place the main and key lights a bit farther away.

And great bokeh balls!

 

I only shot the video, the violinist did the great edit considering it was on Pinnacle and crashed a lot. I think it was corrected colour a tad in post, yes. I set it up to not clip highlights so it could have probably done with a lift overall into the middle. Yeah basically a totally dark room with three lights (background near cross, foot, roof spot. Thanks! Fairy lights are great! The thing that struck me was the IBIS while using my favourite 25mm. My GH4 sat unused.  

[Cary Knoop]

1 minute ago, Orangenz said:

The thing that struck me was the IBIS while using my favourite 25mm. My GH4 sat unused.  

Yes, IBIS is great, it's like a mini gimbal.

Hopefully Panasonic in the future will find a way to distinguish between intentional and unintentional pans to make this work even better. 

For instance pressure sensitivity of the body might be a way, "squeeze when you want to pan".

 

 

 

 

[Vesku]

22 minutes ago, Orangenz said:

I only shot the video, the violinist did the great edit considering it was on Pinnacle and crashed a lot. I think it was corrected colour a tad in post, yes. I set it up to not clip highlights so it could have probably done with a lift overall into the middle. Yeah basically a totally dark room with three lights (background near cross, foot, roof spot. Thanks! Fairy lights are great! The thing that struck me was the IBIS while using my favourite 25mm. My GH4 sat unused.  

Seems that lightning was indeed very difficult and hard. Does the original clips look the same as this edited video?

Can you say how much there is difference in dyn range (GH4,GX85) in same Natural profile?

[Cary Knoop]

5 hours ago, Cary Knoop said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-E2-gf4Pc4

 

 

Finally the 4K version is encoded as well. 

It sometimes takes YouTube a long to to encode all resolutions.

 

[Orangenz]

1 hour ago, Vesku said:

Seems that lightning was indeed very difficult and hard. Does the original clips look the same as this edited video?

Can you say how much there is difference in dyn range (GH4,GX85) in same Natural profile?

I don't have the original footage. The colour is better on GX85. As for the range, it's hard to tell really, apart from saying I prefer the highlight treatment on GH4. There's some comparison shots here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TlNsj-CSaE where you can see the GH4 sky is darker with more contrast showing. 

 

[Cary Knoop]

For indoor shooting dynamic range is not really an issue.

[Vesku]

5 hours ago, Orangenz said:

I don't have the original footage. The colour is better on GX85. As for the range, it's hard to tell really, apart from saying I prefer the highlight treatment on GH4. There's some comparison shots here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TlNsj-CSaE where you can see the GH4 sky is darker with more contrast showing. 

 

I made comparison image GH4 vs GX85 dyn range from your clips. GH4 has more info in highlights.

Both iso400. GH4 Natural and GX85 Natural+idynamic standard. GH4 is still flatter.

 

[Dean]

On 18/12/2016 at 3:29 PM, Nathan Gabriel said:

Has anyone done a good comparison between the gx85 and g85? I want to get one, and I'm not sure if the g85 is worth the cost. The only real benefits I see to the g85 is the weather sealing and cinelike D. However I'm not sure if cinelike D really gets me that much more than -5 contrast on Natural. I'm not even sure how much I need the extra dynamic range, I've been shooting on the gh3 for the past few years and the Natural profile typically works fine for me. Opinions?

I have both now. It really just boils down to the handling I think when deciding which one to buy however there are differences. I doubt there is any difference in IQ for stills or video with these two cameras though. The G85 is amazing value for money IMO.

 The G85 IMO is a nicer camera to use and work with because of it's form factor, but they both have their place in my life  I'll keep both for sure. I like the G85 with the 12-35/2.8 and the 35-100/2.8 but the GX85 is just such great fun when used with the 15/1.7.

The G85 is nicer to hold and use. It's very solid feeling but very light at the same time ... I think there's only 70gm difference between the two bodies. The grip is just great on the G85 also (not talking about the optional grip ... just the grip on the actual cam). Weather sealing on the G85 is a plus for me as I enjoy shooting in the rain.

You also don't need to program the memory functions with the G85. When shooting around the streets or on vacation, I often quickly change between stills & video and also change between different types of stills shooting (static objects in Aperture priority with AF-S  as well as moving people with Shutter priority, AF-S and burst mode & auto ISO. With the G85 I find I can make these adjustments VERY quickly with the dials on the cam as I'm approaching the subject ... I love this aspect of the G85 ... all it's dials.

I only briefly used Cinelike D and it seemed a lot flatter than standard profiles, but have no idea how it compares to -5 contrast on Natural. Haven't tried using FilmConvert over the CineD profile but I'm sure it's good.

The EVF is nicer on the G85.

Haven't used the G85 that much, but it feels like the internal IBIS is better on the G85 when used with the 12-35/2.8. Even the 35-100/2.8 was super stable when filming all the way out to 100mm. Maybe it's just the larger form factor of the G85 that makes it feel more stable ... not sure.

If I had to choose one I'd take the G85 though ... excellent handling, nice EVF and a flippy screen with dials everywhere in a tough but small package !!

The G85 feels very goldilocks to me ... very much reminds me of using my most goldilocks of all AF film cameras ... the Nikon F80

Only thing missing is min shutter speed with auto iso but thats missing in every freaken pana camera !!!!!!!! MAYBE the GH5 will have this but probably not.

.... And ... why can't we have a paid VLOG option for the G85 !!!

Here's a nice comparison between the two cams for you ...

http://mirrorlesscomparison.com/panasonic-vs-panasonic/lumix-g85-vs-gx85-g80-vs-gx80/

Good luck.

 

 

 

[Fredrik Lyhne]

22 hours ago, jase said:

Here you go:

Excuse the bad quality, but my phone is the only other camera I have  I also took your recommendation for the Smallrig Grip - awesome stuff! Yet i am thinking about whether I should add a metalwire or sth like that to the grip and the camera straps, just in case the pressure on the hotshoe is too big... For now it feels pretty rock solid, but I dont know whether I dare to trust this in the long run.

During christmas I will make a small example video. Up until now I am just running around here at home and loving the lowlight as well as the focus ring, feels like Voigtländer! 

I think this GX80+ SB XL + Sigma 18-35 combo is kind of unmatched, there isnt another stabilized system out there that gives me the DOF of f2.2 (FF equiv) with such a wide angle zoom. Loving it! Now if the GX80 would have a mic in an 4k60p I probably would ban myself from this forum to not get caught by the GAS again. Have to admit, this camera is really nailing it for me. Paired with the Pana 20mm, I have a very stealthy kit when I need it, with the Sigma I am now ready for my next backpacking trip.

Wow, where's the camera?  It's not the same grip as I have but they seem to offer good quality for a low price. I think they have cages for the GX85 as well. 

I've been thinking about MB + Sigma for a while as well, but I'm happy with the native lens selection for now. That is a 25-50 f/1.2 right? Looks really cool!

btw, If I could choose just one lens for travelling with a MFT camera it would be the 15mm Pana Leica. It's just a tad bit wider than the 20mm which makes it better for capturing the scenery as well as the people in front of it. 

Please post videos from the Beast when you have some!

[jase]

6 minutes ago, Fredrik Lyhne said:

Wow, where's the camera?  It's not the same grip as I have but they seem to offer good quality for a low price. I think they have cages for the GX85 as well. 

I've been thinking about MB + Sigma for a while as well, but I'm happy with the native lens selection for now. That is a 25-50 f/1.2 right? Looks really cool!

btw, If I could choose just one lens for travelling with a MFT camera it would be the 15mm Pana Leica. It's just a tad bit wider than the 20mm which makes it better for capturing the scenery as well as the people in front of it. 

Please post videos from the Beast when you have some!

No, this is more like a 11,5 - 22,5 f1.1 - or less wide, once you go for 4K or enable electronic stabilization. I think i will get the smallrig cage and another handle that mounts on the cage, so that I can sleep better at night

About 15mm vs. 20mm - i totally agree with you. 15mm is about the same as the iPhones do - and they work pretty well. However, i dont really know why, but i just love the Pana 20mm - so small and yet a linear focus, although the throw is a bit long for my taste. The second version feels way better than the first version.

[Fredrik Lyhne]

24 minutes ago, jase said:

No, this is more like a 11,5 - 22,5 f1.1 - or less wide, once you go for 4K or enable electronic stabilization. I think i will get the smallrig cage and another handle that mounts on the cage, so that I can sleep better at night

About 15mm vs. 20mm - i totally agree with you. 15mm is about the same as the iPhones do - and they work pretty well. However, i dont really know why, but i just love the Pana 20mm - so small and yet a linear focus, although the throw is a bit long for my taste. The second version feels way better than the first version.

Sorry, I meant in FF fov and with the 4K crop. Forgot that you use 1080p and the XL version. So it's basically 23-45mm  in 1080p and a little narrower in 4K. 

The 20mm is a great lens as well, I'm on my second copy but I don't use it often. It's just that for me the 15mm hits the sweet spot if both the subject and background is equally important, like in travel photography. 

[Thpriest]

How do you set up the IBIS for the sigma 18-35? Do you change it every time you zoom?

[jase]

4 minutes ago, Thpriest said:

How do you set up the IBIS for the sigma 18-35? Do you change it every time you zoom?

Since I have the Canon EF variant, the focal length is automatically passed to the body by the lens itself.

[Thpriest]

ah! So it's not like a manual lens! Cool!

[John Matthews]

@jase,

Are you going to show us any test shots? It looks like a big, but really killer setup!

[jase]

26 minutes ago, John Matthews said:

@jase,

Are you going to show us any test shots? It looks like a big, but really killer setup!

For sure! Will do some shooting on christmas

[Nathan Gabriel]

On 12/18/2016 at 4:20 AM, Vesku said:

Nathan, if you want good dynamic range, get a used GH4.

I have two concerns with the GH4. Given my shooting style, I need good low light performance and I also am very interested in IBIS. I use manual focus lenses exclusively wich means all my handheld shots are with a 12mm. The Gx85 and G85 seem to have better low light performance than the GH4 from the comments that I've seen. I guess I can do without the IBIS if the low light on the GH4 is actually better than what I currently think. I kind of hate having so many good options?! The GH4 would also be more appealing if the slow motion was sharper