An adventure into the Panasonic GX85/80 begins - and a look at the Leica Nocticron for Micro Four Thirds

[Sedazin]

The GX80 can be switched to 30p/60p using a "service mode":

IBIS works in video mode:

 

[gethin]

First impressions, some good, some not so.  Not sure its the right fit for me.  Need to test low light and do more shooting generally 

41 minutes ago, Sedazin said:

The GX80 can be switched to 30p/60p using a "service mode":

IBIS works in video mode:

 

Nice hack but no good for me - I need to swap quickly from one to the other.

5 axis - I know it works in video   Just making sure that in the menu you need "E-stabilsazation (video)" to ON. (Because without that it seemed to do nothing.

[Andrew Reid]

Erm no turn E-stabilization for video OFF.

That is the digital, cropped stabilisation.

If the 5 axis IBIS isn't working or is greyed out in the menus, that isn't right - it should be immediately noticeable and you should not have to turn on digital stabilisation

[Sedazin]

I always turn E-stabilization off and have IBIS (not 5-Axis) with legacy or non-OIS lenses like the Olympus 25mm f/1.7.

[ninetto]

52 minutes ago, Sedazin said:

I always turn E-stabilization off and have IBIS (not 5-Axis) with legacy or non-OIS lenses like the Olympus 25mm f/1.7.

seems to be a bit of confusion here, or unclear wording of the manual.

A quick look at page 146 seems to imply that "5-axis-hybrid" stabilization is  available for non-OIS lenses only when "E-Stabilization" is set to [ON]. (See *)

Up until now I hadn't played with this setting. It was "on" for my Canon-FD lenses and I was pleased with the stabilization... but with it off the stabilization seems to work quite well too. Hmmmmmmmm... what is Panasonic trying to tell us? I understand that the "hybrid 5-axis " (+ E-stabilization)  adds digital cropping to OIS-Lenses, but what is the deal with non-OIS lenses?

[gethin]

1 hour ago, Andrew Reid said:

Erm no turn E-stabilization for video OFF.

That is the digital, cropped stabilisation.

If the 5 axis IBIS isn't working or is greyed out in the menus, that isn't right - it should be immediately noticeable and you should not have to turn on digital stabilisation

Well bugger, I just turned the ibis off and on again and it's started working. I'll have to keep an eye on that.  Probably means that the video is a poor gauge of its stabilisation:)

[BucksterUK]

oh I thought the "ideal" was to have both mechanical and electrical stabilzation ?

[John Matthews]

2 hours ago, BucksterUK said:

oh I thought the "ideal" was to have both mechanical and electrical stabilzation ?

I don't think so. The better stabalization comes from dual-IS, a combo of 5-axis IBIS and 2 axis in-lens sabalization. The runner-up is just 5-axis IBIS and no in-lens stabalization. IMO the electronic type doesn't figure in all of this; hence a distant third due to the crop.

[Inazuma]

Nice images @gethin

[mercer]

Yeah, I think for non-ois, non-m4/3rd lenses, e-stabilization needs to be activated to get 5-Axis IBIS... Correct?

[Inazuma]

25 minutes ago, mercer said:

Yeah, I think for non-ois, non-m4/3rd lenses, e-stabilization needs to be activated to get 5-Axis IBIS... Correct?

No. E-stabilization never needs to be activated. Not sure why they've included that... just confuses people and reduces image quality.

[John Matthews]

27 minutes ago, mercer said:

Yeah, I think for non-ois, non-m4/3rd lenses, e-stabilization needs to be activated to get 5-Axis IBIS... Correct?

Incorrect. I'm using a 50mm Pentax F1.7 WITH 5 axis IBIS.

[mercer]

25 minutes ago, Inazuma said:

No. E-stabilization never needs to be activated. Not sure why they've included that... just confuses people and reduces image quality.

Really?! Shit, I have to check my settings, but I think I have been using E-stabilization all this time and I have been pretty blown away by the IQ. I can only imagine how nice it looks without it.

 

24 minutes ago, John Matthews said:

Incorrect. I'm using a 50mm Pentax F1.7 WITH 5 axis IBIS.

Then which stabilization setting do you activate to get the 5-Axis on manual lenses?

[John Matthews]

20 minutes ago, mercer said:

Then which stabilization setting do you activate to get the 5-Axis on manual lenses?

There's been confusion about this since way back in this thread, even when it came out. The stabalizer mechanism in this camera is 5-axis-only IBIS with the option of turning off an axis for panning (never really tried it though). Just set the stabalizer Operation Mode to the "hand with four shaky marks" and set your focal length- work great, even in 4k.

[jase]

16 minutes ago, mercer said:

Really?! Shit, I have to check my settings, but I think I have been using E-stabilization all this time and I have been pretty blown away by the IQ. I can only imagine how nice it looks without it.

Same here... Could swear when comparing this setting on & off that it looked even better stabilized when set to on. I will test this again.

[mercer]

8 minutes ago, jase said:

Same here... Could swear when comparing this setting on & off that it looked even better stabilized when set to on. I will test this again.

 

16 minutes ago, John Matthews said:

There's been confusion about this since way back in this thread, even when it came out. The stabalizer mechanism in this camera is 5-axis-only IBIS with the option of turning off the up-down axis (never really tried it though). Just set the stabalizer Operation Mode to the "hand with four shaky marks" and set your focal length- work great, even in 4k.

I don't mean to be a contrarian here, but I think you are setting the in body 5-Axis to "on" for photos only and you aren't getting the full 5-Axis in movie mode. If you look at the chart and asterisk, the language is pretty plain... E-stabilization needs to be activated for non-ois lenses in movie mode. But I could be wrong. I don't have my cam near me right now.

[Inazuma]

12 minutes ago, mercer said:

I don't mean to be a contrarian here, but I think you are setting the in body 5-Axis to "on" for photos only and you aren't getting the full 5-Axis in movie mode. If you look at the chart and asterisk, the language is pretty plain... E-stabilization needs to be activated for non-ois lenses in movie mode. But I could be wrong. I don't have my cam near me right now.

I stand corrected  However, the stabilisation is already very good without turning on e-stabilization. I just didn't consider turning it on because it would potentially degrade image quality or introduce digital stabilisation artefacts.

[mercer]

20 minutes ago, Inazuma said:

I stand corrected  However, the stabilisation is already very good without turning on e-stabilization. I just didn't consider turning it on because it would potentially degrade image quality or introduce digital stabilisation artefacts.

That was too easy...?

Honestly though, on my GX85, I can't even get the symbol for 5-Axis to show up on the screen without activating E-Stabilizer. There is no option for it in under the Photo or Video menus. This is with a Nikkor ai-s 28mm. Maybe the GX80 is different?

[BucksterUK]

wow I'm really confused now

I thought the "only" disadvantage of adding the further E-stabilizer on top of the 5 Axis - was the extra crop

and if the extra crop no issue then may as well have all stabilization on ?

certainly every since I've bought the camera - I've been using my 14-140 MKII with OIS + In body (so 5 axis) + E-Stabilizer as well ....

maybe incorrectly !

[ninetto]

OK, I take a stab at an answer, since posting Panasonic's own table only caused additional confusion. Perhaps the key lies in Panasonic's use of the word "HYBRID" in their chart. I.E. that in the chart, where only "BODY" is listed for non-OIS lenses (not using E-stabilization), they really do mean 5-axis IBIS... just are not calling it that (for whatever marketing/translation reasons)?