An adventure into the Panasonic GX85/80 begins - and a look at the Leica Nocticron for Micro Four Thirds

[jonpais]

While I'm in YouTube processing hell, I thought I'd post a 4K screen grab from a test I just did of the Leica Noctricon (Lumix GH4, settings -4, -4, 0, -2, 0). 

 

[Cinegain]

Possibly the best lens M43 has ever seen. Just the price... I never shot with Leica, but if I would, I'd probably use the money to buy the Leica R 35 & 50mm E55 and boost 'em.

[jonpais]

When I did a search on YouTube, most of the 'tests' I saw of the Nocticron were of weeds and garbage (literally), with shutter speed set at 1/000 second (because he didn't want to shell out for an ND filter); or set exclusively at f/1.2 (WTF?), when stopping down to f/2.8 gives you 30 lines per mm more resolution; or shot in a studio by a reputable cameraman, but with the ugliest set and lighting imaginable. And this is already two years after the lens was released. Then I came across this fool who belongs in an asylum who can go on for 15 minutes blabbing about the '8 best lenses', without even bothering to give any criteria or showing sample images, yet he has over 50,000 subscribers! I guess I have too much time on my hands... 

[Cinegain]

Who? Steve Huff?

The Zhongyi 42.5mm f/1.2 is a decent much more affordable alternative... though it behaves more like a vintage Zenit lens. Mirrorlessons did a good piece on that: http://www.mirrorlessons.com/2014/11/17/the-zy-optics-mitakon-24mm-f1-7-and-42-5mm-f1-2-micro-four-thirds-mount-complete-review/ .

[jonpais]

Shane Hurlbut. But since watching a review by Steve Huff, where he keeps dragging this beautiful fucking Cosina across a wooden table, I can't watch any more of his videos.

[jonpais]

16 minutes ago, Cinegain said:

Who? Steve Huff?

The Zhongyi 42.5mm f/1.2 is a decent much more affordable alternative... though it behaves more like a vintage Zenit lens. Mirrorlessons did a good piece on that: http://www.mirrorlessons.com/2014/11/17/the-zy-optics-mitakon-24mm-f1-7-and-42-5mm-f1-2-micro-four-thirds-mount-complete-review/ .

I've only recently bookmarked Mirror Lessons, they do some good reviews. Their gorgeous video test of the Fuji XT-2 nearly had me sell everything I own just to get one.  And for around 400 clams, it looks like you could do much worse than the Mitakon 42.5mm. It's got beautiful bokeh. There really is something about handling an all-metal manual focus prime. In their review of the Mitakon 85mm f/1.2, LensTip had this to say,

You have to admit we live in very interesting times. Not long ago we tested the humble Korean Samyang 2/135 which was able to compete on equal terms with the significantly more expensive Zeiss Apo Sonnar 2/135, a top-of-the-range product, the best German optics specialists and Japanese factories can offer. Now the Chinese Mitakon 1.2/85 was able to defeat the legendary Canon EF 85 mm f/1.2 USM II in some categories, including the resolution which is most important one. Already that fact alone makes the tested lens recommendable. The Mitakon is a new brand and the beginners often make different mistakes ; still the results of the Speedmaster 1.2/85 prove that its producers have a huge potential. If they keep improving and developing as fast as they’ve done so far they soon will become a very serious player in the international photography market.

And they don't hand out praise lightly. Like I said, i would never have spent $1,600 on a u4/3 lens if it hadn't been discounted so heavily.  I'm still not sure why they sold it to me so cheaply, since this one shop usually tries to cheat me. In fact, while there might be some problems with the APSC version of the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 (I haven't encountered any yet on my MFT copy), it also sells for a little over $300, and it is optically superior (on the bench, anyhow!) to the Nocticron in many ways - but it is not a true portrait lens. The Nocticron does have beautiful rendering though, however that is quantified. 

[jonpais]

My field test of the Nocticron is up.

[Cinegain]

13 hours ago, jonpais said:

I've only recently bookmarked Mirror Lessons, they do some good reviews. Their gorgeous video test of the Fuji XT-2 nearly had me sell everything I own just to get one.  And for around 400 clams, it looks like you could do much worse than the Mitakon 42.5mm. It's got beautiful bokeh. There really is something about handling an all-metal manual focus prime. In their review of the Mitakon 85mm f/1.2, LensTip had this to say,

[..]

And they don't hand out praise lightly. Like I said, i would never have spent $1,600 on a u4/3 lens if it hadn't been discounted so heavily.  I'm still not sure why they sold it to me so cheaply, since this one shop usually tries to cheat me. In fact, while there might be some problems with the APSC version of the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 (I haven't encountered any yet on my MFT copy), it also sells for a little over $300, and it is optically superior (on the bench, anyhow!) to the Nocticron in many ways - but it is not a true portrait lens. The Nocticron does have beautiful rendering though, however that is quantified. 

Yeah, Mirrorlessons really gives everything a fair shot, I like 'em. ZY Optics/Zhongyi/Mitakon has great stuff. It's like modern vintage lenses, but not in a hippy dippy Lomo Pezval (albeit pretty slick!) or Meyer-Optik-Görlitz Trio-/Primoplan kinda way. They're like somewhere in between Zonlai, Samyang and SLR Magic. Cool options, fine prices. Northrup is one of these polarizing characters, but this video was kinda fun, going on this whole rant and then the plot twist...

You really fetched yourself a nice deal there! You've gotten me curious about the 30mm, gotta try that out. Maybe a boosted 50mm Summicron-R could get me somewhat close to that 42.5mm Leica magic at roughly 1/3th of the price. Plus, it's usable on other cameras as well. Again, never had the luck of shooting Leica glass (unless you consider Panasonic fixed lens cameras with a Vario lens a real Leica). Good food for thought for sure.

[jonpais]

@Cinegain You shoot with an Olympus?

[Cinegain]

8 minutes ago, jonpais said:

@Cinegain You shoot with an Olympus?

Yup. The E-M1, but that's mainly for stills. More serious stills: D5300 (although I think there would be an issue with adapting a Leica R? Need to check that). Video mainly the Panasonics (GH4 as a production tool (though gets less and less use (Andy Lee would probably understand)), BMPCC for that thick footage, GX80 for keepin' it compact, G80 that rivals the E-M1 Mark II in some ways).

[jonpais]

Wow. I'm not familiar with the 50mm Summicron-R. The Nokton 42.5mm f/0.95 runs $800, or half the price of the Nocticron...

[Michael Ma]

Just spent an entire week traveling with the GX85, Nocticron, and 12mm Summilux.  Wedding, Disneyland, Las Vegas.  Ended up with about 400GB of raw pics and 4K video.  It was such a joy to use.  Such a different experience than traveling with a SLR...which I usually end up not taking on short overseas travels just because it's such a huge commitment to carry.  Although the lenses were large, the GX85 body and it's unassuming size and shutter noise encouraged me to carry it just about everywhere I went.  Also, it can take a picture in any light without flash due to the speed of the lens, stabilization, and a fairly well performing sensor in low light.  I also love startup time, fast shutter (electronic and mechanical) and large buffer that just wants to be held down.  I had 4 batteries with me.  I averaged about 2 full batteries a day.  Some days 3.  But the 4th one was just reassuring to just have on hand just in case.

Here's one thing that I love with this camera.  Always have it set on continuous shot.  And for every picture, try to take many shots.  Then, when you review the pics, just hold the back button....it's like watching a timelapse of your entire trip already edited with highlights.  Works great with raw photos and the previews are sharp.

There were a handful of occasions where a flip out screen would have been very handy.  I lost the lens cap for the Nocticron and dented the hood of the Summilux.  I hope it's not too expensive to replace.

[jonpais]

@Michael Ma When you have time, could you share any video of people shot with the Summilux, please, please?

[Cinegain]

34 minutes ago, jonpais said:

Wow. I'm not familiar with the 50mm Summicron-R. The Nokton 42.5mm f/0.95 runs $800, or half the price of the Nocticron...

Me neither. But it looks like a good deal.

For Nikon adaptability I'd have to change the mount apparently though: http://www.leitax.com/leica-lens-for-nikon-cameras.html . That's already what I was thinking. So either do that (as I have the D5300 and a Metabones Speedbooster XL (0.64x) for Nikon)... or just let it be and use a cheapo simple adapter for L/R - EOS and use the Zhongyi Lens Turbo II (EOS - M4/3 0.72x) (like with Contax Zeiss; would be interesting to see how they compare, as some people swear by a Leica R set and some by CY Zeiss). Hum.

21 minutes ago, Michael Ma said:

Just spent an entire week traveling with the GX85, Nocticron, and 12mm Summilux.  Wedding, Disneyland, Las Vegas.  Ended up with about 400GB of raw pics and 4K video.  It was such a joy to use.  Such a different experience than traveling with a SLR...which I usually end up not taking on short overseas travels just because it's such a huge commitment to carry.  Although the lenses were large, the GX85 body and it's unassuming size and shutter noise encouraged me to carry it just about everywhere I went.  Also, it can take a picture in any light without flash due to the speed of the lens, stabilization, and a fairly well performing sensor in low light.  I also love \startup time, fast shutter (electronic and mechanical) and large buffer that just wants to be held down.  I had 4 batteries with me.  I averaged about 2 full batteries a day.  Some days 3.  But the 4th one was just reassuring to just have on hand just in case.

Here's one thing that I love with this camera.  Always have it set on continuous shot.  And for every picture, try to take many shots.  Then, when you review the pics, just hold the back button....it's like watching a timelapse of your entire trip already edited with highlights.  Works great with raw photos and the previews are sharp.

There were a handful of occasions where a flip out screen would have been very handy.  I lost the lens cap for the Nocticron and dented the hood of the Summilux.  I hope it's not too expensive to replace.

That does sound like a good time! And a lot of footage, ha! Yeah, sometimes there's a lot of pressure to nail a moment, but indeed, why not take a burst? Sometimes a micro expression can make a lot of difference. It's not cheating if the results speak for themselves. Yeah, the GX85/80 isn't the most ideal camera to use, but it certainly is a convenient one for size and results! Well done, good luck on the edits and replacements.

-- btw, Olympus is also killing it, this week's headlining picture shot with the 25mm PRO is stunning: http://www.43rumors.com/weekly-43rumors-readers-pictures-roundup-123/ .

[BookMark]

1 hour ago, Cinegain said:

Yup. The E-M1, but that's mainly for stills. More serious stills: D5300 (although I think there would be an issue with adapting a Leica R? Need to check that). Video mainly the Panasonics (GH4 as a production tool (though gets less and less use (Andy Lee would probably understand)), BMPCC for that thick footage, GX80 for keepin' it compact, G80 that rivals the E-M1 Mark II in some ways).

shouldn't be a problem, although i cannot guarantee every R lens will work. but I have a Fuji S5 pro (it's an APSC with a nikon F mount on it), i converted a few R lens (mainly tele 135/180's) and i have no problem using them on the S5. just need to un-do a few screws and replace the mounting metal ring to a F-mount. 

[Charles Maring]

I've been putting the Lumix GX85 through the paces... The 5 Axis is class leading so far for 4K video, and the sharpness is unparalleled IMO. I actually shot about 80% of our most recent web-series episode on it. This is our go-to camera for travel and personal work these days.

 

[John Matthews]

Everyone talks about color and this video reminds us how subjective this is. Here's The Camera Store TV comparison of the out-of-camera jpegs in facotory default settings. Many cameras were tested and they found the Panasonic (G80, arguably identical to the GX80) standard profile to be ahead of the Fuji, but lower than Nikon and Canon.

 

[mercer]

4 hours ago, John Matthews said:

Everyone talks about color and this video reminds us how subjective this is. Here's The Camera Store TV comparison of the out-of-camera jpegs in facotory default settings. Many cameras were tested and they found the Panasonic (G80, arguably identical to the GX80) standard profile to be ahead of the Fuji, but lower than Nikon and Canon.

 

Interesting episode. Definitely proof that this is all very subjective. I liked the Nikon and Fuji the best, but I tend to like darker images.

I was most surprised by Canon, although the jpegs were pleasing, I found them to look rather generic and even though the WB on the Panasonic and Olympus cameras seemed a little wonky, they definitely had an edgier, more unique quality in their renderings.

I was also very surprised by Pentax, I thought the images looked great. I would love to see Pentax bump up their video quality like Fuji has.

Obviously, the biggest outlier in the test was the iPhone and I question if it receiving the number one slot for that one category, was based more on familiarity of the image.

Thanks for sharing. 

[John Matthews]

2 hours ago, mercer said:

I was also very surprised by Pentax, I thought the images looked great. I would love to see Pentax bump up their video quality like Fuji has.

I had a Pentax K5. Loved it... the best stills camera (in RAW) I've ever had. The video, not so much. I hear people complain about the 5DM4's Motion jpeg, the Pentax had similar problems and the DR wasn't so good. In fact, the modern Pentax's would be OK if they could just get their CODEC right... I'd probably still be using them if they had. I just gave up on them.

Anyway, I think you're right about colors being VERY subjective. Then again, people on EOSHD seem only to prefer Canon and Fuji most of the time, but in fact, in terms of audience, their preference would probably be all over the place. As long as you're not shooting in log, someone will probably prefer the colors.

[Michael Ma]

On 11/13/2016 at 7:10 PM, jonpais said:

@Michael Ma When you have time, could you share any video of people shot with the Summilux, please, please?

Hey Jon.  I don't know if I have any exemplary video of people with the Summilux.  Most of the video I have is at a friend's wedding and the groom is very protective of anything that involves him being put on the Internet.  I'll try to grab a video of people for you next time I'm in Seoul with the 12mm.  Are you looking for samples for color, distortion, dof?