sanveer Posted June 5, 2016 Share Posted June 5, 2016 I saw that post of Michael Ma (If you were to design a Canon 5Dc, what specs would it have?), and was surprised that nobody thought of something similar, on the lines for Panasonic. Since Eoshd has a Huge Panasonic fanbase (including your truly), we should Help Panasonic decide the Future of Cameras, based on the needs of customers, price range, available sensors, available codecs and ones to work on, color science etc etc. We could Consolidate the Discussion, as we go along. If someone Does Not like Panasonic Cameras, please ignore this discussion, instead of ranting about some other camera being better, or wanting APSC or FF sensors etc etc. 1. One of the biggest issues (not Huge TBO), with Panasonic Cameras, including the ILC Flagship, the GH series, is that the codec could be better. Canon uses such an excellent version of H264 on many of its camcorders, and the C-line as well as so many cameras cameras. I don't understand why Panasonic cannot tweak their codecs on their range of cameras to get similar output. Atleast 8 bit 4-2-2 on the GH5 internally with a higher bitrate (in the 250-350Mbps range), and other cameras (they could charge a $99 for 4-2-2 and higher bitrate option). 2. Users found the skin tones on models before the GX85 having orange and purple casts, especially for lips etc. Do users of the GX85 still find this, an issue for jpegs? Also, are the jpegs from Panasonic almost as good as Olympus now? 3. If 1 Inch sensors can resolve upto 20MP in cameras like the FZ1000, the RX10, RX100 etc series, then M4/3 sensors can should easily be able to resolve in the range of 27MP. What is stopping them is the fact that Sony makes sensors according its own specifications, and manufacturers such as Panasonic, merely pick up these sensors off the shelf, thereby limiting their choices. Either Panasonic dictate what sensors it needs, or have them made by another manufacturer. 4. Better Log profiles. Like the VLog needs to be improved, and it should be on All Panasonic Cameras (atleast some version of it). As a matter of fact, I feel, Panasonic should release a Firmware Update for some kind of Log Profile on the Panasonic GX85. Let people pay for it, if Panasonic doesn't want to give them for free. 5. I am not sure why Panasonic isn't working on having accessories that can sit on its hotshoe, and add features like external sound recorders (like the Sony XLR-K2M XLR Adapter Kit). Or improve that Yuck Ugly looking YAGH interface. 6. I believe that Panasonic cameras have almost reached the limit at which they can focus and shoot photos. Though, I feel their low-light handling could somehow be better. Atleast usable upto ISO 6400. 7. Since Crop Factor and Low Light have always been an issue due to the smaller sensor, Panasonic should concentrate on working with Sigma, Leica and others, to make Full Frame Equivalent of 24mm. 35mm, 50mm and 100mm lenses at f.95, f1.2 and f1.4. Four of Each. These kind of lenses are essential, especially where one cannot or does not want to use a flash. What do you guys think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted June 5, 2016 Administrators Share Posted June 5, 2016 I am sure the codec will get a nice bump up with the GH5. Colour science from Panasonic can be quite good. CineLikeD wasn't very good, but the GX85 just on standard looks veeeeery nice Skintones similar to Canon and Olympus. VLOG is good, I don't think that needs improving much, but the sensor does - VLOG brought up a lot of noise didn't it? That's the sensor's fault. I'll be disappointed if Panasonic hike the megapixels on the GH4 to 20MP, what we really need is 12MP max and less noise. Some sort of Dual Pixel AF would be great. Bring back the 1.86x crop sensor of the GH2 with wider aspect ratio. Avoid YAGH-like mistakes and do a small compact mini-XLR breakout box powered from camera. Full size HDMI please. SDI is unlikely on a stills camera form factor body in this market. 5 axis in-body stabilisation, surely a given. I think GH5 is looking very exciting, they will have to try hard to mess it up sanveer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronFilm Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 Agreed, full sized HDMI, internal 10bit 422, GH2 sized multi aspect sensor, & XLR-K2M like audio interface rather than a bulky YAGH sanveer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzynormal Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 Good audio inputs and a more robust codec. Otherwise I think they're doing fine and offer impressive value. sanveer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Valles Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 This is my wishlist for the GH5: Dual-Pixel Autofocus with face tracking IBIS 10bit 4:2:2 internal Multi-aspect ratio sensor Full size HDMI with no lag 4K 60p ISO 3200 as clean as current ISO 800 Better implementation of V-Log that uses all the bits properly If they give us internal 5K or 6K then even better, but I'm happy with 4K for now. The Dual Pixel AF of the 1DX Mark II is seriously tempting me to go over to the dark canon side... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanveer Posted June 6, 2016 Author Share Posted June 6, 2016 8 hours ago, Andrew Reid said: I am sure the codec will get a nice bump up with the GH5. Colour science from Panasonic can be quite good. CineLikeD wasn't very good, but the GX85 just on standard looks veeeeery nice Skintones similar to Canon and Olympus. VLOG is good, I don't think that needs improving much, but the sensor does - VLOG brought up a lot of noise didn't it? That's the sensor's fault. I'll be disappointed if Panasonic hike the megapixels on the GH4 to 20MP, what we really need is 12MP max and less noise. Some sort of Dual Pixel AF would be great. Bring back the 1.86x crop sensor of the GH2 with wider aspect ratio. Avoid YAGH-like mistakes and do a small compact mini-XLR breakout box powered from camera. Full size HDMI please. SDI is unlikely on a stills camera form factor body in this market. 5 axis in-body stabilisation, surely a given. I think GH5 is looking very exciting, they will have to try hard to mess it up Interesting. Ok, so the colour (the Brit spelling) science has been fixed almost completely. I am not sure 1.86x crop sensor may not be a such good idea. Especially considering that the physical movement of the sensor effects the 5-Axis In-Body stabilization. Ideally the sensor needs to have as much movement as possible, and so smaller sized-sensors may be better. I could be wrong though. A full-sized HDMI may have issues with Voltage, and thus much higher battery consumption (among other issues). Maybe USB Type-C may be a good compromise? What do you think? It has reasonably higher bandwidth, and also voltage and other things are not an issue with it. Also, would having a 12MP sensor, make people Not want to use it as a stills camera? I am just curious? Or do people believe, that except for serious cropping, 12MP is more than sufficient (ala Sony A7S and Panasonic LX100)? I personally feel that the 16MP+ photos are all an overkill. Dual pixel may be a sensor thing. I hope Sony has been generous with a new sensor. It may be (even) better for photos. 8 hours ago, IronFilm said: Agreed, full sized HDMI, internal 10bit 422, GH2 sized multi aspect sensor, & XLR-K2M like audio interface rather than a bulky YAGH I may be wrong, but I think some of the Canons do 8-bit 4-2-2. The 10-bit would be an excellent, though file sizes could be much larger. 7 hours ago, fuzzynormal said: Good audio inputs and a more robust codec. Otherwise I think they're doing fine and offer impressive value. I think Mini-XLR may be a good thing, especially for a tiny break-out box (like Andrew said) powered by the Camera. Even if it has 2 x AA batteries, it would be great. I personally hate 9 Volt batteries. They are too bulky and too expensive. 1 hour ago, Jaime Valles said: This is my wishlist for the GH5: Dual-Pixel Autofocus with face tracking IBIS 10bit 4:2:2 internal Multi-aspect ratio sensor Full size HDMI with no lag 4K 60p ISO 3200 as clean as current ISO 800 Better implementation of V-Log that uses all the bits properly If they give us internal 5K or 6K then even better, but I'm happy with 4K for now. The Dual Pixel AF of the 1DX Mark II is seriously tempting me to go over to the dark canon side... The GH4 has arguably the highest Dynamic Range for any M4/3 camera (12.8 stops according to DXO Labs :http://www.dxomark.com/Cameras/Panasonic/Lumix-DMC-GH4), which makes it crash into APSC territory. So, theoretically, the Dynamic Range on most M4/3 cameras (like almost all other cameras), can be Improved. So, basically, VLog can be improved too. Atleast not the clipping that a lot of people reported. Moore information, and smoother gradation. Also, I feel that Low Light too is something that Panasonic may be able to improve merely by tweaking processing among other a few other things. Also, I think there should be 14-Bit RAW in Panasonic Cameras. If not by Default, then an Option for Bigger File sizes with 14-Bit as an option should exist, especially to recover highlight or shadow information. I believe that a Dual-Pixel Auto-Focus sensor can be developed for Panasonic, by Sony. Panasonic (and maybe Olympus), merely need to push for it aggressively. Considering that they lead the M4/3 market, I find it difficult to reason, why Sony would not agree. After all, its all about sales. I think Panasonic should push Features like Post Focus and Light Composition to Larger sized photos (atleast 5k/ 12MP equivalent, IF not Full Resolution Photos). Olympus I believe has the Light Composition equivalent feature for Full Sized pics. For Post Focus, it would require a Higher Processing Power, which I am sure Panasonic could manage. That could add improve photography features significantly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronFilm Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 2 hours ago, sanveer said: I may be wrong, but I think some of the Canons do 8-bit 4-2-2. The 10-bit would be an excellent, though file sizes could be much larger. None of the Canon DSLR/mirrorless cameras do 8bit 422 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanveer Posted June 6, 2016 Author Share Posted June 6, 2016 1 hour ago, IronFilm said: None of the Canon DSLR/mirrorless cameras do 8bit 422 The Robust Canon codec and bitrates was with reference to their other lines (C500, the 1DX etc). Their DSLR and Mirrorless don't really have great codec (except the hacked RAW by MagicLantern). The GH5 should have 10-bit 4-2-2 internal. I am guessing that Panasonic may be looking at jacking up their prices substantially this time around. Considering the features that consumer that it to have. Let's see Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zack Posted June 8, 2016 Share Posted June 8, 2016 I hope they get 14bit RAW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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