4K RAW 120fps for £3k?! Say hello to the second-hand Canon C500

[Andrew Reid]

Isn't film and music so very middle-class these days?

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[gnomesteel]

I am seriously considering the C500 plus a Convergent recorder as our next camera. We're a small crew, and we've always been a couple years back in the latest gear. Still shooting on the R1MX, and for our needs it makes a great image. Only problem is it's so darn heavy. Almost bought an F5, and really looked hard at the FS7, but I'm not a fan of Sony's color. Just something off about it to me. FS7 is cheap enough to get away with it, but the menu and other ergonomics are awful to me. Anyway, I've seen some truly beautiful footage from C500's. Hard to think that it won't hold up for several more years. 

[Parker]

Great write-up Andrew! That was a lot of fun to read, I look forward to seeing what you get out of that monster. 

[dbp]

Wow, that sounds like a steal. That camera seemed like it never really hit at its original pricepoint, but the used prices might make it the bargain of the century. Looking forward to hearing your experiences.

[Shield3]

A misleading title - you are not shooting 4k anything until you strap on $2k+ external recorder.  Last week you were dumping the FS5 because "I just like smaller cameras".  Lugging this boat anchor around with the 7q+ is anything but that.  Still, an interesting choice.

[omar]

Great article! Wish these prices were this low before I bought my sony F35. F35 is amazing but having 4K raw at high speed as an option is definitely an advantage over my sony. Thanks for sharing your experience Andrew!

[richg101]

1 minute ago, omar said:

Great article! Wish these prices were this low before I bought my sony F35. F35 is amazing but having 4K raw as an option is definitely an advantage. Thanks for sharing your experience Andrew!

I don't know..  The image from your f35 will always be special, not to mention the motion.  I'd take fullhd upscaled to 4k from an f35 over any camera below an alexa.  what lenses are you using predominantly?

[BenEricson]

1 hour ago, gnomesteel said:

I am seriously considering the C500 plus a Convergent recorder as our next camera. We're a small crew, and we've always been a couple years back in the latest gear. Still shooting on the R1MX, and for our needs it makes a great image. Only problem is it's so darn heavy. Almost bought an F5, and really looked hard at the FS7, but I'm not a fan of Sony's color. Just something off about it to me. FS7 is cheap enough to get away with it, but the menu and other ergonomics are awful to me. Anyway, I've seen some truly beautiful footage from C500's. Hard to think that it won't hold up for several more years. 

I am considering as well. It's such a pro looking image. Wish the recorder wasn't so large. 

[Kino]

Thanks for the review. I look forward to your findings with 4K going to the Odyssey as well as how you intend to setup your rig. I do love the image from the C500, even though it may not have the same DR as some other cinema cameras. It's also one of the best low-light performers out there as you mention. I think there is a good reason for that. It has a larger than average 35mm sensor (26.2 x 13.8mm) with huge photosites (6.4 µm) compared with competing cinema cameras from RED, Sony and Blackmagic. It simply collects more light and can provide a better signal-to-noise ratio than many of these other cinema cameras.

[Oliver Daniel]

10 minutes ago, BenEricson said:

I am considering as well. It's such a pro looking image. Wish the recorder wasn't so large. 

I would buy the C500 if only I didn't have to have the very expensive and rather large Odyssey on top. It's not a small camera once you add that. This is what stopped me getting FS700 and FS5. 

The Kinefinity Terra 5k/6k is out this year. It's much smaller and doesn't require a bulky recorder. It has interchangeable mounts. Switchable shutters. ProRes and Raw. It also has 5k 60fps and 2k 200fps. 

[omar]

30 minutes ago, richg101 said:

I don't know..  The image from your f35 will always be special, not to mention the motion.  I'd take fullhd upscaled to 4k from an f35 over any camera below an alexa.  what lenses are you using predominantly?

I mainly use sony PL lenses and yes I enjoy the F35's image above any canon c-series cam but IMO having the raw option and higher frame rates can be an advantage over the sony. Doesn't mean I'm giving up my sony any time soon. The images it produces are too beautiful for me to let it go

[BenEricson]

10 minutes ago, Oliver Daniel said:

I would buy the C500 if only I didn't have to have the very expensive and rather large Odyssey on top. It's not a small camera once you add that. This is what stopped me getting FS700 and FS5. 

Exactly. Without a recorder, you're better off with a c100mkii... 

[gnomesteel]

51 minutes ago, BenEricson said:

I am considering as well. It's such a pro looking image. Wish the recorder wasn't so large. 

Good thing about the recorder is that it acts as a monitor too. I'd strap on a big monitor anyways. Only problem might be on handheld stuff. Wouldn't be hard to balance though with a decent EVF on the front. 

[Kino]

56 minutes ago, Oliver Daniel said:

I would buy the C500 if only I didn't have to have the very expensive and rather large Odyssey on top. It's not a small camera once you add that. This is what stopped me getting FS700 and FS5. 

The Kinefinity Terra 5k/6k is out this year. It's much smaller and doesn't require a bulky recorder. It has interchangeable mounts. Switchable shutters. ProRes and Raw. It also has 5k 60fps and 2k 200fps. 

Is the Terra really "out this year" and how many? I have trouble believing such a small company will be able to ship in large numbers. The 6K also suffers from the worst rolling shutter you have ever seen unless you shoot it in "sport mode" and a lower resolution. And what about warranty service with Kinefinity. Does it have to go back to China every time something goes wrong?

I'm certainly intrigued by the Terra 5K with its switchable global shutter. I currently have a Raven on order (which I might switch to the Scarlet-W for the 5K). The only thing that would make me reconsider is if Kinefinity announced a U.S. distributor or if Canon announced the 1DC II. While I love the C500, the available recorders may be too large of an addition for the type of portability I am looking for in a 4K camera. With all the wires going everywhere and a big screen attached to the camera, it may become a little unwieldy.

[gnomesteel]

1 hour ago, Oliver Daniel said:

I would buy the C500 if only I didn't have to have the very expensive and rather large Odyssey on top. It's not a small camera once you add that. This is what stopped me getting FS700 and FS5. 

The Kinefinity Terra 5k/6k is out this year. It's much smaller and doesn't require a bulky recorder. It has interchangeable mounts. Switchable shutters. ProRes and Raw. It also has 5k 60fps and 2k 200fps. 

Seems like it could be a great camera, but I trust Canon way more than I trust Kinefinity. Just can't bring myself to buy anything from them. 

[jcs]

Welcome back to Canon (again). Look forward to a C500 test video that also tells a story

[Andrew Reid]

1 hour ago, gnomesteel said:

Good thing about the recorder is that it acts as a monitor too. I'd strap on a big monitor anyways. Only problem might be on handheld stuff. Wouldn't be hard to balance though with a decent EVF on the front. 

When you don't want to rig the monitor, you could just use the built in EVF and I am sure in future Convergent Design and others will look at doing smaller 4K recorders with SDI ports. I'd certainly buy one.

The C500 and Odyssey are more balanced as they are closer in size and weight.

Rigging the Odyssey to the C500 isn't like trying to put it with an A7S. With the tiny camera you have to build a whole rig around it, cage, rails, etc. then it still feels top heavy or imbalanced due to the size and weight difference between the tiny camera and the large monitor.

2 hours ago, BenEricson said:

Exactly. Without a recorder, you're better off with a c100mkii... 

What if you want 4K? Without a recorder I'd say you're better off with a Panasonic GX85. Small, cheap, super steady handheld shots, Super 35 with Speed Booster, 4K internal.

1 hour ago, jcs said:

Welcome back to Canon (again). Look forward to a C500 test video that also tells a story

I've still got all my Panasonic and Sony stuff.

[Oliver Daniel]

2 hours ago, Kino said:

Is the Terra really "out this year" and how many? I have trouble believing such a small company will be able to ship in large numbers. The 6K also suffers from the worst rolling shutter you have ever seen unless you shoot it in "sport mode" and a lower resolution. And what about warranty service with Kinefinity. Does it have to go back to China every time something goes wrong?

I'm certainly intrigued by the Terra 5K with its switchable global shutter. I currently have a Raven on order (which I might switch to the Scarlet-W for the 5K). The only thing that would make me reconsider is if Kinefinity announced a U.S. distributor or if Canon announced the 1DC II. While I love the C500, the available recorders may be too large of an addition for the type of portability I am looking for in a 4K camera. With all the wires going everywhere and a big screen attached to the camera, it may become a little unwieldy.

The 5k seems like the better model. 

Current Kinefinity users have little to complain about and recommend the cameras.

The Chinese thing puts people off, however the parent company making these cameras are absolutely massive. 

Andrew has reviewed and featured previous Kinefinity cameras but has so far ignored the Terra. 

It is intriguing - because if Kinefinity pulls this off, they wil have by far the most complete cinematic camera package considering its price point. 

I really do hope they pull it off. I really do. 

As for any Odyssey fuelled camera setup like the C500, it's just a little bulk too much. Worked hard to go very portable with my gear this year. 

[Andrew Reid]

20 minutes ago, Oliver Daniel said:

Andrew has reviewed and featured previous Kinefinity cameras but has so far ignored the Terra.

Actually the Terra has ignored me.

I'd love to try one out in Berlin at some point, I can't buy absolutely everything just to review it.

[Caleb Genheimer]

Meanwhile I've been shooting corporate stuff all day long with my Sammy NX1/Ronin M combo. No slow-mo, but the colors and resolution are gorgeous.