In Camera or Post Effects/ Techniques that help replicate Global Shutter Motion Cadence?

[User]

Loaded question... I know. Just thought I'd float this out there to see if this is even possible and if anyone is on the inside track?

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

There's software that can counteract rolling shuutter abit (basically rolls the image the other way and crops in for the missing edges to disappear). It's not good. Makes motion look worse IMHO. 

The problem is that we still don't know motion cadence actually is in order to technically replicate it. 

But it's one or a combination of those: 

1- frame rate 
2- shutter angle/speed
3- rolling vs global shutter
4- Codec motion compression algorithms (intra frame / Ling GOP, bitrate blocks on movinh edges etc)
5- An imaginary quality we associate with some classic cameras known for unique IQ (F35, 1Dc, BM 2.5k, Bolex, Pocket). 

Keep in mind we actually see that the sony f35 has better motion than sony f55 and f65. We see 1DC motion better than c100, C300, and c300 MKII. We see better motion in blackmagic 2.5K and pocket cinema camera than Bm4K and Bm4.6K. We see better motion in canon 550D/5D than GH4.

ALL of these examples clearly show inferior camera we claim have better motion than their superior newer better models. just something odd and worth taking note of. 

Only if I had access to a rental house to make a few fimple tests and we'd understznd clearly what motion cadence is. 

Any one with many caneras can volunteer? @Andrew Reid owns a camera store and it'd make an awesome blog post, an enlightening one all over the world. 

I believe you have a 1DC, GH4, NX1, C500, Fuji Xpro2, FS100, d750 and others. Test motion. 

First a 1dc (a camera known for great motion cadence) vs a GH4 (One known for bad stuttery cadence). 

Set up the two cameras side by side on a trpod/s. Point then at a Fan set low speed. Use lenses matching FOV. Do this test at 24p at 1/30s and 1/50s and a high 1/250-ish to analyize the frames more profoundly. 

Just a second test, the two caneras placed on the same triopod, and make a normal pan of a scene. At the aforementioned settings. 

This would allows us to see if there's a difference in the reported shutter speed by manufacturers (the gh4 when I had it looked like 180 degree only a 360. Makes me worry this might be just it!). We'll be able to see how each codec affects motion in the frames by analyzing the same ones from the two cameras. Would make us believe we're just seeing things if both looked identical in motion abd that it's imaginary and based on subjects/cinematography/colouring. 

Any volunteer? It's an important test, it's one that will give us the technical data on the last unknown image quality charachteristic.

[User]

Thanks Ebrahim. Interesting strategy that I for one would be curious to see.

[jax_rox]

In camera trick? Using a global shutter ?  

[Liam]

One kind of dorky trick.. for like a whip pan on a tripod, probably doesn't work for general use, shoot the scene in portrait instead of landscape, and then rotate and crop later. If it's like an a7s, that has almost as bad of an effect, where the vertical line all get really close together in the movement, but if the rs isn't too bad, you just avoid slanties and might get away with it. Lose resolution and sensor size and confidence in your frame though. And a lot of tripods don't work that way

[dhessel]

It is possible to greatly reduce rolling shutter caused by camera rotation only. Any rolling shutter from positional camera changes or fast moving objects cannot be removed.

[Vladimir]

U can rotate camera and applied anamorphic coefficient on that vertical 9:16 area. I've already suggested this at anamorphic forum and preparing footage of my second prototype for now. Of course that comes with some knowing issues with focus and monitoring but lets see whether it's worth it.

[Michael Coffee]

wow, this turning sideways thing really seems to work well on pans... is there any reason sensors aren't mounted this way?

 

[Vladimir]

2 hours ago, Michael Coffee said:

wow, this turning sideways thing really seems to work well on pans... is there any reason sensors aren't mounted this way?

 

if u just rotate a camera then RS still there just in other direction. But if u applied anamorphic and desqueeze in post u got 3.25x/4.2x (for 16:9/2.35:1 ratio) less RS, which is pretty nice i think

[User]

Anyone else have anything else to offer on what gives the F35, 1Dc, BM 2.5k, Bolex, Pocket their mojo and how to simulate/ replicate this through in-camera or post techniques using other cameras?

The reason I'm asking this is that I've seen these "guess the camera" topics and I find it quite interesting how folks choose the camera by its inherent characteristics and 'how' post or in-camera techniques can be used to challenge our sensibilities and possibly disguise which camera is used.

[Nikkor]

Lol, "to offer", use your brain.

You can shoot with a lot of weight, you can shoot slight slowmo.

The disuguise people do in the guess the camera is adding grain, the equivalent in motion would be fusing fotograms, the resulting look is something softporn like.

[User]

Lol, did you take your rubber gloves off before you wrote that?

[Michael Coffee]

The gx7 motion is looking much nicer at 25p vs 24p for me..

[Nikkor]

On 29 de junio de 2016 at 2:50 AM, Ebrahim Saadawi said:

Any volunteer? It's an important test, it's one that will give us the technical data on the last unknown image quality charachteristic.

Ehehe.