Canon 80D first impressions and 3x crop mode

[Andrew Reid]

I have been trying out the EOSHD C-LOG and Film Profiles pack on a few other cameras, and came across a cheap 80D today. Installed a few of the profiles on the camera in-store and boom - MASSIVE improvement.

So the camera I said I'd never buy is going to get a review after all!

Hmm these words are tasty!

Right now in my bag I am shooting with the 1D C, NX1 and now 80D. Let's look at how these compliment each other, because after all I'd rather just carry one camera in an ideal world -

NX1 is in there for the 1080p 120fps. This used to be a bit pants. But subsequent Samsung firmware updates and now the bitrate hack means I get sharp, detailed 120fps at 160Mbit (equivalent in quality to approx. 300Mbit H.264). This camera continues to astound me.

1D C is in there for the sheer brute image quality and full frame goodness, both in 4K video mode and as my main stills camera. I am even starting to warm to the full frame 1080/24p image again because of my Film Profiles. This camera already has Canon LOG but it is immensely satisfying to carry my own pre-graded no-hassle looks around with me and see instantly what the finished shot is going to look like, in cinematic full-frame-o-vision. Also the JPEGs not just the MOVs.

80D is in there for many more reasons of where it is strong than where it is weaker. The camera is surprising me. First the size and weight - it is my travel camera when I can't risk the 1D C or don't want to lug it. It is my crop sensor camera when I need a good quality zoom but don't want to lug around a full frame 24-105 or 24-70mm F2.8. I have the Sigma 18-35mm F1.8 and love to make use of it, I have the Canon 18-135mm and despite it not being a super fast aperture zoom, it is light and gives a fantastic range with a cinematic image + fantastic stabilisation. The Canon 24-70mm F2.8  II lovely though it is on the 1D C does not have the range, stabilisation or small size. I sold it and now just use primes on my full frame camera.

The main reason however for adding the 80D to the bag is for the Dual Pixel AF and articulated screen. This makes the 80D a much better run & gun choice than the 1D C. When it is slow tripod based lock-down art shots I select the 1D C. When it is documentary, camera movement, quicker pace of shooting the 80D can 'get the shot' much better. I have not yet felt justifiable the 6000 euros for a 1D X Mark II so the 80D at 1/6th of that for the same Dual Pixel AF performance and an articulated screen allows me to 'live without' 4K for now.

Now to image quality. The 1080p of course could be better, this is Canon after all. But the skintones, colour science, codec, rolling shutter performance and low light are all very nice indeed - much better than most of the 4K cameras out there in fact and much better than Sony. The image upscales well to 4K on my LG DCI 4096 x 2160 display.

In fact overall detail appears much higher than any Canon DSLR before it, way better than the 60D and 70D. It looks like the GH2 on many shots especially those at closer focus distances. Check out the 1080p frame grab below. It is much better than when I first tried the camera, maybe Canon did a tweak.

Shot in C-LOG, graded with EOSHD CINE LUT 1:

The 60p seems as highly detailed as the 24p. Just a shame about the aliasing and the moire can still rear up and bite you, but overall the image is very satisfying when the conditions are right to use it. And if it means getting the shot vs not, then this justifies the 80D's existence.

The stills are superb - fantastic dynamic range, resolution and colour, can barely tell it apart from full frame for the most part.

Now a surprise

The 3x crop mode with 1:1 sensor output (full pixel output of a cropped region) delivers absolutely superb image quality with no moire or aliasing.

Wrap up

The whole usability seems refined, a very nice sense of ergonomics and straight-forwardness. Touch screen for Dual Pixel AF works superbly.

Build quality could be better, it doesn't feel as solid as a Nikon D7200 for the price point. Dual Pixel AF is very quiet for the most part and flawless, especially with the STM lenses. Enjoying the 24mm F2.8 EF-S pancake.

The C-LOG image grades superbly. It's a good codec on there even in 60p.

[Oliver Daniel]

2 hours ago, Andrew Reid said:

I have been trying out the EOSHD C-LOG and Film Profiles pack on a few other cameras, and came across a cheap 80D today. Installed a few of the profiles on the camera in-store and boom - MASSIVE improvement.

So the camera I said I'd never buy is going to get a review after all!

Hmm these words are tasty!

Right now in my bag I am shooting with the 1D C, NX1 and now 80D. Let's look at how these compliment each other, because after all I'd rather just carry one camera in an ideal world -

NX1 is in there for the 1080p 120fps. This used to be a bit pants. But subsequent Samsung firmware updates and now the bitrate hack means I get sharp, detailed 120fps at 160Mbit (equivalent in quality to approx. 300Mbit H.264). This camera continues to astound me.

1D C is in there for the sheer brute image quality and full frame goodness, both in 4K video mode and as my main stills camera. I am even starting to warm to the full frame 1080/24p image again because of my Film Profiles. This camera already has Canon LOG but it is immensely satisfying to carry my own pre-graded no-hassle looks around with me and see instantly what the finished shot is going to look like, in cinematic full-frame-o-vision. Also the JPEGs not just the MOVs.

80D is in there for many more reasons of where it is strong than where it is weaker. The camera is surprising me. First the size and weight - it is my travel camera when I can't risk the 1D C or don't want to lug it. It is my crop sensor camera when I need a good quality zoom but don't want to lug around a full frame 24-105 or 24-70mm F2.8. I have the Sigma 18-35mm F1.8 and love to make use of it, I have the Canon 18-135mm and despite it not being a super fast aperture zoom, it is light and gives a fantastic range with a cinematic image + fantastic stabilisation. The Canon 24-70mm F2.8  II lovely though it is on the 1D C does not have the range, stabilisation or small size. I sold it and now just use primes on my full frame camera.

The main reason however for adding the 80D to the bag is for the Dual Pixel AF and articulated screen. This makes the 80D a much better run & gun choice than the 1D C. When it is slow tripod based lock-down art shots I select the 1D C. When it is documentary, camera movement, quicker pace of shooting the 80D can 'get the shot' much better. I have not yet felt justifiable the 6000 euros for a 1D X Mark II so the 80D at 1/6th of that for the same Dual Pixel AF performance and an articulated screen allows me to 'live without' 4K for now.

Now to image quality. The 1080p of course could be better, this is Canon after all. But the skintones, colour science, codec, rolling shutter performance and low light are all very nice indeed - much better than most of the 4K cameras out there in fact and much better than Sony. The image upscales well to 4K on my LG DCI 4096 x 2160 display.

In fact overall detail appears much higher than any Canon DSLR before it, way better than the 60D and 70D. It looks like the GH2 on many shots especially those at closer focus distances. Check out the 1080p frame grab below. It is much better than when I first tried the camera, maybe Canon did a tweak.

Shot in C-LOG, graded with EOSHD CINE LUT 1:

The 60p seems as highly detailed as the 24p. Just a shame about the aliasing and the moire can still rear up and bite you, but overall the image is very satisfying when the conditions are right to use it. And if it means getting the shot vs not, then this justifies the 80D's existence.

The stills are superb - fantastic dynamic range, resolution and colour, can barely tell it apart from full frame for the most part.

Now a surprise

The 3x crop mode with 1:1 sensor output (full pixel output of a cropped region) delivers absolutely superb image quality with no moire or aliasing.

Wrap up

The whole usability seems refined, a very nice sense of ergonomics and straight-forwardness. Touch screen for Dual Pixel AF works superbly.

Build quality could be better, it doesn't feel as solid as a Nikon D7200 for the price point. Dual Pixel AF is very quiet for the most part and flawless, especially with the STM lenses. Enjoying the 24mm F2.8 EF-S pancake.

The C-LOG image grades superbly. It's a good codec on there even in 60p.

The wonderful world of EOSHD. We can all be very critical of Canon, and so we should, however most of us still love them.

Ive seen the 1DX II new for £4099 from UK stock. The temptation is rising. 

[Inazuma]

Interesting. Would you be able to do any direct comparisons of the 80d with another camera at 1080p?

Also wasn't the NX1 also known for its superb autofocus?

[Andrew Reid]

We are critical because we care.

Samsung made mistakes for years and nobody cared!

They finally got it right and were rightly applauded.

The 80D would set the enthusiast and consumer video market ON FIRE if only Canon made a few upgrades to the 1080p.

Oliver - the 1D X II for that price is without VAT I assume?

[mercer]

How is DPAF with 3rd party lenses? 

[squig]

Resolution looks about the same as the 5D MkIII, only with added aliasing https://***URL removed***/reviews/image-comparison/fullscreen?attr29_0=canon_eos80d&attr29_1=canon_eos5dmkiii&attr72_0=1080&attr72_1=1080&normalization=full&widget=341&x=-0.09620991&y=0.295104682.

I've only shot with raw 3x crop on the 5D, the downside is the crop accentuates the noise.

[wolf33d]

43 minutes ago, squig said:

Resolution looks about the same as the 5D MkIII, only with added aliasing https://***URL removed***/reviews/image-comparison/fullscreen?attr29_0=canon_eos80d&attr29_1=canon_eos5dmkiii&attr72_0=1080&attr72_1=1080&normalization=full&widget=341&x=-0.09620991&y=0.295104682.

I've only shot with raw 3x crop on the 5D, the downside is the crop accentuates the noise.

If it looks worst than 5d3 then it is shit. 

Eos M5 is coming... Let's see. And still waiting for the FF canon Mirorless

[Damphousse]

4 hours ago, Andrew Reid said:

Now a surprise

The 3x crop mode with 1:1 sensor output (full pixel output of a cropped region) delivers absolutely superb image quality with no moire or aliasing.

 

That is pretty standard with lower level Canons in my experience.  I noticed the same thing on the T3i and the 50D.  I used the 3x mode as much as I could and used wide angle lenses and stepping back a lot.  I believe it has to do with the aliasing filter.

Honestly I would buy the camera if they did a slight crop and full readout.  They could just downscale it to 1080p if they want to protect their 4k offerings.  As is though I just can't spend the dough.  I'll stick with the BMPCC.

[Michael Ma]

I got my 80D 2 weeks ago and got the 10-18, 18-55, and 55-250 STM lenses just out of my spite for the Canon 5D4 that I was originally going to buy.  Something to hold me over and maybe be a companion to the GH5.  I'm really enjoying the 80D.  And I can't say enough about the articulating swivel screen.  It is such a necessary tool for videography and makes photography such a breeze, I wonder why they even make garbage tilt screens found on the Nikon D750.  

I am really amazed how recoverable the deepest blacks are.  There really is no banding  or macroblocking on blacks that I thought would be crushed/clipped for sure.  But you will see noise if you push anything from the black if it's anything that's not shot in the best light.

Definitely stay away from using the Standard picture profile on default.  That sharpness setting will give you war flashbacks from cameras of 15 years ago.

[gatopardo]

Let's see how the EOS M5 1080p is. (No hope for 4k) With the viewfinder, dual pixel AF and maybe the same sensor this can be a fun camera to use too. 

 

http://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/sketches-claimed-new-canon-eos-m5/

[mercer]

42 minutes ago, gatopardo said:

Let's see how the EOS M5 1080p is. (No hope for 4k) With the viewfinder, dual pixel AF and maybe the same sensor this can be a fun camera to use too. 

 

http://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/sketches-claimed-new-canon-eos-m5/

Idk, the m5 could have a lower bitrate mjpeg 4K. The m3 is the first Canon non-Cinema or camcorder to have focus peaking, so I wouldn't be surprised at all. Since Canon is about product segmentation, the mirrorless division has a different competitor base than their DSLR arm. With DSLRs, their major competition is Nikon who also just released 4K in their flagship models. With Mirrorless, their biggest competitors are Sony and Panasonic that have 4K capable cameras on similarly priced cameras. Just saying I will not be surprised if it does have it. Either way, as you said, it should have 60p and DPAF, which will probably get me to buy one to complement the 1080p from my XC10. If it doesn't have those two features, I may get the 80d for the same reason. 

[tweak]

13 hours ago, Andrew Reid said:

Now a surprise

The 3x crop mode with 1:1 sensor output (full pixel output of a cropped region) delivers absolutely superb image quality with no moire or aliasing..

Yep i also used to use this mode a lot on the original M when it came out, which is cool because you can also use tiny C-mount lenses. Noise is increased quite a lot, but if you have good lighting I think the image is certainly better.

[mercer]

5 hours ago, tweak said:

Yep i also used to use this mode a lot on the original M when it came out, which is cool because you can also use tiny C-mount lenses. Noise is increased quite a lot, but if you have good lighting I think the image is certainly better.

I did as well, with eos-m the c-mounts were a joy to use. It was also pretty cool because, even if you reverted back to Canon mode after using ML, the 3x crop option stayed. 

I assume with the 80d, the 3x crop is... 1.6x + 3x = 4.6x crop? It makes sense with the eos-m because you can use c-mounts, not so much with the 80D, the 10-18mm becomes a slow normal to small telephoto. I guess with one of the Rokinon fisheye lenses it would be a normal lens, but still pretty slow. 

[Curtis Ross]

This is the story of canon. They come out with cameras, people bash the specs. But they are GREAT to use in the REAL world... Just saying....

[mercer]

35 minutes ago, Curtis Ross said:

This is the story of canon. They come out with cameras, people bash the specs. But they are GREAT to use in the REAL world... Just saying....

I spent a few minutes looking at some videos online, and I am really impressed with the 80d. Some of the videos I saw looked as good as Panasonic 4k downscaled to 1080. I am kind of in a weird place with cameras. I have two Canons... an XC10 and a 50D and one Panasonic... the GX85. I have only one native m4/3 lens... the Sigma 30mm f/2.8 and no native EF lenses. Although I really enjoy using the IBIS with the GX85, it would seem maybe a 3rd Canon to complement my XC10 may make more sense. I am also in a transitional lens phase where I am starting to swap out a lot of my manual, vintage lenses for a smaller, better overall collection. I have been looking at the Sigma 17-50mm f/2.8 for Canon and some of the videos I have seen from that lens with the 80D look beautiful. Do you know how well the DPAF works with 3rd Party lenses?

[gt3rs]

9 hours ago, mercer said:

Idk, the m5 could have a lower bitrate mjpeg 4K. The m3 is the first Canon non-Cinema or camcorder to have focus peaking, so I wouldn't be surprised at all. Since Canon is about product segmentation, the mirrorless division has a different competitor base than their DSLR arm. With DSLRs, their major competition is Nikon who also just released 4K in their flagship models. With Mirrorless, their biggest competitors are Sony and Panasonic that have 4K capable cameras on similarly priced cameras. Just saying I will not be surprised if it does have it. Either way, as you said, it should have 60p and DPAF, which will probably get me to buy one to complement the 1080p from my XC10. If it doesn't have those two features, I may get the 80d for the same reason. 

I hardly doubt the 4k because it would be even more of a crop that the 5d IV at 2.34 DCI.... my guess is that if we get lucky is the same sensor as the 80D with 1080 60p and DPAF that would be for Canon mirrorless standards very very good.

[mercer]

16 minutes ago, gt3rs said:

I hardly doubt the 4k because it would be even more of a crop that the 5d IV at 2.34 DCI.... my guess is that if we get lucky is the same sensor as the 80D with 1080 60p and DPAF that would be for Canon mirrorless standards very very good.

I thought the DCI crop for the mkiv is 1.64-1.75 (arguably) but yeah you're probably right, 4K is highly unlikely. I just wouldn't be surprised by anything with Canon. It is curious that they're skipping the eos-m4 moniker and going to the m5, though. It's also curious that they are announcing the m5 at Photokina and not the highly rumored full frame mirrorless that they're supposed to be releasing by year's end... unless they're one in the same. 

[gt3rs]

1 minute ago, mercer said:

I thought the DCI crop for the mkiv is 1.64-1.75 (arguably) but yeah you're probably right, 4K is highly unlikely. I just wouldn't be surprised by anything with Canon. It is curious that they're skipping the eos-m4 moniker and going to the m5, though. It's also curious that they are announcing the m5 at Photokina and not the highly rumored full frame mirrorless that they're supposed to be releasing by year's end... unless they're one in the same. 

Yes DCI of the IV is 1.64 but the M5 is probably a 24mpix APS-C sensor so you start already at 1.6x add the 1-1 4k pixel readout and you should land around 2.34 FF crop or 1.46 APS-C crop. Still usable with APS-C wide-angle lenses but I doubt it will be like this.

I personally would be very happy if they would put a 1-1 4k 30p MJPEG at 400 Mbits on it....but is more a dream than an hope

[mercer]

I could deal with a 2.34x crop, the NX500 was 2.5x+ It was annoying, but it was definitely usable. Also that kind of crop would open up some fast c-mount options on the M5. But again, I agree it would be highly unlikely. But then again, until it is announced, the hope is alive...

I would love to see them implement the 5-axis IS used in the xc10... hands down the best 5-axis I have used... of course I have only used one other... the GX85, but the Canon is like using an actual steadicam (almost)

[TheRenaissanceMan]

Remember that there are speed boosters for the ef-m mount, so any crop factor could potentially be reduced to a manageable number.