Nikon Customers

[mercer]

So, as some may have read, I recently purchased the D5500 and fell in love with the camera and its Flat Profile. I wish it had a little more support for ai/ai-s lenses, but it seems the D7200 or D750 would have been a better choice in that regard. 

Meanwhile, I came across a "New" GH3 on eBay, for a fair price. Since I have always been intrigued by the GH series, and since I have a little collection of Minolta and c-mount lenses, I thought I would give it a try. The more I read about the all-i 72mbps files and the more I saw samples from the GH3, the more excited I was to give it a try. I almost even bought a Rokinon lens to use with it. Well, it arrived today and it was hardly new, there was even an SD card in the camera with hundreds of photos and videos on the card. Every nook and cranny had a layer of dust or grime in it. The LCD looks good and it seems to function fine, but for the price it isn't worth keeping. The seller did not offer me any discount, so I am returning it tomorrow. 

Anyway, having the two cameras, the D5500 and the GH3, side by side, I was able to test both with the same lens and I was surprised to learn that even with the high bitrate 1080p, the GH3 did not quite match up to the D5500. The D5500 color is better, the DR seems better, the ergonomics are better... so I am officially going all in with Nikon. 

Sorry for the long post, but I was wondering, from regular Nikon users, is it smarter to upgrade to the D7200, or D750 now, or since both cameras are on the back end of their product cycles, is it smarter to wait to see what the next models will have?

Since the D5 and D500 both have 4K, do you think the next generations of the 7200 or 750 will have it?

Also, does it seem likely that the next models will be released within the next 6 months or so?

Thanks for any insight!

[Nikkor]

Let's see what the d5600 is like, the d5200 introduced "good video" to nikon, maybe we get lucky and the new one gets 4K without crop.

Worst case scenario is a d5600 with 1080p only and a d7300 with cropped 4k

[Cinegain]

I saw the D5600 should be near announcement the other day! http://nikonrumors.com/2016/11/06/nikon-d5600-camera-to-be-announced-next-soon.aspx/

Yeah, it would definitely be nice to e.g. have a body with the focus motor built into it though. And maybe a mode that I believe is called 'tripod mode', where you can use the contrast based AF or just MF without the mirror flipping anyways (which the D5300 does in liveview).

Not sure about 4K. Think they might pull a Canon T-series on that one (keeping it 1080p).

How they use their sensor is really some of the best examples of how it's done. That's why I have the D5300 in the first place. It's just silly good. For stills on a whole other level. Also, the video looks very organic and natural and like you already noticed, great dynamic range as well. But... it isn't very nice to use. That's my gripe with it. Mirrorless has way more bells 'n whistles and Panasonic is just killing it with the video features...

I wish the next Nikon was an APS-C mirrorless one. Something like the Samsung NX2 might have been...

[Nikkor]

11 hours ago, Cinegain said:

Yeah, it would definitely be nice to e.g. have a body with the focus motor built into it though. And maybe a mode that I believe is called 'tripod mode', where you can use the contrast based AF or just MF without the mirror flipping anyways (which the D5300 does in liveview).

This makes me so nervous when shooting stills in liveview , the constant flipping and clapping, it's absurd, only the shutter should click.

[dahlfors]

A successor to D750 will most certainly have 4k, since D750 has been positioned to be a good allrounder for photos & videos.

Sooner or later they will add 4k to the APS-C models below D500, but according to Nikonrumors.com it doesn't seem like there's any 4k in D5600 (and his sources are usually correct).

I wouldn't expect 4k in Nikon's APS-C cameras until early spring 2017 at least. I'd expect the next Nikon camera to be released with 4k would be a D750 successor.

[hansel]

I agree with @dahlfors.

The d750 was my first Nikon and I do have Issues with the usability still after 6 Month that upset my workflow pretty much every time. Also I find it rather clanky... flip out flash and mode dial are looking/feeling quite fragile to me. Been on crop before, I would/should have waited for the d500 as it is a different league quality wise. Saying that, now that I have tasted the full frame, it feels quite nice to have a bigger sensor/lenses going with it, and I would probably not go back to a crop...

...unless it is stuffed with "proper" video features...120fps, peaking, some kind of AF support etc....don't care for 4k atm, my phone has got more processing power than my computer.

[ND64]

The next body after D5600 will be D810 replacement, releasing at CES, which will be probably 50+ MP camera. with this huge resolution, 4k without pixel binning is impossible. Though Nikon algorithm for demosaicing binned data is better than Sony's, but its still binning. 

With Canon 6Dmark2 rumor that certainly says "No 4k", I'm afraid Nikon follows it and keep D760 a 1080p camera. But there is still hope. Best window for announcement would be February at WPPI show. 

[David Bowgett]

On 09/11/2016 at 6:06 AM, Eric Calabros said:

With Canon 6Dmark2 rumor that certainly says "No 4k", I'm afraid Nikon follows it and keep D760 a 1080p camera. But there is still hope. Best window for announcement would be February at WPPI show. 

I thought Nikon's 6D competitor was more the D610. It'd be cool if Nikon announced a 4K D760, along with a D620 that recycles the D750's sensor, though admittedly that's probably a bit optimistic.

[Inazuma]

D5600 announced with minimal changes as usual by Nikon's standards.

Nikon's stills and video image is stellar. If only they would release a body with phase detection in live view, maybe even something mirrorless. And more APS-C prime lenses (especially for 35mm or wider equivalence). As it stands, I see Nikon tanking in the long term. 

[j-oc]

On 08/11/2016 at 1:20 AM, mercer said:

Sorry for the long post, but I was wondering, from regular Nikon users, is it smarter to upgrade to the D7200, or D750 now, or since both cameras are on the back end of their product cycles, is it smarter to wait to see what the next models will have?

I'd rent one, the other or both to see if you like them and if you do, just buy them. Don't waste your life wishing for a better camera if like the one you have.

[Flaaandeeers]

I've said something similar in another post: I've switched to Nikon after being a Lumix (GH2/4) user for 5 years (and having tested as well Canon, Olympus and Blackmagic cameras along the road). I've had the D750 for less than a year and I couldn't be happier with the image I can get with it, specially thanks to the delightful colors, wide dynamic range, reduced RS and unique DOF.

Of course I miss some resolution, focus peaking (easily fixable with an external monitor), anamorphic modes, HFR and some other cool features but in the end, for the types of projects that I do (mostly low budget short films & web series), nice and clean 1080p, beautiful colors without to much hassle and that subject separation that FF easily provides is what ends up being most appreciated.

With so many camera announcements it's easy to be tempted to switch systems every 6 months, but even when I consider the Fuji XT2, Oly EM1 II and Sony A6500 very desirable pieces of tech, I think that I'll stick to my D750 at least until Nikon releases its successor and/or 4k delivery becomes standard.

2 hours ago, j-oc said:

Don't waste your life wishing for a better camera if like the one you have.

And amen to that. I've been suffering from this disease for years and it's been my most unproductive season ever. Too much time spent on looking how gorgeous my footage could be if I had this new cool camera instead of learning how to get the most out of the one I currently have. 

[j-oc]

2 hours ago, Flaaandeeers said:

And amen to that. I've been suffering from this disease for years and it's been my most unproductive season ever. Too much time spent on looking how gorgeous my footage could be if I had this new cool camera instead of learning how to get the most out of the one I currently have. 

Definitely agree. So much to be said for using what you've got and focusing your energy on being creative.

[jhnkng]

I have the D750 and the D500 (and a D3s and D800), and they're both excellent. The difference between the two are mostly to do with features rather than image quality -- both images are pretty much the same, you have to push pretty hard to see the difference. One place where you can see differences is at high ISO -- the D500 might have a 1.5 million ISO headline, but it's pure BS. It's just acceptable for certain applications* at 12,800 ISO in RAW, the D750 is definitely better at 12,800 (not a massive difference a la A7s, but noticeable.)

The D750 and D500 has the same colour, they mix and match perfectly. Not sure if that will be the case for any new cameras, since I've noticed that Nikons do change in look from generation to generation (as you would expect). It changes enough so that I keep slightly different Lightroom presets for each of my cameras to get a consistent look, even in RAW stills. 

Another thing I'll note is that while each new Nikon I've bought have feature differences, they're not hugely different. Nikon is at a place where they're happy to do 4K in crop mode -- I wouldn't expect a new upcoming Nikon to do 4K without a crop. Nikon is incredibly conservative when it comes to adding new features, it would not surprise me that it would take a D6 (probably 4 years from now) before you see un-cropped 4K. No one buys Nikon for bleeding edge tech, they buy Nikon because it always works, under any circumstances, all the time.

(That said, the 4K crop is about the same as the GH4 with native lenses at 2.3x, and I never had a problem with either camera. I do have a Tokina 11-16, which is a lovely looking lens)

For what it's worth, if I absolutely had to only go with one camera I would pick the D750 with the 24-70. But only just, since I also have a D500 with the Sigma 17-50 2.8 with OS, and that is a pretty sweet combo. 

 

 

* I'll go right up to 12,800 for events in a dark room, but in any situation where I have some control over lighting/set/talent, I'd keep it no higher than 6400.

[mercer]

On 11/12/2016 at 11:56 PM, jhnkng said:

I have the D750 and the D500 (and a D3s and D800), and they're both excellent. The difference between the two are mostly to do with features rather than image quality -- both images are pretty much the same, you have to push pretty hard to see the difference. One place where you can see differences is at high ISO -- the D500 might have a 1.5 million ISO headline, but it's pure BS. It's just acceptable for certain applications* at 12,800 ISO in RAW, the D750 is definitely better at 12,800 (not a massive difference a la A7s, but noticeable.)

The D750 and D500 has the same colour, they mix and match perfectly. Not sure if that will be the case for any new cameras, since I've noticed that Nikons do change in look from generation to generation (as you would expect). It changes enough so that I keep slightly different Lightroom presets for each of my cameras to get a consistent look, even in RAW stills. 

Another thing I'll note is that while each new Nikon I've bought have feature differences, they're not hugely different. Nikon is at a place where they're happy to do 4K in crop mode -- I wouldn't expect a new upcoming Nikon to do 4K without a crop. Nikon is incredibly conservative when it comes to adding new features, it would not surprise me that it would take a D6 (probably 4 years from now) before you see un-cropped 4K. No one buys Nikon for bleeding edge tech, they buy Nikon because it always works, under any circumstances, all the time.

(That said, the 4K crop is about the same as the GH4 with native lenses at 2.3x, and I never had a problem with either camera. I do have a Tokina 11-16, which is a lovely looking lens)

For what it's worth, if I absolutely had to only go with one camera I would pick the D750 with the 24-70. But only just, since I also have a D500 with the Sigma 17-50 2.8 with OS, and that is a pretty sweet combo. 

 

 

* I'll go right up to 12,800 for events in a dark room, but in any situation where I have some control over lighting/set/talent, I'd keep it no higher than 6400.

Thanks for this. Do you have any 4K clips from the D500? Hopefully with the Flat Profile? I assume you have to enter live view all the time for video? Or is there a setting where it will power on in live view?

[jhnkng]

On 17/11/2016 at 10:45 AM, mercer said:

Thanks for this. Do you have any 4K clips from the D500? Hopefully with the Flat Profile? I assume you have to enter live view all the time for video? Or is there a setting where it will power on in live view?

I don't have anything in production to show, but today I shot a couple of short clips that I've uploaded to Vimeo:

The password is: eoshd

The clips are straight from the camera, you can download it from Vimeo. The first is my son backlit with a colour card in very light shade, there's bit of flare at top of frame. The second is to give you an idea of what kind of dynamic range you can expect. Both are shot in 4K using the Flat profile with the Nikon 20mm f1.8, around f2 - 2.8 (can't remember). 

Regarding live view, you have to engage live view every time you turn the camera on. I'm pretty sure there isn't a way to have live view turn on automatically. Then again, even when the camera is on it uses very little battery, so there's very little penalty to leaving the camera on and live view off. Except for changing lenses with IS/VR/OS elements, if you don't turn off the camera the lens won't park the moving element and you'll hear the lens rattle like crazy.

I'd appreciate it if you don't share this all over the internets, I made these for this community because I've learnt tons here and I want to give a little back. I just feel a bit weird about my son's face all over the internet even if he is hiding behind a colour card...

[Django]

D750 is incredible and can be found second hand for good price. I had to sell mine for a 5D3 after i got the C100 (couldn't afford dual lens system) but aside from ML Raw, the D750 flat out beat the 5D3 in just about everything. Best stills camera out there also. The sensor is amazing, resolves like crazy. I miss mine

[mercer]

5 hours ago, jhnkng said:

I don't have anything in production to show, but today I shot a couple of short clips that I've uploaded to Vimeo:

The password is: eoshd

The clips are straight from the camera, you can download it from Vimeo. The first is my son backlit with a colour card in very light shade, there's bit of flare at top of frame. The second is to give you an idea of what kind of dynamic range you can expect. Both are shot in 4K using the Flat profile with the Nikon 20mm f1.8, around f2 - 2.8 (can't remember). 

Regarding live view, you have to engage live view every time you turn the camera on. I'm pretty sure there isn't a way to have live view turn on automatically. Then again, even when the camera is on it uses very little battery, so there's very little penalty to leaving the camera on and live view off. Except for changing lenses with IS/VR/OS elements, if you don't turn off the camera the lens won't park the moving element and you'll hear the lens rattle like crazy.

I'd appreciate it if you don't share this all over the internets, I made these for this community because I've learnt tons here and I want to give a little back. I just feel a bit weird about my son's face all over the internet even if he is hiding behind a colour card...

Thanks jhn, I had a go with them this morning. Nice files and good white balance.

I really want to stay with aps-c, and I am getting really tempted by the D500. As of now I have the D5500, and although I really enjoy the camera... the size, weight, articulating screen and image. The lack of kelvin wb and exposure aids with my ai/ai-s lenses is driving me crazy.

Another member told me a trick to shoot a few seconds and then switch to play to see the RGB histogram and it works, but it is a little tedious.

So I was really thinking about upgrading to the D7200, but with recent prices and freebies from BH, when all is said and done and I sell off the freebies, the D500 body would cost about $1400, which is only $400 more than the D7200. So, even though I don't need the 4K, for $400 more...

[mercer]

Also, @jhnkng have you tested the Electronic VR in 1080p? I must admit I am very intrigued by this feature as well. 

[jhnkng]

That was all auto white balance by the way, which I've always found works pretty well. And I have played with the Electronic VR, and it's a mixed bag. There's a crop for starters, I'm not totally sure what it is but it seems half way between normal and the 4k crop, so maybe 1.7x -ish? And while it does a great job if you want to hold the image completely steady, if you try to pan or tilt there's a lag so the image stutters as you move -- not even remotely close to being smooth. It basically mimics a tripod. The good news is that you can turn it on and off in the movie quick menu that's available when you're in live view, so it's easy enough to turn it on and off, but it's nowhere near a regular use feature.
 

[Geoff CB]

4 hours ago, jhnkng said:

That was all auto white balance by the way, which I've always found works pretty well. And I have played with the Electronic VR, and it's a mixed bag. There's a crop for starters, I'm not totally sure what it is but it seems half way between normal and the 4k crop, so maybe 1.7x -ish? And while it does a great job if you want to hold the image completely steady, if you try to pan or tilt there's a lag so the image stutters as you move -- not even remotely close to being smooth. It basically mimics a tripod. The good news is that you can turn it on and off in the movie quick menu that's available when you're in live view, so it's easy enough to turn it on and off, but it's nowhere near a regular use feature.
 

Nice, would maybe be useful in a wedding situation though...

Thanks for posting the footage. Just like the D750 image, very clean with a great organic noise. If the D760 offers 4K full frame like this I will have to buy it. D500 crop is just not worth it for me right now.