dantheman Posted December 31, 2016 Share Posted December 31, 2016 Most of the photographers I work together with at weddings are professional, a few have been award winning for whatever that is worth but every single one of them uses either a flash on camera or has 2 separate flashes which they place separately or clamp onto something and which remotely are triggered from their camera, often they also use such an umbrella or whatever it's called. Now I don't have any experience shooting photos but when I look at some of their work, they certainly know what they are doing because their work is stunning. I"m not going to link to some of these photographers here but if you want I can send you a few links via pm so you can judge for yourself. Cary Knoop 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted December 31, 2016 Share Posted December 31, 2016 2 hours ago, dantheman said: Most of the photographers I work together with at weddings are professional, a few have been award winning for whatever that is worth but every single one of them uses either a flash on camera or has 2 separate flashes which they place separately or clamp onto something and which remotely are triggered from their camera, often they also use such an umbrella or whatever it's called. Now I don't have any experience shooting photos but when I look at some of their work, they certainly know what they are doing because their work is stunning. I"m not going to link to some of these photographers here but if you want I can send you a few links via pm so you can judge for yourself. And it will look just like what I did and others 30 years ago like I said. That WAS wedding Photography 101 40 years ago. On camera flash, 2 umbrella slaves. Accept we used Metz flashes, now they use Canon, Nikon ones. Progress... And guess what I was like 97% of wedding portrait photographers that did the same thing and made a ok living doing it. I didn't stand out from the pack just like 97% of photographers do not now. It is the safe way to go, but you Never stand out that way. And you can in this day and age. There is a TON of neat stuff to use now, and you can have a 3, 4 man crew doing it and make handfulls of money doing it not just a living like I did and the 97% like me did. We all had a Hassy, 3 lenses, a Rolleiflex TLR and 3 lenses, and 3 Metz flash units, and maybe our wife helping, and that was that. Food on the table..Maybe. Davey 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dantheman Posted December 31, 2016 Share Posted December 31, 2016 Can you link to some of your work then? Just for me to see what "progress" really means. You don't need to post the links here, you can PM me. Cary Knoop 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cary Knoop Posted December 31, 2016 Share Posted December 31, 2016 14 minutes ago, dantheman said: Can you link to some of your work then? Just for me to see what "progress" really means. I would be interested to see that "progress" as well because in my mind flash is still king in the photography world! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dantheman Posted December 31, 2016 Share Posted December 31, 2016 It's not that I don't believe webrunner about the new light methods, as I don't have a photography background I obviously don't know what I am talking about, I can only tell what I see as a videographer working together with photographers. I can tell that some I have worked with are of a high end caliber, shooting for magazines in their own studio but doing weddings on the side. In their studio they use totally different light gear then they use on weddings but all of them, and I mean all, use a flash at weddings. To say that just because they use a flash their work must suck is nonsense, how can you even pass any judgment if you have not seen any photos? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted December 31, 2016 Share Posted December 31, 2016 38 minutes ago, dantheman said: It's not that I don't believe webrunner about the new light methods, as I don't have a photography background I obviously don't know what I am talking about, I can only tell what I see as a videographer working together with photographers. I can tell that some I have worked with are of a high end caliber, shooting for magazines in their own studio but doing weddings on the side. In their studio they use totally different light gear then they use on weddings but all of them, and I mean all, use a flash at weddings. To say that just because they use a flash their work must suck is nonsense, how can you even pass any judgment if you have not seen any photos? Because I did it, thousands of others have done it with flash. It is not new. Been there done that. It will look just like everyone else that Does it. It is the EASY way out. And because it is the easy way 97% of the people do it that way, that is why! Do you think flash was invented 5 years ago? Do you think there has not been masters at using them. Books by the thousands out on it! It is Old Hat! There is only so many ways you can use flash without it looking like flash. And you can't really make it Not look like flash, that is the point. Your daughters wedding looks just like her best friends wedding etc. etc.. Flash freezes the moment in an artificial way, not like in reality. It looks unnatural and guess what, it is even on film. It looks staged, and it is. You are limited to certain top shutter speeds, limited f stops, etc.. I don't need to look at anyone's shots that use flash because I know just what it will look like. Seen plenty, that is how I leaned, and what I did too.. And I see plenty of the "lets get a paycheck and get the hell out of here" wedding stuff. Yeah you do a damn good job, but not a Great job. Hard to keep a Great pace up for decades like you have to do. So you take the easy way out, Flash, the old standby. Sad to see it is still prevalent in this day and age. But it puts food on the table. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dantheman Posted December 31, 2016 Share Posted December 31, 2016 Show me, don't tell me. I still don't understand what makes your way so much better then all the others, like I said, I want to believe you but it would help a lot if you can show me an example of a weddingshoot (doesn't even have to be your own) that shows what you call progress. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted December 31, 2016 Share Posted December 31, 2016 28 minutes ago, dantheman said: Show me, don't tell me. I still don't understand what makes your way so much better then all the others, like I said, I want to believe you but it would help a lot if you can show me an example of a weddingshoot (doesn't even have to be your own) that shows what you call progress. 28 minutes ago, dantheman said: I have no clue where this video is from?? My work was no better than the average person, that is what I am trying to tell you. I was average and I know if they are using the same setup that i did 30, 40 years ago, ergo 3 flash rig, they are average also. It is what it is and was. Sure some of them are better than others but so was I at times. That is the ones you put on your website. No web when I worked, so you put a few 11x 17's in the front window to get traffic in the door. Same principle. Jason Lanier is progress like him or not. Put this in You Tube "are you a Picture Taker or Are You a Photographer? Part 1- LIVE presentation by Jason Lanier" and it is pretty alarming what he says. and I have said and it is true like it or not. I can't link it for some reason. Lanier hate LoL?? The truth hurts at times. But you do what you got to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dantheman Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 I just see another way to light a subject but I only see this work in controlled situations with an assistant to hold a light and while standing very close to your subject, just like they do in this workshop. A not very realistic set up to shoot a entire weddingday if you ask me. The light seems useless if you shoot in a larger room like during a ceremony in church. It's just my opinion but the resulting pictures in this workshop are a bit "meh" to me, they don't wow me more then what I see some photographers achieve who only use a flash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 He is one of the best, highest paid photographers in the world now, doesn't Photoshop stuff, doesn't do HDR, and you say his stuff is meh. I guess I am finished on this thread. Not counting he is telling you, for free, by watching both parts, how he pretty much does it. hmm... Davey 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members Mattias Burling Posted January 1, 2017 Super Members Share Posted January 1, 2017 35 minutes ago, webrunner5 said: He is one of the best, highest paid photographers in the world now, doesn't Photoshop stuff, doesn't do HDR, and you say his stuff is meh. I guess I am finished on this thread. Not counting he is telling you, for free, by watching both parts, how he pretty much does it. hmm... You seem to forget that shutter speed controls ambient light but not flash. Therefore flash can never be outdated or obsolete. Thats like saying a 50mm lens is nothing to use because its been used in the past. I suggest all that haven't got experience with flash (and apparently some that do) watch this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davey Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 I love Jason Lanier's work and saw part one of the video above. He not only knows what he is doing with light, but also has a great way with people from all kinds of different backgrounds. You can have all the technical know-how and all the best equipment in the world but end up like the Angry Photographer, who has never produced a single piece of (his own) work for anybody to see and spends all his time ranting at all things Sony. As for flash - does my head in when shooting video. Bloody big white stripes across my slow motion and that horrid clack noise ruining my audio. Still. webrunner5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members Mattias Burling Posted January 1, 2017 Super Members Share Posted January 1, 2017 8 minutes ago, Davey said: As for flash - does my head in when shooting video. Bloody big white stripes across my slow motion and that horrid clack noise ruining my audio. Still. Global shutter = problem solved webrunner5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dantheman Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 1 hour ago, webrunner5 said: and you say his stuff is meh. Yes, and? I have an opinion based on what I can see and I don't expect you to agree with me, at least I don't say his work sucks because he doesn't use a flash without even having seen his work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 Well what ever happens, Happy New Year! May we all get a faster computer. noone 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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