Vesku Posted April 20, 2017 Share Posted April 20, 2017 12 hours ago, Orangenz said: The strange this about this is if you are in A, S, or P modes and you adjust something else, like shutter speed, the same sort of rolling scale pops up but the zebras stay on screen. It's only with the exposure comp scale that the zebras disappear. Also, currently in P mode my dials don't do anything. It would be great to have one set to exposure comp just for P mode. Someone can learn me up on this please. Panasonic designs features but I think they never actually use their cameras to find issues or bad ergonomics. It is our job. The EV comp button should work with P? It would be still nice and logical to use one of the wheels directly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted April 20, 2017 Share Posted April 20, 2017 18 hours ago, Ken Ross said: Fritz, they're on, but awkward to use. So let's say you're viewing your scene, and you see areas of overexposure as indicated by your zebras. You begin to adjust exposure down, but as soon as you press the exposure button, the zebras disappear! So rather than adjusting exposure down until your zebras disappear, you're really just guessing. If you adjust exposure down by 1/3EV and then exit the exposure adjustment, the zebras will either disappear if you adjusted down far enough, or reappear if you weren't aggressive enough in your adjustment. If the zebras are still there upon exiting exposure adjustment, you then need to hit the exposure adjustment again, and bang, the zebras again disappear as soon as you hit the exposure button. It works the same way on the G85. I can't begin to understand Panasonic's thinking on this. Not sure I understand. Which mode are you in? Automatic? Because I just took my G85 and pointed it at the computer and the zebras remained even after starting recording. I use the zebras every day and have never encountered a problem. @Vesku As far as Panasonic never actually using their cameras to find issues or 'bad ergonomics', can you prove this statement, or is it just conjecture? Because the Panasonics I'm familiar with have outstanding ergonomics, save for the buttons that are too flush with the body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesku Posted April 20, 2017 Share Posted April 20, 2017 4 minutes ago, jonpais said: @Vesku As far as Panasonic never actually using their cameras to find issues or 'bad ergonomics', can you prove this statement, or is it just conjecture? Because the Panasonics I'm familiar with have outstanding ergonomics, save for the buttons that are too flush with the body. Panasonic actually has best ergonomics in general. There are still many half thought features which could be easily better if someone could think better. -most Panasonic has no auto iso or EV comp in manual mode. -GH3/GH4/GH5 has play/review button in wrong side. Very difficult to review image or video. -almost useless EV comp button in GH3/GH4. Just decorative. -not possible to change continuous autofocus on/off in other way than digging video menu deep. -not possible to adjust image (contrast, saturation) in other way than digging menus. No FN option for that. -not possible to use separate AF-lock and AE-lock even with custom buttons. -no exposure info in video modes. I must guess my exposure values. -GH4 EVF difficult to see whole image if not putting the eye very close to EVF lens. EVF lens damages very easily if touched. -AF+MF feature works stupidly. -I can find more but these are for start... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Ross Posted April 20, 2017 Share Posted April 20, 2017 3 hours ago, jonpais said: Not sure I understand. Which mode are you in? Automatic? Because I just took my G85 and pointed it at the computer and the zebras remained even after starting recording. I use the zebras every day and have never encountered a problem. Jon, in manual movie mode, whether I'm in P, A or S priority, as soon as I hit the exposure button (the +/- button), the zebras disappear. I'm not talking about seeing the zebras while recording, but rather while adjusting exposure prior to hitting the record button. I have the issue on the GH5 and have it on the G85. Orangenz has the same issue too. It just seems to be the way Panasonic implements zebras in these modes and it makes no sense. You want to see the zebras while you're adjusting exposure, not just after you've exited the adjustment. Orangenz 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orangenz Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 4 hours ago, Ken Ross said: Jon, in manual movie mode, whether I'm in P, A or S priority, as soon as I hit the exposure button (the +/- button), the zebras disappear. I'm not talking about seeing the zebras while recording, but rather while adjusting exposure prior to hitting the record button. I have the issue on the GH5 and have it on the G85. Orangenz has the same issue too. It just seems to be the way Panasonic implements zebras in these modes and it makes no sense. You want to see the zebras while you're adjusting exposure, not just after you've exited the adjustment. SOLVED Quote Joseph Linaschke @photojoseph 25m25 minutes ago More Replying to @deepscience I see. Push +/- button, zebras gone until pressing shutter. Solution; set back dial to do +/- and zebras stay. That's why I never noticed. Custom settings/operation/Dial set/exposure Comp - set to lower dial Ken Ross, MurtlandPhoto and Fritz Pierre 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercer Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 4 hours ago, Ken Ross said: Jon, in manual movie mode, whether I'm in P, A or S priority, as soon as I hit the exposure button (the +/- button), the zebras disappear. I'm not talking about seeing the zebras while recording, but rather while adjusting exposure prior to hitting the record button. I have the issue on the GH5 and have it on the G85. Orangenz has the same issue too. It just seems to be the way Panasonic implements zebras in these modes and it makes no sense. You want to see the zebras while you're adjusting exposure, not just after you've exited the adjustment. Sorry, maybe I am not understanding what you mean, but if you are in P, A or S modes, the zebras should disappear because the camera is making sure it isn't overexposing... so as soon as you hit exposure compensation, the camera is readjusting exposure so there is no clipping... so naturally the zebras would disappear? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 1 minute ago, mercer said: Sorry, maybe I am not understanding what you mean, but if you are in P, A or S modes, the zebras should disappear because the camera is making sure it isn't overexposing... so as soon as you hit exposure compensation, the camera is readjusting exposure so there is no clipping? hmmmm... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orangenz Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 On 19/04/2017 at 5:37 PM, Orangenz said: Two things I noticed this weekend: Current timelapse photo count does not show on screen during capture. Exposure zebras disappear when exposure compensation is being changed. And I must have been blind. The photo count does show on the screen and in evf. Top right corner. Silly orange. Different place from GH4? I must have some excuse. 3 minutes ago, mercer said: Sorry, maybe I am not understanding what you mean, but if you are in P, A or S modes, the zebras should disappear because the camera is making sure it isn't overexposing... so as soon as you hit exposure compensation, the camera is readjusting exposure so there is no clipping... so naturally the zebras would disappear? you missed my post :O Ken Ross, mercer and jonpais 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Ross Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 33 minutes ago, mercer said: Sorry, maybe I am not understanding what you mean, but if you are in P, A or S modes, the zebras should disappear because the camera is making sure it isn't overexposing... so as soon as you hit exposure compensation, the camera is readjusting exposure so there is no clipping... so naturally the zebras would disappear? No, not really. Let's say you go down in exposure less than is necessary to eliminate the zebras. So you're really still overexposed and you should still see the zebras. The problem is you won't as soon as you exit the adjustment. 50 minutes ago, Orangenz said: SOLVED Custom settings/operation/Dial set/exposure Comp - set to lower dial YEAH!!!! YEAH!!!!! And did I say, YEAH!!!! Orangenz, I'd give you 5 likes if I could. That was unquestionably my biggest annoyance with the cam and it's now gone. MurtlandPhoto, Orangenz and Fritz Pierre 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orangenz Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 56 minutes ago, Ken Ross said: No, not really. Let's say you go down in exposure less than is necessary to eliminate the zebras. So you're really still overexposed and you should still see the zebras. The problem is you won't as soon as you exit the adjustment. YEAH!!!! YEAH!!!!! And did I say, YEAH!!!! Orangenz, I'd give you 5 likes if I could. That was unquestionably my biggest annoyance with the cam and it's now gone. Had me stumped too. Still, it shows that the default action with the menu popping up and zebras disappearing is still something that needs fixing, imho. Moving to the dial is more a workaround. But having said that, I definitely prefer it, especially as the roll menu doesn't show up at all now. No extra button pushes! Ken Ross 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanriverprod Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 Pretty honest appraisal of the camera at its current state. They say full hdmi for production is a big deal but that image still suffers from magenta and cyan macroblocking in V-log at 10bit. Hopefully, the summer firmware takes full advantage of the 10bit and sorts this out or else besides the 4k 60p is this camera worth twice the cost of the g85? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Ross Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 25 minutes ago, Orangenz said: Had me stumped too. Still, it shows that the default action with the menu popping up and zebras disappearing is still something that needs fixing, imho. Moving to the dial is more a workaround. But having said that, I definitely prefer it, especially as the roll menu doesn't show up at all now. No extra button pushes! That was the other side benefit, one dial turn instead of a button push and dial turn. Orangenz 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orangenz Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 5 minutes ago, Hanriverprod said: Pretty honest appraisal of the camera at its current state. They say full hdmi for production is a big deal but that image still suffers from magenta and cyan macroblocking in V-log at 10bit. Hopefully, the summer firmware takes full advantage of the 10bit and sorts this out or else besides the 4k 60p is this camera worth twice the cost of the g85? Mmm, very positive review. But out before the rewrapping thing though, works better now. The magenta macroblocking and banding is absolutely way less with the GH5. I really have not seen it at all in well exposed material. I can try to replicate it but on the same kind of scenes that used to fall apart on the GH4, now hold together easily. I really do love it. I can see some strange repeating splotches on my astophotography - 1600iso 20seconds - but that's an investigation into how far one can push things, not normal work. And this is all before the main codecs come out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 22 minutes ago, Hanriverprod said: Pretty honest appraisal of the camera at its current state. They say full hdmi for production is a big deal but that image still suffers from magenta and cyan macroblocking in V-log at 10bit. Hopefully, the summer firmware takes full advantage of the 10bit and sorts this out or else besides the 4k 60p is this camera worth twice the cost of the g85? Wow the audio on the bigger guy in the stripped shirt, well what can I say. Total fail. What the hell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orangenz Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 5 minutes ago, webrunner5 said: Wow the audio on the bigger guy in the stripped shirt, well what can I say. Total fail. Wow the audio on the bigger guy in the stripped shirt, well what can I say. Total fail. What the hell. Good moire test shirt though jonpais 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 1 minute ago, Orangenz said: Good moire test shirt though Yeah and it looked good also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davey Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 17 minutes ago, webrunner5 said: Wow the audio on the bigger guy in the stripped shirt, well what can I say. Total fail. What the hell. Levels too high. But yes, great moire test. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 1 hour ago, Hanriverprod said: Pretty honest appraisal of the camera at its current state. They say full hdmi for production is a big deal but that image still suffers from magenta and cyan macroblocking in V-log at 10bit. Hopefully, the summer firmware takes full advantage of the 10bit and sorts this out or else besides the 4k 60p is this camera worth twice the cost of the g85? I guess it depends what you plan to do with it. But it's really hard to take a video seriously when the lighting, focus, and composition (directly against a brick wall) are so awful. Sorry, that's just how I feel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orangenz Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 Found a cream wall to shoot and some blue sky. Absolutely no magenta blocking at all. Smooth as a whistle. I'm not sure what that means but it's smooth. And almost fell off the chair at the beauty of my vlog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 7 minutes ago, Orangenz said: Found a cream wall to shoot and some blue sky. Absolutely no magenta blocking at all. Smooth as a whistle. I'm not sure what that means but it's smooth. And almost fell off the chair at the beauty of my vlog. Hopefully, you were wearing an elegant checkered shirt to show off the moire. A houndstooth or prince of wales would be awesomeness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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