Panasonic GH5 - all is revealed!

[webrunner5]

Yeah the GH5 Vlog looks pretty good I must admit.

[tonysss]

test2:

 

[Mattias Burling]

4 hours ago, tonysss said:

test2:

 

Thanks a bunch, really appreciate it (even if it did make my life a little more difficult in choosing a b-cam for video  ).
Also, the bmpcc.. wow. Stil holds such tremendous value. If I end up letting go of the X-H1 and stick to m4/3 I will ad one of them as well. I often miss having one.

Thanks again!

[IronFilm]

21 hours ago, jonpais said:

This from an article about the influences in Better Call Saul (shot with the Red Dragon and Angenieux zooms):

One of the Breaking Bad trademarks that Gilligan wanted to maintain for Better Call Saul is placing the camera in unusual spots. For many of those shots, Albert used a very compact Panasonic Lumix DMC-GH4. “We put it on the ground shooting straight up, inside a coffee cup, on a threshold. Anywhere you could stick a camera, we put a camera,” he says. “When we were shooting a driving shot, I put it on the ground and Bob Odenkirk, who is a brilliant driver, very precisely drove over it without touching it. We were always looking for unusual shots.”

source

Oh wow, I'm watching Better Call Saul right now! (as in it is playing in the corner on this monitor right now as I type)
Am quite a fan of the show. 
And yes, I've noticed it uses a lot of unusual camera positions. Didn't realise it was with a lowly GH4! :-o

The article however is from early 2015, I wonder what they're using now?

[jonpais]

2 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

Oh wow, I'm watching Better Call Saul right now! (as in it is playing in the corner on this monitor right now as I type)
Am quite a fan of the show. 
And yes, I've noticed it uses a lot of unusual camera positions. Didn't realise it was with a lowly GH4! ?

The article however is from early 2014, I wonder what they're using now?

Same here. I think it was at the beginning of this season, there were a lot of shots from inside the refrigerator, stuff like that. A little bit goes a long way! I was also wondering what they’re shooting with now. Let us know if you find out.

[IronFilm]

I have a truly truly ridiculously large amount of BTS content, vlogs, chats, etc still to one day be uploaded to my YouTube channel.... but one of those videos, was me having a microphone inside a refrigerator to capture that sound too! ha

[thebrothersthre3]

To really test dynamic range thoroughly wouldn't you also need to see how much info you can pull from the shadows?

You might want to add HLG to the test. There is a claim out there that you'll get 1-2 more stops of dynamic range then in vlog.

This is the method I've heard gets one more dynamic range in HLG.

"So in FCPX for instance you just make all your libraries 2020 and bring in all your footage and pull your HLG highlights down to 50IRE and export to 709. You don’t need an HDR monitor or anything else. Your 709 output will have the 14.6 stops of DR if you remap it this way. "
from

[Dan Sherman]

2 hours ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

To really test dynamic range thoroughly wouldn't you also need to see how much info you can pull from the shadows?

You might want to add HLG to the test. There is a claim out there that you'll get 1-2 more stops of dynamic range then in vlog.

This is the method I've heard gets one more dynamic range in HLG.

"So in FCPX for instance you just make all your libraries 2020 and bring in all your footage and pull your HLG highlights down to 50IRE and export to 709. You don’t need an HDR monitor or anything else. Your 709 output will have the 14.6 stops of DR if you remap it this way. "
from

 

I find that hard to believe considering rec 709 only has 5 stops of dynamic range. You might have started with more, but you're not going to end up with more.

 

 

 

[thebrothersthre3]

1 hour ago, Dan Sherman said:

 

I find that hard to believe considering rec 709 only has 5 stops of dynamic range. You might have started with more, but you're not going to end up with more.

 

 

 

Try it and tell me what you think compared to vlog. 

[anonim]

21 minutes ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

Try it and tell me what you think compared to vlog. 

I think we have here one of the most precious inside-out tester and authority for that question - @Sage.

[Dan Sherman]

12 minutes ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

Try it and tell me what you think compared to vlog. 

I don't use/own vlog, as i don't need it.

However, it doesn't need to be tested, as this is a math/science thing not an artistic perception thing.

 

when you do a color space transform, your dynamic range is constrained by the final color space. If you have footage with 15 stops of range, and you want to shove it into a color space with 5 stops, it is compressed down to fit into the 5 stop range, or it's clipped.

[Mattias Burling]

More DR in = more DR out.

15 stops capured shows more DR than 8 stops captured on a 5 stop screen.

[Dan Sherman]

6 hours ago, Mattias Burling said:

More DR in = more DR out.

15 stops capured shows more DR than 8 stops captured on a 5 stop screen.

That's purely perception!

If you are using  a screen that follows the rec 709 spec you are not going to see more than 5 stops. Technically you have about another stop in the over exposed highlights and underexposed shadows, but the display wont show them. 

The only way you are getting more than 5 stops is if you are using a custom gamma, like REDGamma, but then again your display has to know what to do with it.
 

 

 

[thebrothersthre3]

15 hours ago, Dan Sherman said:

That's purely perception!

If you are using  a screen that follows the rec 709 spec you are not going to see more than 5 stops. Technically you have about another stop in the over exposed highlights and underexposed shadows, but the display wont show them. 

The only way you are getting more than 5 stops is if you are using a custom gamma, like REDGamma, but then again your display has to know what to do with it.
 

 

 

I think it should give you more room in grading though to decide where those stops are going.

[Dan Sherman]

18 minutes ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

I think it should give you more room in grading though to decide where those stops are going.

That's correct, You get more leeway when you start with more dynamic range, because most nles work outside the constraints of a given profile. However, once you render out you are bound by the constraints of the color space you are rendering in. 

It might not sound important, but it is!

 

 

 

[mercer]

I’m confused. I understand that Rec709 (for instance) only has so many visible stops but if you display one of those dynamic range charts in a Rec 709 space, you can clearly see more than 5 stops of DR.

And there’s also the effect of DR on color tonality, highlight rolloff, etc. So it seems it is a little more complex than just to say you can only display so many stops in any specific space?

[Dan Sherman]

2 hours ago, mercer said:

I’m confused. I understand that Rec709 (for instance) only has so many visible stops but if you display one of those dynamic range charts in a Rec 709 space, you can clearly see more than 5 stops of DR.

And there’s also the effect of DR on color tonality, highlight rolloff, etc. So it seems it is a little more complex than just to say you can only display so many stops in any specific space?

I'm probably not the best person to explain this type of thing. This is a good starting point!

http://downloads.atomos.com/support/HDR_Tech_Guide.pdf

Quote

Before you can display an image you need to record it from the sensor. As explained above, the sensor sees light completely linearly, it measures every photon of light in bands of the 4096 steps that exist on a 12-bit sensor. When it comes to recording we need to match what can be displayed on monitors. The 12+ stops of dynamic range capable with modern day sensors are hamstrung by the 5-6 stop limit1 of television standards still currently used (Rec709). Log curves solve this problem be “bending” the brightness curve to fit 12 or 14 stops of dynamic range into an 8 or 10-bit signal, but at the expense of no longer matching human perception so the image looks flat or washed out and is difficult to expose correctly. AtomHDR solves this.

 

 

 

[KnightsFan]

8 hours ago, mercer said:

I’m confused. I understand that Rec709 (for instance) only has so many visible stops but if you display one of those dynamic range charts in a Rec 709 space, you can clearly see more than 5 stops of DR.

And there’s also the effect of DR on color tonality, highlight rolloff, etc. So it seems it is a little more complex than just to say you can only display so many stops in any specific space?

There is no rule mandating a 1:1 correlation between dynamic range captured and dynamic range displayed.

Measuring the "stops of DR" of Rec.709 is based on an 8 bit image with a standard gamma curve. This means that on a Rec709 screen, the light emitted by a white pixel is 5 stops brighter than the light emitted by a black pixel. It doesn't matter what the pixels refer to--an "untouched" video from your camera, CGI, some text, a webpage, etc.

The amount of compression (or expansion) of dynamic range that you apply to an image is just an artistic choice. It's just like a CGI render: your image doesn't HAVE to look like the real world, but it will end up on a screen that emits 5 stops of DR. So, to make a "natural" looking image, you should display about 5 stops of real world DR on that screen. However, we've universally agreed that we like a little bit of compression at least, so we put maybe 8 stops of the real world onto our 5 stop display. But if you show straight up log footage with 12 or 14 stops, it looks really unnatural.

[matthere]

New autofocus guide for GH5/s/G9 -  Here

[jonpais]

The one thing I’m not looking forward to are the ten million YouTube AF tests after the firmware update. ?

https://www.panasonic.com/global/consumer/lumix/gh5_firmware.html