Panasonic GH5 - all is revealed!

[Mattias Burling]

2 hours ago, Dan Sherman said:

I would not trust some random YouTuber. Dxo has the gh5 at 13 stops!

https://www.dxomark.com/panasonic-lumix-dc-gh5-sensor-review-best-performer-in-the-lineup/

Im not trusting some dude, I'm looking at actual images. Lab tests are fun but doesn't tell you about real performance.

btw, Thats for stills. Its probably more like 10. Maybe 12 in V-log with a bit of luck and if the circumstances are perfect.

For 13 you are in Blackmagic territory. Nikon can do it. The old Sony A7s cant, but the newer once might.

7 hours ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

Brother the dude in that test was using extended ISO. This decreases dynamic range. They are the same in CineD otherwise. Vlog and HLG you get at least a stop more. The XH1 has pretty solid dynamic range in Flog and Eterna. 

Thanks, Didn't notice what isos where uses. Will recheck. Vlog would be cool but the G9 doesn't have it. Im only looking at GH5 vs GH4 tests because they are way easier to find than G85 vs G9 (same sensors)

EDIT: Where did you read about the ISOs used, cant find any info in the description or video?

[Dan Sherman]

Panasonic says 12 for v-log.

[tonysss]

I have GH5,GH4,GX80 and BMMCC , and GH5 has biggest DR of all in 400 ISO , with less iso decreases DR.

BMMCC has smaller DR and noise shadow (in ProRes),  and other colors than Panasonics. 

The (CineD Hack) GX80 is more usable DR than BMMCC in ProRes

[Mattias Burling]

1 hour ago, tonysss said:

I have GH5,GH4,GX80 and BMMCC , and GH5 has biggest DR of all in 400 ISO , with less iso decreases DR.

BMMCC has smaller DR and noise shadow (in ProRes),  and other colors than Panasonics. 

The (CineD Hack) GX80 is more usable DR than BMMCC in ProRes

Care to show a comparison between the GH4 and GH5 in Cine-D? You would probably be the first showing it so Im sure it would be appreciated by many, if you manage to prove them wrong 

(According to all the tests I've seen including my own there is no way the GX80 can match the BMMCC, so no need to test that.)

[thebrothersthre3]

17 hours ago, Mattias Burling said:

Im not trusting some dude, I'm looking at actual images. Lab tests are fun but doesn't tell you about real performance.

btw, Thats for stills. Its probably more like 10. Maybe 12 in V-log with a bit of luck and if the circumstances are perfect.

For 13 you are in Blackmagic territory. Nikon can do it. The old Sony A7s cant, but the newer once might.

Thanks, Didn't notice what isos where uses. Will recheck. Vlog would be cool but the G9 doesn't have it. Im only looking at GH5 vs GH4 tests because they are way easier to find than G85 vs G9 (same sensors)

EDIT: Where did you read about the ISOs used, cant find any info in the description or video?

I am not 100% sure. I think its just me guessing. I remember when the video came out though (around when the GH5 was first released). I remember seeing another video where a guy was puzzled at the lack of Dynamic range and sure enough he was using 100 iso (which is extended iso that decreases dynamic range).

I know Paul Leeming found the GH5 to have the same dynamic range in cineD.

[Mattias Burling]

7 hours ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

I am not 100% sure. I think its just me guessing. I remember when the video came out though (around when the GH5 was first released). I remember seeing another video where a guy was puzzled at the lack of Dynamic range and sure enough he was using 100 iso (which is extended iso that decreases dynamic range).

I know Paul Leeming found the GH5 to have the same dynamic range in cineD.

Im pretty sure they are using the same iso on both, at least thats what they say. Given that all tests that Ive been able to find plus the simple fact that its a higher res sensor makes me pretty sure that in Cine-D the GH4 and therefor also the G80/85 beats the GH5 in DR. Otherwise Im sure here would be tests to confirm the opposite.

Its a shame since this will most likely rule out the G9 as a purchase for me. The GH5 is alot cheaper and has V-log to counter the issue but Im just not willing to buy such a large camera without a top LCD or controls showing me my settings. Bummer, was exited to get back into the m4/3 game with all the mice glass the system has.
There was however rumors of a firmware update announced at Photokina, fingers crossed for V-log in the G9.

[tonysss]

13 hours ago, Mattias Burling said:

Care to show a comparison between the GH4 and GH5 in Cine-D? You would probably be the first showing it so Im sure it would be appreciated by many, if you manage to prove them wrong 

(According to all the tests I've seen including my own there is no way the GX80 can match the BMMCC, so no need to test that.)

Not a problem, I compare GH5, GH4, GX80, BMMCC, Panasonic at ISO400 and CineD , and BMMCC at base ISO 800 ProRes. Maybe already tomorrow.I can not do a scientific test, only put the camera in the same place with the same settings on a lot of contrast scene. (Sun and shadows)

I will give the result to VIMEO for download.

[Mattias Burling]

25 minutes ago, tonysss said:

Not a problem, I compare GH5, GH4, GX80, BMMCC, Panasonic at ISO400 and CineD , and BMMCC at base ISO 800 ProRes. Maybe already tomorrow.I can not do a scientific test, only put the camera in the same place with the same settings on a lot of contrast scene. (Sun and shadows)

I will give the result to VIMEO for download.

That's very kind of you, looking forward to it! And I hope you are right so I can buy that damn G9, its haunting me

[PannySVHS]

DR on GH5 is higher for photos. Why should it be less for video?:) Especially in lowlight it provides more usuable information than a GH4. If used in 10bit, no contest at all. GH4 looks outdated in comparison. Maybe tester did a mistake in the 0 255 setting, maybe codec is not the same, though both at 100mbit 8bit, leaving errors when interpreting footage in Premiere. Nonetheless, interested in seeiny tonysss´ test! BMCC, one tasty camera! GX80 4K in Natural gives me one beautiful image! So, cool to see that kid in the test as well, hopefully.

[Mattias Burling]

10 minutes ago, PannySVHS said:

Why should it be less for video?:) 

All tests online I've seen so far shows that it is the case. And if it is true my guess is that its because of the higher mp count.

Lowlight and DR monsters are usually low mp cameras. But its been a while and a few firmwares since anyone made a test so hopefully we will know for sure soon.

[PannySVHS]

54 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said:

All tests online I've seen so far shows that it is the case. And if it is true my guess is that its because of the higher mp count.

Lowlight and DR monsters are usually low mp cameras. But its been a while and a few firmwares since anyone made a test so hopefully we will know for sure soon.

I´ve seen footage with better DR from GH5 than in vids from GH4, just not comparisons. If there are any besides the seemingly failed one from the tester above, always interesting to see of course. I compared both cameras in moderate lowlight and GH4 got smoked big, big time in video. Big n nasty blocks and blotches in the GH4 footage vs. none in GH5 footage. GX85 is much better in 4K than GH4 as well in lowlight. Thats just technical progress in sensor and camera tech.

[Mattias Burling]

59 minutes ago, PannySVHS said:

 seemingly failed one from the tester above,

What was the fail?

[webrunner5]

It is because most cameras, and probably the GH5, like most cameras, has a higher bit rate for photos than video. It is probably 12 bit, some cameras are 14, even 16 bit in photo mode.

[PannySVHS]

1 hour ago, Mattias Burling said:

What was the fail?

seemingly something caused the fail, the seemingly flawed result, as it does not go along with my findings. Seemingly. Hard to believe that clipped footage is representing inferriour dr instead of a flawed test. Could be early date and sofore nle incompatibilities and different interpretation of material in the nle. different 0-255 ,16-235 in camera settings or interpretation in nle. If your findings are different I am sure it will influence your buying decision as you have posted a few posts ago. LIke I stated, sensor and/or pipe is much better in gh5 for video. My two cents and many of words.

[anonim]

33 minutes ago, PannySVHS said:

seemingly something caused the fail, the seemingly flawed result, as it does not go along with my findings. Seemingly. Hard to believe that clipped footage is representing inferriour dr instead of a flawed test. Could be early date and sofore nle incompatibilities and different interpretation of material in the nle. different 0-255 ,16-235 in camera settings or interpretation in nle. If your findings are different I am sure it will influence your buying decision as you have posted a few posts ago. LIke I stated, sensor and/or pipe is much better in gh5 for video. My two cents and many of words.

I'd say it is very unseemingly that Mattias Burling really needs any advice about proper testing of cameras and instructions about possible testing flaws 

[Mattias Burling]

38 minutes ago, PannySVHS said:

seemingly something caused the fail, the seemingly flawed result, as it does not go along with my findings. Seemingly. Hard to believe that clipped footage is representing inferriour dr instead of a flawed test. Could be early date and sofore nle incompatibilities and different interpretation of material in the nle. different 0-255 ,16-235 in camera settings or interpretation in nle. If your findings are different I am sure it will influence your buying decision as you have posted a few posts ago. LIke I stated, sensor and/or pipe is much better in gh5 for video. My two cents and many of words.

I would agree. The only problem is that it wasn't exactly noobs doing it. All settings where equal. And finally, all other tests online show the same thing. So calling it a "fail" isn't something I can do, until someone proves them wrong. Which I sincerely hope someone would. There are tons of GH4 vs GH5 comparisons out there made after the GH5 launch. All show a drop of DR in Cine-D for the GH5. But like I said, that's a couple of firmwares ago and things might be different today.

Panasonic have great cameras, I've been shooting on them for what feels like ages now. Its the most used camera brand on my channel followed closely by Sony (Ive owned more Sony cameras than any other brand but Panasonic is the longest lasting and most used for me). The DR in the GH4 generation was bad but I can live with it. I just wouldn't want it to get even worse.

[PannySVHS]

14 minutes ago, anonim said:

I'd say it is very unseemingly that Mattias Burling really needs any advice about proper testing of cameras and instructions about possible testing flaws 

I am not THAT keen on quoting myself, but not THAT unkeen neither, so now rather keen on it: "My two cents and many of words.", implying a bit the inner conflict of answering a question and wrongly evoking the impression of being paternizing. I think you had a gentle smile due to it just as I did when I was typing. Mattias is an eloquent individual who would not feel paternized that easily I figured.

@Mattias Burling, Havent found any tests proving better DR on GH4, but having watched plenty of Lumix videos showing me a more intriguing image of the GH5, with better DR along.  But then again, not wanting to prove anything but giving my bits of insights. cheers and looking forward to more cool videos of yours.

[anonim]

18 minutes ago, PannySVHS said:

I am not THAT keen on quoting myself, but not THAT unkeen neither, so now rather keen on it: "My two cents and many of words.", implying a bit the inner conflict of answering a question and wrongly evoking the impression of being paternizing. I think you had a gentle smile due to it just as I did, typing. Mattias is an eloquent individual who would not feel paternized that easily I figured. And right I was and am about him

 

Of course and you so nicely twice explain your ideas... but meaning of my observation was quite contrary one  MB has so much great experience in evaluating cameras and camera tests that, I think, it is "totally unseemingly"  that without highly accurate experiment and deep elaboration any of us could help/concure/add in estimation if DR in GH5 is as bad as in GH4 or it is worse to the level that make impossible to live with it.

[thebrothersthre3]

2 hours ago, Mattias Burling said:

I would agree. The only problem is that it wasn't exactly noobs doing it. All settings where equal. And finally, all other tests online show the same thing. So calling it a "fail" isn't something I can do, until someone proves them wrong. Which I sincerely hope someone would. There are tons of GH4 vs GH5 comparisons out there made after the GH5 launch. All show a drop of DR in Cine-D for the GH5. But like I said, that's a couple of firmwares ago and things might be different today.

Panasonic have great cameras, I've been shooting on them for what feels like ages now. Its the most used camera brand on my channel followed closely by Sony (Ive owned more Sony cameras than any other brand but Panasonic is the longest lasting and most used for me). The DR in the GH4 generation was bad but I can live with it. I just wouldn't want it to get even worse.

I do think they were using identical settings but I don't think the GH4 had the same lose of dynamic range with extended ISO. This wasn't a known issue right away so I wouldn't blame it on the guys doing the video. Who else do you know that has found dynamic range in cineD to be better on the GH4? 

I'll run it by Paul Leeming as I know he's done a lot of thorough testing on both cameras. 

 

[PannySVHS]

@anonim i love Mattias´ videos. That does not exclude my pleasure of enjoying a variety of dslm and other footage nor my insights getting from them. Mine are not a copy of yours. No reason to be so doubtful about my posts.

What benefits are you getting from your GH5 over a much cheaper GH4 besides IBIS? Are they related to better usuable DR, much better usuable DR in lowlight, to a better image over all? If so, why supporting the idea of preferring Gh4s image quality over a G9?

If you´re just trolling, lemme know. I will save time and even that repetition of mine, which you have taken the pleasure and duty to point out.